Commentary about the politics of 'Star Wars' [SPOILERS]

CubsWoo

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Once again, this has spoilers.































A lot of left-wing blogs I've read have compared Palpatine to Bush, how the Empire is the Republican Party of today, and how Lucas was commenting as such with lines like

"Only the Sith deal in absolutes."

"This is how liberty dies. With thunderous applause."

And so on.

A blog I read fairly regularly has a different take, posted Here and quoted here:

As I briefly mentioned in a previous post, I think the idea that Episode III has anything to do with Bush has much more to do with the anti-American tendencies of the European idiots who saw the film at Cannes than anything George Lucas intended. In fact, if I were making a commentary on the political subtext of the film in terms of the contemporary geopolitical zeitgeist, it would be that Bush is Obi Wan.

In the film, Anakin states something to the effect that the difference between a Sith and a Jedi is that the Sith are emotional and turn inward and are selfish in the Force, while Jedi are ruled by logic turn outward and are selfless. Being selfish and emotional are the literal hallmarks of contemporary liberalism. It’s all about how you feel, doing what you feel is right. There are no moral absolutes. At one point Obi tells Anakin that Palpatine is evil, and Anakin responds that he believes the Jedi are evil. Obi believes in absolute moral evil, whereas Anakin takes the liberal position that “one man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter.”

At one point, Palpatine tells Anakin that, in order to be truly great, one must understand both sides of the Force. This was presented to Anakin very much in the vein of Sun-Tzu: “If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.” However, Palpatine told that to Anakin because he knew the corrupting influence of the Dark Side would consume him. This, to me, smacks of the old left-wing shibboleth that the only reason people go to war is because of a lack of understanding between them. If we all understood each other better, and respected and tolerated each other, then the world would be at peace. However, this assumes the righteousness of the idea of moral relativism. As we see in the film, this moral relativism leads to the ultimate downfall of not only Anakin but the entire Republic itself.

Then there’s another angle. The Jedi know something is up for virtually the whole movie. They can sense the danger, yet they wait for absolute proof of Palpatine’s intentions before they act. By then, of course, it is too late. They all know Palpatine is a bad guy, but their adherence to their ideals eventually becomes their downfall. Palpatine knows this and uses it against them, in much the same way that prior to 9/11 al Qaeda used to recruit terrorists by stating that the United States had shown it would not fight back. By refusing to confront the threat of the Sith when it first manifests itself and is relatively weak they allow it to grow into a force that even the Jedi cannot overcome.

The Senate, to me, is much more representative of the United Nations than anything we find today in America. Comprised of representatives from every system, with diverse peoples, populations, languages, and values, the Senate is more concerned with preserving the status quo than anything else. There is no system of checks and balances in the Senate, which is exactly why Palpatine is able to use and manipulate it for his diabolical ends. Conversely, we live in a country where Bush, the alleged kindred spirit to Palpatine, cannot even get his judicial nominations passed because the minority in the US Senate is using parliamentary tricks to prevent a vote, and Bush’s ideas for reforming Social Security are stalled because of a successful campaign by the opposition. Some all-powerful tyrant we’ve got there. If there’s a point to be made comparing Palpatine to Bush I’ll be damned if I can find it. The reason the US system works is precisely because the founders set it up so that no one branch could grab too much power from the others. The reason the United Nations does not, and will never, work is precisely because it is an unelected, limp, flaccid, corrupt body with no checks and balances whatsoever. It relies on the good intentions of its members, and whenever you have diverse, competing interests, relying on the goodwill of your fellow man is heading down the path to disaster.

After the war against the separatists appears to be over, Padme remarks to Obi that since victory has been achieved, it is time for Palpatine to return his emergency power to the Senate and let diplomacy resume. This, of course, is exactly what the left will call for the second Osama bin Laden is finally caught. But, of course, diplomacy only works when both sides have a common goal and a desire to amicably work out their differences. As any thinking person will admit, the radical Islamofascist groups have absolutely no desire to ever peacefully coexist with either the West or with Israel. Their intentions are victory or death in its pursuits. So merely achieving victory in one aspect of the battle does not, in any sense, mean victory in the larger war. Padme refused to believe that there was a war larger than the war against the separatists, much like the Western left refuses to recognize the threat to world peace that the existence of radicalized fascist Islam represents. This is the larger war we are engaged in.

The final point I want to make is about sentimentality. Obi Wan initially states that he cannot kill Anakin, because the latter was like a brother to him. However, after seeing a holographic recording of Anakin slaughtering the Jedi younglings, Obi is forced to reconcile with the fact that Anakin must die. After the spectacular lightsaber battle in the volcano planet takes place, and Anakin had his limbs sliced off and is sliding towards certain death in the lava, Obi feels a tinge of sentimentality; he can’t finish him off, and leaves Anakin to burn to death. As we know, however, Anakin does not burn to death, and becomes the Darth Vader we all know and love. The lesson here? When you have a chance to finish off your enemy and remove the threat he represents, take it. Because not doing so will spell your ultimate destruction.

It’s worth noting here that I don’t believe that there is a contemporary political subtext to Star Wars. I think that anyone can, if they choose, divine just about anything they want from the film. This post was simply meant to show that there are numerous lessons that one can take from the films, not to attempt to guess that Lucas’ “secret” message. That’s something left-wing journalists, America-hating Eurowimps, and bleeding-heart leftist intellectuals engage in.
 
I think people look into too much meaing about things they shouldn't.. seriously.. I doubt lucas cared about making some political statement as much as making a movie to get some money and complete his "masterpiece"
 
/sigh... its a f'n movie. Maybe Bush is C-3PO because he says the line "I feel so helpless" ... or maybe he's Anakin because he is obsessed with power... or maybe... Bush is not in the movie. Was an interesting blog posting, Cubs.
 
This is funny, i just read an article in my local newspaper about this very thing.

Thing is, those lines were there long before bush ever took office. Mr. Lucas himself just finds it kind of ironic. He wrote the whole Star Wars series (or rather most of it) durring the whole Nixon era. Which is where essentially Palpatines(sp?) persona kind of comes from.

It is funny though how close it does resemble Bush's terms in office and what he's doing. People read too much into things really. Star Wars was written so long ago. Lucas himself never even imagined Bush being in office when he started production on the films. I wish I had bought todays paper that way could actually quote from it.

Silly politicians. Always gotta make something out of nothing.
 
Alyada said:
Most of us intelligent people have something to say about the human condition, and we do it by using mediums in the media.

I say to you: Do not take things at face value. There are wonders beyond your own experience; you only have to look for it.

(don't mean to offend, but I don't understand why everyone wants to take things at 'face-value.' What happened to the thinking man?)

You're right. Every time I watch a movie I should be looking for the deeper meaning. What happened to the thinking... well, I don't see anything wrong with watching a movie for the simple fact of entertainment. No need to put me and the other 2 on a level where we are less intelligent than you, thats kind of uncalled for.

So I guess in X-Men, the writer wants Magneto to symbolize Hitler then? Being that he thinks mutants are a superior race? Do we need to look into things like that to be entertained? Next time I will watch Star Wars and discard the face value so I can watch it intelligently I guess.

I noted that Cubs' post was cool to read and poked fun at the situation. I posted my opinion on how I like to perceive movies. I don't understand why I'm not "intelligent" as you subtly put it. I am able to read things, watch things and analyze them into what they can mean. To you I am some kind of average American idiot you loves blood and guts and cool special effects it seems. Well, I am. Telling people how they should be watching movies is sort of like telling people what they should be spending their paycheck on. Don't criticize me for watching it for pure geeky fanboy pleasure, I paid ten bucks for my ticket. I will not respond to this thread anymore. I apologize for interruption here.
 
I find that post quite interesting.

I am of the opinion that there is an underlying meaning behind most stories and art in the world, a little bit of the writer's soul if you will, but it is not always intentional. No one can see into another writer's heart. Unless boldly stated, (what are those called, the analogy stories... Allegories! thats it.) it would be pretty arrogant to decide what another person's story really 'means'.

To give an example, my high school senior english paper, I was going to do the topic of "How the War of the Ring (Lord of the rings) symbolizes WWII" Then doing my research came across several things straight from the author about how the war of the ring had no basis in WW2 at ALL. In fact he summarized what the ending of the book would have been had he based it on WW2 and it would have been very different. (Then i had to redo my thesis, "How the war of the ring was not influnced by WW2." and yes my english teacher rolled his eyes at me but he let it slide.)

So things that might be 'obvious' often arent. You can guess, or get your own meaning out of something yes. Each person's reaction to a story is different, and based on their own experiences and feelings. I might see a painting as a beautiful flower, and it might look like a blood soaked field to you. Nothing is concrete in art.

I guess I'm just saying that 'reading into it' is not a bad thing, but don't expect your reading to be the only right answer. And don't expect it to be what the author intended at all either.
 
/em puts on his tinfoil hat...

If you want to believe there is a subtext in anything you read, go ahead. Is episode 3 an allegory of modern times? I dont think it is.

What I do think is that Lucas does have themes in his movies, like any other writer. Entertainment is his goal, but without themes Star Wars would be nothing more than a typical crappy action movie. One of these themes may unboubtably deal with fanaticisim; it is dangerous in any form. Palpitine was able to stir everyone into a frenzy and thus was able to think for people, which could be seen as a parellel to Nazis being able to carry out atrocities that they did.

I think what people are doing is applying the themes in episode 3 to the current administration. Do I think there is much to this compairison? Not much more than would be under any other modern administration. Fact is, any political leader could potentially do something like this, doesnt matter if they are liberal or conservative. People have to think for themselves and ask themselves what is right.

Saying things like "Bush is the antichrist" is no more correct than constantly shouting about "left-wing journalists, America-hating Eurowimps, and bleeding-heart leftist intellectuals" because either way you are still villifying people who you do not agree with. Just because a person or a party wins an election does not make them correct on everything, it has been, and always will be the people's responsibility to keep their government in check... not the other way around. Thats what I believe Lucas' message is, and it is a message that can be applied to any government anywhere... hell, lets go one step further and say any organization.

But lets just all go see that movie again... explosions are cool!

-Ham :shock:
 
Alyada said:
You three below Cubs post do not understand the craft of writing.

When writers sit down to write something (and I mean something beyond the sappy love poetry you wrote freshman year) we have a message to get across. I know that George has a message that he wants us all to realize with his battles between the Sith and the Jedi. Similarily, there are countless stories that always take pages from the writers life, his goals, and his failures. You can find out a great deal about a person, and what they believe in, if you look close enough to their work.

Most of us intelligent people have something to say about the human condition, and we do it by using mediums in the media.

I say to you: Do not take things at face value. There are wonders beyond your own experience; you only have to look for it.

(don't mean to offend, but I don't understand why everyone wants to take things at 'face-value.' What happened to the thinking man?)

where's the meaning in movies like.. well.. pretty much EVERY movie released today O.o I fail to see meaning in any of the movies... I see a bunch of people just trying to make money one way or another. Granted there can be meaning in such things but in all ACTUALLITY.. the meaning is left to the audience to be interpretted on their own to what they wish to interpret it... if a director came out and said specifically "well I meant this to mean this" a person will still go "well it still seems like he REALLY meant this"..
 
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