Elitists never learn, do they?

lol @ Peregrine
The dancing bear is back or was it the bearded lady?

I'm not even as decked out as Deci on Ninja and I outdamage warriors.
Anytime you want to Ninja cannon let me know Decidence.
 
But then why don't DRK use Ridill too? x_x;
Sorry for keeping this derailed....I'm just kinda stupid at that kindof thing~
 
Mishaela said:
But then why don't DRK use Ridill too?
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They do. A DRK with Ridill is one of the most deadly DD in the game. If I got a Ridill I would prolly switch to axe/ridill full time except on high evasion mobs like Kirin.
 
Dodging the flame for a moment:

Skaw said:
Yeah, it even puts Focus to shame. Focus with Temple Crown is only +30. :(

I've heard Agressor being +45, but unsure if thats with Warrior's Lorica or not.
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From tests I've seen (and I have not bothered testing this myself), Aggressor is +25 flat. Warrior's Lorica reduces the evasion penalty, nothing more.

Mishaela said:
DRK gets I believe 220 Club at 75, and 240 Sword
WAR gets I think 240 Club and 250 Sword.
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DRK club skill cap @ 75 = 220
WAR club skill cap @ 75 = 240

DRK sword cap @ 75 = 240
WAR sword cap @ 75 = 250

Considering our A+ weapons cap at 276, the difference is huge.

Mishaela said:
Kraken Club, if I remember right, will hit 4 times average (20%TP)
Ridill will hit 2 times average (14%TP), making KClub much better TP gain if acc isn't an issue.
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Ignoring the skill difference between club & sword for both jobs, look at the max base dmg. Kraken, in a full 8-hit round, will pseudo-'cap' at 88 base dmg. My crappy great axe does better than that, in one hit. Ridill, in a full 3-hit round, will pseudo-'cap' at 120 base dmg. No weapon in the game, even relic scythe, can touch that. Personally, if I had a choice between Kraken and Ridill for my WAR, I'd go for the latter hands-down. I wouldn't wipe my ass with a Kraken if I had a Ridill.

Well... alright bad example.

Mishaela said:
Why is Ridill better for WAR in the first place? I mean if Double Attack procs the same with KClub as it does with Ridill, that means they'd get even more TP than they already do..someone please fill me in on this. ^^;;
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I think I answered this above... I dunno. I just like pretending I know what I'm talking about.
 
decidence said:
JohnnyB and Msa gonna come after you. Just cuz they don't eat meat doesn't mean they are jokes lol... almost everyone I PT with is usually pretty well geared, and in the case of JB I don't think WAR's can ask for much more then that except maybe a Ridill =P

I actually PT'd with Bramd's WAR yesterday... he did worse then both of them, and I think he has a Relic doesn't he?
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Bramd's WAR is suprizingly average. His PLD has excalibur, but he doesn't use it anymore (go figure)

He doesn't have a HNMLS either, never has. He's a pretty gimped PLD too, his excalibur + full PLD AF2 is enough to make people go OMFGHELLO but other than that he's really just average.
 
Another thing to remember about Rydill vs Kracken...

You can buy a Kracken, even if you're a nobody, as long as you can make the gil for it. And the mob that drops it, although horribly low droprate, is killable by 3-4 people.

Rydill on the other hand requires quite a it more people, and you really have to be there for it. No amount of gil can buy a Rydill. [Although I suppose you could merc a whole LS to do it for you, maybe...]

Hell, I have a Kracken, but I would deffinately be up in the tree busting my ass if I could even use a Rydill.
 
In addition the Suppanomi(sp?) earring from DM adds +5 Sword skill as well as enhance dual-wield. Obviously best earring for a ridill wielding war or drk and another bonus over the kraken.
 
NIN club cap isn't aroun 203 ish ? if I'm not mistaken.

When my nin uses the club I miss a lot compared to war's with it or drk's with it. even If I have accuracy gear.
 
Don't forget another thing: DRK Axe caps at 240, Warrior caps at 269. Meaning the main hand Axe, especially for Rampage, will have significantly lower Attack and Accuracy too.
 
kraken isnt all that....... i partied with a war/nin on my mnk two weeks ago, and owned a war/nin with kraken.

war/nin: kraken, 2 flame rings, pcc, osode, etc.
mnk/nin[me]: destroyers, rajas/flame, sh+1, spectacles, etc.

he was first voke, and hasted. i was not hasted, but did not need to voke essentially.

anyways, it wasnt even close. i was about 200+ dmg above, WITH a nin sub (greatly lowers damage with no berserk, less str, and loss of double attack -- even though i have brutal earring).

----------------------------
on another note--- theres a reason why the war's in my ls are so good... adaman body and ridill <3<3 im pretty sure that the "decked out war" you are considering has neither.... and the ninja that you are comparing to probably has most their god gear considering events with the ls that he is in.
 
hmm, where to begin..

ridill is the best piece of gear a WAR can equip (never again should you EVER compare a ridill to e.body, e.body is a joke compared to Ridill, period) hands down

(merits and suppanomimi are a MUST to get the most out of what this weapon is capable of) Ridill + Joyeuse with capped sword merits, suppanomimi & fortitude torque is arguably the best mainhand/offhand combo for WAR in the game. with haste (spell) and a good haste setup (17-20%), this equipment build can out-tp a blinged 75 MNK with black belt, as well as bringing up their native B skill in sword (250) to 278, which is 2 points higher than A+

second, meat in KRT works. those mobs are on the verge of conning "Tough", they are generally a few levels lower than D.Weapons (And many levels lower than Kindred Demons in U.Range). knowing this, meat does NOT work in sky/u.range as well as it does in KRT, even WITH aggressor up. any WAR worth his own shit knows this, even with a full accuracy setup, eating meat will drop your accuracy to about 75-80%, lowering your DOT per fight considerably, but I guess if you want that random FREAK high-number rampage for your e-penis, go for it and eat meat

about kraken offhand, i've never used one in a merit party, though I have partied with a war/nin who used juggernaut/kraken, and his TP gain really wasn't that impressive, however the damage/hit that the kraken was doing, was impressive, for being an 11 base damage weapon, he was hitting for about 30-40 damage per hit when the club landed (this was in u.range)

so uh, summary

ridill > all for WAR with sword merits & specific pieces of gear
sushi > meat for WAR (since we don't whore KRT when we need merits)
kraken offhand isn't as bad as people think

man, there was so much bullshit in this thread, I couldn't believe it @_@
 
Back on the siderail, Suppa won't increase your TP gain unless you're at the 5.0 per hit floor already, because while it drops your delay, it also drops your TP per hit. You'll get more of a TP gain from 3 acc in the slot, and TP is your goal when you offhand a gimp damage multi-hit or low delay weapon.
 
Stouter said:
Back on the siderail, Suppa won't increase your TP gain unless you're at the 5.0 per hit floor already, because while it drops your delay, it also drops your TP per hit. You'll get more of a TP gain from 3 acc in the slot, and TP is your goal when you offhand a gimp damage multi-hit or low delay weapon.
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Joyeuse & Ridill are not gimp-damage multi-hit weapons, and figuring they attack more than once, more than 50% of the time, suppanomimi does indeed increase your TP gain with these weapons
 
Reality said:
Joyeuse & Ridill are not gimp-damage multi-hit weapons, and figuring they attack more than once, more than 50% of the time, suppanomimi does indeed increase your TP gain with these weapons
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Maneater - Delay 276
Joyeuse - Delay 224
Ridill - Delay 236

Maneater and Joyeuse DW2 - Delay 425, 5.7 TP per hit, 1.0 TP/74.56 delay
Maneater and Joyeuse DW2 + Suppa - Delay 400, 5.4 TP per hit, 1 TP/74.07 delay

Maneater + Ridill DW2 - Delay 435, 5.8 TP per hit, 1.0 TP/75 delay
Maneater + Ridill DW2 + Suppa - Delay 409, 5.5 TP per hit, 1.0 TP/74.36 delay

Since the proc rate for the multi attack is the same, it cancels out. If you're getting 6% more attacks in, that's 6% more multi hits, which is 6% more overall hits in still. If you lose 5% per hit in TP, then it comes close to balancing. Your TP return ends up as less than a 1% boost from Suppa in the axe delay range. More often than not, 3 Acc will give you a better return on TP gain.


And btw, I was talking K-Club and Hornetsneedle and gimp damage low delay and multi-hit weapons being offhanded for TP.
 
Mishaela said:
But then why don't DRK use Ridill too? x_x;
Sorry for keeping this derailed....I'm just kinda stupid at that kindof thing~
Click to expand...

Would if I had one....listen to Bigboy, Phraust, Reality, Cmdrfly...
 
Stouter the earring also gives you +5 sword skill which I believe is +5acc and +5 att for that sword as well. That earring is far better than putting +3acc on that ear(and also you don't have to have CoP finished, Zm, and Bahamut for the Suppanomi).
 
+5 Sword won't help any with and axe in main hand and a k club or HN offhand. :P
 
So where was this before it decended into normal and logical discussion? Coulda sworn there was some kinda Peregrine flame here...
 
I was eating meat on Rams and Abraxas' last night, Reality, and still had absolutely no problem with accuracy unless I was hit with Scratch. Those mobs are slightly higher than D. Weapons.

Just for some quick info for you:

Spartoi Warrior 78-80
Decorative Weapon: 79-81
Spartoi Sorcerer 80-82
Abraxas: 80-83
Tavnazian Ram: 81-83
Aura Statues: 79-84

Oh wait! Whats that? Spartoi Sorcerers are a higher level range than Decoratives, yet you claim Meat is fine in KRT but not Ru'Avitau? Tsk Tsk. As well, since I was doing fine on Abraxis' and Rams, Statues wouldn't be too much of an issue.

Merits have eliminated the need for sushi in an EXP PT.
 
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