Gas prices

Studies showed that Elk?(something like deer, which species eludes me) absolutely loved the pipelines up in Alaska because they were warm.
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Caribou.

World-wide massive cattle farming and the resulting cowpie farts cause somewhere around 30% of the greenhouse gasses that contribute to global warming (Hello, Methane).
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Myth.

Britain itself isn't self sufficient :P isn't all that oil in Scotland? So the UK can be but not all parts of the UK. Hence why there's fear of Scotland leaving the UK (or so there was sometime ago, I haven't bothered to keep up on it).
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UK is short for the United Kingdom of Great Britain. UK = Britain. You're thinking of England. Which the Englishman you were replying to was not talking about.
 
I heard that there is actually a larger oil reserve under the entirety of Michigan and the Great Lakes than that of Alaska. I'm not sure if thats true, but if we have a shitton of oil to ourselves why not just start using a little of it and watch the foreign countires start begging us to come back and buy their crap?
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Because no matter where the gas is found, Alaska/Michigan/Uranus, it will always go to the international Market FIRST before being sold to the US's reserves. We'll never see our own gas for ourselves. It just won't happen.
 
All I have to say is click my signature.
 
2.20 bucks a litre here and the price jacking isn't scheduled to affect our prices for another 2~3 weeks.
Somehow I have no sympathy for people complaining about how they don't get to pay 30 cents a gallon.
If you're really that outraged over the prices then catch a bus or train to work/school/ect and STFU. you could even try and see if any taxis have forgotten to upgrade thier fares in accordance with the price of gas.
 
A friend sent me this e-mail, something to chew on...

TIPS ON PUMPING GAS

I don't know what you are paying for
gasoline.... but here in California we
are also paying higher, up to $3.50 per gallon.
But my line of work is in
petroleum for about 31 years now, so here are
some tricks to get more of
your money's worth for every gallon..

Here at the Kinder Morgan Pipeline where I work
in San Jose , CA we deliver
about 4 million gallons in a 24-hour period thru
the pipeline. One day is
diesel the next day is jet fuel, and gasoline,
regular and premium grades.
We have 34-storage tanks here with a total
capacity of 16,800,000 gallons.

Only buy or fill up your car or truck in the
early morning when the ground
temperature is still co ld. Remember that all
service stations have their
storage tanks buried below ground. The colder
the ground the more dense the
gasoline, when it gets warmer gasoline expands,
so buying in the afternoon
or in the evening....your gallon is not exactly
a gallon . In the petroleum
business, the specific gravity and the
temperature of the gasoline, diesel
and jet fuel, ethanol and other petroleum
products plays an important role.

A 1-degree rise in temperature is a big deal for
this business. But the
service stations do not have temperature
compensation at the pumps.

When you're filling up do not squeeze the
trigger of the nozzle to a fast
mode. If you look you will see that the trigger
has three (3)stages: low,
middle, and high. In slow mode you should be
pumping on low speed, thereby
minimizing the vapors that are created while you
are pumping. All hoses at
the pump have a vapor return. If you are pumping
on the fast rate, some
other liquid that goes to your tank becomes
vapor. Those vapors are being
sucked up and back into the underground storage
tank so you're getting less
wort h for your money.

One of the most important tips is to fill up
when your gas tank is HALF FULL
or HALF EMPTY. The reason for this is, the more
gas you have in your tank
the less air occupying its empty space. Gasoline
evaporates faster than you
can imagine. Gasoline storage tanks have an
internal floating roof. This
roof serves as zero clearance between the gas
and the atmosphere, so it
minimizes the evaporation. Unlike service
stations, here where I work, every
truck that we load is temperature compensated so
that every gallon is
actually the exact amount.

Another reminder, if there is a gasoline truck
pumping into the storage
tanks when you stop to buy gas, DO NOT fill
up--most likely the gasoline is
being stirred up as the gas is being delivered,
and you might pick up some
of the dirt that normally settles on the bottom.
Hope this will help you get
the most value for your money.

DO SHARE THESE TIPS WITH OTHERS!

WHERE T O BUY USA GAS, THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO
KNOW. READ ON

Gas rationing in the 80's worked even though we
grumbled about it. It might
even be good for us! The Saudis are boycotting
American goods. We should
return the favor.

An interesting thought is to boycott their GAS.

Every time you fill up the car, you can avoid
putting more money into the
coffers of Saudi Arabia . Just buy from gas
companies that don't import
their oil from the Saudis.

Nothing is more frustrating than the feeling
that every time I fill-up the
tank, I am sending my money to people who are
trying to kill me, my family,
and my friends.

I thought it might be interesting for you to
know which oil companies are
the best to buy gas from and which major
companies import Middle Eastern
oil.

These companies import Middle Eastern oil:

Shell....... ......... ......... .. 205,742,000
barrels

Chevron/Texaco. ........ 144,332,000 barrels

Exx on/Mobil. ......... ..... 130,082,000
barrels

Marathon/Speedway. .. 11 7,740,000 barrels

Amoco....... ......... ......... ...62,231, 000
barrels

Citgo gas is from South America, from a Dictator
who hates Americans. If you
do the math at $30/barrel, these imports amount
to over $18 BILLION!
(oil is now $90 - $100 a barrel

Here are some large companies that do not import
Middle Eastern oil:

Sunoco...... ......... ...0 barrels

Conoco...... ......... .. 0 barrels

Sinclair.... ......... .....0 barrels

BP/Phillips. ......... ...0 barrels

Hess........ ......... .....0 barrels

ARC0........ ......... ....0 barrels

If you go to Sunoco.com <http://sunoco.com/> ,
you will get a list of
the station locations near you.

All of this information is available from the
Department of Energy and each
is required to state where they get their oil
and how much they are
importing.

But to have an impact, we need to reach
literally millions of gas buyers.
It's really simple to do.

Now, don't wimp out at this point.... keep
reading and I'll explain how
simple it is to reach millions of people!!

I'm sending this note to about thirty people. If
each of you send it to at
least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)...and those 300
send it to at least ten more
(300 x 10 = 3,000) and so on, by the time the
message reaches the sixth
generation of people, we will have reached over
THREE MILLION consumers
!!!!!!! If those three million get excited and
pass this on to ten friends
each, then 30 million people will have been
contacted!

If it goes one level further, you guessed it
..... THREE HUNDRED MILLION
PEOPLE!!!

Again, all you have to do is send this to 10
people. How long would all that
take?
 
Khajit said:
catch a bus or train to work/school/ect and STFU. you could even try and see if any taxis have forgotten to upgrade thier fares in accordance with the price of gas.
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Simply not possible in a LOT of places. Where I live, Im ~20 miles from 2 different cities, both of which do not offer public transportation, and Im about 60 miles from the nearest city that does.

Considering I work in one city, and used to go to school in the opposite one, I often had to travel 80 miles a day. This basically meant that I was earning between $2 and ~$12 a day. And what does that 2-12 dollars go to? Food and leisure. Not much leisure, at that.

So now its just work with a better sum of ~$25-30 a day depending on hours
 
This is why Iceland rocks, not only is their public electricity 100% green (geothermic and hydroelectric) but they have a high hydrogen initiative....

The real problem with hydrogen (and other alternative fuels) is the manufacture cost. Not cost in dollars but right now hydrogen takes more energy to create than to use... For those that don't know Hydrogen is derived by running a current through water, but the current requires mroe energy than burning that hydrogen would put out.

Which then puts us on a higher dependance on Electricity, which makes me laugh actually....

Theres alot of morons here that are driving electric cars now and they think they are helping the environment, but since they cannot see beyond the outlet they don't realize that now their car is powered by the Indian Point Nuclear Plant. But who cares right?? Nuclear waste we can just seal in cement and dump off the coast of France. Out of sight, out of mind.

The way I see it with the research I have done (and im by no means an expert, just educated) we have 3 realistic options...

1. Go completely solar - Solar panels are inefficient and expensive, but there are entire powerplant designs that are only on paper right now but look really good. Theres a beautiful design that involves water trapped between polarized glass and a chromium plate. The water flash boils and rises up to a turbine, the theoretical output for such a design was astronomical. it also recycles the water used as it cools, I believe they are building one in arizona for testing ATM. (I read about it 2 years ago in ECO 2)

2. Release the patents on high efficiency engines - There are engine models out there that get 100+ MPG, the problem is that when these engines were invented, big oil bought them and wont release the rights... Honestly, I would pay 4x for gas if they released them. Id rather pay more than run the world into the dark ages through consumption. I know it sounds like im stealing this from that Steven Segal movie where he pretends hes an Inuit Indian, and Kris Kristopherson gets his ass kicked, but two of these engines are on display at the Smithsonian Museum in DC, which when I saw them with my own eyes made me think 'Holy shit, that sore throat squinty fake tanned bastard was telling the truth'

3. Fusion - The process of fusing hydrogen into helium... if you want to know exactly how it works watch spiderman 2, the information is scientifically accurate except that you really shouldnt attempt it in a swanky loft in lower manhattan. Unfortunatly, no one has been able to sustain the process and its such unchartered territory that there is barely a theory on how to sustain it... The issue is mass. This is the same way the sun gives off energy but the sun is so massive it can fuel itself for almost an eternity, but even then it will eventually fizzle out, just like it does in the labs.

I understand that alot of you agree with the drilling initiative, but that only delays the inevitable. I think things will get better when the presidency changes over. Im not going to accuse Bush of any underhanded dealings but the fact is the bush family as a whole made billions on this oil boom, and yes the boom was created in part by the bush administration. Alot of people would say that is bullshit because the Bush family owns Texas oil, which is true, but currently the way that oil prices are regulated, the price is the same no matter where it comes from.

The price boom started when we got to Iraq and we found out they had alot less in reserve than they had reported to OPEC, which is not much of a surprise because the amount of oil any 1 country is allow to sell is a % based on the total reserve of that country... So.. Saddam was lying for a few years so he could sell extra.... So we go there looking for one thing and we find empty oil tanks... price goes up, never come down, michael moore makes a new movie.

The real scary part is if Iraq was able to misappropriate their numbers without impartial regulations we have to wonder who else is doing the same. If we took a closer look at Saudi Arabia and they only had 10% like Iraq did, the world would be instantly crippled with unaffordable gas prices.

If youre really looking to make an impact in your own life, Id say the best way is to go hybrid and write a letter to your congressman. The reality is nothing will change overnight, but if you really need a quick fix....

Move to Iceland
 
Unfortunately, demand for oil is at an all time high and OPEC ultimately controls the distribution of most of the world's oil. A hefty reason as to why gas prices are soaring, however, is due to speculation by investors who believe that they can ride this price wave and then get out as soon as the price begins to peak.

It was originally reported that $4.00 was the breaking point for most Americans, but that has since changed. Americans simply do not have the will power to actually do anything about gas prices. On that note, many Americans do not even know what to do about it.

I have heard many people cry fowl on the part of OPEC and even Congress has filed a lawsuit against them. Is this even worth the time and effort? Yes, but only because of semantics and to send a message. The message itself is clear: we are fed up with OPEC driving up the prices when it isn't more necessary than when it was a year ago at ~$3.00 (a.k.a Price Gouging). However, a lawsuit against a foreign entity by Congress is absolutely useless because they don't adhere to U.S regulations. OPEC doesn't even consist of international leaders. It consists of oil barons and owners who grouped together in the Middle East to control supply and output within their industry. So to sue OPEC is, in reality, only good for the message and not the actual intent. Furthermore, the price at the pumps isn't solely dependent on the price of barrels of oil. The price we pay at the pumps is a miniscule percentage of the price of one barrel. The U.S then buys these barrels of oil and refines it into gas. Once it reaches the pumps, there are both federal and state taxes placed on the price of the gas (varies from state to state).

I have also heard people cry fowl about the U.S oil companies and how they are being greedy. What people fail to realize is that they pay much higher costs than most industries, so what may seem like billions and billions of gross income is actually a diminished net gain, let alone the taxes they pay as well. I believe last I checked, the oil companies have actually lost profits over the last year.

There are only really five ways that the government can decrease gas prices. They can either 1) cut taxes on gas at a state level (this is why every state has a different price of gas due to state regulated gas taxes), 2) explore new oil reserves off the Florida Keys (ironically we don't allow ourselves to drill there, but we allow China to), Alaska, Gulf of Mexico, and other places off the coast of the south coastline, 3) tap into the emergency oil reserve (this wasn recently denied, however, so this may no longer be a viable option), 4) create tax incentive initiatives by restarting the tax break system for consumers who purchase and use hybrid vehicles (this initiative has since been depleted due to a lack of interest in hybrid vehicles), or 5) place more funding into alternative energy and pray that they invent something soon and fast.
 
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Motley has it mostly correct except his deal on Fusion. Thats only one model of fusion, and an underdeveloped theory currently. Though, the NIF, National Ignition Facility is researching it and there is a new reactor being developed in Britain designed for a sustained burn.

If you want more information on the most promising Fusion tech, look up "ITER."
 
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Ruffyreborn said:
Simply not possible in a LOT of places. Where I live, Im ~20 miles from 2 different cities, both of which do not offer public transportation, and Im about 60 miles from the nearest city that does.

Considering I work in one city, and used to go to school in the opposite one, I often had to travel 80 miles a day. This basically meant that I was earning between $2 and ~$12 a day. And what does that 2-12 dollars go to? Food and leisure. Not much leisure, at that.

So now its just work with a better sum of ~$25-30 a day depending on hours
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Carpool? Exercise on your bike if there isn't too much smog where you live?
2~12 dollars a day kinda sounds like you probably qualified for wellfare or something so you could have done that and concentrated on school?
Alot of colleges have job listings for students that you could have tried if you needed a job closer to you.
 
Khajit said:
Carpool? Exercise on your bike if there isn't too much smog where you live?
2~12 dollars a day kinda sounds like you probably qualified for wellfare or something so you could have done that and concentrated on school?
Alot of colleges have job listings for students that you could have tried if you needed a job closer to you.
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Both suggestions could work, but its still a bit hard. Catpooling would have little or no significant impact. Friends live just as far from me as both cities.

Biking wouldnt be so bad if it wasnt ~20 miles per day, but still if I had to travel those 80 miles a day again, I dunno how that would work out.

I do try for closer jobs, Ive been trying for a couple years. No idea why, getting a job is hard these days, so I have to stick with what I have.
 
Arctyrael said:
Motley has it mostly correct except his deal on Fusion. Thats only one model of fusion, and an underdeveloped theory currently. Though, the NIF, National Ignition Facility is researching it and there is a new reactor being developed in Britain designed for a sustained burn.

If you want more information on the most promising Fusion tech, look up "ITER."
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Oh the crime that is City funded Colleges!!!! My information is outdated... but what I want to know is, will Britain build this in a swanky loft like Doc Oc???

Oh I wanted to add, if anyone does move to Iceland via my suggestion and their green initiative, be warned that they also have months of total darkness and the highest depression rate per capita worldwide... Positives are Northern lights, the geo-thermic spas, and highest worldwide Bar:Person ratio.

Another scary thought about the energy crisis is barring oil for a moment, the local big energy supplier in the north east is Con Edison, and within the last 5 years they have purchased ALL of the old dormant coal mines that are scattered throughout Pennsylvania and New Jersey...

They haven't reopenned any of them but the fact that they are even considering going backwards to coal as a means for mass-energy is a little scary.
 
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Bela said:
This and



this are the best points brought up. Only one problem.
Democrats.
God forbid you drill from the numerous oil hotspots surrounding the US (Alaska, Gulf of Mexico, Atlantic AND Pacific coasts) because you might have a problem inhibiting some animal from doing something.

It's as ignorant as the Global Warming fiasco. Studies showed that Elk?(something like deer, which species eludes me) absolutely loved the pipelines up in Alaska because they were warm.
The only fear is oil spills, and as is we are the fastest, cheapest, and most efficient clean up country in the entire world(thank you volunteers) and have the highest oil regulations and precautions.

Want lower gas prices? Write to your representatives and tell them to give the tree hugger organizations the finger. Can't drill if the environmentalist extremists don't "allow" it.

$4.03-$4.28 regular here(varies by station) $0.10 increments for Plus and Super.
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don't have kids. i would pick apart this foolish argument but its been done already.
 
Only a fraction of the oil that goes on the market is actually turned into gasoline or diesel. Most of it is used either to generate electricity, or in manufacturing. The reason China has such a high demand for oil isn't just because they're driving more, it's because the oil is used to make all those cheap plastic trinkets they sell to the US.

Even though prices on gas have increased dramatically, the demand for gas stays the same. This is because most of the people who are buying gasoline don't have much of a choice; they can't cut their usage without cutting out things like work or school. Since it's apparent that you can't decrease the demand for gasoline, you'd have to decrease the demand for other oil uses. The US doesn't have much control of the crap that China pumps onto the market, save for market pressures (in other words stop buying chinese plastic crap). What we do have control over is our methods of generating electricity.

Of the current economically viable methods, Nuclear has the least impact on the environment. Yeah yeah, nuclear waste, I know, but at least it's not pumping out millions of tons of greenhouse gases the way current plants do.

Ideally a change to solar would be in our best interests, but it would be a slow change because it requires a totally new infrastructure for power management. The most feasible method for solar energy would be for each home/building to have their own solar array plugged into the larger grid. The power company would then become just a middle management business; buying wholesale electricity from homes that produce more than they use, and selling that power retail to places that use more than they produce. Our current power plants would then supply only electricity to meet excess demands that the solar grid couldn't meet.

In order to institute this sort of system, however, solar needs to become more economically viable. Solar needs to be made more efficient, but more importantly it needs better manufacturing. The reason the automobile went from a novelty to a necessity is because Henry Ford created a system for mass production of cars at a greatly reduced cost. If the current inefficient solar arrays could be manufactured at a price that ordinary people can afford, then more ordinary people would buy them. This would set in place the beginnings of the infrastructure needed for a mass transition to solar.
 
There are a few things we could do. One drill in the small portion of ANWR that was set aside for oil drilling specifically. Do not believe the phony pictures of how great that place looks in the area they want to drill.

We could also start dilling off the coast of Florida if the retired weren't so worried about the way the view from their homes was going to look.

One major thing that would probably help would be to build a refinery since we haven't made one in more then 30 years.
 
There are a few things we could do. One drill in the small portion of ANWR that was set aside for oil drilling specifically. Do not believe the phony pictures of how great that place looks in the area they want to drill.

We could also start dilling off the coast of Florida if the retired weren't so worried about the way the view from their homes was going to look.

One major thing that would probably help would be to build a refinery since we haven't made one in more then 30 years.
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It would still not be OURS. We would not see cheaper gasoline prices. It will be sold to the international market where it will sell for much more money and profit than you'd ever get -donating- it to the US driving community.

This will never lower our Gas costs. Ever.

Edit: I'd agree on the refinery. That would give us more gas, obviously lol.
 
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Supply up -> Price Down. With all oil refineries working at or near 100% a new supply would only help so much. It would help a lot more if a new refinery would be built, but zoning laws basically stop that from happening.
 
Went downtown(chicago) $4.49 for regular. In the burbs its $4.05-4.40.

Go Chicago-land prices.
 
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