dont ****ing engage sleeping mobs

Passions

Passions

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Chryos, Beckham

Next time you get help from a blm to solo OSE DON'T FUCKING ENGAGE IT AFTER I'VE KILLED IT HALF WAY SLEEP NUKING.

Nothing pisses me off more then when melee run up and start whacking away and a sleeping mob. I had it half way and am a flimzy blm you dont get time to turn it after i've done 6k in damgae to it.

Yes we probably could of won, but what was my reasons to help you live when you couldn't follow a simple request that i kept repeating over and over in party chat. You let my blm die because you wanted to grow your balls bigger and melee ose, well FUCK YOU.

FUCKING WISE UP YOU DUMB ASSES!!
 
reminds me of when I decided to help a brd/nin kill ose. He kept sleeping it with the brd spell and at one point I was thinking "Hey Dia will lower it's defenses so that he can hit harder" >.> I forgot it would do damage and keep it awake... well we almost died but we survived until dia wore and then won. He didn't seem to angry... of course I was making sure he wasn't going to die because of my mistake. I definately learned my lesson about hurting mobs when they are being slept >.>
 
Waking up a sleeping mob is definately one of my pet peeves. What really bugs me is in link situations, when the add is slept, and the first mob dies, a melee (typically the thf that pulled the add) runs over and wakes the sleeping mob before the tank has had any time to build hate on it, turning the mages into tanks.

Sure, sometimes it's possible for the tank to build hate while killing the first mob while keeping hate on the one being killed, but not always. After you kill the first mob in a link situation, let the tank decide when it's ok to wake the add. If you have a ninja, let them toss out some enfeebles and get a voke or two in. If pld, let them flash, voke, and toss out a cure on themselves or someone else. If you have a thf in the party, line up and fire off a sata on the tank while the mob is still sleeping.

And definately on a side rail, why is it that link = Sleep/Sleepga II? Sleep/Sleepga II overwrite Sleep/Sleepga, and for the first time in exp last night, after countless levels, I finally witnessed a mage besides myself that slept a link with sleep, did some business on the main mob, then casted sleep II on the link. The first tier spells also have shorter casttimes, which is another benefit. Of course, the thief in the party ran over and slapped it as soon as the first mob was dead, so it kinda cancelled out a skillful move.
 
I would have hit Bind and (if it actuall stuck) warped on them. Actually, I simply would have 2hrd and warped on them, but that's not a luxury you had. They should have been left to their own devices if they wanted to fight him that bad.
 
Stouter said:
And definately on a side rail, why is it that link = Sleep/Sleepga II? Sleep/Sleepga II overwrite Sleep/Sleepga, and for the first time in exp last night, after countless levels, I finally witnessed a mage besides myself that slept a link with sleep, did some business on the main mob, then casted sleep II on the link. The first tier spells also have shorter casttimes, which is another benefit. Of course, the thief in the party ran over and slapped it as soon as the first mob was dead, so it kinda cancelled out a skillful move.
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You already know the answer to that question chief. It's because most BLM don't understand that it works that way. And when you tell them, they either don't believe it or they never persue 'finding it out for themselves.'

Of course, there are times where II is better to use than I as a starter. BLM's job to do spot-judgements like that.

That, and most BLM never really learn any consequences between Sleep I -> II instead of a straight Sleep II because there usually isn't one. Unless you really need to keep something asleep for a very, very long time.
 
Actually there is one consequence; more hate. That's besides the point. Sleeper should also put up SS and Blink.

By the way, I found out last night that Drk Sleep2>Hoarde Lullaby on pressionaires. MWAHAHA!!!
 
alanon said:
Actually there is one consequence; more hate. That's besides the point. Sleeper should also put up SS and Blink.

By the way, I found out last night that Drk Sleep2>Hoarde Lullaby on pressionaires. MWAHAHA!!!
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SleepII/Sleepga II > Sleep/Sleepga > Foe/Horde Lullaby.

Doesn't matter what job casts what, a brd/drk with 0 enfeebling magic could overwrite their lullaby with sleep, if they could stick it.

More hate is not that big of a deal, sleep doesn't generate much hate at all, and in many cases the main healer will be higher on the hate list than the sleeper when wake time comes.

The reason to use I -> II is to buy yourself time. An unresisted II is 90 seconds. That sounds like a lot of time, and usually is, but in parties fighting higher level mobs, fighting for chain 5, 90 seconds is not enough time to kill the main mob, and recover mp/establish hate. This is where that extra up to 60 seconds on sleep comes in very handy. When you're fast chaining, the 30-36 seconds off a lullaby is sometimes enough.
 
Oh I didn't mean to say that I was surprised that they overwrite. Hoowever mine stuck (Drk) and the Brd's did not. :p
 
I remember doing a KS30 Desert Swarm, and the party setup was BLM BLM RDM BRD.

me and the BRD were taking turns with handling the links, and i can tell you that Sleep(ga) I doesn't overwrite Lullaby. Sure though, Lullaby doesn't last as long, so for practical usage, Lullaby < Sleep.

Sleep(ga) II > Sleep = Lullaby (for overwriting lower sleep spells)

Sleep(ga) II > Sleep > Lullaby (for the length of time sleeping)

That was a good run though ^^ we netted 7m each ^^
 
*Snarl@Reishu*

Where's Shiva's Sleepga set in? It's kindof odd because when it casts it makes the Sleepga II noise.. O_o
 
For some god forsaken reason. It's seems like most melees first instinct when there is a link is to engage it. Don't asked me why. I've yelled at hundreds of ppl over the course of my game life for being so stupid.

Maybe its some primordial "Dunes" instinct they never broke habit of. Unless it's an unsleepable mob then let the blm/rdm/brd handle it. That's what we're here for. Don't be a hero stupid ass!
 
I've got to agree with Passions on the people meleeing sleeping mobs thing. A Red Mage friend and I have done the Sleep-Nuke thing to Osse quite a few times and on a couple of occassions we had other people with us and melee near killed me waking Osse up...he hits damn hard when your a Taru
 
I'm inclined to disagree and say let the main healer decide when to engage, rather than the tank.

After the first mob is dead, the healer may be very low mana (From having to heal the sleeper the puller and the tank, depending on resists.) Using that extra 30 seconds to regen is very helpful. The tank should be building aggro with provoke and Non-damage enfeebles (Flash, kurayami etc) anyways.

As mnk or when i was leveling drk if there was a sleeping add and the tank was busy i would often keep hate on the add (provoke) so when it woke up it hit me rather than the blm or rdm. The secondary melee is a lot more durable than the sleeper, and it helps since the add won't interrupt the sleepers recasting.

As for the OP's situation, yeaaaah if you told them more than once they didnt deserve the kill. [True Strike].
 
When there is link in exp, sometime is hard to not attack other one, because of the weapon delay, is like a sword stike ever 3 sec, and let say we got a link, mage sleep it, moding delay, my sword is been delay for like 2.5sec, our normal killing mob die, then auto target to the sleep mob, try to avoid but soemtime is hard :O lol

but in other case, if a person was attacking a sleeping mobs, they may got confused on what mob should we attack or just plain noobish
 
I'm a blm that's guilty of sticking exclusively to sleep II/Sleepga II. To be honest, I only pull out the tier I sleeps if the II is resisted. I've never had much impetus to change my ways. I'm not going to disagree that starting with tier I is the better way to go, but I will say I've never really encountered problems starting off with II. My logic for starting with II was that it's a longer duration, and I'm always in a pt with someone else who has sleep capabilities, be it a bard or rdm. A sleep II from me followed if necessary by a sleep II from the rdm seemed like a better idea.

Getting to the main topic, my biggest problem with melees waking slept mobs is typically in a case when a puller grabs multiple mobs and I'm supposed to sleepga II the hoard back at camp. I typically type something to the effect of "Everyone make sure you target the same mob" but I must say it rarely happens. Sleep three different mobs and it's almost certain that the tank will take one, melee A will take one and melee B will take one. This isn't a putdown on melees or anything. There should be a rule that the tank's mob is the party's mob, so that there's never any indeciveness about choosing who to follow.
 
Reishu said:
I remember doing a KS30 Desert Swarm, and the party setup was BLM BLM RDM BRD.

me and the BRD were taking turns with handling the links, and i can tell you that Sleep(ga) I doesn't overwrite Lullaby. Sure though, Lullaby doesn't last as long, so for practical usage, Lullaby < Sleep.

Sleep(ga) II > Sleep = Lullaby (for overwriting lower sleep spells)

Sleep(ga) II > Sleep > Lullaby (for the length of time sleeping)

That was a good run though ^^ we netted 7m each ^^
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Just tested this, guess I was wrong. I always assumed that sleep I overwrote lullaby. I swear I have seen it do so before.

Pompidou said:
Getting to the main topic, my biggest problem with melees waking slept mobs is typically in a case when a puller grabs multiple mobs and I'm supposed to sleepga II the hoard back at camp. I typically type something to the effect of "Everyone make sure you target the same mob" but I must say it rarely happens. Sleep three different mobs and it's almost certain that the tank will take one, melee A will take one and melee B will take one. This isn't a putdown on melees or anything. There should be a rule that the tank's mob is the party's mob, so that there's never any indeciveness about choosing who to follow.
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When I was leveling ranger in static there were times when I would intentionally pull multiple mob. Sometimes it was due to the choice of either pull two now, or wait a few minutes for enough seperation between them. Other times it was shooting for an easy chain 5. It was very easy for us to select which to kill. Melee takes the red one, rdm sleeps the link. Or in the case of a shadowbind link melee take the first one to get to camp, which is yellow, and rdm takes the shadowbound mob, which makes it to camp about 30 seconds later.

Pulling two mobs worked nice for us, gave our lazy ass rdm something to do in our nin whm rdm setup.
 
<< trigger-happy-monk-bane-of-blms

So many times i've been on the wrong end of a sleeping mob .... >.>

Most of us are jumpy by nature, we only notice it's a bad idea once it's a done deal, tragicly.

Good times ......
 
Stouter said:
Pulling two mobs worked nice for us, gave our lazy ass rdm something to do in our nin whm rdm setup.
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If it's the same Rdm I'm thinking of.... yeah, god damn was he lazy! I think he was just afk and leeching most of the time anyway.... :p
 
Vandoura said:
When there is link in exp, sometime is hard to not attack other one, because of the weapon delay, is like a sword stike ever 3 sec, and let say we got a link, mage sleep it, moding delay, my sword is been delay for like 2.5sec, our normal killing mob die, then auto target to the sleep mob, try to avoid but soemtime is hard :O lol

but in other case, if a person was attacking a sleeping mobs, they may got confused on what mob should we attack or just plain noobish
Click to expand...

I feel like 2.5 seconds is definitely enough time from a kill to not whack the second mob, especially when it's not generally in the exact same place.

As a melee, I try to be aware of the status of slept mobs at all times. As a monk, I have the ability to off-tank it if necessary, so I try to be especially alert on a slept mob, if the second sleep attempt fails.

It's nice when mages can take the time to fire off a sentence while casting, too, to explain what they're doing. Communication = key.
 
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