Christmas

[Uzor]

Thought this might be interresting. Why is Dec 25 the date for Christmas?

Well, its generally accepted that's the date Jesus was born. But how do we know?

The actual birthday of Jesus was forgotten by the early Christian movement. in those days, various groups celebrated his birth on JAN-6, APR-21 and MAY-1. By the 4th century, the church selected the approximate time of the winter solstice as the date to recognize Jesus' birth. They picked up this date from Pagan sources. As luck would have it, the autumn equinox might have been a more accurate choice.

The winter solstice occurs about DEC-21 each year. It is the day of the year when the night is longest and the daytime shortest. Using the crude instruments available, ancient astronomers were able to detect by DEC-25 of each year that the daytime had become noticeably longer. This date was chosen, and remains, the traditional date for followers of many different Pagan religions to celebrate the rebirth of the sun. Following the solstice, each succeeding day has slightly more sunlight than the previous day. It was seen as a promise that warmth would return once more to the earth. Numerous pre-Christian Pagan religions honored their gods' birth or rebirth on or about that day. Their deities were typically called: Son of Man, Light of the World, Sun of Righteousness, Bridegroom, and Savior. Some examples are:

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Roman Pagan Religion: Attis was a son of the virgin Nana. His birth was celebrated on DEC-25. He was sacrificed as an adult in order to bring salvation to mankind. He died about MAR-25, after being crucified on a tree, and descended for three days into the underworld. On Sunday, he arose, as the solar deity for the new season. His followers tied an image of Attis to a tree on "Black Friday," and carried him in a procession to the temple. His body was symbolically eaten by his followers in the form of bread. Worship of Attis began in Rome circa 200 BCE.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Greek Pagan Religion: Dionysus is another savior-god whose birth was observed on DEC-25. He was worshipped throughout much of the Middle East as well. He had a center of worship in Jerusalem in the 1st century BCE. Some ancient coins have been found in Gaza with Dionysus on one side and JHWH (Jehovah) on the other. In later years, his flesh and blood were symbolically eaten in the form of bread and wine. He was viewed as the son of Zeus, the Father God.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Egyptian Pagan Religion: Osiris is a savior-god who had been worshipped as far back as Neolithic times. "He was called Lord of Lords, King of Kings, God of Gods...the Resurrection and the Life, the Good shepherd...the god who 'made men and women be born again'" 5 Three wise men announced his birth. His followers ate cakes of wheat which symbolized his body. Many sayings associated with Osiris were taken over into the Bible. This included: [/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]23rd Psalm: an appeal to Osiris as the good Shepherd to lead believers through the valley of the shadow of death and to green pastures and still waters[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Lord's Prayer: "O amen, who art in heaven..."[/FONT]
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Many parables attributed to Jesus.[/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica] Worship of Osiris, and celebration of his DEC-25 birth, were established throughout the Roman Empire by the end of the 1st century BCE.
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[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Persian Pagan Religion: Mithra was a Persian savior. Worship of Mithra became common throughout the Roman Empire, particularly among the Roman civil service and military. Mithraism was a competitor of Christianity until the 4th century. Their god was believed to have been born on DEC-25, circa 500 BCE. His birth was witnessed by shepherds and by gift-carrying Magi. This was celebrated as the "Dies Natalis Solic Invite," The "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun." Some followers believed that he was born of a virgin. During his life, he performed many miracles, cured many illnesses, and cast out devils. He celebrated a Last Supper with his 12 disciples. He ascended to heaven at the time of the spring equinox, about March 21.[/FONT]

All of those situations are almost identical to how Jesus life was. All from different religions, and most, if not all, are older then the christian religion.

 

[Marajade]

I thought they'd recently (last few years) placed the birth of christ sometime in march, not december.

Christmas is in december because the catholic church needed a holiday around the same time as the religions it was trying to surpress.

 

[Uzor]

http://www.religioustolerance.org/xmas_sta.htm

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]The star did not exist because the whole birth story is a myth: There were dozens of well-established religions within the Roman Empire during the 1st century BCE, well before Jesus was born. Each of these faiths worshiped their own version of a godman. Although called by different names, such as Adonis, Aion, Antiochus, Asclepius, Attis, Bacchus, Dionysus, Osiris, Mithras, etc., their life stories were very similar. They were typically born about DEC-25 of a human virgin in a cave or cowshed. Their father was a god. Their birth was prophesized by a star in the heavens. Dozens of occurrences in Jesus' life, as described in the gospels, are identical or very similar to events in the legends of these godmen. Many magical and miraculous factors in Jesus' life were simply copied from pre-existing religions. The star of Bethlehem was one of these. The adoption of Pagan myths was necessary in order for Christianity to compete with other religions in the Empire. Otherwise, it would not have attracted many followers.

Which have pretty much always been my belief in the christian religion.
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[delsus]

Jesus was born before it says in the bible almost 52 yrs , so we should be in yr 2058 or something but we are not....

 

[K. Ishitar]

Why worry about the exact details and just pick a day? Can't be 100% accurate, unless it is considered less "holy" not to know?

 

[Uzor]

Why worry about the exact details and just pick a day? Can't be 100% accurate, unless it is considered less "holy" not to know?

It's not the fact that thye took a wild guess. It's that they decided to pick a date that many other religions have, and make an almost identicall story.

 

[Bajaratt]

http://www.religioustolerance.org/xmas_sta.htm

The star did not exist because the whole birth story is a myth: There were dozens of well-established religions within the Roman Empire during the 1st century BCE, well before Jesus was born. Each of these faiths worshiped their own version of a godman. Although called by different names, such as Adonis, Aion, Antiochus, Asclepius, Attis, Bacchus, Dionysus, Osiris, Mithras, etc., their life stories were very similar. They were typically born about DEC-25 of a human virgin in a cave or cowshed. Their father was a god. Their birth was prophesized by a star in the heavens. Dozens of occurrences in Jesus' life, as described in the gospels, are identical or very similar to events in the legends of these godmen. Many magical and miraculous factors in Jesus' life were simply copied from pre-existing religions. The star of Bethlehem was one of these. The adoption of Pagan myths was necessary in order for Christianity to compete with other religions in the Empire. Otherwise, it would not have attracted many followers.

Which have pretty much always been my belief in the christian religion.
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Mithra are god-like! Suck it elvaans!

But yeah, christianity just started copying other religions so that people would actually join, otherwise it would have just fizzled out probably.

 

[Mortanis]

All religions are based on eariler religions.

They are all man-made up.

They are all useless and unbelievable.

 

[Uzor]

All religions are based on eariler religions.

They are all man-made up.

They are all useless and unbelievable.

quoted for truth.

Although if I had to chose 1 world-wide religion, I'd chose buddhism

 

[RoM]

This thread sure does give me that warm holiday spirit. Who gives a shit what god/religion you subscribe too .. happy chrismachanukwanzika ya bastards.

 

[Uzor]

This thread sure does give me that warm holiday spirit. Who gives a shit what god/religion you subscribe too .. happy chrismachanukwanzika ya bastards.

You might be interrested in knowing where Santa comes from them.

He was originally gray, but Coca Cola gave him those holiday spirit red and white colors.

They also stole him for mseveral other religions, though:wacko:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/santa1.htm

 

[delsus]

You might be interrested in knowing where Santa comes from them.

He was originally gray, but Coca Cola gave him those holiday spirit red and white colors.

They also stole him for mseveral other religions, though:wacko:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/santa1.htm

Was green actally was a druid thing and you know u want 2 dis a druid they got weird powers :shok:

 

[RoM]

Jesus was black, Santa's a hippy, and hallmark owns your soul. No surprises here.

I was actually expecting something warm and fuzzy when i opened this thread. No offense, i don't mean it as a criticism. Information is keen i was just surprised is all. Me likey holidays, people suck less.... or more if you're a good little boy

 

[Uzor]

This made me laugh though.

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Amount of time Santa spends per household: [/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Number of humans in the world: 6.0 billion.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Number of children (humans under 18 years of age) about 2.0 billion.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Percentage of children whose parents are Christian: 33%. [/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Maximum number of children who might receive gifts: 667 million.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Average number of children per household: 3.5[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Number of destinations where Santa might deliver presents: 189 million.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Number of destinations for Roman Catholic and Protestant families: 173 million. (The remainder are Eastern Orthodox locations which Santa would handle in his second trip on JAN-5. The Eastern Orthodox church has not yet adopted the Gregorian calendar; the current gap between the calendars is 12 days and expanding).[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Total number of destinations where Santa delivers gifts: 156 million.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Santa cannot arrive until the children are asleep. Some people suggest that he start to distribute presents in each time zone at perhaps 9 PM local time, finish within an hour, and then move one time zone to the west. But that is a higher level of performance than is really needed. He could take longer in each time zone, as long as the entire job was finished comfortably before children woke up in the last zone. Assuming that the children sleep for 7 hours, this gives him 31 hours (or a total of 1860 minutes, or 111,600 seconds) to finish all deliveries.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Average number of homes to visit per second = 1,398. This only gives him about 715 microseconds in which to decelerate the sleigh, land on the roof, walk to the chimney, slide down the chimney, distribute the presents and retrace his steps.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Adjustment for special circumstances: If one considers that:[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Santa's competitor Befana distrubtes gifts in Italy.[/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]

Santa distributes some gifts on Boxing Day (DEC-26) to poor children in some British Commonwealth countries.[/FONT]

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Santa distributes some gifts in bulk quantities to orphanages, children's hospitals etc. before Christmas.[/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]

Sinter Klass distributes some gifts on DEC-5 to children in Belgium, Germany and Holland.[/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]

then the average number of homes to visit per second on Christmas Eve is only perhaps 1,000. He would deliver gifts to about 500 million children.[/FONT]

That's a calculation someone made to try and figure out how Santa makes it <.<;

http://www.religioustolerance.org/santa2.htm

He also have to travel a little more then the distance from earth to the sun every christmas Travel 111 million miles in 31 hours, means he have to travel 3,6 million miles an hour, or a about 1000 miles per second. Wow, that's one fast sleigh xD

[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]he average speed of the sleigh would be on the order of 3.6 million miles an hour. This would be a sufficient speed to allow travel to the moon in about 4 minutes, except that the reindeer need a steady supply of oxygen.) The acceleration and deceleration loads on the reindeer, Santa and the sleigh would be astronomical.

[/FONT][FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]At perhaps 0.2 cubic feet per toy, the payload would occupy a space of 100 million cubic feet.

[/FONT][FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]Potischman and Handy estimated the weight of the average toy to be 2 pounds. The sleigh would thus have to carry about 1 billion pounds or 500,000 tons of cargo for the 500 million children.

lmao
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[Dayner]

but i didnt get any gifts D:

 

[Bluefrost]

I'm not telling my kids about Santa.

 

[K. Ishitar]

I'm not telling my kids about Santa.

Mhmm...was thinking about this awhile back whether not to do that or not

Thanksgiving=Christmas without the cash spent to acquiese people

Christianity is the closest thing to Islam(by most of Old Testament) Christmas is one of those ones where its kinda up to the family but generally dont celebrate, if we do its not as lavish per say. Chances are I'll be marrying one of Christianity always a thought to bounce around.

*bored*

 

[Rappa]

They are all useless and unbelievable.

This isn't true. I've gotten countless amounts of "lols" out of scientology, so you can't really say it's useless because it spreads laughter and joy to sane people who like to laugh at dumb people.

 

[Blabj]

Isn't Santa derived from Finland. I heard a wierd rumor that Finnish people would feed the Reindeer Fly Agaric mushrooms, which are halucinagenic, but can be hazardous to humans yet not to Deers who have a better digestive system, and then drink the urine of the Deer (A sort of natural filter, if you would).

Then, while absolutely tripping off their heads, it would be obvious that the image of flying reindeers and fat men laughing their heads off in a sleigh seem real...

Although thats just what my mum has been told. We debated it for a while, it seems pretty plausible. Viking invaders used to do something similar, where berserkers would drink tonnes of alcohol and do all sorts of crazy substances, and then the people below the berserkers would drink the urine and get a little bit of "dutch courage" (I'm well aware it wasn't the netherlands who invaded most of europe)

 

[Elemmire]

winter solstice fools!