High-level Noobs

[Xean]

For anyone who is a high level, and is in fact a good player, this is not aimed to you. But there ARE high-level noobs out there, and I'm about to mention one of them that tried talking me down a while back. Sorry I don't have pictures, I forgot to save the chat so you can have visual proof of what he said or did, but I hope you just take my word for I have no reason to lie.

Anyways, onto my topic.

Some days ago, Zerayla and I were leveling our subs in Garlaige Citadel. I was Black Mage and she was Warrior. I'll quickly mention the White Mage, whose name I don't remember or really matters because he wasn't insulting. Actually, he accepted afterwards. The thing is that he HAD to mention his level. He was talking to me through tell and in party, telling me what I should be doing as a Black Mage, as he adds that he is some 59 BLM, thinking he knows more than I do. He's telling me not to cast some of the elemental enfeebles, but I already know which ones not to because certain pairs cancel out. He also said in party that I was casting Burn. BURN! In Garlaige Citadel. I am sensible enough to know that there is no reason for me to lower the INT of mobs that don't even use magic (i.e. bats and beetles). I told him he must have confused Burn with Bio because they both start with Bs. Either way, he took back what he said.

The REAL problem for me that day was a high-level noob named Aldowin. I didn't like his cockiness. When the party finally gathered in Garlaige, the WHM asked "so who here's a good puller?" I was going to say myself, but I would sound like the noob saying I'm gonna pull as the Black Mage in the party. Plus, answering that kind of a question is just too "show-offish". So what does Aldowin say? "Probably me because I'm a level 70 RNG lol" That was one of the stupidest answers, but I didn't say anything. I hate it when people think they're good because of their high-level, when they're in fact bad. Continuing, through the course of the party, Zerayla was talking to me in tell that he was using Berserk. I couldn't see for myself because I had my chat filters on so I can spot the use of weapon skills easier to do MBs. I brought it up to him, and told him it lowers defense. He goes "i didnt know that lol". And I thought to myself, "and you're level 70. -_-" After having this revelation!, he uses it to get some hate, and cancels it out. A fine plan of action. But then he starts to complain to Zerayla that she needs to stop Boosting so much. He gets rude more complaining that she's the fault that he's losing hate. This is absolutely wrong. His tanking skills sucked. Btw, he was tanking as WAR/NIN. The WHM died 5 times in party, and I died about twice. And this was before Boost became a problem... because it wasn't. I'm sure it did make it harder on him, because yes, Boost does draw some good amount of hate, so Zerayla halted it. His tanking still sucked. His health dropped too fast that the WHM had to cure a lot which brought him hate, and death. Guess that Evasion armor didn't help you there did it? If you're War/Nin, using dual axes is a pretty big reason for it. He was using Great Axe. Great Axe is excellent, don't get me wrong, but he could really get better use out of dual Axes. Also, Zerayla was basically taking his hate from her damage. In the end, after all those deaths and long downtimes, I said to just let Zerayla tank, and the rest of the party agreed. So she changes from her DD equip to tank equip, and OMG! The tank isn't dropping down to orange health! And the mages aren't getting hate! Then me and Zerayla have to leave, and kinda had to quickly because one of our LS members had her opportunity to do her RSE, so we go to help her. She's a lvl 30+ so of course we see she needs help, and getting the time for RSE isn't always at the time you want. Well when we exited out into Garlaige, this tell pops up in my chat log. It's from Aldowin. I can remember his first words pretty well. "You two really are a pair" - here he referred to Zerayla and I. Then he continued after a momentary pause, "a pair of noobs". Then I did "LOL YOU'RE THE NOOB" and I further explained that he was the one who said he was such a good puller that he pulled a Bat link that were like ONE foot away from each other and DIED himself, and couldn't hold hate, and that he didn't know Berserk lowered defense. Then he says that he will be laughing when he sees one of us shouting for help and that "you'll be seeing none from my ls's". And I said "yeah that's real professional and skillful" and didn't hear a response from him. Yeah. He annoyed me.. with some good laughs.

 

[Reya]

that really sucks, sorry you had those few rude party members.

I can comment on Garlage Citadel.. or I like to call it Garbage Shitadel. I never go there pre 33, (shagins ftw) or if I do, I make sure I am very very close to 33. Many parties go there at 30 and completely bomb. I know this from a few party encounters where I died many times....

I hate when people with certain levels and ranks act so noob :\ like the time I had a rank 5 level 30 samurai in my party who didn't have gate crystal to altepa because level 30 was his highest job ><; it comes assumed you are at least 45 when you have rank 5 or over. It can be annoying and feel like that one person is dragging you down, but I suck it in and think, gotta learn it sometime why not let it be now? However, if people are commanding you do play your job a way, they aren't going to do it, and the person is gonna sound like a complete A-hole like that one high lvl blm in your pt at first. Work with the person. Now adays since over 60% of the server seems to have at least one job over 50, it comes assumed most of the time low levels know what they are doing and their mistakes can be overlooked and not treated like say the puberity age of valkrum dunes to quifim.

However, I think you took the matter well ^_^ You kept a good clear head on your shoulders and remained tolerant. You tried to work together with the group rather than be too pushy. I hope your future sub job parties stay more steady and fun

 

[Antor]

After having this revelation!, he uses it to get some hate, and cancels it out. A fine plan of action. But then he starts to complain to Zerayla that she needs to stop Boosting so much. He gets rude more complaining that she's the fault that he's losing hate. This is absolutely wrong. His tanking skills sucked. Btw, he was tanking as WAR/NIN. The WHM died 5 times in party, and I died about twice. And this was before Boost became a problem... because it wasn't. I'm sure it did make it harder on him, because yes, Boost does draw some good amount of hate, so Zerayla halted it.

1) If anyone uses Boost for more than just the start of the fight and a weapon skill, they're making it hell for the tank. As a WAR/MNK, you use Boost in order to gain hate (through ability and raw damage). I beleive Boost is the equivilance to half of one Provoke, and its recast timer is also half of a Provoke. Thus granting the hate of a provoke in the same amount of time.

2) If you're a WAR subbing NIN before having acces to Combat Caster Axe+1's (at the earliest), chances are, you don't know what the hell you're doing, anyway.

3) Although I don't really think you did much wrong (in fact, this WAR did a lot of stupid stuff, like subbing Ninja), you aren't completely right. Why were you casting Bio? I assume the party had access to Dia. Shouldn't that be used instead? Maybe he didn't need to say his RNG was level 70, but level and rank are sometimes (not always) a decent indicator of skill. For example, when I'm leveling up as a WAR and I'm partied with a gimpy PLD, I'll generally give him some advice through /tell if I think he needs it. I'm also not trying to brag here, but I've seen very few pullers that are able to chain as well as I am, granted the party isn't fighting IT++++s, which is the new trend (thanks a lot for eating sushi, you gimped ass melee).

4) WTF is up with him not understanding Berserk? Any good RNG would have WAR as a leveled subjob (obviously he didn't because his RNG is only level 70 and his WAR is in the Citadel) and would know that Berserk lowers Defense. Hell, I expect everyone in the game to know what basic job traits do. This part made me very sad. D:

5) If your MNK was boosting, I don't see why they wouldn't have the next most hate (if not the most) unless they were gimped. I assume they weren't using a Republic Subligar. :/ Or perhaps you mages were casting too often? I wasn't there, so it's not like I can really fairly judge on this.

 

[Thnikkaman]

People can't use the whole "I'm a high level player" thing anywhere past Valkurm or maybe Qufim. After that, pretty much everyone (should) know what they're doing.
Lots of people speed level now (or I've just noticed more), and it's screwing everyone up. WHM's that can barely cure, BLM's that overnuke way too much, and your whole WAR and MNK ordeal. Antor's right though, against Beetles, Crabs, etc., Dia is very, very useful. Also, Paralyze and Slow (especially with a NIN tank) work absolute wonders. Any hit the tank doesn't take is a benefit to everyone.

 

[DarkMagnus]

Not all warriors use just axes with /nin. I tanked with war till 50 and almost 70% of the parties didn't include a brd or rdm, so using GA for armor/shield breaks is useful.

 

[Antor]

That really wasn't my point (if I was the SATA partner pre-50 and the party wanted me to use /NIN, I'd use a Great Axe with people telling me I'm stupid - people don't realise that you don't have to use dual wield if you sub NIN). If you're a WAR tanking pre-50 (solo tanking), you should be subbing MNK. MNK holds hate better; it has higher VIT, STR, DEF, HP, Counter, Boost, Dodge (really only used for grabbing hate or stacking with Aggressor), and I'm probably missing out on something, too. NIN offers you Utsusemi: Ichi. Good luck dodging 6+ hits if you can't even hold hate long enough to be hit.

 

[Thnikkaman]

Not all warriors use just axes with /nin. I tanked with war till 50 and almost 70% of the parties didn't include a brd or rdm, so using GA for armor/shield breaks is useful.

Yeah, subbing NIN doesn't mean you HAVE to use two weapons. GAX and AXE are equal in Warrior's abilities, so either one is amazing.

But you're right; WAR don't have to use one specific weapon. They're the most versatile Melee in the game, and can use almost any weapon. That's why they're great to start out as, because they can be used as a subjob for lots of jobs, and you can use them for leveling just about anything in the game. They're also good early on because they're good on both tanking and damage dealing accounts all throughout the game.

 

[DarkMagnus]

Never had a problem holding hate with war/nin ga, unless mages in pt were casting every chance they got.

 

[Antor]

Yet you could've done much better with MNK. I'm not saying it isn't doable, but if you tried both, you'd know exactly what I'm talking about. The only person to ever really applaud me for subbing MNK, though, has been Sneakypants. Apparently subbing MNK to WAR isn't a very common idea - well, at least on this board. The general GameFAQs's PC FFXI Message Board's opinion pretty much could sum up how I play WAR; I eat meat, wear accuracy gear (macro in STR for WS), and have six possible subjobs (two of which honestly should never be subbed to WAR).

 

[Lavi]

Where to begin, where to begin? Let's start with Burn. Burn isn't a bad choice to use. You are mistaken in that it's only for mobs that can use magic. All mobs have INT just like a warrior has INT and doesn't use it. In your case, you might have chosen Frost which conflicts with Burn to make the mobs less evasive, but you didn't clarify that. Burn lowers ALL mob's intelligence and will increase the potency of elemental spells and lessen their resistance. For a party with BLM as the main source of damage, this is a wise choice.

Next, it seemed to me you are a little predisposed to think that high levels are jerks simply because someone stated he was a 70 RNG and had more experience pulling than most. I might be wrong in this but it seemed to me you had it out for him from the start. First off you are mad at him for not being able to tank and hold hate. This is an unfair statement to make, warriors are not tanks, they are damage dealers. They CAN tank, but only in in correct setups and with proper assistance. For instance dual warrior blink tanks are one of the best parties at that level and work amazingly well, but even then with their lack of evasion don't work forever. You seem to think it's his fault he cannot hold hate well and he cannot be blamed for that. Your friend Zerayla was a WAR/MNK which has more STR(assuming same race and food) plus can boost for more attack, getting more hate from each individual attack she does than Aldowin ever could. Then to make things worse, all Aldowin has at his disposal is the same tools Zerayla had plus Utsusemi: Ichi which is a 30 sec recast and gets only a miner amount of hate. Your friend has boost instead which is a 10-15 sec recast and gets more hate than Uts:Ichi plus any abilities from MNK(not sure if there is any at that level). Instead of thinking he is a noob, give him a chance and make the proper setup for him. In this case, I would have had Aldowin tank for 6 shadows and once he starts to take damage have Zerayla, who has better defense gear and probably better VIT because of monk sub, tank until Utsusemi recast is up or mob dies. Simply put, because it seems both of you were so set to think the other was the worse neither of you took advantage of what you did have. In the end, I think you both acted like noobs.

 

[Xean]

Where to begin, where to begin? Let's start with Burn. Burn isn't a bad choice to use. You are mistaken in that it's only for mobs that can use magic. All mobs have INT just like a warrior has INT and doesn't use it. In your case, you might have chosen Frost which conflicts with Burn to make the mobs less evasive, but you didn't clarify that. Burn lowers ALL mob's intelligence and will increase the potency of elemental spells and lessen their resistance. For a party with BLM as the main source of damage, this is a wise choice.

Next, it seemed to me you are a little predisposed to think that high levels are jerks simply because someone stated he was a 70 RNG and had more experience pulling than most. I might be wrong in this but it seemed to me you had it out for him from the start. First off you are mad at him for not being able to tank and hold hate. This is an unfair statement to make, warriors are not tanks, they are damage dealers. They CAN tank, but only in in correct setups and with proper assistance. For instance dual warrior blink tanks are one of the best parties at that level and work amazingly well, but even then with their lack of evasion don't work forever. You seem to think it's his fault he cannot hold hate well and he cannot be blamed for that. Your friend Zerayla was a WAR/MNK which has more STR(assuming same race and food) plus can boost for more attack, getting more hate from each individual attack she does than Aldowin ever could. Then to make things worse, all Aldowin has at his disposal is the same tools Zerayla had plus Utsusemi: Ichi which is a 30 sec recast and gets only a miner amount of hate. Your friend has boost instead which is a 10-15 sec recast and gets more hate than Uts:Ichi plus any abilities from MNK(not sure if there is any at that level). Instead of thinking he is a noob, give him a chance and make the proper setup for him. In this case, I would have had Aldowin tank for 6 shadows and once he starts to take damage have Zerayla, who has better defense gear and probably better VIT because of monk sub, tank until Utsusemi recast is up or mob dies. Simply put, because it seems both of you were so set to think the other was the worse neither of you took advantage of what you did have. In the end, I think you both acted like noobs.

Actually, I really had nothing against him until he called me a noob, and taking an offensive at me. And he was staying tank until the party agreed that we change tanks. And he was complaining rudely.

And I know what Burn does, but that's why I said I didn't use it there. Bats and beetles aren't casting magic. And INT is elemental accuracy. So it's really pointless to use against them because they aren't mage mobs. But yes, I was using Frost to lower the high AGI that bats and beetles have.

3) Although I don't really think you did much wrong (in fact, this WAR did a lot of stupid stuff, like subbing Ninja), you aren't completely right. Why were you casting Bio? I assume the party had access to Dia. Shouldn't that be used instead? Maybe he didn't need to say his RNG was level 70, but level and rank are sometimes (not always) a decent indicator of skill. For example, when I'm leveling up as a WAR and I'm partied with a gimpy PLD, I'll generally give him some advice through /tell if I think he needs it. I'm also not trying to brag here, but I've seen very few pullers that are able to chain as well as I am, granted the party isn't fighting IT++++s, which is the new trend (thanks a lot for eating sushi, you gimped ass melee).

Well, without Bio, he would have been dying a lot faster than he already was. Even with Drown and Bio, his health was going down to past 50%.

And Antor, I too applaud you for using MNK sub for WAR. I then also highly applaud you for using acc/dex equip, then using meat food.

And to the rest, I don't deny war/nin can use great axe, but War/Mnk really brings out the most potential for it, and War/Nin brings our more potential for dual axes. They're very close, but you do get faster dual wield attack with nin sub.

 

[Passions]

And I know what Burn does, but that's why I said I didn't use it there. Bats and beetles aren't casting magic. And INT is elemental accuracy. So it's really pointless to use against them because they aren't mage mobs.

the higher your int is as blm or rdm over the mob the more damage and less resistance you will face, whether it is a magic mob or not it still has a base INT, so you dont know what burn does unless you just decided that melee was the main DD in the group. which isn't really ever true if a blm is in the party. frost till sc time to help build tp, but burn that baby before sc time and unload on the MB, you should be equaling or surpassing the whole sc as blm.

 

[DarkMagnus]

Unfortunately getting a pt with War (at certain lvl ranges) is tuff and subbing nin increased my invites by 101%. I gave in to, "can you sub nin" requests.

 

[Davion]

INT stat control elemental damage potency and its accuracy ( that part is speculative). Burn & Shock are great on resists against any mob so you cant say that the spell is usless against nonmage mob. Knowing what the spell does and how to use it effectively are 2 totally different concepts.

 

[Mishaela]

WAR (wether /MNK or /NIN or whatever..) can be a great tank...they just need the right gear. A WAR in Snipers and Centurion Gear = not gonna be it. =P

As for the thread itself...kinda stupid of him to call you a noob when he doesn't know what Beserk does...regardless of his 70 job, Beserk is 15. He should've known what it did when his WAR hit 15.

 

[Xean]

To Mishaela: Yeah that's what I'm saying.


To Passions: And MND is magical resistance, INT is magical potency/accuracy. I was casting Shock on the mobs to lower that. To let you know how I was doing, as Elvaan BLM/RDM, yesterday my Water II MB's on Worker Crawlers were varying from 174-214 damage on a Reverb SC. I load myself with INT, which adds to +25, and lower magical resistance with Shock.

 

[Stigmatas]

i thought MND was for debuffs like para and slow?
lowering the INT is like magic down, allowing you to do more dmg?

so i should be casting Shock every fight vs.. burn?

 

[Solitia]

If the BLM was yanking hate anyway, why not use Drown/Rasp/Frost? WAR does more damage = WAR holds hate better.

 

[Neyla]

i thought MND was for debuffs like para and slow?
lowering the INT is like magic down, allowing you to do more dmg?

so i should be casting Shock every fight vs.. burn?

Burn and Shock stack with each other.

 

[Thnikkaman]

lol, this post actually taught me something. I was always wondering why Burn was the highest level elemental debuff. Man, I love QCDN. I learn things that I didn't always know. Can someone post some sort of a quick chart to show me what elemental debuffs stack with eachother, so I learn even MORE?