lolParties

[Aires]

Is it me or does no one like thief's at 60+? i was on all day thursday campaignuing/looking for party with no luck of invites. pretty much 5-6 hours of petty xp from campaign granted i got around 10-12k but party could get that in a hour. after i finally gave up, i switched to my SAM which is 61 and in less then 5 minutes i get an invite -. -. maybe i should just figure out a way to make an all thf party work lol.


sry if words are missing, i do that a lot >.>

 

[Zaltana]

oh people love thf's 60+. but just like blm's they just want the finished 75 product instead of partying with them.

 

[Aires]

lol i want the finished product also ; ;. i'm also almost done meriting marks and dagger so i dont really need to merit much on it >.<

 

[PBParrot]

I love Thief's. free hate for the tank is a good thing for an entire party. I actually will not make party's with a NIN tank if I don't have a THF.

 

[Bajaratt]

I hate thieves, they're one of the last jobs I'd pick for a party. The only things I'll invite after a thief is a BLM, then a PUP. I'd like them more if 99% of them could learn to SATA properly, and without almost killing the "first voke" guy every fight.

Even when I was leveling ninja, I hated having thieves in the party because they'd cause more hate problems than they'd "solve" via trick attack. Any tank who needs a thf to hold hate(outside of merits) is a shitty tank. A good tank makes a thf a waste of a slot since they're not necessary to fulfill their role.

Now, there are VERY few thf's I'd actually party with voluntarily, but there's so few of them that they're obviously the exception to the rule.

 

[Aires]

; ; well atleast on colibri you can start the fight with a mob thats half dead and absolutly hates the tanks guts. i really dont see whats so hard about using sata. its just a simple macro. at 55-60 i was consistantly closing SC's for 600-1k in damage with SATA + Viper Bite. after aquiring dancing edge and assasin THF becomes even easier to use. Theres only one job in the job that can pull hate of the tank with these numbers and thats my main RNG lol. THF = good .

 

[mdkuser]

I dont mind a THF especially for colibris level synced camps, as long as he isnt gimp ( AF pants= no thanks for example..). Suckes to say, but reason peopel dotn invite THF is due them being gimp in majority.

 

[Bajaratt]

; ; well atleast on colibri you can start the fight with a mob thats half dead and absolutly hates the tanks guts. i really dont see whats so hard about using sata. its just a simple macro. at 55-60 i was consistantly closing SC's for 600-1k in damage with SATA + Viper Bite. after aquiring dancing edge and assasin THF becomes even easier to use. Theres only one job in the job that can pull hate of the tank with these numbers and thats my main RNG lol. THF = good .

And yet, almost all of them can't seem to get it right.

By "starting the fight" you must meen 20 seconds into the fight, because that's how long it took the THF to get around to using his SATA macro on the tank, while the first voker is nearly dead. Yes, with assassin, they can break up SATA so that they don't fuck up the party, but very few of them do it and even fewer do it effectively. I'm not going to explain how to do their job when they're level 60+, I'm just not going to invite them. If they haven't learned by that point, they never will, so they're not even worth my time.

Even on piercing weak mobs, I'd easily go with DRG or RNG over THF. THF's are only useful in exp if your tank sucks; and I'd rather get a good tank than get another player to make a shitty tank decent.

 

[Khajit]

Yeah.. most thf suck. I'm generally the only ones I trust unless it's a person I know has their brain attached.
Everything baja said was correct except the part about THF being useless if the tank sucks. THF is a DD capable of dealing damage perfectly fine and can out damage "cannon" DD if they actually give a shit about what they wear and play properly just like any other DD job. (pup is not a DD. it is an abomination)

The idea that THF sucks because half of them are gimp is slightly wrong as well imo. All the other jobs can and usually turn out to be just as gimp, THF is simply affected by it more and it's alot easier for retards to screwup sata etc than for them to screwup engage-->WS.

Basically to sum it up you're taking a chance whenever you pick a guy in a pickup party and the results you're seeing is because people want to minimize risks. It doesn't help that people are stupid either. Hay we got a thf in this pt. let's go tell the sam wearing a soboro to sub thf!(yes that actually happened)

 

[K. Ishitar]

thf is one of those jobs like rdm, nin, and pld(to a lesser extent) it's always a chance to take when inviting them lol.

I love good people at x job if there's a slot to make it work then I'll invite them if i know they're a good player.

I personally don't mind sata when I play blue mage, dd seem so scared of it like it's going to kill them but maybe it's because of head butt and using shadows(sometimes was /thf pre 50 90% of the time)

I know how you feel though it could always be worse...try leveling a job that doesn't have much room or flexibility in higher levels it would be worse lol.

 

[Arietti]

For me, the majority of my exp from 60-75 came from campaign with a few odd levels gained in parties. And I fought EM crabs for skilling up.

 

[Euphacent]

The issue isn't about setting up macros, it's about people not knowing when they need to use their abilities and/or prep them. A thf should prep sata or whatever they're going to use when they start to pull, and once a mob has been voked, the mob should be placed on the tank within a few seconds of the party engaging. It's not hard, it's just some people don't understand how to manage their abilities.

 

[Bajaratt]

Everything baja said was correct except the part about THF being useless if the tank sucks.

No, I said that THF was only useful if the tank sucks. If the tank is good, then the thf is useless. If the tank sucks(has trouble holding hate), then obviously a thf will help; but if they don't need a thf to hold hate, then another DD is a much better option.

THF is a DD capable of dealing damage perfectly fine and can out damage "cannon" DD if they actually give a shit about what they wear and play properly just like any other DD job. (pup is not a DD. it is an abomination)

LOL. No, just no.

This is what thf's tell themselves to make them feel better about themselves and to think they're DD. If a thf could outdamage a cannon DD so easily, then thf would be a cannon DD. THF can outdamage a cannon job on piercing weak mobs, but on normal mobs(who they also don't lose TP/food from), they don't outdamage any cannon job. Again, there are the extremely rare exceptions, but don't peddle off the abilities of 2-3 thf's on the whole server as though every thf could play just as well.

The idea that THF sucks because half of them are gimp is slightly wrong as well imo. All the other jobs can and usually turn out to be just as gimp, THF is simply affected by it more and it's alot easier for retards to screwup sata etc than for them to screwup engage-->WS.

It's not that they're gimp, it's that they're idiots who can't manage a simple macro. It's their ONE job during a party, and while it is slightly more involved than DD job, it's in no way, shape, or form difficult to do. It is more noticeable when they suck, but then that only proves my point even more. Most thf's suck, how can I tell? Because I've seen them do it and it's very easy to notice.

 

[exodusamphi]

Go merit on PLD then come back and complain about lack of invites.

 

[Khajit]

Yeah.. thf cant DD. Bullshit. if that was true then i wouldn't have out damaged my entire limbus shell for almost every single run for several months until my pc with ffxi broke when I was on thf.(only runs where i spent the more time pulling new mobs than being engaged weren't counted)
I used to believe that crap but so far every time I've parsed what I've seen is that ANY DD job can deal good damage when they take the proper effort. No there isn't anything broken with my parser. I've had multiple people parse and compare thier results with mine to see if i screwed up somewhere and the results have been exactly the same.
I don't even go to the bird camp 99% of the time when I do these parses yet I have to deal with people claiming lolbirdcamp because I out damaged the "cannon" DD.(or they claim that the DD was gimp, etc etc. I throw out the parses where I win vs gimp people anyway so that's not even an issue yet it's always brought up)
Whenever i do go to birds i multiply the other DD's damage by 15% and then the first thing people claim is that my piercing bonus is what made me win the parse.

So no. you are wrong when you say that THF cant out damage a cannon job vs a mob that isnt peircing weak. Just because you base your opinion of thf damage on shitheads who fulltime relic(gilfinder) pants, wear thf knife, and think "str is lol for thf" doesn't mean that they are what normal thf damage is in a party.

 

[Neisan]

Thief can DD if they aren't too busy wearing -atk rings, full dragon set, main handing TK knife... I don't get how you think you're going to deal damage wearing half the crap I've seen thieves full time. If the gimp/confused/wtf player thread is to believed Thf, Rdm, Pld and Sam are the most gimped jobs out of all of them in FF.

 

[mdkuser]

wait. THF using sata AFTER level 60? wtf..

 

[Bladewind]

wait. THF using sata AFTER level 60? wtf..

I try to Sata > Hide > WS every 5 mins, gives about the same damage as splitting SA and TA WS, but it happens faster so i can auto attack and afk for the next 50 seconds! ;D

In seriousness though, THF while not being hard to play, at any level, does have alot more to do than standard "cannon" melee. At least if they want to do the best damage they can. It's fairly depressing when you need to be absolutly perfect with everything you do, and have top class gear, just to keep up damage wise with the SAM full timing Str rings.

 

[Bajaratt]

Yeah.. thf cant DD. Bullshit. if that was true then i wouldn't have out damaged my entire limbus shell for almost every single run for several months until my pc with ffxi broke when I was on thf.(only runs where i spent the more time pulling new mobs than being engaged weren't counted)
I used to believe that crap but so far every time I've parsed what I've seen is that ANY DD job can deal good damage when they take the proper effort. No there isn't anything broken with my parser. I've had multiple people parse and compare thier results with mine to see if i screwed up somewhere and the results have been exactly the same.
I don't even go to the bird camp 99% of the time when I do these parses yet I have to deal with people claiming lolbirdcamp because I out damaged the "cannon" DD.(or they claim that the DD was gimp, etc etc. I throw out the parses where I win vs gimp people anyway so that's not even an issue yet it's always brought up)
Whenever i do go to birds i multiply the other DD's damage by 15% and then the first thing people claim is that my piercing bonus is what made me win the parse.

So no. you are wrong when you say that THF cant out damage a cannon job vs a mob that isnt peircing weak. Just because you base your opinion of thf damage on shitheads who fulltime relic(gilfinder) pants, wear thf knife, and think "str is lol for thf" doesn't mean that they are what normal thf damage is in a party.

Congrats on parsing against gimps. You're not parsing against the cream of the crop; maybe the best the AH has to offer, but a far cry from the full potential the cannon jobs can really unleash. A pimp THF can beat a gimp DD, A pimp THF can beat average DD, but a pimp THF cannot beat a great/pimp DD.

Again, if THF's could reliably out damage cannon DD jobs, they'd BE cannon DD jobs.

 

[Khajit]

Congrats on parsing against gimps. You're not parsing against the cream of the crop; maybe the best the AH has to offer, but a far cry from the full potential the cannon jobs can really unleash. A pimp THF can beat a gimp DD, A pimp THF can beat average DD, but a pimp THF cannot beat a great/pimp DD.

Again, if THF's could reliably out damage cannon DD jobs, they'd BE cannon DD jobs.

so the following is a gimp player right?

No those arent tiger rings. 21% haste on a mnk is gimp amirite? That's obviously why i've outparsed him and other mnks in similar/equal tp gear?
Because I throw out/delete parses where the DD are gimp I obviously must use only gimp DD as my reference point?

Since this is the only pic/parse i have left since my pc meltdown because i'd put it on photobucket so I'll have to use this.
In here you can see 1 gimp(drk) a 20% haste ebody ridill war, a cor, a brd and a rdm as well as my thf(only 18% haste on me at the time and missing my hect feet since i left em in MH by accident).

The first step is to ignore the gimp because he's a gimp.
Now let's see if i can approximate the crap that I've heard over and over again that i'm going to hear from you this time.

you:The party was at birds!
me: it was at the north mamool camp
you:The DD's were gimp!
me: so ridills are gimp now? So the fact that if I outDD a party full of gimps I delete the parse doesnt mean anything?
Guy with ridill that wasn't in this parse(you know who he is): the equatorial equinox must have aligned with the moon to give you an unfair advantage.
you: he didn't have speed belt//dusk+1/etc so that's doesnt count etc
Me: so he has to have 2% more haste for it to be fair when I could stand to have 5%+ more haste myself(at that time)?
That sound about right?
person I came within 1~3 % of in a Beadeaux cannon while offhanding that shitty thf knife since we were farming peiste pellets the day before he got Ebody. http://www.ffxiah.com/player.php?id=321196#home
Hay that lsname seems familiar. care to call him a gimp to his face?
Now I know that you have a tendency to refuse to beleive you're wrong even when you clearly are and will argue that until the end of time or the other person involved gives up trying to get information into your thick skull so im ending it here.
Those sam WS crits without sneak attack sure are awesome eh?
To sum it up yes thf can deal damage and so can almost any other job i've seen so far. The main problem is knowing if they have enough brains in thier skulls to actually play it (or any non cannon job)right. in thf's case a person who barely meets the standards to engage-->ws on a cannon job isnt going to have the intelligence/skill to to actually give a shit about doing sata right.