How strong are your convictions?

[Gagne]

I vote Yes. I was in a party of some sort in Kuftal, we got wiped and they gave us R3. Couldnt really believe it, but i accepted and gave them a /bow.

 

[Erinael]

Personally, I doubt many people would be willing to turn down a R3. I probably wouldn't. It only helps you after all. Regardless of that, the real problem is talking about harming someone after the helped you. Gilselling may or may not indirectly affect you. But that person just directly affected you with a R3. What's the logic of then going and killing that person? I'd probably be inclined to place that kind of person lower than a gilseller on the social order. Generally speaking, of course.

Next time she saw me mining and everytime since, she passed me by and let me have my mining point to myself. Sometimes that dosen't work, but there are ways that you can make the gilsellers respect your space and even help you out when you need em to.

Heh, after reading that I'm almost inclined to say that "gilsellers" are nicer people than "non-gilsellers". :lol:

 

[Valoran]

I'm not really sure how this is a moral issue at all . . .

You are wasting time and mp that they could be using to acquire gil to sell.

The only factor that could make accepting an R3 "helping" gilsellers would be to consider that you're giving them a slightly nicer working environment by tacitly accepting their gestures of kindness. Frankly, making them feel bad will not get them off our server, nor will it lower prices.

Prices will drop when people are not willing to pay for higher-priced items.

Gilselling will stop when people do not buy gil.


In terms of being rude to an experience party:

An experience party is founded on a loose unwritten contract that the 6 people will work together to get each member experience. If your party is going at a rate of 4k exp /hour, that's 24k experience /hour total. Divide that by 5 minutes (time I'm allowing for an R3 to get there), and the PARTY's total exp /5mins is 2000. An R3 will restore, depending on the level, 1500- more than 2000 exp to a single member, and it will keep that member in balance with the rest of the party, which may or may not be important.

Now, for that SINGLE player, they save 30-60 mins. Each person in the party sacrifices 5. Thus, by these loose time economics, it seems fairly even (and I have trouble finding parties that go at 4k /hr).

My personal conviction is that it's polite and kind to wait. The player died trying to help you get exp, let them have their exp back. You are already eating downtime due to the death; doubling it so someone can not be demoralized (which could affect their play in the party, etc.) seems an easy sacrifice to make. Getting that R3 may even improve their attitude and spur them on further.

EDIT: This last bit, of course, assumes that they haven't caused their own death through tomfoolery, in which case, I think it's rude for them not to do whatever's best for the rest of the party.

Just some thoughts,

Val

 

[dreamreaper]

Well kind of ironic that i read this post being i was the dragoon that palum is talking about. I am sorry at the higher levels getting xp with drg is like pulling teeth. Parties dont want ya and SE nerfed the job way too much. So would I take the R3....Yeah cause its only hurting yourself. I mean I am not a gilseller yet as I am running through an area I always heal or help anyone that needs it, so whats the difference? Because I am greedy and keep my gil to myself and help people everyone should be ok with it. If a gilseller wants to R3 me or buff me in anyway, Hey they are helping me then all I can say is "Thanks!"

 

[Produn]

This is probably gonna turn into a flame.

I would take anything a gilseller wants to give me. Now, that's not to say I'm gonna pay them for it, I just see nothing wrong with taking a raise 3 from a gilseller.

Thre are some gilsellers out there that give them all a bad name. But, then again, there are gilsellers that do absolutly nothing bad to anyone (lvl 1 fishing bots in town for example).

As far as Rosehot goes, she used to mine in Gusgen 24/7, when I was in there mining one day, she mined on top of me, and I expressed my displeasure in a very civilized manner. No Response. So do I mine on top of her? No. Next time I see her mining, I walk right up next to her, /bow at the mining point and walk away. Then she mined on top of me again. Next time I saw her, I did the same thing, /bow to the mining point. She sent me a /tell that said "?". I replied "^^".

Next time she saw me mining and everytime since, she passed me by and let me have my mining point to myself. Sometimes that dosen't work, but there are ways that you can make the gilsellers respect your space and even help you out when you need em to.

I'm not sure if the player Luky is a gilseller or not, but she sure did act like it the first time I met her. We got to a mining point at the same time, and we both started mining it. After it disappeared, she started sending me /tells that said "FQ FQ FQ FQ FQ" and "DEATH DEATH DEATH" then she started following me around. Following someone is not against ToS, but the GM I called on her saw that she was trying to keep me from being able to mine, therefor harrasing me. Next thing I saw was Luky disappear. A couple of days later, I saw her again. This time I /waved at her, and she started with the "FQ FQ FQ FQ" again. I replied "please use the Auto-translate function" and "English Do you have it?". Then she mined on top of me again. I sent the /tell "No Thanks. please". Next time I saw her, I passed her by and /bowed to the mining point. She then sent me a /tell that said "you me Friends?". I replied "yes please".

and I haven't had a problem with luky or Rosehot since.

I guess my point is, people get agrivated at gilsellers and even other players to easily. People need to learn to turn the other cheek, be nice, on the other end of every character is a human being. Humans have feelings and emotions, wether they are gil sellers or not. When you appeal to the good side of a person, you might get nothing but rewards in return.

Does this mean I'm gonna party with them? Does it mean I'm gonna pay them RL money for gil? Does it mean I sell gil myself? No. It means I'm a nice guy and Karma is paying me back.

This is the last time I will ever speak of gilsellers on this message board.

I perfered following Rosehot around Gusgen stealing her points making her cast invisible until she left.

 

[Rinoah]

I admit i would take the R3.

But accepting help off someone then wanting to MPK them is just wrong...i mean yeah they are gil sellers and deserve to be MPKed, but if you care about them that much then dont accept their damn raise.

Btw...when i say i would accept the R3 this would never actually happen is i have RR2 cast on me at all times . But i thought i would at least be honest.

 

[Sandria]

- I have a funny story that's a slight bit on topic and a slight bit off topic. I was in the tunnel right outside of Bastok.. (can't for the life of me think of how to spell it.. the one that starts with a K..) And I was doing a quest to get my accuracy ring.. searching out the clams and what have you. I have most likely gone to this zone a thousand times to lvl my bst. Never really bothered to go upstairs for the sake I liked staying close to the zone in event that I had a link or a mischarm to deal with. So.. I'm nonchalantly walking around on my whm - and I some how come across these psycho leeches.. Yes.. Jammer leeches..

... they ripped through me faster than I could blink. I had no reraise on, no buffs up, or nothing.. as I had no idea there was anything in this zone that could so much as kill me..

At first thought.. I turn around and run out of this room.. and suddenly ppl out of no where start examining me.. and they're all emoting /huh and such at me... thus causing me to be all the more embarressed.. okay, maybe it was like 2 or 3 people.. but that's a lot for this area. lol.

suddenly a pld sends me a tell

Raise I Can I have it? in translation.. I get this a couple of times.. and I am still so upset about death.. (pride issue if you will).. that I swear s/he is insulting me.. as some might consider a Raise I an insult to a higher lvl .. so I don't respond.. all the while in LS asking wth is up with these psycho leeches that just wiped me out.. and they sorta laugh.. none of the other white mages were on at the time.. or were exping.. or so the only other raise I'd be able to get would be a raise 1 anyway..

I'm still upset.. and still haven't responded.. and the pld seems to come back around and casts it on me anyway.. Now.. had it been Raise I Do You need it? I might not have taken it so wrongly...

After laying there dead for a bit.. I got to thinking.. maybe it was simply a misunderstood translation.. and I go ahead and raise and rest.

So, truth is.. I think I'd accept a raise if the intentions were good.

Now, to accept a raise or some form of call for help, and then want to turn around and mpk them is absolutely wrong. Lately, my piggest pet pieve in parties is hearing.. 'oh that's a gilseller party.. we should mpk them'.... and I'm like.. wtf... why become what you dislike?.. and why spend so much time and focus on them.. I hear comments like.. 'I've been watching that group for weeks..'.. that just scares me ; ; Then again.. end of game wars scare me too... my friend's mules scare me also... cus like.. they wave to me.. and I have no idea who they are !

I really wish the game returned to when I was a noob.. and did not have to pay attention to who was a mpk'er.. who was a gilseller, a scammer, etc. All I had to do was figure out how to get my kazham keys! Back in the days where anyone who tossed you a cure was your hero! Things really don't have to be so complicated.. but, we kinda get into that groove.

 

[Mariox]

Guess I would accept it, but I'm not going to thank them for it. Nor like them any more then before.

Hell, if I was an azz and looking for trouble, I'd train a bunch of crabs on top of them as soon as I'm raised. Then ask for another raise!

 

[Mattaru]

I don't hate gilsellers really, if they packet sniff itll get on my nerves, when they brag about getiing claim i just think to myself "you sell gil.....for a living, what do you have to brag about" and i just get frustrated i cant tell them that in chinese. Never been mpk'd by them, in fact in Ordelles its the other way around when ya can. But I hate gilbuyers, if i knew you buy gil, I would not accept a Raise 3 or anything, not even items because youd just spend more money to buy more gil. On the other hand if a gilseller gave me all their archers ring id take every single one of them and put them on AH for 550k, a 200k discount, because thats gil that no one is buying. No gilbuyers = no gilsellers, its an equals sign so its the same if you were to turn it, but one of those you can control the other you cant.

 

[Nifal]

I know this post isn't a flame but....

Its kinda like a misplaced flame. I assuming its a flame saying the gilsellers are ruining our economy? I mean why else would you be mad at gilsellers?

I think there should be a choice for people who pay OUTLANDISH prices too, because we all know they are the ones ruining the economy.

This is Not directed at you or anyone in particulur but Gilsellers are not the ones tht ruin the economy. Its the greed of the legit playes that do
if you notice Gilsellers only sell at the going price I havent noticed any price hikes from them its almost always legit players that attept to hike priices. For example lets take a common item.. As tack of Fire crystals you you sell them for the going price of 3-3.5 or do you go for 4k... or even 5k in some cases. thats price hiking a alot or ppl do it.. i piced fire crystals cause tats aminature scale to otherthing that have fell victim to this. Oh the other day i was saving to buy a wind staff going price is 180- 200k normally.. then next couple sells jumped to 250k. that is not a gilsellers product. Anyways I am just making a point dont exclusively Blame gilsellers for Quetzelcoatl not very good economy.

Again darkdante im not aiming at you at all lol I am actually agreeing lol

 

[Kensou]

I'd take the raise III, and the other way around, if I was a WHM and gil seller died I'd raise III them, I don't hold grudges against no one, even if I saw th eperson that I hate the most die I'd give him/her a raise III, but that's just me, sometimes people say I'm too nice :|, been in game since the it was released here in NA and never added someone to my blist

 

[Acutie]

I'd accept it, if anything they're being nice, even if they do dickish things on a daily basis.

 

[Flameass]

Was soloing robbers in kuftal and skilling up my eva at lvl 62

The amemet gil sellers would toss me a Cure IV every time i was resting...

After like 15ish crabs i was getting tired and died got R3 from rosehot i think. MPKed and left.

 

[Gannon]

I voted Yes since it is hard for me to get exp and I think ever bit I can save would count.

 

[Palum_Q]

Well kind of ironic that i read this post being i was the dragoon that palum is talking about. I am sorry at the higher levels getting xp with drg is like pulling teeth. Parties dont want ya and SE nerfed the job way too much. So would I take the R3....Yeah cause its only hurting yourself. I mean I am not a gilseller yet as I am running through an area I always heal or help anyone that needs it, so whats the difference? Because I am greedy and keep my gil to myself and help people everyone should be ok with it. If a gilseller wants to R3 me or buff me in anyway, Hey they are helping me then all I can say is "Thanks!"

lol.. you know what? I've had time to think about this. I actually don't think you were that bad. It was a combination of a LOT of things that night. Bad camping spot. Gilseller PL-ers party right over us. Those dang giant birds. That initial dying in Kuftal tunnel. It was just a bad night.

Honestly, once you been around the boards a bit, you'll notice DRGs have a terrible time in general getting a party until the higher levels (you should be seeing more invites I hear past 60 because you can do more S/C's...or is that monk)?

What I really wanted to know from the questions was basically, how can people bitch and complain about the gilsellers and turn to them when they need help?

I mean, I bitch and complain about the gilsellers because they take everything that we need and come back and sell it to us at a set price. Kind of like... if you were the mob and hording majority of the available water and selling it back to us when the water should be basically free in the first place if we get our asses down to the river. I'm sure they could be nice people......but they're still representing something against the rules.

And...it is true though. Gil sellers aren't the only ones screwing up the economy. It's people who go with the flow. That's the standard. No one wants to take the hit right?

There aren't any gilsellers without gilbuyers right? Same goes for the AH. There isn't any gougers without people who are going to pay to be gouged.

I might have been originally harsh with everyone in the party that night because I was in a very foul mood with everything compiling. But then I notice how people just hate gil sellers so much but only because they don't help them. If they do some teensy favour for you, then they're all right. Like... here's a crumb from my big ass cake I took from you... now that you're happy, I'll just go about my ways again. This could just be messed up thinking but when I get on a rant, it usually goes that way...

 

[Strid]

R3 and mpk FTW. They wouldn't raise me anyway they know me all to well for my antics towards them.

 

[Chasym]

well. For all you know, one of your closest friends in the game could be a gil seller or a gil buyer, and theyll of course never admit it.
So im sure youve been raised be someone who has sold or bought gil at some point in time.
I know in my two years im sure i have.
Id take it.
It benefits me only.