How exactly do you lose "Claim" on a monster ?

R

Rylend

Chocobo Licensed
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From all the talk lately in the Flame section from people losing claim on a monster I was wondering if someone could walk me through how this happens.

The idea of it confuses me a bit as the only time I have seen people losing claim on a monster was if they had to target a new monster (links) and fight it.

With the larger (18+ person HNM fights) it really confuses me because I would think the Party/Alliance would always have claim on the monster unless there was a total wipe of the party/alliance members. Even with Kiting the HNM around I would assume that there are people staged all along the Running person's way to keep attacking the monster as it passed by, thus keeping claim on the monster.

NOTE - I have seen the odd times (in EXP partys) that a monster will just go "Un-claimed" for no apparent reason. That one really confuses me.

Thank you for all responces to this and making me a better player for it.
 
I have experienced a form of this "losing a claim" several times. I'm not sure as to how it happens but there has been at least 2 times where while camping a mob, my voke animation and text will go off on my screen but somebody else will still get the claim. I also have been hearing about things of this sort from certain other players and I'm wondering now if there might be some sort of bug in the system that allows two claims to go through if they go in at the exact same time in the system. If this is true it would be hard to explain how that happens, so I'm not even stating this as a theory. Also, a lot of claims can be lost to a temporary disconnection from the network which many players are experiencing lately. So the new suggestion is: If you don't want to lose claim and you're camping solo, don't risk taking a long time to kill it, kill it as fast as possible.

Edit: This was before I had gotten fraps or I would have taken a screen of the text just to show the validity of my statements. Oraga can vouch for my being pissed about it in the days following the incident though.
 
i've stunned NM's for other people before.. i stun it, i take hate, they get the claim... it's retarded. by losing the claim mostly it means someone beat them to it really. there is one unorthodox gil-seller used trick for stealing claims thought... cure you, invincible for hate and pull it away from you until you disengage. with the element of suprise i've seen that work 3/3 times. against me. Grasinthor turned it against one once ~_^ he's my hero.
 
Taurothar said:
I also have been hearing about things of this sort from certain other players and I'm wondering now if there might be some sort of bug in the system that allows two claims to go through if they go in at the exact same time in the system.
Click to expand...

Word has it Lucifar has a bot that claims the Admantois HNM before it pops. The server registers the mobs position before it apears, his bot sees that and puts the voke in, causing it to pop purple. Granted you could also be lagging.
 
Few confirmed ways that claim is lost -
Monsters lose hate, if not slowly (and actually gain hate on a person simply by hating them) - if they're being ran from or kited and they're not being hit, they'll eventually disengage YOU, which removes the claim.
If incompacitated (sleep, stun) and not touched for a few seconds (roughly 4+), it's considered disengaged, and will lose claim
If the entire party is incompacitated for a certain amount of time (sleep, stun, or dead for roughly 4+ seconds), it's considered disengaged and will lose claim.
And of course, if you lose sight of the monster (which, to a huge annoyance seems to happen alot which NIN NMs that 2h), it declaims.
 
also if you manually disengage, it has a high chance of turning yellow if you have any sort of hate.

Also, if someone in your pt hits the NM, then immediately hits a different mob before anyone else in the pt has a chance to hit the NM, it has a high chance of turning yellow too (1player can't have 2 claimed mob bug).

This is just my observations from what I've seen.
 
to hold claim on a NM or HNM you must always be hitting it or casting on it. You have say.. about 30 seconds if you don't do anything to it where it'll go into the unclaimed mode even though it will still have hate on you. I'll give you an example. Behemoths are normally straight up tanked with about 4~6 people with easy... no problems as they don't hit too hard and a NIN or WAR/NIN or THF/NIN can tank it well. Then comes King Behemoth. He is a beast. He hits much much harder and has a huge AoE called Meteor. (no surprise there if you've played other FF games with KB in em). Anyways.. the way you fight this mob EFFICIENTLY is that you kite him. Which means a paladin will provoke it, red mage will gravity it/bind it(at times)/stun it (if DRK sub or a BLM will do this). Anyways, the PLD runs around with it in the big open area while BLM cast on it (after a few provokes and such to make the PLD have efficient hate) and then the melee will come in out of the cave after killing too weak mobs for up to 300% TP and then they will do a weapon skill on it. Periodically through-out the fight the king behemoth will appear to be unclaimed because the PLD are not constantly hitting it or casting on it and mages might not be as well because they might be resting MP... and the melees are building up TP.. so while a PLD holds hate they will not hold claim to the King Behemoth (as in the name will go from purple to yellow). And this is where people can be complete asses.. or be morally correct. Some will steal the mob when it goes "unclaimed". As in.. they will cast on it and take it for their party. Then their group starts beating on it and even though the other group might still have majority of the hate... they'll still kill it.. this can lead to a death in the other group because they will have no way to counter the attack off the one PLD or Mebmer being attacked.. eventually the other group will get majority of hate but they will still have stolen it when they didn't get original claim.. this is very very wrong. Everyone SEEMS to know this.. they just don't seem to enforce it...
 
BST loose claim on mobs all the time, when hunting for another pet to toss at the mob.
 
Elemmire said:
to hold claim on a NM or HNM you must always be hitting it or casting on it. You have say.. about 30 seconds if you don't do anything to it where it'll go into the unclaimed mode even though it will still have hate on you. I'll give you an example. Behemoths are normally straight up tanked with about 4~6 people with easy... no problems as they don't hit too hard and a NIN or WAR/NIN or THF/NIN can tank it well. Then comes King Behemoth. He is a beast. He hits much much harder and has a huge AoE called Meteor. (no surprise there if you've played other FF games with KB in em). Anyways.. the way you fight this mob EFFICIENTLY is that you kite him. Which means a paladin will provoke it, red mage will gravity it/bind it(at times)/stun it (if DRK sub or a BLM will do this). Anyways, the PLD runs around with it in the big open area while BLM cast on it (after a few provokes and such to make the PLD have efficient hate) and then the melee will come in out of the cave after killing too weak mobs for up to 300% TP and then they will do a weapon skill on it. Periodically through-out the fight the king behemoth will appear to be unclaimed because the PLD are not constantly hitting it or casting on it and mages might not be as well because they might be resting MP... and the melees are building up TP.. so while a PLD holds hate they will not hold claim to the King Behemoth (as in the name will go from purple to yellow). And this is where people can be complete asses.. or be morally correct. Some will steal the mob when it goes "unclaimed". As in.. they will cast on it and take it for their party. Then their group starts beating on it and even though the other group might still have majority of the hate... they'll still kill it.. this can lead to a death in the other group because they will have no way to counter the attack off the one PLD or Mebmer being attacked.. eventually the other group will get majority of hate but they will still have stolen it when they didn't get original claim.. this is very very wrong. Everyone SEEMS to know this.. they just don't seem to enforce it...
Click to expand...


Is there no other way to kill KB other than kiting it? O.o
 
not really.. you could straight up tank it.. but it really spams Meteor hardcore.. and that does 800 damage to me with stoneskin, phalanx, and all other buffs up


Duffman said:
BST loose claim on mobs all the time, when hunting for another pet to toss at the mob.
Click to expand...

SE did that on purpose and stated it so.. so they don't have an unfair advantage over other players.... so if a BST tried to monapolize a NM or monster... they couldn't do it efficiently enough
 
Elemmire said:
not really.. you could straight up tank it.. but it really spams Meteor hardcore.. and that does 800 damage to me with stoneskin, phalanx, and all other buffs up
Click to expand...

Ouch >.O I gotta see that sometime
 
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