Absolute Virtue

Uzor

... A Man For All Seasons
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Uzor
As some of you may or may not know, Absolute Virtue is basically the Kirin of sea. He have been considered "Broken" for quite some time, and he's now considered literary unkillable.

However, I am of the belief that he is very much killable, the correct method have just not been discovered, due to the reason it nvolves more strategy then most other fights in the game.

Either way, this thread is intended to bring up some discussion between those of us on QCDN that are involved in Sea; mainly Kaizen, Antares and Home, and any other shells that I may have forgotten.

First some information about Absolute Virtue. He have access to all 2-hours, and mainly cast Wind based spells, except during Chainspell when he casts Meteor. His main job is considered to be DRG, due to his ability to summon 4 Wyverns and wielding a spear, in addition to using known DRG-Aern WS's. Absolute Virtue have a chance to pop each time Jailer of Love is defeated. In order to pop Jailer of Love, you have to go through a long process of gathering various pop items. As for the point of this thread, it starts below.

My theory, which I want to discuss in this thread, together with other theories, is the following. Yo udon't actually fight the vitues, you fight whatever jailed the virtues, which is most likely Absolute Virtue, as proven by talking to the "???"'s in Al'Taieu. This is only part of the theory, though, and I believe most people already knew or believed that. However, that needs to be mentioned for the following part.

Anyone that have done sea know the order in which pop items must be obtained. First, you need to defeat 3 Aern NM's, the Ix'Aerns, These are three jobs: DRK, DRG and MNK. The DRG are accompanied by three pets, these are BRD type Wyverns that cast spells such as Virelai. Second up is the Ix'DRK. He's accompanied by RNG type Aerns. Last, but not least, we have the Ix'MNK. He's accompanied by RDM and WHM. All of these Aerns are popped by killing Aerns. For the Ix'DRK, you have to gain Aern "hate", and when you've killed enough, talking to the "???" will make the Ix'DRK spawn. For MNK, you need to trade 1, 2 or 3 H.Q Aern organs, which are dropped by Aerns. For the DRG, he will randomly spawn from killing Aerns. each of these three will drop a certain Deed.

The first-tier Jailers are the ones inside the palace. Faith, Fortitude and Temperance.

For Temperance, he randomly pops in the place of a Zdei. He's completely immune to magic, but can be harmed by DoT spells. Also, he only takes damage from 1 weapon-type at a time. Also, he's SAM-type. When defeated, he drops First Virtue.

For Fortitude, you need to trade 12 Ghrah M Chips to a "???" in one of the rooms. Jailer of Fortitude pops together with 2 dark based Grahs, and any spells cast on Fortitude himself while these 2 Grahs are up will case him to respond by casting the magic back on to the caster. Once these are defeated, he can be safely cast on. Jailer of Fortitude is a PLD-type mob, and when defeated drops Second Virtue.

For Faith, you need, to trade a H.Q Euvhi organ to the "???" in one of the rooms. Faith is a BLM-type mob and casts mainly earth based spells. As someone mentioned on BG, it might be to show that he have no faith in the heavens. He also have the ability "Manafont". When defeated, he drops Third Vitue, as you have now freed the virtue from its prison.

Jailer of Justice is spawned by trading Deed of Moderation, Second Virtue and H.Q Xzomit organ to the "???" at F-11 in Al'Taieu. He's a BST-type mob that spawns NIN-type pets that Mijin Gakure. When defeated, he drops Fourth Virtue.

Jailer of Hope is a Warrior, and uses Mighty Strikes. He will also cast Thunder Magic on targets outside of melee range, and all of his melee hits causes an additionall effect of Stun. He is popped by trading a First Virtue, Deed of Placidity and H.Q Phuabo Organ to the ??? at D-9. When defeated, he drops Fifth Virtue.

Jailer of Prudence are actually two mobs in one.They are popped by trading Third Virtue, Deed of Sensibility, and H.Q Hpemde Organ to the ??? at L-8. They both use Perfect Dodge several times, and teleport around to the people with hate. When both are defeated, Sixth Virtue drops.

he last jailer, Jailer of Love, is popped by trading fourth, fifth and sixth virtue to the ??? at K-12. Jailer of Love is a SMN mob that spawns the Lumorians in Al'Taieu. He spawns 3 each time,and when defeated, it lowers his regen, untill he's finally easily killable. He also constantly changes element, and will absorb any attacks directed towards him of the same element. He will also use nukes and enfeebles of the same element.

The above was mainly to explain to those who don't do Sea how sea works, but also to provide you with the basics of how I came up with my theory. On ot the next part.

JLove is in greek mythology often painted as a woman surrounded by todlers. Jailer of Love can also summon "babies", up to 27 of them as a matter of fact. Her constantly changing elements can be a symbol to how often changes throghout life, and the two earrings she drop can be represented as Women (Novia) and Novio (men). *ia is the feminine plural ending in Latin, and *io the male plural ending in latin, similar to how all words in most languages are either female, male or neutral.

Anyway, as for the theory itself, it is as follows. Every jailer drops a weapon 100% of the time. We (Antares) have managed to pop him twice. Last time Absolute Virtue popped were for Kaizen, and we played aroudn with it a bit, and managed to get the following message:

"Absolute Virtue's powers are absorbed by the Justice Sword".

The theory is simple. Each sword is free from sins. Justice Sword is a sword of pure justice, and it absorbs the sin from Absolute Virtue. When the sword absorbed his powers, he never attempted to resummon his pets, nor did he attempt to Mijin Gakure.

From our attempts on Absolute Virtue, you'll see that all of his abilities and 2-hours and overall-behaviour is extremely similar to that of the earlier jailers. Jailer of Justice summons pets that Mijin Gakure. Absolute Virtue summon pets that Mijin Gakure. Ix'DRG have Wynav's that cast BRD spells. Absolute Virtue's Wynav's also cast BRD spells. Additionally, when Jailer of Love uses Astral Flow, his pets are the ones that uses their special abilities. In a similar way, Absolute Virtue's pets uses their special abilities when AV Astral Flows.

The reason he have Benediction and Chainspell is because Ix'MNK's followers are WHM and RDM.
So by using the appropriate weapon, you lock down some parts of his abilities, and thus make him weaker.

Manafont, Jailer of Faith.
Invincible, Jailer of Fortitude.
Mighty Strikes, Jailer of Hope.
Perfect Dodge, Jailer of Prudence
Mijin Gakure+Charm(Call Pet), Jailer of Justice
Astral Flow, Jailer of Love
Meikyo Shisui, Jailer of Temperance.

Now, that's only 6 of the 2-hours. The remaining ones come from the Aern's.
Benediction+Chainspell+Hundred Fist = Ix'MNK
Eagle Eye Shot+Blood Weapon = Ix'DRK

Now, here's where my theory has a flaw in it:
Call Wyvern+Soul Voice = Ix'DRG

as been studied before, he didn't attempt to call his Wyverns again when Justice Sword absorbed his powers, which could possibly mean that either this theory is wrong, or locking his DRG abilities locks his DRG abilities (mainly his AoE+stun jump)

Additionally, he only uses Meteor during Chain Spell, and if I remember right, he uses Comet during Manafont.

Now, assuming the above is true, how do you lock his Aern abilities?

The way I could think of it, locking his Aern abilities can be done doing the following;

Deed of Moderation coems from Ix'DRK, and is used to pop Fortitude, who drops Second Virtue, which is used to pop Justice. So what you need to do is pop the jailers related to the Aerns.

Ix'DRK = Jailer of Justice + Jailer of Fortitude
Ix'MNK = Jailer of Temperance + Jailer of Fortitude
Ix'DRG = Jailer of Faith + Jailer of Prudence

Now, what all that's left is his spells. These are locked by using the Love Halberd. If you remember what I explained earlier, Love loves to cast spells, and he quite often enjoys changing the element which he casts. Absolute Virtue loves to cast Wind magic, and his Wynavs actually cast spells of the same element as the current in-game day.

Yes, I do realize that people have tried using the weapons before. However, that doesn't neccesarily mean much. I believe that earlier, he was broken, and could be locked through flukes, as no one really knew what they did. If SE fixed those flukes, the only way to lock him would be by doing what they intended to do.

Now, how do you lock him by using the weapons? If you've been following me thus far, you'll have noticed that I mentioned that popping the Ix'Aerns in order to obtain the first pop items requires you to kill Aerns. Since Absolute Virtue is basically all Jailers in one, and is an Aern himself, the next logical step would be to kill Aerns in order to "power up" the weapons. It would be quite stupid of SE to simply make it luck based, and you need to attack Absolute Virtue and hope that the weapon kicks in. As AV doesn't require and pop items, but instead is a random pop after Jailer of Love have been defeated, the secret to killing him would be to use the weapons you've bee ngathering so far in order ot weaken him, thus making him killable. But that would be a bit TOO easy, and we know how SE jsut loves to screw us over. So in order to activate the weapons, you need to power them up by killing Aerns. Which honestly isn't as bad as it sounds, as you can do this while farming the Deeds. This would also explain why SE decided to not make pop items 100% drop rate, as it gives you more chances to power up the weapons.

Also, some interresting fact. Going from start, this is all the text that AV provides you with in Al'Taieu.

Jailer of Hope said:
Knoweth...thou? Firs...irtue...
Deed...tranqu...ser...ity...
...receptac...from phua...
...I...cannot...deciph...them
Jailer of Justice said:
Desssireth...thou? Sssecond...irtue...
Deed...ressstraint...willpo...er...
...from...fallen...Xzom...
...cannot...derssstand...them
Jailer of Prudence said:
Seeketh...thou? Thir...irtue
Deed...rationa...
...receptac...from Hpem...
...cannot...omprehend...them
Jailer of Love said:
A distant voice emanates from the depths of your soul.
"Now...I...know..."
"Fourt...irtue..."
"Fif...irtue..."
"Sssix...irtue..."
"I...desssire..."
Here comes the interresting part.
Uppon popping said:
At lassst the time has come... The ssscattered fragments of my thoughtsss once again mine. Long forgotten memoriesss filling me once more...
However... these memories generate sssuffering... These thoughtsss... bring remorssse...
Tell me... for what sssearcheth thou, to travel this far? Show me... by what principlesss art thou driven?
This most likely refers to him remembering all that he had forgotten. All of the sins commited, and these memories brings him pain, suffering and regret.

The most interrestign part is the last one that I bolded. Looking back at what we've done, we have gathered all of the virtues. In religion, the vices and sins are there to instruct people and guide them through life. Basically what you're allowed to do and not allowed to do. For example, we're driven by principles such as Love, Justice, Temperance, Hope, Faith, Prudence and Fortitude. What he's doing is basically asking you to prove which principles you are driven by. This is the main evidence of my whole Weapon theory.

Uppon defeat said:
By thy principlesss... I have been freed by the chainsss placed upon me from time immemorial. Thy path... extends to the far reaches of time and ssspace... But sssomeday... thou shalt reach... thy destin...
Here, he talks about the principles freeing him from the chains. Absolute Virtue is the greatest sinner of them all, so by cleansing him of the sins by showing him our principles, his powers are removed, thus weakening him.

The reason I post this, is for people to be able to try it out. Absolute Virtue pops are few and far-inbetween, so trying this theory out with the sea shell I am in alone could take a rather long time. Thus, I ask the rest of the Quetzalcoatl end-game community to try it out aswell. The way I see it, if you're going to throw exp at him, you might aswell try stuff out, right? The worst thing that can happen is that i doesn't work, in which case nothing have been lost either way.

The reason I chose not to psot this on BG is rather simple. All threads posted on BG about Absolute Virtue gets derailed.

Edit: Also, Absolute Virtue is usually what you call a being who have reached the absolute truth, similar to "Nirvana" in the Buddhism. Absolute Virtue can be defined as God. However, Absolute Virtue drops 7 sins, Indignation, Insolence, Indulgence, Infatuation, Indolence, Invidiousness and Intemperance, which is why I believe Absolute Virtue in FFXI is the absolute sinner, or perhaps a "Sin Eater". If you've seen the movie "Sin Eater" you'll know what I mean.

Since SE base most of the things they do around real-life mythology, the Greeks stated that Absolute Virtue would contain the virtues of Wisdom, Courage, Temperance, and Justice, while the Christians believed he would contain Prudence, Fortitude, Temperance, Justice, Faith, Hope and charity.

Additionally, Prudence is said is often painted as a woman wielding snakes, and can also be painted as a 2-faced woman, possibly refering to the two sides of truth. And the greeks refer to it as the virtue of Wisdom.

As for Fortitude, the Goddess provided us with the gift to overcome fear and challanges, courage. Jailer of Fortitude can be said to be a complete coward, with the ability to become completely invincible and also reflect any magic directed towards him, which is quite obvious as it is the jailer, not fortitude himself that you fight.
 
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Uzor said:
"Absolute Virtue's powers are absorbed by the Justice Sword".

Any pics? That is rather big, never heard of anyone ever getting that before.
 
Any pics? That is rather big, never heard of anyone ever getting that before.

Same here - heard Kaizen was up there for like 5 hrs and tried EVERYTHING, from using all the sea weps to having nekked buttsekks orgies, and no cigar...

People actually believe he's broken, but eh...
 
Any pics? That is rather big, never heard of anyone ever getting that before.
Indeed. Last patch they added the Curse message to the .dat's, and I believe that the Weapons absorbing his powers were included with these messages. The message itself is most likely an additional hidden effect, which is why they're not in the Al'Taieu .dat's themselves.

And no, I do not have a screenshot of this. I were changing to WHM at the time one of our THF's got this message, so I honestly do not know wheither he lied or not, as he is unable to provide me with a screenshot of it due to him playing on PS2. I will, however, give him benefit of the doubt as we never saw Absolute Virtue attempt to resummon his wyverns, nor use Mijin Gakure after this. Either way, I still believe the Jailer weapons are the secret to beating Absolute Virtue. The only thing left to do is actually attempt it. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd love to get his hands on an Aureole.
 
Same here - heard Kaizen was up there for like 5 hrs and tried EVERYTHING, from using all the sea weps to having nekked buttsekks orgies, and no cigar...

People actually believe he's broken, but eh...
In all honesty, the only reason people consider him broken is due to SE removing the only known way of beating him. Once that were removed, people haven't bothered figuring out a new way, and just let him despawn so they can summon yet another Love. For all we know he was broken before, adn is now fixed and working the way they ment for him to work.

And no, I can't remember it being 5 hours. I were up there the entire time hoping they'd find a way to beat him xD

Either wa y, I wouldn't say this is the way to beat him, as I hoenstly don't know. I'm just providing you with my own theory, and why I came to the conclusions I did, and how I believe it works. I'll let you decide what to do with it yourselves.

I would, however, be greatfull if you could try it out.
 
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Well, if it helps. Signet changes have made Aern on the Sealion's Den side completely gankable. I've gone a gauntlet of 3 without needing to rest, solo. A reraiser and a very, very late link.

Any decently equipped melee should be able to tear through two on their own before needing a break. Assuming you don't get Medusa Javelin, Glacier Splitter, or Wing Thrust/Auroral Wind. Excellently equipped, higher tier damage dealers can obviously do more. Seeing as how my mediocre ass did three.

Some jobs might have problems with BSTs though. Xzomit pets wear down shadows fast.
 
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I'm sure there are other LS out there that have attempted these concepts, as AV has been around long enough now if I'm not mistaken.

Though SE could have pulled a Blizzard here and literally made him unkillable until they decide to nerf him. Which, honestly I wouldn't be all too surprised at.
 
Also, it is possible that you are not ment to lock all abilities. As he say that:
At lassst the time has come... The ssscattered fragments of my thoughtsss once again mine. Long forgotten memoriesss filling me once more...
However... these memories generate sssuffering... These thoughtsss... bring remorssse...
Tell me... for what sssearcheth thou, to travel this far? Show me... by what principlesss art thou driven?
By thy principlesss... I have been freed by the chainsss placed upon me from time immemorial. Thy path... extends to the far reaches of time and ssspace... But sssomeday... thou shalt reach... thy destin...
He tells you to show him what principles YOU are driven by. And uppon defeat, he tells you that THY (aka. your) principles defeated him. So it is possible that only some of the abilities are lockable, and you need to chose which ones you'd prefer to lock.

In which case, the ones that are a must to lock are: Love, Justice, Fortitude and Temperance, for Benediction, spells, Wyverns and Mijin Gakure, Chainspell and Hundred Fists.

And Svina, as I stated before, people haven't even attempted him since they "nerfed", or as I'd prefer o call it, fixed him.
 
And Svina, as I stated before, people haven't even attempted him since they "nerfed", or as I'd prefer o call it, fixed him.

Somehow I find that hard to believe that no one has attempted him. There's always a few overachiever guilds on any MMO, especially one with a population still doing pretty good as FFXI, that will literally hammer this kind of content nonstop when the chance arises.

If you don't believe me, look up some of the top WoW guilds and I assure you most of them spend weeks of long days trying to conquer the new content the day it comes out.

I've been doing a lot of reading up on AV and the weapons seem to have the most relevence to the encounter. Like you said, if that message is something you've never seen or heard of before, try things with it. Maybe you have to use your 2h ability with the weapon equipped? That's kind of a wild idea, but just throwing dice on the table. You definitely seem to have done a considerable amount of research on the whole thing though, and you're probably on the right track.
 
You forgot to mention how to kill AV's auto-regen (unless that's been removed now)... As I recall, Squeenix mentioned that half of it is related to JoL, and the other half by doing the right debuffs on AV itself.

Other than that, interesting theory that indeed will take time to check out.
It wouldn't surprise me if there actually is a hidden effect on the weapons that only triggers after enough Aern damage/kills (or other damage/kills if it doesn't have to be Aerns).
I'm certainly not going to discard the theory only because "others already tried the weapons" or "others already tried everything conceivable".

I think your biggest problem getting it verified or cast out is going to be LS's that post false information or refuse to share what they actually know.
 
You forgot to mention how to kill AV's auto-regen (unless that's been removed now)... As I recall, Squeenix mentioned that half of it is related to JoL, and the other half by doing the right debuffs on AV itself.

Other than that, interesting theory that indeed will take time to check out.
It wouldn't surprise me if there actually is a hidden effect on the weapons that only triggers after enough Aern damage/kills (or other damage/kills if it doesn't have to be Aerns).
I'm certainly not going to discard the theory only because "others already tried the weapons" or "others already tried everything conceivable".

I think your biggest problem getting it verified or cast out is going to be LS's that post false information or refuse to share what they actually know.

How to lock his auto-regen has never been changed. You push and push and get him down below 95% and his regen lessens. Not a lot, but enough to make him killable rather than stay at 99-100%.
 
How to lock his auto-regen has never been changed. You push and push and get him down below 95% and his regen lessens. Not a lot, but enough to make him killable rather than stay at 99-100%.

I was referring to
Absolute Virtue How to Enfeeble Absolute Virtue
The regen effect will be cut in half by defeating as many of the Ru'phuabos, Qn'xzomits, and Qn'hpemdes summoned by the Jailer of Love as possible. In addition, using an elemental based attack that corresponds to the current day of the week (i.e. using Fire spells on Firesday) will stop the remaining regen effect.
from Vanafesta 2006.
 
Somehow I find that hard to believe that no one has attempted him. There's always a few overachiever guilds on any MMO, especially one with a population still doing pretty good as FFXI, that will literally hammer this kind of content nonstop when the chance arises.

If you don't believe me, look up some of the top WoW guilds and I assure you most of them spend weeks of long days trying to conquer the new content the day it comes out.

I've been doing a lot of reading up on AV and the weapons seem to have the most relevence to the encounter. Like you said, if that message is something you've never seen or heard of before, try things with it. Maybe you have to use your 2h ability with the weapon equipped? That's kind of a wild idea, but just throwing dice on the table. You definitely seem to have done a considerable amount of research on the whole thing though, and you're probably on the right track.
They did try after they fixed/broke him, but since they couldn't lock him by doing it the old way, they simply ignored him and let him depop
 
Any pics? That is rather big, never heard of anyone ever getting that before.

considering only one person said they saw this and that jailer weapons have been tested many times before, i'd say its pretty far fetched.
 
considering only one person said they saw this and that jailer weapons have been tested many times before, i'd say its pretty far fetched.

Do you know that they have been tested? Often times an LS that discovers a gimmick like that will denounce its existence, preventing many who don't have the patience to investigate things themselves from ruining a potential world first at something.

I mean, hey if all the e-glory in the world was at your fingertips and someone was pulling at your leg going "HEY TELL ME HOW TO DO IT TELL ME TELL ME" would you tell 'em? I'd be leading them every which way from the right way just to gain that advantage.
 
Do you know that they have been tested? Often times an LS that discovers a gimmick like that will denounce its existence, preventing many who don't have the patience to investigate things themselves from ruining a potential world first at something.

I mean, hey if all the e-glory in the world was at your fingertips and someone was pulling at your leg going "HEY TELL ME HOW TO DO IT TELL ME TELL ME" would you tell 'em? I'd be leading them every which way from the right way just to gain that advantage.

Absolute Virtue dies from Taisais.
 
considering only one person said they saw this and that jailer weapons have been tested many times before, i'd say its pretty far fetched.

Yes, jailer weapons have been tested. But they didn't make any real tests, they just threw someone to randomly melee with one while they kill the Wynavs. That's not really testing. Testing usually involves actually testing different things out, and see if anything changes.

Also, like I mentioned earlier, jailer weapons were tested when AV were first released, not after SE "broke" him. For all we know he were broken before and is now fixed. It is also possible that there were no message about it untill SE added a "cursed" (from Igqira Weskit) to the game in the last patch. It is also possible that no one have seen the message due to the reason that they didn't unlock it or do whatever it takes to trigger the effect.

No one in Antares have seen this message either untill after last patch either, even though we've meleed with Jailer Weapons every time. The person that got this message farmed Aerns for organs with Justice Sword before we did Sea that day, which is partially why I believe killing Aerns is part of triggerign the effect.
 
You didn't watch us clearly then Uzor.

We had one of each of the jailer weapons in the alliance, they all tp'd on aerns to over 100%tp and all used weaponskills on AV (weaponskills that would give you a WS point, ie not Spirits Within etc).

This was like a week ago and nobody recieved any message.

You may want to speak to your thief more or look at what he did before/during the fight. As that's a huge discovery if true. But a little suspect we didn't get.
 
Yes, I know you did use weapons. I also saw you all die a horrible death in approximatley 55 seconds xD 'twas fun.

Besides, simply getting 100% TP might not be enough, which is why in my post I mentioned killing the Aerns for the Ix'Aerns with Jailer Weapons to try it out on AB later. As for the THF himself, I think he had Justice Torque and stones equipped, and he didn't WS. So its not about WS'ing on AV. What he did was simply sneak attack AV from behind. So I don't think WS'ing on AV with the weapons have anything to do with it. It'd be more likely that you need to WS on Aerns. Although I don't think WS's have anything to do with it at all, and simply killing enough Aerns is sufficient.
 
I did 635 damage on mijin, just line up 1000 ninjas and all do a mass mijin orgy, problem solved.
 
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