Munich - Crock of Hollywood Bullshit

Firestreak

Firestreak

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Spielberg two-sided view of a clearly one sided issue. I'm tired of the whole liberal horseshit argument that violence only begets more violence. Israel was clearly the victim in the Munich Olympic incident and that message was clearly drowned out by this pile of dog shit movie.

Spielberg mixed REAL events with 11 Israeli athletes being murdered with IMAGINARY characters retaliating.

Israel is a country surrounded by muslim countries who want to see them exterminated simply because of their religion. They are outnumbered TWO HUNDRED FIFTY to ONE per capita. Israel isn't the country who runs around blowing up SCHOOL BUSES.

What baffles me most of all, is Spielberg is fucking Jewish. The terrorists he wants to understand would murder him and his whole family without a second thought.

So unless you want to see absolute trash, don't see Munich, Hollywood's latest waste of time. Do something better with your 10 bucks, like use it for toilet paper. You'll definetly feel like you got more value out of it.
 
this argument is just enough to peak my interest.

Now i kinda want to see it.
 
Firestreak said:
I'm tired of the whole liberal horseshit argument that violence only begets more violence.
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What's the conservative view of what violence begets (other than profit of course)?
 
you do know there are Israel terrorists right? let's not go into the "Isreal is completely innocent" bullshit :| and 250 to 1 is a bit...inaccurate. Speaking purely of numbers, sure.. (atleast of just Israel vs others) but Israel has superior technology not to mention the backing of the most powerful country ont he planet... the odds are not 250 to 1 :|
 
Also Operation Wrath of God only got one person directly connected to Black September.

That being said, Israel had every right to freak out. Shit, the Germans released the terrorists responsible cause some of their friends hijacked a plane... You know, you would think Germany would bend over backwards to accommodate Israel after the whole holocaust thing. Hell, I would have bombed Germany if I was PM of Israel at the time.
 
What kills me about Spielberg and all of this crap lately...He made Schindler's List. Yes, he's a Jew, but so are a lot of people, and it's simply possibly to be detatched and/or ignorant. However, making a movie like Schindler's List required a lot of knowledge of the subject, passion for telling that story, dedication for a cause.

I know Schindler and terrorism are two totally different stories, but I am amazed that two totally different viewpoints come out of the same man.
I've lost a lot of respect for Spielberg lately.
 
Sculli said:
What's the conservative view of what violence begets (other than profit of course)?
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True, but is it always complaining to cry victim?

...Or could it actually be true, and there's really something that's been wiped under the rug?
 
Sculli said:
What's the conservative view of what violence begets (other than profit of course)?
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Killing terrorists prevents future terrorists attacks.

Elemmire said:
you do know there are Israel terrorists right? let's not go into the "Isreal is completely innocent" bullshit :| and 250 to 1 is a bit...inaccurate. Speaking purely of numbers, sure.. (atleast of just Israel vs others) but Israel has superior technology not to mention the backing of the most powerful country ont he planet... the odds are not 250 to 1 :|
Today 06:39 AM
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What terrorists? Name one terrorist attack perpetrated by Israel. They are blamed by liars often with distorted numbers. If 10 civilians are killed, BBC will report first 100 civilians killed and blast it over the world for days, and then a week later correct their original numbers which were 100% wrong. Civilians get killed because Palestinian terrorists and their leaders walk open in the streets and people don't think to stand away from them. I'm sorry but some guy in America starts chanting to suicide bomb Canada and I'm going to stand 5 meters back from his ass.

I've got more sources to show where civilian deaths were inflated from tens to hundreds... an especially famous one was were 13 deaths were turned into 500 by the act of media. Unfortunately I'm up in VT and my connection sucks and can't really research.

And btw, Israel — Population: 6,276,883

Muslim Population is 1.70 billion

Israel also controls an extremely tiny percent of the landmass of the middle east. Here's a nice source for some history based on that information.

http://www.eretzyisroel.org/~jkatz/myths.html

If a bus full of American children was blown up by Palestinian terrorists, I find it hard to believe people here would look at civilians killed(civilians throwing flaming bottles at tanks(real smart) or living with the terrorists) during a retaliation aimed at the terrorists as just as bad. The difference is that Israel always targets combatants and occasionally civilians are killed. This is NOT their fault. It's the fault of the terrorists for setting up base in populated towns and then making attacks. The terrorists, on the other hand avoid the IDF forces and target civilians specifically.

I have a nice source with an IDF(Israeli Defense Force) explaining a lot of the policy, the methods they go through to prevent civilian deaths and his own views on the matter. When I get home I'll post it.

In short, the world needs to pull its own head out of its ass and try and look at it from the Israeli side. You're surrounded by people who want you exterminated. To their extremists there is no act too horrible that they wouldn't do it to get to you. They will use children for suicide bombers. They will use ambulances to smuggle guns. They absolutely hate you, and for one reason alone, you're Jewish.

Consessions obviously don't work, note how Israel withdrew from the West Bank, the area demanded, and now they want Israel to just "move to Europe." It's ridiculous.
 
Firestreak said:
Consessions obviously don't work, note how Israel withdrew from the West Bank, the area demanded, and now they want Israel to just "move to Europe." It's ridiculous.
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Glad you mentioned that. I mentioned it in another thread, and it went unnoticed. These people do want Jews dead. Israel, in an effort to make a peaceful gesture in hopes that terrorist acts would ease, backed up. Terror didn't stop, and ridiculous requests that they move to Europe have been brought up.

I have an idea. Move the terrorists to fucking 20,000 leagues under the sea.
These bastards do not even deserve to be talked to. They understand one thing. Speak to them in that way, and kill them...All. They wouldn't give you another thought. Realize it.
 
Spielberg, I feel, would bend over backwards and have an ass-baby for terror, just so he could "understand" them more. Just after giving birth to the putrid being, the terrorists would cut his throat, gut him, film it, and bring all their buddies out to dance in the street and laugh while filming the scene. They'd burn the body and drag it around, laughing.

...And we'd try to negotiate...More...WTF.
 
Firestreak said:
Sculli said:
What's the conservative view of what violence begets (other than profit of course)?
Click to expand...

Killing terrorists prevents future terrorists attacks.
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That's interesting, but not the answer to my question.
Let me try it again: In your point of view, what does violence beget?

As far as your answer goes though; If we are talking about killing terrorists before they attack, how do you qualify who's a terrorist, and who's a guy that just happens to look different than you do, or perhaps has different values than you do?
 
Sculli said:
That's interesting, but not the answer to my question.
Let me try it again: In your point of view, what does violence beget?

As far as your answer goes though; If we are talking about killing terrorists before they attack, how do you qualify who's a terrorist, and who's a guy that just happens to look different than you do, or perhaps has different values than you do?
Click to expand...

I think it's a distinguishing trait that the "terrorists" portray...What with the parading and celebrating cruel murders, relentless attacks that sacrifice their own lives and the lives of innocent people around them, unwillingness to negotiate, etc.

How come it's ok for them to say, "This is who we are, and you need to understand that" ???


Yet America is criticized for the slightest of things that "offend" some people.



The fact that America strikes AFTER they themselves or allies have been attacked would show them not to be terrorists. I don't think we need to muddy this by skewing words and bastardizing what we know is the truth.

I am not saying America is perfect by any means...Far from it. But I am saying there is such a massive difference between a terrorist and George W.
Some of you might like to make a funny and joke about that "relationship" between the two. You people are idiots. Wake the fuck up.


The way a guy looks, Sculli, has nothing to do with issues as large as this...Not to a civilized people, anyway. People of different backgrounds unite to fight evil.
 
I am all for killing people who deserve to die, I am also all for making sure that this "merit" is measured by acceptable standards, and not by a blanket "Ah, those guys don't like us, kill them all!".

Be that as it may, the question what conservatives think violence begets remains to be answered.
 
Sculli said:
I am all for killing people who deserve to die, I am also all for making sure that this "merit" is measured by acceptable standards, and not by a blanket "Ah, those guys don't like us, kill them all!".

Be that as it may, the question what conservatives think violence begets remains to be answered.
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Completely agreed. "Ah, those guys don't like us, kill them all!"
That's just messed up. We're responding not to the fact that they don't like us, but rather the fact that they'll kill us no matter what...And be gruesome about it...And celebrate it.


Anyhoo, I'm neither liberal or conservative...A little of both.
No matter how I slice it and dice it, violence does beget more violence, if looked at from the general sentiment. Most people's gut reaction to violence, is more violence. An eye for an eye. That's just an obvious reaction. It's to be expected.

HOWEVER...Let's bring up WW2.
The U.S. remained not part of that war for the beginning years. We got "officially" involved after the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. I think our retalliation was both extreme and completely final. My point is, even after such a royally deserved ass-kicking, with time and effort on both sides, the Japanese have recovered and are better than before and our relations are also better than before.

So, sometimes I think it's ok to just "fight it out"...
The situation in Iraq is quite different than the Vietnam some claim it to be. Vietnam never saw results.
Iraq has seen some results. More than I thought would ever come to fruition. U.S. forces remain to ensure smooth transitions to democracy...Something the non-radical, non-terrorist community supports. And why wouldn't they? The average citizen has been held down for the longest time. They've not been allowed to know anything but that, and now they are given that chance. They are given the chance to vote and come up with their own choices, and forge a decent relationship with other civilized countries in the process. The future is in their hands. They won't become the next Japan, but they can realize a successful, peaceful future with the implementation of a new set of laws, voted upon.



Good change can happen, but nobody can force it. The fact that we have to remain in Iraq and show a strong presence means nothing...The Iraqis are the ones that want the change for themselves. We are there to help ensure that rebels do not undermine the process before it can actually take place.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink...
 
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This is a situation I want the opinion of.

What if, by some chance, that the people of Iraq elect an insane muslim leader. Who yes in turn has a grudge against America. Now, these people have selected him through the process of democracy, what do we do?

I've often wondered about this. :/


And, something that bothers me about the words of fighting. I've always been a firm believer, in the idea that you shouldn't cheer a war on unless you're willing to go sign up and fight for it. Because only then could I truly see a person being a true believer in what we're doing is right. It's easy to sit back and talk about how righteous we are or aren't.

So...this is only my feelings, but don't cheer on fighting, don't cheer on war, unless you're willing to grab up your rifle and fight. It's alot easier to do this when your life isn't on the line. My cousin is a marine, my uncle is in the army. They believe what they're doing is right. They believe in risking their lives. THEY are the one's who's opinions I will mostly respect above others who sit at home and discuss it.

And because of my feeling...I try not to decide whether this war is just or not....it doesn't feel completely right to me...so I haven't made the decision. Am I willing to risk my life for a war I don't completely understand? And...can I really listen to the words of the general populous, which as a total usually just plays follow the leader,a nd doesn't think past that for themselves...?
 
I don't think the US will let them have a rebellious candidate. Democracy isn't really democratic, especially with the big dog.

What you say about if you're for the war you should pick up a rifle and fight, is really interesting. I'm not for the war, so I don't have to pick up a weapon... ever. I hate wars... :nono:
 
The Druw said:
What if, by some chance, that the people of Iraq elect an insane muslim leader. Who yes in turn has a grudge against America. Now, these people have selected him through the process of democracy, what do we do?
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That's their choice...I doubt it will come to that, but if it does, and if that leader chooses to strike out on us, then we bury them.

Questions?
 
The Druw said:
And, something that bothers me about the words of fighting. I've always been a firm believer, in the idea that you shouldn't cheer a war on unless you're willing to go sign up and fight for it. Because only then could I truly see a person being a true believer in what we're doing is right. It's easy to sit back and talk about how righteous we are or aren't.

So...this is only my feelings, but don't cheer on fighting, don't cheer on war, unless you're willing to grab up your rifle and fight. It's alot easier to do this when your life isn't on the line. My cousin is a marine, my uncle is in the army. They believe what they're doing is right. They believe in risking their lives. THEY are the one's who's opinions I will mostly respect above others who sit at home and discuss it.

And because of my feeling...I try not to decide whether this war is just or not....it doesn't feel completely right to me...so I haven't made the decision. Am I willing to risk my life for a war I don't completely understand? And...can I really listen to the words of the general populous, which as a total usually just plays follow the leader,a nd doesn't think past that for themselves...?
Click to expand...


That's an opinion I can respect.
Actually when 9/11 happened, my career was just budding. I thought long and hard about leaving the new job and joining the military. My family and I have always thought I'd do well there.
In the end, I chose to stay with what I was already involved with. Mostly because I figured that our guys would already be en route somewhere to whoop the enemy. It didn't seem like it would require new people to sign up. Seemed like a simple job. Mostly, the actual fighting was, but the extended efforts we see today and that will carry on in the future, I didn't really anticipate.

For me to make that jump would be a permanent career change. Abandoning it didn't make sense, considering the scope, at the time. Still, if it comes to fighting for this country if the fight is brought to our front door, or in the event of a draft...I'm there and I have complete confidence in the other citizens of the U.S. that we will gladly fight to the death for this country. We do, after all have quite a large private firearm collection for a reason. We will use it.


Yes, it is easy to sit back and talk. I've never been one to talk something up that I wouldn't back up though. There are just decisions that are so simple that you just do them. Like I said, the fight comes to your door...What do you do? Lay down and get steamrolled and beheaded? Fuck that. You take as many as you can with you, protect those you love, and never see defeat.

It's easy to say, and even easier to do if you are left with no other choice.
That's just me though. I can't imagine people choosing to hide from such a reality.
 
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