Dynamis - Xarcabard question

[Bajaratt]

It's not luck. It's odds times attempts. It's endurance. Stamina. Government. Skill drops to 0 when you're dead, and if you're dead all that skill you think you had was false since you can't keep it together as a team. Nothing but premature ejaculation. Not something to brag about. An important requirement of being a good shell is kinda to still be around. Winning is easy. Going is hard.

I find it utterly amusing that people still point out that I command up to 50 people in beau, slam every extention in the zone, get bored, slaughter angra, go to xarc, kill the NMs, kill the farms, kill the demon line, thrash the dragons, decimate Yin and Yang...and you think we don't have what it takes.

Trust me. Winning is easy. The only thing keeping you from piping down about how big the DL is is me telling my team not yet. We have the force. We have the access. We have the numbers. We have the mechanics. And the hardest part of that? We've had it for some time, just waiting for it to mature a little so I know my team better.

Again, you are simply mistaken if you think beating the DL is harder than being known as a marathon shell. How many shells have beaten DL? How many shells are or were as old as us? Enough said. It is easier to win than to go long.

And yet you haven't done it yet, there's nothing to trust you on since you've never done it. You keep talking about how great your linkshell is because you have people who show up all the time, which is nothing special since just about every dynamis linkshell has people like that, they're called members. Yes, it's impressive that your linkshell managed to last over a year, but you're nothing special, despite what you keep saying. There's several linkshells that have been around as long as you, a few that have been around longer. There's no reason to think that the other linkshells that have been formed in the last year will break up soon either, so stop acting like building a dynamis linkshell that lasts is such a huge deal when there's only been 3(that I know of) that have broken.

While the longevity of a linkshell is important, it's not the single greatest thing that a linkshell can do like you seem to think it is. Yes, a linkshell that beats DL and dies soon after is unfortunate, but there's only been one of those so far, while the only other two linkshells are still going strong. You're only focusing on that one linkshell that died, and ignoring that it's in the minority at the moment; if you beat DL, it will be even further so. But then that would prove you wrong about how DL kills linkshells.

 

[hellstorm]

As for Shadow items, I haven't decided how to distribute them yet. Going to speak to the other leaders about it to think of a good lotting system for them.

As of right now, the most "fair" one I can think of is shadow mantle being free lotted by all PLD's attending, and Shadow Ring being free lotted among all other members with lotting right.

We haven't really decided on a fair lotting rule for Shadow items. The only thing I'm certain of is that shadow Mantle will be tanks-first. Because, lets face it. It doesn't really benefit the LS to the same extent if a Shadow Mantle went to another job.

that seem fair. You giving everyone with lotting right for a chance at a shadow item.

 

[decidence]

Perfect didn't die, it split into two LS's which continued runs almost without interruption (PerfectAtaraxia took some time to do some recruitment again first). And PA is still around, I've been running with a lot of these people for like 1.5 years now.

 

[Uzor]

Well, GTC are one of the few shells who can do Dynamis - Xarcabard whenever we want to since no other shell goes on our times.

And Peregrine, what exactly do you mean with

That being said, dyn difficulty goes as follows:
1. Town losers. Endpoint: dead shell
2. Town winners. Endpoint: uncertain
3. Beau winners. Endpoint: good prognosis
4. Town farmers. Endpoint: good prognosis
5. Beau farmers. Endpoint: good prognosis
6. Xarc winners. Endpoint: good prognosis
7. Xarc farmers. Endpoint: end-stage dyn shell
8. DL farmers. Endpoint: end-stage dyn shell with high distinction

I'd have to dissagree though. Every time we do Dynamis - Xarcabard we farm it with ease. Winning all areas, except for Xarcabard, is just as easy as farming them. there's nothing hard about it. The only exception to this would be Dynamis Lord.

reason being that there's so much luck involved in the fight. He's not easy, if he was, everyone would have killed him by now.

As for your linkshell's Xarcabard drops... The ammount of drops you've got doesn't show how skillfull you are. It only shows how long you've been around. Hell, 1 more MNK, 1 more DRK and 1 more WHM and we have we have about 9 free lots in Beaucedine, and about 5 in Xarcabard. Next THF gloves go to a WHM main.

I wouldn't say that's because we're just that much more skilled then everyone else. I'm sure other shells are just as skilled as us. We go with low numbers, and thus going through the lotting lists are rather fast.

 

[Marajade]

People dont kill the boss while farming for the 30 minute extention? (this obviously does not apply to glacier)

 

[Uzor]

People dont kill the boss while farming for the 30 minute extention? (this obviously does not apply to glacier)

Good point. That's why we recruited when we decided to farm cities again so new people could get the wins from them.

Although Sandy's boss don't have extention The NIN NM is fun though.

 

[hellstorm]

Good point. That's why we recruited when we decided to farm cities again so new people could get the wins from them.

Although Sandy's boss don't have extention The NIN NM is fun though.

hey what not to love about orc nms. Best part when it get charmga off and you kill your ls mates.:biggrin:

 

[Blancho]

Rules of the bet.
1. You have until 3/3/07 to beat the DL.
2. There must be screenshots.

I won't back out. I really don't care if you win this bet. I more just want to see you do it since you say it's so easy.

 

[Uzor]

Rules of the bet.
1. You have until 3/3/07 to beat the DL.
2. There must be screenshots.

I won't back out. I really don't care if you win this bet. I more just want to see you do it since you say it's so easy.

fixed

 

[Blancho]

Lol..

 

[Lavi]

If by "a lot" you mean only one NA linkshell on the server, then yeah, DL leads to lots of linkshells breaking up. As for "unfairly distributed" it's tanks first, no other job would use them other than to show off; the only non-tanks that complain are the kind of people who care more about themselves than the team and you wouldn't want those people in your LS anyways.

You missed the part about "Or a lot of people leave once they defeat DL" or more likely skipped over it. That part aside, when most shells attempt or defeat DL, they have already done a lot of farming and many have obtained the 5/5 they need. What is to keep them going in the shell longer? The idea that they will get more gear? With the way drops are, some shells get a huge excess of one job while another gets just plain fucked. To keep it fair, they would need to wait for everyone to get 5/5 or at the very least, wait till the secondary job has all primaries with 5/5. Some are just not willing to wait that long so they move onto new shells. I am sure all shells know this very well, they are constantly losing members and having to add members here and there.

There is also the added problem of multiple people having tank jobs. With everyone constantly experiencing, having multiple 75 jobs, and plans to level more, it's not hard to see why everyone might want the mantle and ring. Already, there are a lot of people with PLD or NIN leveled. How do you fairly decide which should get it? Those who come those jobs for dynamis? That's unfair for those who put a lot of time in and come as other jobs. They have just as much right to it as the next player. What about PLD vs. NIN? Some argue only PLD should recieve it, but a NIN can put just as much use as it as a PLD. It's not exactly an easy decision and even if you think those people are greedy for wanting it, those people do exist in all shells and can have an effect on a shell.

 

[Bajaratt]

You missed the part about "Or a lot of people leave once they defeat DL" or more likely skipped over it. That part aside, when most shells attempt or defeat DL, they have already done a lot of farming and many have obtained the 5/5 they need. What is to keep them going in the shell longer? The idea that they will get more gear? With the way drops are, some shells get a huge excess of one job while another gets just plain fucked. To keep it fair, they would need to wait for everyone to get 5/5 or at the very least, wait till the secondary job has all primaries with 5/5. Some are just not willing to wait that long so they move onto new shells. I am sure all shells know this very well, they are constantly losing members and having to add members here and there.

There is also the added problem of multiple people having tank jobs. With everyone constantly experiencing, having multiple 75 jobs, and plans to level more, it's not hard to see why everyone might want the mantle and ring. Already, there are a lot of people with PLD or NIN leveled. How do you fairly decide which should get it? Those who come those jobs for dynamis? That's unfair for those who put a lot of time in and come as other jobs. They have just as much right to it as the next player. What about PLD vs. NIN? Some argue only PLD should recieve it, but a NIN can put just as much use as it as a PLD. It's not exactly an easy decision and even if you think those people are greedy for wanting it, those people do exist in all shells and can have an effect on a shell.

No I didn't, I had already addressed it several times and didn't think anyone would would need another, hell it was even in the post you quoted. Once again, we're back to the people that you wouldn't want in your linkshell to begin with, the people who get their stuff and leave as soon as nothing is in it for them. If they're going to leave just because they won't get anything else or they won't get anything for months, they should have joined at all. Dynamis is supposed to be a team effort, like anything else in this game; people who only do things when they benefit are a problem in every endgame activity but successful linkshells weed them out.

As for your point on shadow items, if a linkshell doesn't have any rules set up as to handling shadow items, then of course it's going to fail. The "whoever the leader points to gets the drop" system is inherently unfair, but a clear cut system takes all that away.

Your whole argument boils down to a linkshell full of flakes and with either no plan or a horribly abusive plan for drops; neither of which is the majority of linkshells. You're still focusing on the minority case of linkshells that have killed DL; but as decidence already said, they reformed so it didn't kill the linkshell so much as change the leadership.

 

[Lavi]

Looking for Dynamis shell. I am in it for myself and as soon as I get what I want I am leaving. Also, if I don't get what I want, I am ninja lotting it and warping out.

Yes, I see LS recruiting full of these types of messages daily. No one is going to directly say they plan on leaving as soon as they get the items they desire. Heck, I even believe most don't have the intention to do so and don't even realize they are when they quit. People spend 6 months or more getting 5/5 easily and it puts a lot of strain on someone when only 2-3 pieces of each set are worth using on a regular basis. Most have every intention of staying until they realize staying means spending years doing two runs every week. Most didn't or don't realize the amount of effort it would take just because the drops are so random. Then, there are those who leave because so many left before them and now they are working to get gear for people who weren't even present when they first obtained theirs. You may very well suggest these aren't the greatest people for any linkshell, but how do you differentiate them from those that are? They sure as hell aren't going to state it and they sure don't think of themselves like that either. It's no different than any sky or HNMs shell, many will and do leave once they get gear. Shells will always try to weed those players out, but there is no perfect way to stop it.

Shadow items can never be distributed fairly even if you know the rules before hand or if a majority think it's fair, there is always someone who will think it's unfair even if they still put up with the rules. The only truly fair way is to get everyone both, but we both know that's unlikely. Even if everyone is to agree that only these jobs or those people should obtain them, that still leaves the matter of working for solely those people every time. Spending time obtaining gear specifically for only a few players, then you have to do the same for others (In other words, work harder for jobs that are lacking drops). It's no different than a sky linkshell or HNMs shell, many will and do leave once they get gear. Shells will always try to weed those players out, but there is no perfect way to stop it.

Just out of curiousity and I am not trying to start anything, but since Cythe and Elemmire left, what happened to the upgrading relic weapons in lolDynamis?

Edit: Skipped the Decidence part about Perfect. The fact the shell HAD to be reformed after the incident speaks of how bad the incident actually was. I don't know much about it nor do I particularly care, but if a shell has to reform because of an "incident", then it's not the same shell it once was. It's a new shell.

 

[Uzor]

As for your point on shadow items, if a linkshell doesn't have any rules set up as to handling shadow items, then of course it's going to fail. The "whoever the leader points to gets the drop" system is inherently unfair, but a clear cut system takes all that away.

That reminds me of something that got me laughing for soem time...

Shadow mantle works on a point system. I point at someone who gets to lot

xD

You missed the part about "Or a lot of people leave once they defeat DL" or more likely skipped over it. That part aside, when most shells attempt or defeat DL, they have already done a lot of farming and many have obtained the 5/5 they need. What is to keep them going in the shell longer? The idea that they will get more gear? With the way drops are, some shells get a huge excess of one job while another gets just plain fucked. To keep it fair, they would need to wait for everyone to get 5/5 or at the very least, wait till the secondary job has all primaries with 5/5. Some are just not willing to wait that long so they move onto new shells. I am sure all shells know this very well, they are constantly losing members and having to add members here and there.

There is also the added problem of multiple people having tank jobs. With everyone constantly experiencing, having multiple 75 jobs, and plans to level more, it's not hard to see why everyone might want the mantle and ring. Already, there are a lot of people with PLD or NIN leveled. How do you fairly decide which should get it? Those who come those jobs for dynamis? That's unfair for those who put a lot of time in and come as other jobs. They have just as much right to it as the next player. What about PLD vs. NIN? Some argue only PLD should recieve it, but a NIN can put just as much use as it as a PLD. It's not exactly an easy decision and even if you think those people are greedy for wanting it, those people do exist in all shells and can have an effect on a shell.

Well, I don't want people in my shell that only comes for drops anyway. I personally think Dynamis is fun. I aim to have members in my shell that share my joy towards Dynamis.

Now, I know there's people out there who only do Dynamis for AF2. I don't consider that a very smart reason t ojoin a Dynamis LS, because in msot shells they'll beseverely dissapointed. If you instead join to have a fun time, and consider AF2 a bonus, you'll have a fun time and never be dissapointed. If you join GTC only for AF2, you're in it for the wrong reason. While yes, you'll most likely end up getting AF's and all that, but it shouldn't be the reason you join.

Either way, yes. I want dedicated people. If people end up leaving after we kill DL, then so be it. I'll still be there doing Dynamis. I'm sure we can farm any and all Dynamis areas with 18 people. And I'll atleast sleep good knowing those other 17 are dedicated and enjoy doing Dynamis.

 

[Lavi]

That was Bajaratt who posted it. >.>

 

[Uzor]

That was Bajaratt who posted it. >.>

sorry >.< copy/paste the wrong post <.<;

 

[decidence]

Edit: Skipped the Decidence part about Perfect. The fact the shell HAD to be reformed after the incident speaks of how bad the incident actually was. I don't know much about it nor do I particularly care, but if a shell has to reform because of an "incident", then it's not the same shell it once was. It's a new shell.

If you compare most Dynamis LS's after 1-2years of being together you will probably find that 70% of the regular members are different from the regulars that started the shell, we just resumed runs under a different name with about 50% of the shell consisting of new recruits.

 

[Ajs]

You missed the part about "Or a lot of people leave once they defeat DL" or more likely skipped over it.

My shell has lost two members that attended regularly since beating DL. One of them left as soon as he went 5/5 (about a month after the DL kill) and another one left over a personal dispute with me. I think my shell is doing pretty well.

Just out of curiousity and I am not trying to start anything, but since Cythe and Elemmire left, what happened to the upgrading relic weapons in lolDynamis?

Cythe had the option for people to sponsor once he got enough coins for stage 4, the problem was that nobody ever did. We have a few people in shell who sponsor cities now, but nobody sponsors EVERY run like Cythe did. (He quit without turning in coins for stage 4 and gave them for me to do stuff with)





I believe the problem with other LSs is that runs are no fun. If your LS runs more like a machine than friends, you're doing it wrong. I've actually had a member come out and say "I'm surprised you let people talk in LS chat... most LSs don't". My LS has a fun, laid back atmosphere. I know majority of my LS enjoys running with us.

 

[Uzor]

I believe the problem with other LSs is that runs are no fun. If your LS runs more like a machine than friends, you're doing it wrong. I've actually had a member come out and say "I'm surprised you let people talk in LS chat... most LSs don't". My LS has a fun, laid back atmosphere. I know majority of my LS enjoys running with us.

Yeah, I let my members talk in LS chat too as long as they don't overdo it during a huge link or something xD

 

[Claudhert]

Speaking as a non-dynamis run leader.. I can honestly say when i join a Dynamis shell its for the long haul

Ive been in 4 dynamis shells in my FFXI career.. TaintedLegends dynamis offspring LS (which i cant remeber the name of). GrandTheftChoco, PinCks and LolDynamisII. And since ive been in those shells i never joined another until the Shells disbanded (TL-shell, and PinCks) or was booted for my attendace durring school (GTC)

Im currently in LolDynamisII and i plan to stay with them till the end of FFXI or they disband.

yes I want AF, but once i get full PLD af ill move to WAR, then another job. And mabye ill even upgrade my relic Sheild. Theres plety to do in Dynamis once you kill DL you just gotta want to do it