I wish people encouraged others to have fun....

[Sephectja]

Idea for a solution, try asking what people the _want_ to play in a role of a party!

People will probably remember you for this and invite you back , and may even learn what you did to them.

 

[Anderithe]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

 

[Ronith]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

1. Depends on what weapon you wish to use really, /MNK is always nice with 2 handed weapons or if you -have- NIN use /NIN and use 2 hand axes

2. Also depends on what you want to be a DD most usually.../WAR is all the MNK use, but lemme see only other SJ i could see for that would be maybe /RNG for more Dmg on the ranged and the buffs for ur attacks, or maybe I've seen MNK/NIN for the de-buffs then the WS's for the DEX+ on NIN dunno tho really, my MNK is 15 ^^;

3.Use /WAR almost always lol PT's wont invite you w/o it really, use alot of De-Buffs Ninjutsu spells, and you're not much of a tank in that area from MNK type mobs, but usually if u use NIN/MNK maybe Boost, Block etc. use Acc+ and Att+ food and do melee dmg on the stack along with the De-buffs use elemental WS's for a stronger hit ^^;

just IMO

 

[Mishaela]

Just because I hafto say it -

Every party has strengths and weaknesses, especially wepending on the skill of the players, how they go about doing things, what they fight, etc. Now, while in MOST parties I'd rather the more "fragile" classes (mainly WHM/BLM/SMN) not melee, if they do and it doesn't hinder the party, then by all means do...but if it does hinder the party, please, just stop. (this is in huge reference to the Ulungeurand(sp?) Range party I had - I wouldn't have minded the WHM meleeing but she rarely healed at all, and the AOEs meant unecessary extra healing, so she SHOULD'VE stopped....but didn't.)

As WHM, I really preferr NIN tanks, because post-60, literally the only good PLD I've seen is Veteran, whom was so good I could melee without any risk to the party. If other cases, if I found myself lacking mp or just causing unecessary +TP to the mob, I would stop meleeing, period. Same goes for when I'm on SMN. *Shrug* Its fun to do extra stuff, yes, but not-fun to know you're a hinderance. People who whine that they "can't do what they want" should aknowledge this.

 

[Firestreak]

There is 15 different jobs you can alternate depending on your mood. If you want to be a damage dealer, play a dark knight. If you want to play a tank, play a paladin. You can switch between the jobs of your liking easily and instantly for FREE in your mog house whenever you feel like it, why is there the need to play one job as if it's another job in an exp party?
Why don't I think SMN are damage dealers? Because their damage sucks. There's no other way, no kind way to put it. If I want a damage dealer, I'll get a dark knight.
When I'm playing a SMN, what pisses me off, is when I join a party and there's already a whitemage and they have invited me to "play SMN". Well... great, I can give you a freakin stat buff or dispel the mob or give you enthuder... people playing SMN with that as all their worth is the reason SMN is considered a low demand job. If people played Whitemage to just haste then you wouldn't want too many WHM in your PT.
Like look at the bloodpact Hastega. It lasts... a minute. Giving me enough time to... cast it again. If that's all I did as SMN, then that's exactly what I'd be, a WHM who does nothing but haste.

Just playing your own way to have as much fun as possible... well that's just not the way Final Fantasy 11 works. When I'm chewing down expensive food and you're skilling up your weapon that's 50 levels behind your pretty much wasting my time. Not just my time in the party but my time getting gear and food and items to make myself affective in the party in the first place. There are plenty of MMORPGs where playing your own way is the standard, this is not one of them.

 

[Mishaela]

I'm pretty sure Hastega is 90 seconds...
And a party of a WHM with a SMN, in a sense does falter the SMN's usefulness, but it also depends solely on whom is in your party. with a NIN/WAR, WAR/NIN, RNG/NIN, THF/NIN, WHM/BLM, SMN/WHM party, I did Elciptic Howl before pull. Rolling Thunder shortly into battle (did +8-20 damage per each person's attack, roughly). My melee hits did 35-50 damage per hit +enthunder DMG. SC was something along the line of Blade: Chi > Rampage and Slug Shot > Viper Bite onto NIN. We got constant chain 5's and about 4800exp/h. This was mostly off of Crawlers in Boyahda (Crabs if all Crawlers were dead)



Yes, in many cases one class combined with another won't work...but it all depends on everything else. Hastega, for example, doesn't have the best duration, but if it gives everyone a good enough delay boost to pull off another SC set and get a chain 5 or 6, then it seems perfectly worthwhile to me. All depends on how you go about with things..

*edit* While I admit I usually am main healer, I refuse to let myself be "useless" just because of another job in the party. I figure out what works well for certain mobs, what doesn't. I can join in and melee vs Crawlers because I do a damn good amount of damage, but not crabs. Oh well. At least in one case I'm more useful than normal. I can say same for Doom Skels and Goblins. There's no real way for a job to be useless if coupled with another person, unless it's the same job of a higher level..

 

[Firestreak]

I'm pretty sure Hastega is 90 seconds...

The point is it's not 2 minuts, so you can't keep it up and another BP up all the time.

Rolling Thunder shortly into battle (did +8-20 damage per each person's attack, roughly).

Another BP that doesn't last much longer than its recast time. And 8-20 is a gross exageration. And it doesn't help the RNG's attacks so you're looking at just the three.

My melee hits did 35-50 damage per hit +enthunder DMG. SC was something along the line of Blade: Chi > Rampage and Slug Shot > Viper Bite onto NIN.

Please tell me you weren't meleeing... on a MP intesive job like SMN... Hell you can make up crap that you should melee on WHM or RDM because you can't squeeze 20 seconds to rest a full tick(not true) but a SMN who's not even main healer? Your BP has a minute timer and your PT has no refresher, why aren't you resting in between?

We got constant chain 5's and about 4800exp/h. This was mostly off of Crawlers in Boyahda (Crabs if all Crawlers were dead)

Yea, your PT also had a Ninja, Thief, Ranger and War(probably /nin) setup. You could stick anything in there and get great xp.

Not trying to go down on you and say you're a bad SMN here(though the meleeing aspect can't be helping), I'm just trying to say... you could be a DRG/BLM for nuking and be a great party due to the fact the rest of the members are so strong. But let's face it, another actual damage dealer would have been more useful if they don't have downtime because an affective ninja and already have a main healer/haster. Your example doesn't really prove anything to me.

 

[Sethala]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

1. Either MNK or NIN is good at that level. MNK is best if you want to use 2-handed axes, NIN is best if you want to dual-weild axes. At 24 if you're just joining a party, it's probably in Kazham and against mandies. Double attacks tear through shadows quickly, so Utsu doesn't help tank much, and MNK is probably the optimal subjob to use if tanking mandies. Although you probably should use a 1-handed axe and shield if you tank. If you're not tanking, however, use whatever you want. THF and SAM, while both good subs for WAR, don't get key abilities yet (Sneak Attack and Meditate, respectively), so they probably should be avoided.

2. Advanced job, huh? Well, WAR's probably the best job you can use as a sub, since you get Berserk at that level, but you want only advanced jobs... SAM's probably the only one that could work, but one Store TP trait isn't enough to justify it more than WAR, in my opinion. Still, it could work, and it's better than something like, say MNK/BLM

3. At 28 you're probably taking on mandies in Yhoator, and maybe a stray gob or two. You'll probably tank, although being invited as a DD won't be uncommon. Note that mandies hit often and weak, so you don't need to try to recast Utsusemi mid-fight when fighting them. Goblins, on the other hand, hit a lot harder, so you want to keep shadows up.

Now I'm curious as to what kind of point you want to make...

 

[CubsWoo]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

1) This depends on the quality of your party. If you will be partying with a tank that can hold hate, go with Monk. If they can't, sub NIN with a Great Axe (Axe skills suck early compared to Sturmwind) and be prepared to tank due to your damage output.

2) None. Nothing you can get from any 'advanced' SJ will rival Berserk. For career MNKs, don't consider any SJ other than WAR until level 60 at LEAST.

3) If you bleed gil, max your Throwing skill, sub RNG and toss Shurikens to be a quality DD (you have an A in Throwing and Shurikens have some of the best DPS of anything in the game.)

 

[Faedryth]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

Warrior doesnt get Double Attack until 25, so subbing Ninja and using Axes isnt such a great idea yet. I would say go with a Sword at this point and sub monk. Red Lotus Blade is going to do the most damage and the skillchains with it will be better. GAxe is nice once you get Sturmwind and once you get double attack, dual wielding axe is also nice. Monk is the only real thing you can sub at this point. You can sub Rng and shoot, but its not that effective until you get the +acc from knives. Dark Knight is also a viable option for melee such as Warrior. I want to see some people subbing Drk at 60! It gives nice Str boosts and Last Resort on top of Berserk at 30 will be hot.

Like others said, if you are sticking SOLELY to advanced jobs, then Sam will be the best bet. Store TP will help a bit. But there really is no point when you got Warrior sitting there.

Ninja really cant do anything too well at this point. They cant tank very well unless fights are extremely fast, and even then its still a better idea as a lot of mobs at this point are Mnk or War (double attack) based. I would either go Nin/Rdm and be a DD or Nin/Rng and spam shurikens. You have a few debuffs at 28 I think so you could save the mages some mp by doing those. You can also pull. I think if you sub Rdm youll have enspells as well which will make for more damage. I want to try this combo and see how it works ^^. Even then woudl take a lot of kickass gear to work.

Fae

 

[Lyndis]

since everyone hass wonderful opinions about everything. i'm just curious, i'm a lvl 54 rdm with the tendency to sub either drk or nin. i have no problems main healing with a decent back up, my preference is blm. between a blm and myself,throw in 2 refreshes, there tends to be very little downtime. i will freely admit that i can't main heal very well by myself or with a brd as back up. not sure why i can't do it with brds but bad experiences have made me see the light in that.
yes i am stubborn and won't accept an invite if the first words i see are can you change your sub. also i refuse to sit in the back even main healing. feel free to rip me apart now :twisted:

 

[Elyssa]

You are a waste of a slot in the party. And the reason why you can't main heal with a brd is that they can't do your job (main heal) for you. Blm can (or at least better than a brd before zenith).
Such a gimp. I'll wait until you get 60 before I lvl my whm (which might be a while). Don't want to run the risk of partying with you by mistake. :roll:
You are probably the rdm that lets people die because they are too busy either weakly melee'ing "!'z l33t! 1 g0tz m3 2 s0wrds!!!111!!" or too busy keeping themselves en-spelled to use dispel on the mob.
All I can say is, I wouldn't invite a pld/drk to tank and I won't invite you to do anything either. Know your role in the party. Go level a mage sub you worthless and completely useless red mage.
Good enough? God. Now I'm going to start to see whm/nins and blm/drks. Long live the Ub3r n00bs! :lol:

 

[Lokkin]

I'll say something, this game is not about fun, it's about trying to give other people fun by sacrificing yours, and they all sacrifice theirs to give you fun, thus the fun all escapes into the atmosphere and causes global warming.

Seriously though, some games you can have fun in, others, you just waste your time on, no big deal, your choice, I still play the game, I will be a SMN eventually, I won't mind main healing, but if you so much as hint that I'm not allowed to use my avatars for a lil more than blood pacting, that I can't add even a lil damage to the mob, well, my sentiments are,

Screw you.

My 3 cents

 

[Darkdante]

You know, I really grow tired of the typical thing. Like for instance I read in a thread earlier, that a SMN is a healer, whether they like it or not. Eh, I'm pretty sure the job class is called a Summoner, and that would imply they summon, so they -shouldn't- be forced into main healer if they don't want to, let them summon, and do their thing.If a WHM isn't available, consult them first, don't tell them"hey....you're main healer" after you invite them.

I remember going to the dunes for the first time, I was leveling Greatsword. I got bitched at horribly, because I was a WAR not using a Great Axe. I don't like giant axes really....I like swords. So, I did something I thought was cool and I enjoyed, and after explaining this they still harassed me.

Why can't people just have fun? I know it doesn't make you "teh l337" but, let people have their fun, and enjoy tit with them.....

Just some random thoughts.

Theres a reason I get more invites when playing smn then when I play a melee DD job. Its because it's generally viewed as a combo type job. Meaning you can do many things.

Anytime you play a job that can do many things, many things will be expected of you. I don't have a very high lvl smn, but when I do party and there is no whm, I can either
1. leave
2. party and obviously heal
Nobodys ruins my fun if I "choose" to stay, I do it all myself. It'd be pretty stupid to think you could stay and not heal either, parties need a healer and your being selfish if you think otherwise. Being asked to do something else is actually a benefit to you even though you may not see it. Because its either you do the job that the party asks, or sit on the sidelines and do nothing at all, and wheres the fun in that?

NOw if you happen to have a whm, I don't think I've ever been told to "just heal" actually I"ve been told I"m not summoning enough, lol. And all the parties I"ve been with a smn has been like this also.

As far as the fun goes, just like real life there are lots of people that you can have lots of fun with, and there are people that you can't. You need to find "friends" that you can have fun with, and avoid those that you can't. Its as simple as that.

P.S. Just to put things in prespective... There are people out there who's idea of fun is simply to have a party to find friends in and laugh and joke. Sometimes I feel like this, but I don't like dying 10 times a day either, some of these types don't care. In other words everybody's idea of fun is pretty different depending on the day.

Find the freinds that you are compatible with to have the most fun, its not possible to have fun with every person you meet.

 

[Firestreak]

I won't mind main healing, but if you so much as hint that I'm not allowed to use my avatars for a lil more than blood pacting, that I can't add even a lil damage to the mob, well, my sentiments are,

Screw you.

Do the world a favor then and don't play SMN. If you are dead set on being a damage dealer why not just stick with a job well designed for it?

 

[Anderithe]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

1. Depends on what weapon you wish to use really, /MNK is always nice with 2 handed weapons or if you -have- NIN use /NIN and use 2 hand axes

2. Also depends on what you want to be a DD most usually.../WAR is all the MNK use, but lemme see only other SJ i could see for that would be maybe /RNG for more Dmg on the ranged and the buffs for ur attacks, or maybe I've seen MNK/NIN for the de-buffs then the WS's for the DEX+ on NIN dunno tho really, my MNK is 15 ^^;

3.Use /WAR almost always lol PT's wont invite you w/o it really, use alot of De-Buffs Ninjutsu spells, and you're not much of a tank in that area from MNK type mobs, but usually if u use NIN/MNK maybe Boost, Block etc. use Acc+ and Att+ food and do melee dmg on the stack along with the De-buffs use elemental WS's for a stronger hit ^^;

just IMO

Okay, a few uncommon, but sometimes used 'situational' subjobs.

1. Warrior/Dragoon- Note the level is 24? This gives you two things that are VERY importent to a DD. The first being Attack Up which a Warrior does not get until thirty. The second being "JUMP" which is in no way gimped in ANY fashion when used by a GA wielding Warrior.

Not only does it do impressive damage, but Jump is an additional means to get TP every fight. Which is importent as a Warrior playing a DD at this level is a great closer for Fragmentation.

Furthermore, I've used this setup *Strictly as a dd.* and have seen it used. Works very well. It isn't very common though, because people don't like to look beyond the cookie-cutter, and because most people don't have DRG when they level WAR.

I think the nifty thing is, the Warrior who did it first was doing so while I was Dragoon. ^_^

My standard policy with this sub had been to put my flag up War/Mnk and ask the pt if this was okay with them if I get invited as a DD.

2. Monk/Dragoon- Same reasons as above. It gives you an attack boost, and Jump. *Although not nearly as good as with a GA.* The wyvern earring isn't bad either. You won't have a voke, so if you're in a party with a Thief I wouldn't reccomend it.

Had a Monk trying this when I was pt'ing in Garliage. It worked well, but his invites sucked MORE then usual. Worked like a dream, stupid ppl.

3. Ninja/Ranger- Juji Shuriken, Dual Archers, Beetle Rings +1 and a lot of agility gear. Expensive as all hell, but studies have been done and posted on Alakazm that this makes you a more then legitimate dd. Hell, I've had success with it at the early twenties believe it or not, but I am not going to do it more until twenty-eight.

I did put up Nin/War though and then asked if I could do this once I got invited as a DD.

My biggest gripe with leveling Ninja early on has been it's hard to contribute to the pt. Sure I can blind the mob and pull, I can ease the tank's dmg and the downtime, but I know how weak a melee I am. My Ninjutsu doesn't seem to like me either.

My point is, there are legitimate and uncommon subjobs out there. people are quick to blast them because people ussually use them without consideration for the level they are at, or towards those asking them to invite.

However, if you understand your role in the pt, and the subjob fits, wear it. I never have had a single complaint when I used those subs at the level range they work. I've gotten nothing but praise for it.

You should be considerate to your party, and parties should be considerate to what works.

So common is the jump to say OMFGLOL!!!111! YOU SHOULD ONLY SUB WARRIOR!!1!! to melee it makes me sick. Sure, it's by far the most useful subjob for the majority, but majority isn't the entire time.

 

[Sethala]

Wow, very good insigts... I admit I never thought of subbing DRG, although it's probably mostly because it's still level 1 >.>

A few point-by-point comments...

1. Never even thought of this - most people consider DRG to be a bad sub for anything, as you don't get a wyvern. Not sure if /DRG or /THF would be better post-30, though - Jump gives you a free attack, SA gives you a free critical. I've heard that the Jumps shed a little bit of hate, though; if that's true then it would kind of push this in favor of /DRG. Regardless, it's a viable alternative, especially if you plan on being DRG/WAR to 75.

2. Again, never thought of this. However, here I'm thinking that perhaps /WAR might be better for Berserk. Having one free attack every 1:30 (that's the cooldown timer on Jump, right?) is nice when you only get about 10 normal attacks in that time, but when you get about 20, it's not as big of a boost. Meanwhile, unlike WAR/DRG, MNK/DRG doesn't know Berserk already. Still, it is an alternative.

3. If you're not being asked to tank in a party, this would work good (remember - if there's no optimal tanks seeking, you'll have to make due with a sub-optimal tank). It's incredibly expensive, though, and if you want to actually save up gil, it's probably not the best.

Really, I have no problems with someone wanting to try out a sub or a way of playing that's not the norm, as long as they can back it up. A RDM/NIN saying that he likes NIN sub for two swords, or a WAR/WHM that says he can act like a PLD would instantly be labeled a gimp in my book. But if someone can justify their use of an uncommon sub (and if it actually seems like it could work - no, saying "OMG itz t3h l33tzors" doesn't count as justifying your sub), I'd be willing to let them in.

 

[Ronith]

Here's a few interesting questions:

1. I'm a Warrior at level twenty-four. I get invited to an XP party to be a DD, what job *Out of any.* should be my optimum subjob?

What kind of gear should I wear?

2. I'm a Monk at level thirty-two. What advanced job could I justify using as a subjob and why?

3. I'm a Ninja at level twenty-eight, what's the best way for me to fit into a party?

I will be making a point here, but I'm doing it this way because I'm curious to some people's answers.

1. Either MNK or NIN is good at that level. MNK is best if you want to use 2-handed axes, NIN is best if you want to dual-weild axes. At 24 if you're just joining a party, it's probably in Kazham and against mandies. Double attacks tear through shadows quickly, so Utsu doesn't help tank much, and MNK is probably the optimal subjob to use if tanking mandies. Although you probably should use a 1-handed axe and shield if you tank. If you're not tanking, however, use whatever you want. THF and SAM, while both good subs for WAR, don't get key abilities yet (Sneak Attack and Meditate, respectively), so they probably should be avoided.

2. Advanced job, huh? Well, WAR's probably the best job you can use as a sub, since you get Berserk at that level, but you want only advanced jobs... SAM's probably the only one that could work, but one Store TP trait isn't enough to justify it more than WAR, in my opinion. Still, it could work, and it's better than something like, say MNK/BLM

3. At 28 you're probably taking on mandies in Yhoator, and maybe a stray gob or two. You'll probably tank, although being invited as a DD won't be uncommon. Note that mandies hit often and weak, so you don't need to try to recast Utsusemi mid-fight when fighting them. Goblins, on the other hand, hit a lot harder, so you want to keep shadows up.

Now I'm curious as to what kind of point you want to make...

lmao Already said it b4 Seth look above ur post

 

[Mishaela]

Daresay, Firestreak....I use a BP once every 55 seconds (ever heard fo Austere?), it tends to be Ecliptic Howl/Growl, and an occasional Earthen Ward so if mages are resting mid-fight, Bubble Shower won't make them stop resting. If there's no WHM, the joy of Hastega is it also removes Slow from the people who get it from Crawlers. Yes Enthunder helps RNG damage because some melee for extra TP (durr). I don't melee Crabs, and I can melee Crawlers without having ANY downtime inbetween fights, EVEN IF I'M MAIN HEALER. How the BLOODY F-!K does that make me a bad Summoner? Because I can melee for an extra 35+ per hit and do starburst which allows for another SC/more MBing/faster kills/more xp? OH GOD KILL ME NOW.

Please explain what I'm doing wrong, because right now you're sounding like one of those guys who critisize a movie they haven't even SEEN. How dare you, a what, 30 SMN, go and say I'm not only doing something wrong, but call me BAD? You obviously don't know what a bad SMN is.

Goto Valkurm Dunes and see how many of those sh-!ts summon Carby to melee and just stand around. THAT'S bad. But again, please explain what what dastardly sin I've commited that hasn't won your praise, cause right now I don't see jack sh-!t asides you either (a) hating ALL SMNs or (b) just looking for stupid excuses to tell people they suck.

 

[Firestreak]

Daresay, Firestreak....I use a BP once every 55 seconds (ever heard fo Austere?), it tends to be Ecliptic Howl/Growl, and an occasional Earthen Ward so if mages are resting mid-fight,

It's Lunar Howl. And why should mages be hit by water anyway if they keep a reasonable distance?

If there's no WHM, the joy of Hastega is it also removes Slow from the people who get it from Crawlers.

You really aren't seeing my point at all. If there's no WHM, you're not main healing anyway are you? When you are main healing, whatever you want to do as BP which you think makes the most efficient extra is fine by me, specially if you're making up for deficiencies in a specific party setup.

Yes Enthunder helps RNG damage because some melee for extra TP (durr).

The extra damage is based off the original damage. How much damage do you think a ranger actually hits with their dagger?

I don't melee Crabs, and I can melee Crawlers without having ANY downtime inbetween fights, EVEN IF I'M MAIN HEALER. How the BLOODY F-!K does that make me a bad Summoner? Because I can melee for an extra 35+ per hit and do starburst which allows for another SC/more MBing/faster kills/more xp? OH GOD KILL ME NOW.

No, no way. There is no excuse for a Summoner to be meleeing AT ALL. Even with reduced BP time you still can very easily be resting for spare MP back. Not to mention, summoner is the weakest job physically in the whole game, has the lowest HP and if you're equipped right should have quite a bit of HP > MP conversion gear.

Please explain what I'm doing wrong, because right now you're sounding like one of those guys who critisize a movie they haven't even SEEN. How dare you, a what, 30 SMN, go and say I'm not only doing something wrong, but call me BAD? You obviously don't know what a bad SMN is.

I'm a 48 SMN actually now. And I've got a 42 RDM, a 66 WHM, a 75 BLM... you know what.. I think I might just know a little something about mages? Enough to know you should shut the hell up, and stop making excuses to meleeing. Just because you can still function somehow doesn't mean you're benefiting with your shitty damage versus healing MP and not giving the mob free TP. Just admit it, you're freaking skilling up during an xp pt. If I was your paladin I'd take off my sword and shield and start skilling up my GSD because that's only fair.

Goto Valkurm Dunes and see how many of those sh-!ts summon Carby to melee and just stand around. THAT'S bad. But again, please explain what what dastardly sin I've commited that hasn't won your praise, cause right now I don't see jack sh-!t asides you either (a) hating ALL SMNs or (b) just looking for stupid excuses to tell people they suck.

Yea, so what, I had a paladin in dunes who didn't know how to voke? Congrats there, you're better than the absolute worst. Does that make all that you say and do right? Apparently not. And I've partied with plenty of good SMN lately, and taken the time to learn from them. Like Ingwe and Phazen. And who would have guessed it? They're 75 WHMs. And what do they think about SMN? Main healing job. Who would have guessed?

Also saw a SMN letting his avatar melee and melee on flies. Then heal himself only from the AE he was taking. Hmmm... what's more useful?