Final Fantasy Online

[RoM]

WoW sucks go play ffxi or better yet play vanguard

Way to recommend a WoW knockoff there, slick.

And to those of you who are going to froth at the mouth over that comment give me a fucking break and go look at in game footage. Vanguard is crap. Much like LOTRO it offers nothing that's not already being done right elsewhere.

The plain nuts and bolts of it is FFXI is where it's at ... for 5-7 years ago. Which isn't that bad of a slam if you think about the context as opposed to the source.

/end obligatory check in to a WoW v FFXI thread.

 

[Mai Ikari]

They won't have better DPS than a cannon job, and that's where it's unbalanced. The game is broken when an average geared warrior parses evenly or even better DPS than an amazingly geared -Any job I mentioned-

Yes, they will have better DPS than a cannon job. I've seen it. Highest parses I've ever seen have come from Ridill WARs, Black Belt MNKs, and a THF eating Hedgehog Pie. DRK/SAM is insane too, keeps up with my DPS the few times I've seen it wearing proper gear, have never seen it inside a real merit party though. I've never seen an AH-geared WAR/MNK outparse an endgame geared DRK/THF/RNG/SAM... Have never partied with an endgame geared DRG/BST/PLD, so I can't comment on them. I've heard that PLD/NIN can do pretty well, and DRG with Homam.

BST does BST-burn anyway, last I heard those give pretty good exp.

 

[Mishaela]

To the nameless people who left me negative messages, could you please clarify how not liking a game for it's graphics is "shallow"? A game needs to be well-rounded to keep people interested, and some people prefer certain things over others. Some people can get around so-so graphics or bad sound if it has a good fighting system, or party system or whichever, it's all preference. I personally don't like WoW's voiceacting or graphics, it's too rugged for my taste. I loved WoW's crafting system, but really in the end the game just wasn't for me; it didn't cater to enough of my tastes in a game.

I'm into more cute things, like FFXI, RO, Flyff, and Trickster - but these games ALSO have their own faults, the second two to a degree that makes me not really like them either. Hell, I don't like WoW's graphics but I still applaud it for not using the same skin for every single monster of [x] race (at least...not that I've seen)

I repeat - I personally don't like the game cause I don't like the look and the sound. It's kindof like how people's opinions in movies change - one person might say it's a good movie, someone else may say it's bad due to the plot, and someone else may say it's bad due to the acting. Opinions change. You guys wanna karmabomb people just because their opinion of something so completely insignificant is different, go back to goddamn Allakhazam. Good god.




On topic - Yes, FFXI has some job imbalances, some more obvious than others. But every MMO I've seen does.

 

[Bajaratt]

Wow, people got pissy over not liking the graphics? That's one of the lamest reasons to hate someone I've ever heard of. Especially because you're right, the game is lacking graphically.

 

[Skaw]

Wow, people got pissy over not liking the graphics? That's one of the lamest reasons to hate someone I've ever heard of. Especially because you're right, the game is lacking graphically.

I wouldn't say the game is lacking graphically. It's just not an attractive style. I think WoW looks great for an MMO, but the style is just a huge turn off to me.

 

[Ruffyreborn]

WoW and FFXI are almost two completely different games with some similarities. WoW is easier to ppick up and play, for the simple minded people. FFXI is a little more complicated, and takes much more work to enjoy. Kind of reminds me of the "get a mac" commercials. WoW is mac, FFXI is PC. You get more depth with FFXI, but easier, more relaxed(lol) gameplay, with WoW.

I used to (and still do, on occasion) play PSO. Its one of the simplest, easiest, and most satisfying online games Ive ever played. Its a good thing to pick up when FFXI has that boring streak that hits sometimes, because theres nothing you feel like doing. If you want a private server, PM me and Ill get you the links and crap to PSO:BB if you like.

 

[Ruffyreborn]

Wow, people got pissy over not liking the graphics? That's one of the lamest reasons to hate someone I've ever heard of. Especially because you're right, the game is lacking graphically.

WoW's graphics are fine, despite what people think. The game pretty much follow's what it grew up looking like, although I believe a "Diablo-esque" game would have been much more satisfying. And hey, WoW has no load time. Thats kinda cool.

 

[Tymon]

They can't change the WoW graphics without messing up the lore.

At least in appearance.

They do need to tone up the textures though and they said they were intending to.

 

[Svina]

They won't have better DPS than a cannon job, and that's where it's unbalanced. The game is broken when an average geared warrior parses evenly or even better DPS than an amazingly geared -Any job I mentioned-

In EXP yeah, big deal on WARs.

They can't stun or self heal, debuff (DRK)

They can't increase treasure drop rate (lol?) or perform gigantic damage bursts that transfer hate to another party member. (THF)

They can't guarantee full flexibility in skillchain and TP options (SAM)

They can't mitigate damage or hold hate solidly, or heal themselves to some extent (PLD)

They can't give party buffs and deal decent damage with absolutely no hate gained (SMN)

They don't have the ability to completely drop hate after dealing a massive amount of damage (DRG)

They don't have the ability to control area mobs and/or use them to their advantage (BST)

They don't have the ability to... uh... Slug Shot? Okay maybe RNG suck =P

Basically, I'm saying there's more to this game than just cannon partying. Sure some jobs can do these kinds of parties and level up quickly, but then what?

WAR is a great overall damage dealer. So is MNK, that is their specialty. There is a lot of things they can't do that other jobs can. If the game was nothing but WARs, BLMs, and WHMs... well... i assure you a lot of shit would not get done =P

 

[Calais]

Kid n Play movies suck. (It's on TBS, lawl)

Oh, you bastard. Say what you like about FFXI but you leave Kid n Play out of this! House Party is a wondrous classic that no video collection should be without.

FFXI has a ton of problems. I still enjoy playing it, but I never want to play another SE MMO after this.

 

[Tim Wakefield]

I am not a WoW player. I have never tried it, nor will I ever probably. I have nothing against WoW, but some of you people are morons.

Let me lay it out for you...

1) Neo lists reasons why he hates this game
2) People say "Lawl WoW has shittyz graphicz lawlcopter"
3) If you even mentioned WoW, in comparison to FFXI, then GTFO. That has nothing to do with the OP, and bascially nobody cares about your opinion here. FFXI vets love the game, and will give you every reason why WoW sucks. WoW vets will tell you why the game is soooo much better than FFXI. Moral of the story: Nobody gives a FUCK! Save your whining and lame graphics comparisons for someone who cares, because you certainly won't find any of the above here...

Thank you.

 

[Bajaratt]

I am not a WoW player. I have never tried it, nor will I ever probably. I have nothing against WoW, but some of you people are morons.

Let me lay it out for you...

1) Neo lists reasons why he hates this game
2) People say "Lawl WoW has shittyz graphicz lawlcopter"
3) If you even mentioned WoW, in comparison to FFXI, then GTFO. That has nothing to do with the OP, and bascially nobody cares about your opinion here. FFXI vets love the game, and will give you every reason why WoW sucks. WoW vets will tell you why the game is soooo much better than FFXI. Moral of the story: Nobody gives a FUCK! Save your whining and lame graphics comparisons for someone who cares, because you certainly won't find any of the above here...

Thank you.

Actually, it does:

Yep. I still play too, sorta. I just can't let all of these flaws go unheard of. And I couldn't sleep (Thank you you-know-who...), So I made this flame as I was joining a WSG arena in WoW.

He made the OP while he was playing WoW, obviously they're not related.:wacko:

 

[Tim Wakefield]

Actually, it does:


He made the OP while he was playing WoW, obviously they're not related.:wacko:

Thats fantastic. So lets sit here and make the SAME FUCKING COMPARISONS between FFXI and WoW that have already been beaten into the ground 100x over...

Rebuttal: WoW is ugly as sin. I'm sure some people can enjoy it for other qualities but if you can't like that graphics, that alone lowers it's fun several notches...

FFXI's chat system is a hell of a lot better than WoW's. Unless you buy one of the keyboards that has the buttons with the chat modes already built in, you have to type /p, /g, /s every time you want to chat in a different mode, but then it makes that new chat mode your default. At least in FFXI, you just have to hit ctrl+p/s/l to speak in a different mode than you default, without changing your default. About the only advantage WoW has is that you can move the window around, but then it's built on an entirely different platform that actually uses the mouse, so it's not much of a comparison.

I also agree with Mish, WoW is ugly as hell.

FFXI search system is easier and better as well.

I like the events better too, from what I've seen about WoW's events, you have to be high level or just be willing to die a lot running through every zone talking to npc's. Yeah, some of the gear you get from the FFXI events isn't hugely useful, and some can require you to pay a bunch if you have no patience, but they're still largely more enjoyable.

FFXI's pvp sucks balls, but wow's sucks even more when I can get ganked by some retard 20 levels higher while I'm in the bathroom. PVP in general sucks, but at least FFXI's requires consent.

I agree wholeheartedly with what you all have posted regarding this subject because I trust you and respect you as human beings.

Not really, WoW is more fun. LAWLZ



DONT TELL ME YOU'RE ON BLOODSCALP, UFFFFFFFFFFFffffff

I'll roll there after I hit 70 on Kel'Thuzad :|

I'll continue if you want...

 

[Tim Wakefield]

P.S. Good job mods! Top notch job on this thread!

 

[Bajaratt]

Report the thread then or just stay the hell out of it. Stop whining already, no one's forcing you to read it; if you don't like it, don't read it.

 

[Skaw]

BST is an insanely useful job to have at 75. It doesn't matter that it sucks in exp at 75. Whoopty do. BST has a variety of uses endgame. People are just too retarded to give it a chance. Like most jobs. That's not my problem. That's their problem.

Yeah, I'm not saying the job is useless/perfect at 75. Towards the lower end of the leveling ladder, the jobs just a fucking steamroller in damage, before the other jobs get their niche abilities(bergressor) and stacked traits(DW/MA)

 

[Neolink]

I am not a WoW player. I have never tried it, nor will I ever probably. I have nothing against WoW, but some of you people are morons.

Let me lay it out for you...

1) Neo lists reasons why he hates this game
2) People say "Lawl WoW has shittyz graphicz lawlcopter"
3) If you even mentioned WoW, in comparison to FFXI, then GTFO. That has nothing to do with the OP, and bascially nobody cares about your opinion here. FFXI vets love the game, and will give you every reason why WoW sucks. WoW vets will tell you why the game is soooo much better than FFXI. Moral of the story: Nobody gives a FUCK! Save your whining and lame graphics comparisons for someone who cares, because you certainly won't find any of the above here...

Thank you.

Once again I find myself in total agreement w/ u.

 

[decidence]

Your chat system sucks.

Your auction house system sucks.

Your endgame sucks.

Your level grind sucks.

Your quests suck.

Your job versatility sucks.

Your zones suck.

Your economy sucks.

Your events suck.

Your trade skills suck.

Your unbalanced jobs suck. Bad.

Your mounts suck.

Your same-skinned mobs suck.

Pre-nerf RNG was okay.

Tarutaru are okay too.

Your endgame still sucks.

Kid n Play movies suck. (It's on TBS, lawl)

Your PvP sucks.

Your PvE sucks.

A huge chunk of people that play you suck.

Nearly everything about you sucks.

Anyone care to make a rebuttal?

This is Neosquall comparing the two games, he might not have said it in the OP but he has been playing WoW for a week now on my server and we talk about these things all the time.

Also I'm not a FFXI hater, but I am in the game development business and I have seen flaws in FFXI for a long time, I too never thought I would play WoW but after playing the free trial I got hooked on it. I do see flaws in WoW as well but I will make comparisons between the two games here... damn I should just goto bed but this topic interests me.

Your chat system sucks.
FFXI Chat system is "OK" but WoW's is more familiar. Press Enter to start chatting and Enter again to send. Simple.


Your auction house system sucks.
FFXI's system is "DIFFERENT" in that FFXI limits you to 7 items, but what I really think Neo is getting at here is what ties into the economy in general and that there is way too much supply which puts a stranglehold on the amount of stuff you can sell in a week. WoW allows you to sell as much stuff as you want at a time, charges you "tax" based on how long you want to list it and people simply don't goto the AH to buy many items. Anything thats of the lower two qualities (grey and white) are almost never on the AH unless they are materials for popular mid/high-level synths.


Your endgame sucks.
Neither myself of Neo has the capability of drawing a comparison to WoW in this regard yet. However I can safely say that FFXI's end game is quite dry in terms of "action packed gameplay" which is what most young gamers want. Maybe old people want to sit around at a camp and chat for 3 hours but real gamers want almost constant action or at least some involvement in real gameplay (I'm of course referring to instances and raids etc).


Your level grind sucks.
I really doubt he means that actual leveling sucks. The problem is that in FFXI it is almost so incredibly linear that SE would have to make a whole new game to change it. In FFXI all you can do to EFFECTIVELY level up is party with 5 other people and find a very specific zone (there will only be a handful) and be at that zone with low competition (each zone or area can only handle a couple parties).

In WoW not only can you solo to Lv70 by grinding on mobs exactly like FFXI but you can join instances with a 5 man party, you can turn in quests for SUBSTANTIAL XP rewards (ex. In WoW around Lv45 it takes 100K XP to level, you get around 200-400 XP per kill which take like 10-15 seconds each, and each quest you turn in which you are completing while killing stuff will give you a bonus 3-7K XP and you turn in a handful of these each level).


Your quests suck.
I wouldn't say WoW's quests are any better. I'm almost Lv52 now and already getting bored of them. Although FFXI's quests suck for a different reason (no reward). WoW's quests suck for being repetitive (kill 10 of these, collect 5 of these... etc etc).


Your job versatility sucks.
This is huge. In FFXI most jobs are used for very specific things and can't be interchangable in many situations. The most glaringly obvious of these is the White Mage. A totally underplayed job which is used only for healing. In WoW theres a job called Priest also a healer which is probably also one of the least versitile jobs but can be spec'd to do different things such as be an effective damage dealer. Any job in WoW can be effective solo or 1v1, or in group PvP and PvE.


Your zones suck.
Yes, they do...FFXI's zones (at least in CoP and ToAU) have very nice art in some places but FFXI lacks epicness! Theres no massive towers (other then crags) huge hills that you have to climb, no vista's and very little chaff. The FFXI environments are usually pretty plain and just scattered with mobs and a simple texture overlay.


Your economy sucks.
The supply and demand economy model is very broken. Things stay on the AH for way too long which leads to a lot of undercutting. In WoW the longest you can list something on the AH is 24hrs which gives everyone a chance to sell something. Also you cannot check price histories if you want to sell something and it has never been sold or you haven't ever seen it sold. So you have to price is based on how much you think it is worth, or even relist it a few times until it sells.


Your events suck.
Haven't done an event in WoW yet but FFXI's have always been pretty boring. Too time consuming for crap rewards that are never used.


Your trade skills suck.
I don't mind FFXI's trade skills, in that I think Neo's complaint is the difficulty it takes to level them. In WoW you can level tradeskills with the materials you loot from corpses for the most part. Each item you can synth has 3 different level caps in which the chance for skillup deteriorates. But for the most part you're getting a skillup after every synth. Oh and you can break or lose materials.


Your unbalanced jobs suck. Bad.
I think long time WoW players would argue that WoW has just as many balance issues with jobs. Ask Elemmire or something.


Your mounts suck.
Uhh yea... fuck breeding for 30 days only to get a subpar rental chocobo. When you're level 40 you get a mount that you can summon anywhere and get off and on as many times as you want without having to recharge some stupid whistle. Nevermind the fact that at Lv60 you can get even better mounts and again at 70.


Your same-skinned mobs suck.
I'm noticing the same thing in WoW so I'm not sure where this argument is coming from. It's impossible for an Art team to have unique mobs for every zone in a MMO. It takes rougly a month to mode, texture, animate a single model in my studio. Re-texturing can take as little as a day or two.


Your PvP sucks.
I never understood carebears. I love PvP wherever it is. I also like to show some responsibility and not gank people who will give me no benefit. I also even let people go by who may give me benefit for killing but I feel it's not worth it to ruin their questing or whatever. Sure theres people out there who will just be total dicks but I just love the extra element of a possible fight starting out of nowhere. Also the battlegrounds are so fast paced and action packed compared to FFXI's ballista and such, it's no comparison, WoW's PvP completely trounces FFXI's attempt at inserting PvP into a game that wasn't designed for it.


Your PvE sucks.
Well it's pretty much the same as WoW, except WoW has several more interesting ways to PvE. Also jobs in WoW are always active. There's no such thing as a job that you just hit Attack and forget about it like Warrior or Monk or something. In WoW every single job is using abilities every few seconds or so and fights are quick and lively then your on to the next thing. The Epic fights are saved for bosses (which are regular encounters not 3hr waits).


A huge chunk of people that play you suck.
I would have to say that theres sucky people in both games, it's just possible that since theres more people playing WoW and the game is indeed that much more "action packed" that people are forced to learn how to play their job or never have fun. People don't care as much about their reputation in WoW and will not give a second thought to kicking a slacking player... you don't see the same people twice very often for a instance or raid unless your in the same guild or running the same instance all day. With more accountability for your skill you damn well be sure you won't get your ass kicked from groups.

 

[Pastry]

I agree with most all your points Decidence, except sucky people.

I've seen a staggering amount of successful stupid people in both games. But, WoW has more players and its more appealing to a younger audience, the number of immature people in WoW is very high last time I played.

 

[Mishaela]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH..

I'm sorry we wasted an amount of your lifespan equal to less than that of what one cigarette is believed to whittle off. We all owe you one cigarette.


*Big edit for you~*
While my main viewpoint [vs WoW] is the graphics, most all of his flames towards FFXI apply to virtually every MMO in existance anyhow.I mean hell -


- Your chat system sucks.
Most games have some aggrivating button that requires you push something to open a chat window, then while in this window you can't push keys that may be vital to execute an action.

- Your auction house system sucks.
Most games don't have an auctioning system to speak off. And the ones that do either most always have some form of bid history and/or "current bid", which just turns it into a game of undercutting if stock is high and gouging if stock is low.

- Your endgame sucks.
Always sucks when a game comes to an slowdown.

- Your level grind sucks.
All MMOs are levelgrinders.

- Your quests suck.
Two sides to this: No quests = nonstop, droning kill. Nothing BUT quests = game ends once you've done all the quests. It's lose-lose. The happy medium is if there's a couple good quests, but then it's near impossible to make an actually worthwhile quest thats either monopolized/abused to the point where it's no longer good.

- Your job versatility sucks.
Most all games have the exact same crap. Healer, Paladin, Barbarian, Archer, Thief, Wizard. Some try to be "original" and throw in a Necromancer or Beast Tamer. Same crap, different names.

- Your zones suck.
Very few games have a varying environment of areas. At least half the MMOs out there have a "you've seen one area, you've seen them all" look.

- Your economy sucks.
All economies decompose as they get older, especially ones prone to hacking (D2, PSO, PSU)

- Your events suck.
Most all games' events suck. They can't give good sellables because people will monopolize it, and they can't give good unsellables because it'll forever give people imbalances that others would complain about.

- Your trade skills suck.
Most games don't have trade skills at all.

- Your unbalanced jobs suck. Bad.
No MMO I've ever played has come remotely close to having balanced jobs.

- Your mounts suck.
Most MMOs only have one mount, and thus, suck.

- Your same-skinned mobs suck.
You're right, FFXI is a bunchof lazy bastards for this.

- Pre-nerf RNG was okay.
So was pre-nerf Shaman?!

- Tarutaru are okay too.
My Tauren named Milkshakes brings all the boys to the yard.

- Your endgame still sucks.
One you hit the end it tends to suck and continue sucking. (And you thought she was kidding. :wink: )

- Kid n Play movies suck. (It's on TBS, lawl)
Yes.

- Your PvP sucks.
It's proportionate to how badly the game's jobs are imbalanced.

- Your PvE sucks.
Same.

- A huge chunk of people that play you suck.
Stop this planet, I'm getting off.

- Nearly everything about you sucks.
I know I don't have much but lets not get to name calling here...