Is it wrong to have standards?

F

Faedryth

Limit Breaker
Adventurer
Joined
Jun 13, 2004
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519
Ok this happened to me today. I got invited to a party by a Blm I was rather leery of. Anyways, we head out to Bibiki Bay to level off of Gobs. Was a 65-67 party, with me at 65. So we fight for an hour, starts off pretty good, then slows down. So the hour is up, and we havent even made 4k. Sadly, I have a benchmark that I make when I start a party, and that is 4k. We werent close, like 500 under. 4k is my minimum, but honestly I dont see ANY reason a party shouldnt be able to do 5k/hour.

Moving on, I let the party know that they need to replace me. They ask why, and I tell them the truth, knowing they will be upset. Ok so then they start going off on me, "arrogant ass" "gilseller" (funny) and so on. I explain to them the whole situation, but they still were pissed at me. Thankfully, the Blm still Warped me which I did not expect.

So my question to you is this QCDN community. Is it wrong to have standards when in a party? I know no person here would stay in a 1k an hour party. I have higher standards than many people yes, but I also play a job where every single shot costs me 50-200 gil. Leveling takes time AND money which equates to more money. Id rather wait and get a great party doing 6k an hour, than settle for 3.5k an hour every time i sought a party. I dont find this rude at all, and would not be upset if someone else did it as well.

I do not intend to change my ways, but hopefully I will get some feedback, and find out if perhaps I am wrong. Thank you.

Faedryth
 
when i join a "normal" party as rng, i usually use scorp arrows, if we don't look like we are going to hit 5k an hour, i won't bother macroing in my good arrows for ws or barrage.

I've stayed in a couple 4k an hour parties cause i liked the atmosphere of the party, but if i wasn't enjoying myself, i would leave.

Rangers kind of have the rep that they think they are gods gift to parties, well the fact of the matter is yes, they are. they can sub in for blm and do almost as much damage, or along with a blm and do even more damage.

There really isn't any excuse for a party with a ranger and blm to do any less than 5k an hour. The only reasons i would see for this is if there isn't a good skillchain going off, or one of the key members(whm pld rdm) aren't pulling thier weight.

When i'm spending 10-30k an hour you are god damn right i'm going to hit an xp quota, and if that quota isn't met i'm gone.

In between statics i could walk around doing my thing and get a tell for xp, i ask the set up, and i kindly accept or decline the invite. Most of the invites that i accepted were form other rangers or people i knew weren't there to bs.

I was xp'n as my drk the other day with a nin as the tank. I've had some good experiences before with nins, i can't blast away like i like to do, but there is a nice balance of damage i can achieve to get my job done without comprimising the whm's mp to cure 1300+ hp.

well, the blm starts nuking like he was in the dunes and the nin, i think it was tsumi, was spamming and voke trying to get hate back. i tell the blm to cool it, he's like ok. then me and cami do our tp calls, cami starts the sc, and all of a sudden here comes stone 15 crashing down on the crab, who then makes a b line for the noob ass blm.

i'm already halfway into my macro and poof 0 tp. It was a matter of time before tsumi either a) made up an excuse to leave, or b) bluntly told it like it was. he chose b and said he was going to waste too much gil in this pt to keep hate. pt disbanded, no way in hell i can blame the nin for not wanting to spam ninjitsu.

If you are in a party with a job that spends money while he is xp'n, and he decides the party costs to much for the xp being gained, you don't have a leg to stand on when you call him elitist or an asshole.
 
Puttin as much money into a single party session as Ranger/Ninjas do, I see nothing wrong with having requirements at all. As a Paladin, the only money I spend on consumables during a party is food, although Tavnasian food can be quite expensive at this level. (30k for a stack for tacos... [huh?!])

Anyways... The only thing I would add to this is an idea. Maybe let the party know your expectations before you venture out with them. Give them a chance to look around and say "You know what, I can't guarentee that, maybe we should find someone else."

That is of course assuming most people who play are rational human beings. They aren't, I know this, but I'd prefer to have faith in my fellow players and assume they are all of rational mind then assume they will all think they are the best and get the "omfg i getz teh 300 XP every mob!!!11!"

I digress... Let me put it this way. If I was to ask you to join the party I've formed (or is forming) and you were up front about your expectations (given you aren't an ass about it: "If we XP for less than 5000XP an hour I'm ditching your sorry asses") then I'd be much more easy to work with in reguards to finding just the right person to fill that empty slot. And if I have any doubts, I'd let you know, and the rest of the party, and we'd just go from there.

:?: My question is... were you getting such slow XP because you were on the low end of the party, and were having problems gaining TP and landing your ws's? I mean, Ranger is a HUGE part of the DD process, and if like you said you were on the low end of the ladder and you knew it (you said you had reservations about the BLM or something), maybe you should have spoke up a bit sooner. I've got a friend whose a PLD at level 63, he was in Bibiki Bay today and needed to leave the pt. He asked me to join (I'm 61) and I asked him "are you having any problems with the mobs?" He said some of them hit hard, but he's ok for most of them. Now, knowing that I was a few levels lower, I declined because I might have hurt the party more than helped by joining up with them.

Anyways... yeah... I don't think you're wrong at all. :P
 
R acc is ridicoulus, there are so many pieces that add r acc that are nice and affordable that rangers rarely miss. I was doing dhalmels at 64 and putting big holes in them. for those who don't know, you can xp off of these up to 70-71 i think.

the problem i would guess is not having a good sc partner. drk and thf i know are good for teaming up with ranger. My guess is the blm just picked another melee out of a hat and rolled on out.

All parties i joined have done 4k plus, like i stated unless i like the people i'm out. I send the leader a tell at the 30 min mark, that i will be leaving in 30 min and ask if i should look for replacement.

When i get asked for xp i ask the set up, i give my xp requirements, and every single time, i can't drive home the fact that every single time, i get the same response: Dude we had this set up yesterday and got (fill in big xp number here).

one of these parties had a drg and another job i cant remember off the top of my head. there wasnt a good sc between the drg and this other job, so i sc'd with the other job. this left the drg soloing.

Now not ragging on drgs, but thier ws's were not designed to solo, they were meant to open a light chain. just dumb party mechanics on the part of the leader, and i left that party.
 
It's ok to have standards and expectations - but on the same token these are people sitting accross from you at the game table fae.

If you let a person know outright that you think they are substandard they are going to be offended.

A little tact with your honesty would go a long way I'm sure :)
 
meeze said:
R acc is ridicoulus, there are so many pieces that add r acc that are nice and affordable that rangers rarely miss. I was doing dhalmels at 64 and putting big holes in them. for those who don't know, you can xp off of these up to 70-71 i think.

the problem i would guess is not having a good sc partner. drk and thf i know are good for teaming up with ranger. My guess is the blm just picked another melee out of a hat and rolled on out.
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Hmmm.... Yeah, my Ranger is only level 14, so my knowledge of them is only limited to Valkrummy. And yes, I agree, a poor Skillchain will be a huge detriment to a parties XP/hour.

Oh, and personally? <3 Rangers :D
 
Standards are ok. But in my opinion, 3.5k / 4k is close enough. If I was LFG, I'd just stick it out with that party knowing that I'm still getting XP instead of just sitting around waiting for it. RNG doesn't feel that problem the THF does though, as you know.

Be grateful you can play as often as you do.
Standards, for me, even with a static, are a luxury...So I forge ahead.

If this scenario is the worst thing that ever happens as a result of your standards, good for you for holding strong and not accepting anything less.

I'm usually way too excited to even get a party if I am LFG with some spare time. The only way I'll leave is if it just royally sucks ass. Otherwise, I take what I can get.
 
Sneakypants said:
Standards are ok. But in my opinion, 3.5k / 4k is close enough. If I was LFG, I'd just stick it out with that party knowing that I'm still getting XP instead of just sitting around waiting for it. RNG doesn't feel that problem the THF does though, as you know.

Be grateful you can play as often as you do.
Standards, for me, even with a static, are a luxury...So I forge ahead.

If this scenario is the worst thing that ever happens as a result of your standards, good for you for holding strong and not accepting anything less.

I'm usually way too excited to even get a party if I am LFG with some spare time. The only way I'll leave is if it just royally sucks ass. Otherwise, I take what I can get.
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Heh, well said Sneaky.
 
Keep on Rockin Fae, we need more peole like you! Shun away all the crappy pt's. If I'm in a slow party the most I'd ever stay is till my food runs out (sadly its a 3 hour food but I usually make it only and hour till I leave).
 
I can understand your setting of standards, since you're burning money while in the party. I don't see that much of a problem with leaving a sucky party and telling them why you're leaving, as long as some tact is used.

I have my own standards for exp parties, but since I don't get invites all that often, they're much lower than yours. I use sole sushi, even with the new price, but if the party is getting less than 3k/hr, I just switch to squid+1 or a jack-o'-lantern or something. You can use less expensive stuff if you still want to stay in the party but it's not giving optimal exp.
 
Is it ok to have high standards? Sure.

Were you wrong to leave party? Heck no. If I was in the same position I'd have done the same, thats alot of gil to waste.

Where they wrong to be mad at you? Of course not, they spent time energy and frustration putting that damn party together and you just screwed them over with your selfish standards.

Whenever your in a party that has more than 1 person your not gonna have things your way all the time. Your going to have to cut corners, and somebody isn't going to like it. The only way to make a team work is to work together, to teach each other, and to learn. If your too quick to leave all the time, learning doesn't happen. People stay dumb, and the next time you party with the same people you'll most likely get the same party.

This is the reality of "team play", you can't have it your way all the time. But in a team you can do things that are impossible solo. You can learn things you can't learn yourself, and you can teach somebody who dosent know any better.

But most people are usually there for themselves...........
 
meeze said:
one of these parties had a drg and another job i cant remember off the top of my head. there wasnt a good sc between the drg and this other job, so i sc'd with the other job. this left the drg soloing.

Now not ragging on drgs, but thier ws's were not designed to solo, they were meant to open a light chain. just dumb party mechanics on the part of the leader, and i left that party.
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So very true lol I might be able to pull off 300+ Skewers or Wheeling Thrusts, but no way will that ever match an 800+ Slug Shot to the Mobs face. I think one of Dragoons biggest flaws is that was take the same place as a Ranger in the skillchain chart. If anyone ever invited me to a party where the only other DD was a Ranger, I would tell them I would stay until they found a replacement for me, because it's worthless. We can't skillchain together for shit because we take the same place as ranger. Dragoons are there to shed hate and open a wide variety of light skillchains.


Oh, and on the standards thing. I can't have standards. I'm a melee :roll: For a dragoon, any xp is good xp lol
 
Hmm to me it's more if the party gels. Even if I'm burning gill on ninja, if I'm having a blast in a party I don't usually even notice what the exp per hour is and don't really care if it sucks. And if the party is pulling in 8k an hour if i am seriously not gelling with the member's I'll still leave.

But I don't think it is wrong to have standards especially on a gill burning job. Be careful not to set them *too* high though.

On something basically free (Hello BRD) I can make 1k an hour and not really care, on ninja I expect 3k or more... 3k is my absolute limit. Of course things like AFK, accidental deaths, random misfortunes occur that are out of the party's control that might tip the scales in my opinion.

I take pity on the party leader more often than not.. my whole trip to 71 on drk i was party leader 99 times out of 100, so I sympathise. Hehe.
 
I dunno I guess I have low standards. I'll sit for a 3,000-3,500xp party if I like the company.

There are other people there playing too, and if they can stomach the xp so can I. I'm not going to bum them and myself out over xp. I get enough fantastic parties to make up for it.

Even if you're spending money on ammo and food so what? It's going to take a boat load to get to seventy-five anyway.

If a person is going to do nothing but brag about how useful they are to a party, and how much they spend, then you're just being an asshole who doesn't care about the rest of the party.

One person can drag an entire xp party from over 6k an hour to that little 3k, and that certainly is NO reason to bail out on the other four hard working people.

It may sound like I'm trying to cut people down for leaving a party only getting a certain amount of xp, but I'm not. I'm just saying that the best part of partying for me isn't in our hourly rate.

I love it when I'm clicking with my party. We may not have the means or the full crew to get the xp job done, but it's still fun damnit.

Some people hereM forget that.
 
Personally I have more fun when I click with the pt. Getting huge amounts of XP is great, but its not a race to 75. I remember a few days ago I was with a pt that was doing decent to pretty good XP. The only problem is that no one talked...ever. Even when i would try to start a conversation or something, no one would bite. I know that they were Na since they all said Hi or hello, how are ya, things like that. But when we started to take mobs, it was as if their keyboards didnt work. Thats what made it annoying to pt with them. I come to play this game so i can interact with other people, not so i can end up playing alone.

Then again, i'm a blm so my spells dont cost anything to use, just the initial payment. So we are in a different boat altogether. So i do aggree that you were right in leaving, since you did let them know you were going and that they should start looking for someone else. Its not like you just bailed and told them why in a /shout as you ran off. (That would just suck.)

Some people cant see how much jobs like RNG and NIN are. Unless they used that job themselves at one point.
 
I dunno, maybe I'm weird, but personally, I don't care about "clicking" with the PT, so long as we're doing good. Yeah, it's nice to talk to people, but I'd rather just get the damn exp. For me, the fun in this game is from the quests and missions and such, and XP'ing is something I just have to do in order to be able to do said quests/missions. Now if I'm doing a quest/mission and I'm in a PT, I would much prefer the PT be talking and having fun. But even if they're not, as long as I get it doee, I'm happy. For me, the socializing aspect of the game comes mainly from my linkshell, not from smaller groups. :? Just something I noticed.

So yeah... in a PT, if I'm not making good exp, I leave. However, I have lower standards than Fae here, being as I'm a THF and will take almost any PT I can get. :lol: The funny thing is though, I never pay attention to time when I'm in a PT (or when farming, either, for that matter). I don't go by exp/hour, I just sorta go by how fast it feels like we're getting exp.
 
I read all those posts, and I got some good info. I will start to let people know about the goal I have before joining. I guess I just assumed too much, that nearly any party is possible to get 4k, and we know what happens when we assume ^^.

Well I took a big step today, now the price of the job just went up big time. Until now, I used mainly Crossbow, which is extremely cheap compared to other jobs. Well I hit 66 today, and from this point on, a Holy Bolt will never again touch my weapons. I will use all 3, Gun, Bow, and Crossbow, but now every piece of ammo I will use is 15k and up. That factors to about 55k an hour if I use it sparingly. This is when you start seeing 250k per level...

I appreciate all your input. I will take it into consideration. As an aside to Sneaky, honestly, I wish I didnt have so much time to play. I hate knowing that there is so much more I COULD be doing, but am playing this game instead. Stupid money...

As for clicking with a party, I find it crucial. But I find that I am much more amiable when we are getting 5000 or 6000 an hour then when its down in the dumps. I do take into consideration downtime. Last night had a party where we kept moving to find a decent spot, and it dropped us below 4k. I realized though that is was because of this and so, didnt leave. Same with deaths. I dont like to die, and I do everything in my power not to, but it happens (376 times actually), and I wont disband at the first sign of death.

Other said that enjoying partying is important, and with this I strongly agree. I enjoy it, very much, I see it as a challenge. I like to try and get as much exp as possible per hour. Sadly, having hit 9000+, I have had to rethink this, as it took me a while to readjust to "normal" 6000 an hour parties lol. But its a long grueling road to 75, and as little time and effort as it takes me, that is the road I shall take.

Excim, no I wasnt having trouble hitting at all. One of the problems was that I would have 250 tp before the skillchain was ready.

Finally, as for clicking. There was one member who was rather annoying me. So I suppose that was just more incentive to go. Standards sounds so harsh, but I can really see how it would be. Others sit around all day in Jeuno, where I get invites occasionally when I am not seeking. Of course, I have had days where it takes hours to get invited as well, so I like to make the most of my time. You all see how reasonable it sounds I believe, but I guess I must take into account how it must feel to have someone say that to me. "Fae Im leaving, were not getting 8k an hour, this party isnt worth my time". I wasnt this harsh, but I can see how a goal I dont see as reasonable would piss me off.

Fae
 
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