Another pet question

[Cookamungas]

I think it was proven on KI by kornflake, that for the Monster Gloves to be active the entire time, you need to wear them the entire time. Although its not really necessary if you have Beast affinity merited.

 

[Davion]

BST and SMN gear work different from what we've seen.

I still think that SE will ultimately have to answer the question of how Rage works.

 

[K. Ishitar]

I don't think so, it's very possible to test it, you just have to be quick with macros is all and assume it falls under the same rule that ethanos mentioned.

we still can't see taisa's shots as valid because no time stamps were there, even though he was right to an extent so far.

I'll be linking this thread to ffxiclopedia when I get home

really glad at the info garnered here.

 

[Taisa]

As a final note, My SS button was hit at different times and I'll make sure to remember to take the "hide" functions off when I SS for posting on QCDN. I want to thank Evanos for manning up. I commend you on your tests, very well done.

 

[Davion]

I'm glad Evanos posted that as well mean I can slap on more SMN magic stuff for ward to make it last.

Also I'm glad Taisa mentioned the Sac. Torque. I honestly never knew about it till when he mentioned it in this thread.

 

[Calintzpso]

Someone said the spats help you summon the sprites faster. Your summoning Magic does that, It always did that and is your interuption rate for summoning before SE added the Accuracy effect, still is too. Pants don't help you Crap out a Element faster, and for the record the legs are good for decent MP and as a BP timer down. Its what I use them for.

Did a little test, Got lazy after the second one so bite me. Besides Regen being close, Shell, Haste, Protect, etc from the light spirit always beat the Starting initial Cast of first spell before anything else when i Had the Summoner spats on.

I even Used Fraps and recorded my Summoning animations and played them back in my Movie Studio. The Animations/fps matched no matter what was on. Only time it sped up is when i wore my swift belt and Turban(Seperate Test). Might post video later.

Spoiler:

Test1

Test2

Also KillingIfrit boards had tests on it before as well. Its the Spirit FAQ on there Summoner Job forums.

For my next trick with all my free time, I'm going to go pop 3 stacks worth of Bubbly Bernie and parse it all using my BP-Attack Macros, cause I'm with taisa in reward from both.

Why do i think this? If a WS is like a BP, why can we issue the BP out of range, and then a second later issue assault to get our avatar in range to do the attack and not miss(to far away bs). Last i remember when I hit my Rampage on Bst and THEN run in, I lose my TP/miss.

Secondly, Sacrifice torque is a Latent. Everything in the game that uses latents must meet active requirement in order to give reward, Even if its partial(See a 1 mp merit mnk/war with a cassie earring as example, how it takes what it can) or else it does not function. The Torque ticks off our mp and hp when an avatar is out.

If going by my currently limited knowledge on all the latent based items out there that I have seen. If it could not give us any Attack at all, why take HP and MP after the avatars summoned and we equipped it after. My thought is It kicks in asap upon being put on. Regardless if avatars been summoned with master wearing it at the time or not. Which would extend to say that the boots would take effect the moment you put them on, which would probably extend to Avatar accuracy, and even Avatar Enmity which I tested a while back to take effect after pets summoned and you change gear.

Now my logic for the summoning magic for duration and why it is not lasting after you issue command and swap gear could be because attacks different from a buffs. No one would know unless SE tells us on that one. Maybe its like that cause buffs are a solid variable? You can't Crit a buff or miss like BPs can. Mobs evasion etc, distance factor in for rage so its different, where Wards off the avatar so calculations done immediately?

 

[Davion]

Someone said the spats help you summon the sprites faster. Your summoning Magic does that, It always did that and is your interuption rate for summoning before SE added the Accuracy effect, still is too. Pants don't help you Crap out a Element faster, and for the record the legs are good for decent MP and as a BP timer down. Its what I use them for.

Did a little test, Got lazy after the second one so bite me. Besides Regen being close, Shell, Haste, Protect, etc from the light spirit always beat the Starting initial Cast of first spell before anything else when i Had the Summoner spats on.

I even Used Fraps and recorded my Summoning animations and played them back in my Movie Studio. The Animations/fps matched no matter what was on. Only time it sped up is when i wore my swift belt and Turban(Seperate Test). Might post video later.

Spoiler:

Test1

Test2

Also KillingIfrit boards had tests on it before as well. Its the Spirit FAQ on there Summoner Job forums.

For my next trick with all my free time, I'm going to go pop 3 stacks worth of Bubbly Bernie and parse it all using my BP-Attack Macros, cause I'm with taisa in reward from both.

Why do i think this? If a WS is like a BP, why can we issue the BP out of range, and then a second later issue assault to get our avatar in range to do the attack and not miss(to far away bs). Last i remember when I hit my Rampage on Bst and THEN run in, I lose my TP/miss.

Secondly, Sacrifice torque is a Latent. Everything in the game that uses latents must meet active requirement in order to give reward, Even if its partial(See a 1 mp merit mnk/war with a cassie earring as example, how it takes what it can) or else it does not function. The Torque ticks off our mp and hp when an avatar is out.

If going by my currently limited knowledge on all the latent based items out there that I have seen. If it could not give us any Attack at all, why take HP and MP after the avatars summoned and we equipped it after. My thought is It kicks in asap upon being put on. Regardless if avatars been summoned with master wearing it at the time or not. Which would extend to say that the boots would take effect the moment you put them on, which would probably extend to Avatar accuracy, and even Avatar Enmity which I tested a while back to take effect after pets summoned and you change gear.

Now my logic for the summoning magic for duration and why it is not lasting after you issue command and swap gear could be because attacks different from a buffs. No one would know unless SE tells us on that one. Maybe its like that cause buffs are a solid variable? You can't Crit a buff or miss like BPs can. Mobs evasion etc, distance factor in for rage so its different, where Wards off the avatar so calculations done immediately?

The way I understand how the relic legs work is that they shorten how long we have to wait for the summoned elemental to cast a spell or it gives them fast cast or something.

First let me clarify something on why I believe the avatar BP: Rage moves are similar to WSs and answer your question about Distance if you're confused.

Like a player's WS the avatar needs to be in range to perform the attack and hit it's target; even a little bit further out than most if you're using Meteor Strike or Nether Blast since those are ranged like Mistral Axe.

The summoner, like beastmasters have a distance of:

17.5' Provoke, Charm, Quick Draw, Shadowbind, pet commands, Requiem.
Source: http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Distance

in order to issue commands to pets, however the avatar must be in the proper range to use the command you gave it and it has to be within the same distance of you to receive it. Additionally, for the attack to land (because you used Assault in time) the avatar it's self has to be close enough to the target for the attack to land.

As far as damage is concerned, still I think SE will have to answer that question because results are still so inconsistent.

 

[K. Ishitar]

Caliz you must also consider that when they do get out of range they lose their tp(90% sure on this part) excluding the 70 bps of course and a certain few.

Just like with monsters having extended and different ranges for their ws abiliities, jet stream has a much longer range than say goblin rush. Avatars are monsters themselves and different from pcs. Some weaponskills themselves such as Mistral Axe have some range too.

Good point about the sac. torque latent, I'd assume that'd it would activate immediately but there could be a slight wait time and the possibility of a 2 second window frame could mean it shouldn't be used.

It'd be nice to say that all latent and hidden function under the same property and activate all of the time like blau under 100% tp. However some items such as fencer's ring lose their ability on the hit that gains the pc 100%tp...

I still think rage can be tested just have to get up there to use the stuff to use it...derp

 

[Davion]

edit. nvm. what I posted is pretty much what Khidir just said.

 

[hellstorm]

what I think he was saying is that the move can be called to do a blood pact even not in range it will then move closer to do the move, because there is about a 4-5 sec delay before doing a move. In same token if mob move withen that 5 sec the bp will miss, unlike that of ws which will miss but only if there moving while pushing the ws button, and normally because the mob is further then it appears do to server>computer delay. Just like if you duel boxing you will see that you char be ahead on 1 screen behind on another.

 

[K. Ishitar]

the same holds true for monsters as well...they can ready wses and fail because the target is out of range. It's mentioned above in my previous post.

The point I was getting at was that it's not limited to smn pets only.

 

[Davion]

Fixed your words hellstorm. Please proofread what you say before you post it. (This isn't a jab at you so don't even go there)

what I think he was saying is that the move can be called to do a blood pact even not in range it will then move closer to do the move, because there is about a 4-5 sec delay before doing a move. In same token if mob move withen that 5 sec the bp will miss, unlike that of ws which will miss but only if there moving while pushing the ws button, and normally because the mob is further then it appears do to server>computer delay. Just like if you duel boxing you will see that you char be ahead on 1 screen behind on another.

Fixed:

What I think he was saying is that the move can be called to do a blood pact even not in range it will then move closer to do the move, because there is about a 4-5 sec delay before doing a move. By the same token, if the mob moves within that 5 seconds, the bp will miss, unlike that of ws which will miss but only if the mob is moving while pushing the ws button, and normally because the mob is further then it appears do to server/computer delay. Just like if you're duel boxing you will see that your char is ahead on 1 screen behind on another.

Please don't confuse your range as a SMN to issue the command to be the same as the avatar; with the exception of Nether Blast, Meteor Strike, and possibly Wind Blade (never used it like it was ranged) because they are ranged attacks and can be performed a little further away. The avatar must be in range of the target you chose to complete it's attack. The summoner and must be within 17.5' of the avatar to give it the command if I'm reading this distance thing right. The only exception to the distance rule is Retreat and Release. An example of this fact is when I was attacked by the bees and hit when I told Leviathan to do Spinning Dive (see my screenshoots) and Leviathan moved to attack the bee automatically and then he performed his attack.

The avatar will only move closer if you have executed the BP: Rage move on mob that you haven't engaged yet. The avatar's AI knows to always protects the SMN from harm (<3). When you do a BP: Rage on a mob you haven't claimed yet, the mob attacks the summoner first and the avatar will move to go attack the mob if it can; and if they are close enough, execute the command/attack you gave it.

By the same token, If you execute the attack and you haven't issued the assault command, and/or if the mob moves away or was out of ranged before the avatar could complete it (regardless of server delay) then the attack will miss.

 

[hellstorm]

Here another example which learn hard way today on imps. If it was that the transfer of energy was at the point of when the smn pushes the button then the pet would continue to us it ws instead of stopping if it is amnesia. (To clarify it was amiesa after pushing the blood pact button and stop mid ws.[After you start to see the pet charge])

 

[Davion]

Here another example which learn hard way today on imps. If it was that the transfer of energy was at the point of when the smn pushes the button then the pet would continue to us it ws instead of stopping if it is amnesia. (To clarify it was amiesa after pushing the blood pact button and stop mid ws.[After you start to see the pet charge])

What?

Also Leviathan from what I've seen isn't effected by Imp Amnesia.

 

[K. Ishitar]

No, actually pets are affected by the amnesia according to BlueFrost since pet commands are issued to pets to make them work. If they're affected by amnesia then it shouldn't work.

However the same shouldn't apply for a pet in starting or mid bp really since the action was initiated before the imp started the amnesia effect.

The same can be said for the melee in a long ws that happens a split second- 1 second before the amnesia effect.

 

[Davion]

Well from my own experience, Leviathan wasn't effected by amnesia, but was effected by silence, Garuda is unaffected by silence but is effected by amnesia.

 

[K. Ishitar]

amnesia is fire based which is probrably why

and of course silence is wind based

 

[Davion]

No, actually pets are affected by the amnesia according to BlueFrost since pet commands are issued to pets to make them work. If they're affected by amnesia then it shouldn't work.

However the same shouldn't apply for a pet in starting or mid bp really since the action was initiated before the imp started the amnesia effect.

The same can be said for the melee in a long ws that happens a split second- 1 second before the amnesia effect.

If the avatar is hit with amnesia and it sticks, even if it's in mid BP animation (Readying) it will not work.