BeastMaster Damage In PT

[Oracant]

This has bugged me and a lot of other Bsts, A lot of people think bsts can't out Damage a pure DD class, therefore we are not good in exp parties and "Don't Deserve them".

There are a couple of Threads Below of Parsed damage inside exp parties from other bst,(I can't do it really i'm only a 50bst), These numbers show that Bst can out DD or = most DD jobs.

Now then with this and the evidence presented let the debating about bst in pt, bst dmg >/< drk/drg/thf/war/sam/rng. I just wanted to show that bsts are not as useless in exp parties as people think. Finally if this sounds like Rambling Sorry it's 2 AM here

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.html?fjob=8;mid=1141398995155348209;num=4;page=1

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.html?fjob=8&mid=1114020903867415415&num=36

 

[Neyla]

I don't think many people question that BSTs can be useful in a party, especially when you add their jug pet's damage to the equation. If you're a BST seeking a PT, you have to deal with the fact that you're pretty much in the same boat as a DRG - a lot of people have a natural bias against you for one reason or another, or simply don't understand the job. Generally speaking, the only people who feel sympathy for BSTs are...other BSTs.

Really, to me it's not so much a question on does a BST "deserve a party," as much as "Why the hell would I as a BST want one?" I duo with a taru and he's all the party I'll ever need. One of the many beautiful things about being a BST is not having to deal with five other idiots to get something done. If I was interested in swinging an axe in your basic normie party, I'd level WAR instead.

More power to you if you try to go the PT route and keep your flag up while you're out there soloing, but you're going to be waiting around like every other melee job. I'd just hate to see the old BST spirit get killed by a stupid update and new BSTs who think they should be a slave to the PT system for faster, easier levels.

Don't mind me if I sound jaded, 34 levels of Refresh has made me appreciate the relative peace and quiet of the soloing/duoing BST that much more.

 

[LadyKiKi]

I remember reading somewhere while researching BST that jug pets aren't the best pets to use against incredibly tough EXP monsters due to the fact that the jug is at your level and fighting something way more higher than the pet itself with no enhancement that can be provided by gear is all but useless. I haven't tested it, just adding to the discussion. But I did read it from one of the threads on Allakhazam on the BST boards.

 

[pakomen]

Jug pets aren't the best pets. Wild pets are. However, usually where a party exp's, there aren't any available wild even match pets to charm. Usually.

Flamingo's in sky hit pretty damn hard against some of the lesser gods though. Or so I've heard. Never done gods as bst..

 

[Reko]

It sure does sound like rambling.

I can out DD a war with my whm if the war is poorly equipped enough.
Since we dont know what gear or food or, well, anything about the sky parse it's useless.
Especially since one of the wars outdamaged the other 2 wars so much I'd have to say atleast 2 of them had very poor gear.

So the bst did same as a very poorly equipped war.


As for the second parse, the bst outdamaged a dragoon...
Well, is anyone surprised?
This isn't news in my book.

 

[Saevel]

Quite frankly, that parser is BS. It's either edited or simply faked. Why? A BST/WAR can be a very good addition as DD to pt, but a BST/NIN lacks Berserk and Double Attack. Which means 2 important things:

1- His ATK is considerably less than the other WAR/NINs who have all abilities such BST/NIN had + BERSERK and DOUBLE ATTACK

2- His TP gain is slower for lacking DOUBLE ATTACK.

The OP on that parser could've said: "See, we can do very close to War/Nin", but he went to far in his lie.

It's just pure logic.

Edit: On a side note, assuming that parser to be true, those War/Nin could be gimped beyond recognition, Dual Wielding, say, Daggers and spamming to Wasp Sting to help that BST out-damage them and promote himself (one can only imagine the egos some of the players have). OR, that BST is pimped to god-hood, and even then, he wouldn't out-damage a DECENTLY equipped War/Nin due to his sheer lack of combat oriented JAs and JTs.

 

[Zoolander]

The EXP/Hr in those parties is god awful, and the players are shitty as well that are being parsed against. Look at the WARs in that rampage pt in sky and their acc, thats fucking awful. And that party in den of rancor got chain 3 like 3 times in 24 fights? wtf?

I'm not saying a BST is weak in exp, but these pares prove nothing, just that most of the players are not very good.

 

[Reality]

2- His TP gain is slower for lacking DOUBLE ATTACK.

i guess this means thf/war gains tp faster than thf/nin, because thf/nin lacks double attack? lol

bst/nin *should* gain tp faster than a bst/war due to Dual Wield I & II (15% delay reduction total), especially if the bst has ridill (and merits/gear to compensate for the low skill) or temperance axe

 

[Saevel]

i guess this means thf/war gains tp faster than thf/nin, because thf/nin lacks double attack? lol

You guessed wrong. THF/NIN has Triple ATK and use very low delay weapons with an incredible hit/acurracy rate. THF has nothing to do with the BST/NIN vs. WAR/NIN comparison, stay on topic please.

bst/nin *should* gain tp faster than a bst/war due to Dual Wield I & II (15% delay reduction total),

No he shouldn't. 15% delay reduction total on a 280+280 delay weapons is not enough to compensate on a 280 delay weapon + double atk. I'm PLD and I tried PLD/NIN a couple times without Joyeuse just to find out I gain TP faster as PLD/WAR. If you don't have a JT that multiplies your atk, don't sub /NIN thinking you'll get faster TP than /WAR.

especially if the bst has ridill (and merits/gear to compensate for the low skill) or temperance axe

OR, that BST is pimped to god-hood, and even then, he wouldn't out-damage a DECENTLY equipped War/Nin due to his sheer lack of combat oriented JAs and JTs.

I think I covered that topic.

 

[Reality]

1. THF/WAR & THF/NIN both have Triple Attack, so you should know with simple math that you can remove that from the equation, which brings you down to subjobs. Which subjob gives you the best DOT, /NIN which gives you a 15% delay reduction on *every* round of attacks, or /WAR which gives you a 10% chance to attack twice

again, simple math will show you that regardless of triple attack and "THF's naturally high accuracy" (which is BS, btw), /NIN offers more to TP gain than /WAR does

2. you didn't offer any factual evidence here to support your theory, just an opinion that "it isn't enough to compensate for double attack". double attack is not a reason to use a subjob for a TP gain increase, now if your arguement was "BST should sub WAR at 75 because of Berserk", then I'd have no problems agreeing

3. a BST/NIN with Ridill or Temperance Axe will gain TP faster than a BST/WAR, damage output was not included in my previous post, not sure why you're even mentioning it here when replying to me

THF has nothing to do with the BST/NIN vs. WAR/NIN comparison, stay on topic please.

I'm PLD and I tried PLD/NIN a couple times without Joyeuse just to find out I gain TP faster as PLD/WAR.

Oh the irony

 

[Direwolf]

I have always been under the opinion that its not that beasts are not wanted, but that bsts do not want to pt with ppl.

 

[Kinkkerbelle]

I'd say that a beast with a jug pet and WAR subbed does a respectable amount of damage. I've only partied my beast about five times and each time me and courier carrier did good damage but I wouldn't say we outdamaged the DD's in the parties. BSTS do steady DoT and with my gear I rarely missed. On of the problems is that BSTs Rampage is sort of gimped compared to WAR. A WAR will always rampage for more than a BST, not sure why that is.

In gods the other day Courier Carrie was whappin Kirin for more than anyone else except the blms which gave me a thrill like no other.

 

[Waylander]

It sure does sound like rambling.

I can out DD a war with my whm if the war is poorly equipped enough.
Since we dont know what gear or food or, well, anything about the sky parse it's useless.
Especially since one of the wars outdamaged the other 2 wars so much I'd have to say atleast 2 of them had very poor gear.

So the bst did same as a very poorly equipped war.


As for the second parse, the bst outdamaged a dragoon...
Well, is anyone surprised?
This isn't news in my book.

The Drg had a 77% hit rate, he's a gimp, just like the war/nins in the first parse, you can't read anything into it, keep your hate mongering to yourself.

 

[Astraea]

My RL boyfriend is a 72 BST and they do good DD. With the right gear a bst can be just as good as a war. However bst like to solo are they would not play bst. I wouldnt mind a party with a bst, but it just dont happen.

 

[Saevel]

1. THF/WAR & THF/NIN both have Triple Attack, so you should know with simple math that you can remove that from the equation, which brings you down to subjobs. Which subjob gives you the best DOT, /NIN which gives you a 15% delay reduction on *every* round of attacks, or /WAR which gives you a 10% chance to attack twice

again, simple math will show you that regardless of triple attack and "THF's naturally high accuracy" (which is BS, btw), /NIN offers more to TP gain than /WAR does

WTF, didn't I agree with that?! Read my post again flame-boy. /NIN in THF main WILL offer more TP since they not only have a multiple atk feature, they will benefit from having a reduced delay + stuff that beefs up +haste.

That's why I'm saying leave THF out of discussion, it has NOTHING to do with BST.

"THF's naturally high accuracy" (which is BS, btw),

I don't remember saying natural accuracy. Let me check... I didn't! You just made that up, how cool. Their high accuracy comes from the fact of high DEX and their DEX items, along with +acc.

2. you didn't offer any factual evidence here to support your theory, just an opinion that "it isn't enough to compensate for double attack". double attack is not a reason to use a subjob for a TP gain increase, now if your arguement was "BST should sub WAR at 75 because of Berserk", then I'd have no problems agreeing

Offered the same factual evidence you did mate, simple maths. Or do you have anything else to show?

3. a BST/NIN with Ridill or Temperance Axe will gain TP faster than a BST/WAR, damage output was not included in my previous post, not sure why you're even mentioning it here when replying to me

Of course he will, and that's why I said PIMPED TO GODHOOD (read the post again if you have a problem understanding that), just like me, a PLD/NIN (a main job with no multiple attacks like BST -got my point now or I have to make myself 100% more clear everytime I post something?) gets TP faster with Sword/Joyeuse (oh, the irony).

To sum it up:

WAR/NIN gains TP faster than BST/NIN AND outdamages for the simple fact that they have JA Berserk and JTs (follow me here) Atk up, Double atk (proceeding in both hands), DW II leaving BST/NIN with a pathetic comparison of having only DW II.

This, Reality, is what we call simple maths. Only, like I already said, an exceptional BST/NIN with godly equipment vs. a very, very gimped WAR/NIN can out-parse him with TP gain and ESPECIALLY damage dealing.

 

[meeze]

WAR/NIN gains TP faster than BST/NIN AND outdamages for the simple fact that they have JA Berserk and JTs (follow me here) Atk up, Double atk (proceeding in both hands), DW II leaving BST/NIN with a pathetic comparison of having only DW II.

This, Reality, is what we call simple maths. Only, like I already said, an exceptional BST/NIN with godly equipment vs. a very, very gimped WAR/NIN can out-parse him with TP gain and ESPECIALLY damage dealing.

You guys were talking about subs not mains. You claim bst/war gains tp faster than bst/nin. Why are you talking about war/nins?

 

[Saevel]

Because, Meeze, I was always talking about WAR/NIN vs. BST/NIN, but apparently this is very diffcult to comprehend and people find the need to stray off topic.

My first post:

Quite frankly, that parser is BS. It's either edited or simply faked. Why? A BST/WAR can be a very good addition as DD to pt, but a BST/NIN lacks Berserk and Double Attack. Which means 2 important things:

1- His ATK is considerably less than the other WAR/NINs who have all abilities such BST/NIN had + BERSERK and DOUBLE ATTACK

2- His TP gain is slower for lacking DOUBLE ATTACK.

The OP on that parser could've said: "See, we can do very close to War/Nin", but he went to far in his lie.

It's just pure logic.

Edit: On a side note, assuming that parser to be true, those War/Nin could be gimped beyond recognition, Dual Wielding, say, Daggers and spamming to Wasp Sting to help that BST out-damage them and promote himself (one can only imagine the egos some of the players have). OR, that BST is pimped to god-hood, and even then, he wouldn't out-damage a DECENTLY equipped War/Nin due to his sheer lack of combat oriented JAs and JTs.

100% clear now?

 

[meeze]

Quite frankly, that parser is BS. It's either edited or simply faked. Why? A BST/WAR can be a very good addition as DD to pt, but a BST/NIN lacks Berserk and Double Attack.

Hmmm, looks like you are talking about BST subs there. 100% clear?

BTW where are your parsers at that show a bst/war beats a bst/nin?

 

[Saevel]

My god, this is simple maths. /war has ATK up, Berserk, Double ATK. /nin has DWII. Unless you get god equipment (Ridill or Temperance Axe) you're not benefiting that much from using two weapons.

/nin works extremely well with WAR because they carry over their innate JAs and JTs while exploiting the benefits of DW.

And yes, talking about BST subs as it is inherent to the original discussion of BST/NIN vs. WAR/NIN. Interpret the post as whole, not just a single sentence out. You're a quick-witted person, don't play dumb just to twist the post's point.

 

[meeze]

I don't know which is better to sub, but the advantages to /nin is that you can mischarm without getting owned and you can sub the axe with +7 str when its damage isn't good enough to main hand it. You've covered the /war sub advantages.

Now, from your argument you left out pet damage. If you've ever seen a DC or EM doing damage to a XP mob you'll know how much damage they do.