Need NIN Tanking Advice from Vet. NINs

Ronith

Ronith

Annkoku
Adventurer
Joined
Dec 2, 2004
Messages
995
Age
39
Location
Republic, Missouri
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Windy
Main Job
DarkKnight-Male
Secondary Job
Paladin-Male
Third Job
Ninja-Male
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Quetzalcoatl
Linkshell
NoizyTribe
FFXIV
Sakujou
Okay, like the topic says, I need some good advice for tanking on NIN, I know there was a topic about tanking in general earlier in this GD thread, but!

I'm focused strictly towards NIN, I have all the Ni and Ichi spells cept Jubaku, simply because I don't feel like spending 500k on the scroll then, another 600k on 12 stacks for the tools...

But I do MB my Ninjutsu when it comes around, I macro ENM gear for Voke, I macro INT and stuff for Ninjutsu... voke every 30sec etc... but I still lose hate at spots... and i can't seem to time Utsu perfectly like people I know do... I constantly have haste on me in a PT and I still can't always time it 100%... I've only got +19 eva, and +29 whilst at night... please any vet. suggestions would be awesome...^^ thx
 
40-61 nin use your spells for hate 61+ use the slow spell and DD for hate and voke every 30secs all i could say
 
I start off with Jubaku -> Kurynami-> Hojo

I also have 2 eris earrings and a mermaids earring that I wear almost all the time plus i eat dorado sushi, I hardly lose hate, I tank for skill up pts of 70+ in kuftal all the time without much problem.
 
The main reason you are losing hate on ninja is because you are losing Enmity to the damage other people around you are dealing. Keeping hate nearly 100% of the time ensues that you must out damage, or nearly keep up with, the other people in your party. Through the Elemental Nuke period, I dont suggest you spam them. I more or less suggest that you swing - nuke - swing - nuke, then nuke as required. THIS IS ONLY DURING THOSE LEVELS. Mainly you will stop using the elemental nukes at 55-60 or so, as your melee becomes even more effective. When you start the fight, a huge hate booster is starting off with the usual provoke, then immediately casting enfeebling spells. Hojo and Kurayami are great hate grabbers, and it's a great start. One thing to ensure is that you are NOT gimping your melee output simply by stacking evasion. Stacking evasion in the early levels is good, but be sure you can hit the mob and still do some damage too. Once you get your pattern down, and are dealing a moderate amount of damage to the enemy, keeping hate should not be a tough challenge at all, I know for myself in my trip from ninja 1-75 I kept hate rather well.
Hope this helps, if you would like more details, or have questions, please send me a PM.
 
Im about the same - for emn+ I macro in a resentment cape (+2), that lvl 1 facemask (+2), Eris Earring (+2), Mermaid ring (+2 but I actually wear that full time), red sash (+1). I also boost Str where I can (range, rse hands, spike necklace macroed in for ws >.>) and wear a life belt to keep up w melee as best I can. War cant even voke it off me to turn the mob for a sata w this setup (at lvl 56), and Im a taru so I know its not the DD.

I open with Kuryami as the mobs coming to camp, and maybe toss off a hojo or jubaku. I also pop in the elemental:ni that the particular mob type is weak to (mainly Hyoton) every chance I get, esp for MBs.

As for shadows, I recast Ichi Before pulls. When 2 shadws are down I Start recasting ichi, so I still have one shadow and dont get interrupted during the long cast. When all my shadows drop next I move on to :ni, and can get that up easily between attacks. (just cast when shadows drop)

Now heres the tricky part. Getting up Ichi after :ni. Since It doesnt overwrite, what I do is wait til 3 shadows are gone. Then I start casting :ichi about halfway between mob attacks. At @ 30% cast the mob will attack. If it drops that last shadow, np, ichi goes up fine. If it misses, then I manually cancel :ni. I do this before 60% cast so I dont lose the spell and end up sol cuz it wont overwrite.

Rinse, repeat.


EDIT: OOH OOOH OOOH, btw, any experienced nin know how to lvl parry? I sti around on my RDM w full parry+ gear going for skill-ups, and solo between XPs on my nin w evade- gear, but I cant get skill-ups worth anything T.T plz help!
 
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Numa said:
Im about the same - for emn+ I macro in a resentment cape (+2), that lvl 1 facemask (+2), Eris Earring (+2), Mermaid ring (+2 but I actually wear that full time), red sash (+1). I also boost Str where I can (range, rse hands, spike necklace macroed in for ws >.>) and wear a life belt to keep up w melee as best I can. War cant even voke it off me to turn the mob for a sata w this setup (at lvl 56), and Im a taru so I know its not the DD.

I open with Kuryami as the mobs coming to camp, and maybe toss off a hojo or jubaku. I also pop in the elemental:ni that the particular mob type is weak to (mainly Hyoton) every chance I get, esp for MBs.

As for shadows, I recast Ichi Before pulls. When 2 shadws are down I Start recasting ichi, so I still have one shadow and dont get interrupted during the long cast. When all my shadows drop next I move on to :ni, and can get that up easily between attacks. (just cast when shadows drop)

Now heres the tricky part. Getting up Ichi after :ni. Since It doesnt overwrite, what I do is wait til 3 shadows are gone. Then I start casting :ichi about halfway between mob attacks. At @ 30% cast the mob will attack. If it drops that last shadow, np, ichi goes up fine. If it misses, then I manually cancel :ni. I do this before 60% cast so I dont lose the spell and end up sol cuz it wont overwrite.

Rinse, repeat.


EDIT: OOH OOOH OOOH, btw, any experienced nin know how to lvl parry? I sti around on my RDM w full parry+ gear going for skill-ups, and solo between XPs on my nin w evade- gear, but I cant get skill-ups worth anything T.T plz help!
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Parrying is a very hard skill to level up. You will greatly increase your chances at parrying by increasing your agility, because the Parrying skill is tied in with the AGL stat.
 
This may not be what you want to hear, but I never much cares as a ninja if I held hate or not. Incidentally, I held hate fight because of that attitude. I focused on evasion and never getting hit. I viewed ninjas job as to never take hits, paladin's job as to never lose hate.

By taking very little damage, as a result I held hate...
 
Firestreak said:
This may not be what you want to hear, but I never much cares as a ninja if I held hate or not. Incidentally, I held hate fight because of that attitude. I focused on evasion and never getting hit. I viewed ninjas job as to never take hits, paladin's job as to never lose hate.

By taking very little damage, as a result I held hate...
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That's a very good point. You lose large chunks of hate whenever you take damage from whatever hates you.
 
NEVER overlook Jubaku. It's expensive for a reason, and that reason is it's a rediculously potent paralyze. Your debuffs are one of your most powerful weapons.

Until around level 60 you should be spamming the elemental wheel and debuffing the mob with hojo kurayami and jubaku unless a mage is doing it too with more accuracy, but still spam the elemental wheel. at level 60 you get kind of a DD upgrade in hauby/byrnie and blade:jin, your damage alone will put up more than elemental wheel, so you still want to use it, just not spam.
 
Life Belt > survival belt, use jubaku, use kurayami, use hojo, in that order, use enmity on voke, dont leave enmity gear on while meleeing, use snipers and evasion earrings.

Should cast NI between pulls, ni + ichi easily lasts the length of ni recast.

When you get blade jin, make a WS equip macro if possible and drop the stupid elemental spells at 55ish or so.

I say go the DD route over the evasion route. DD helps the pt kill shit faster and gets you more hate. But be flexible, if the mobs are really accurate, then you need to add a little more evasion. If they are evading you like crazy, then throw on some DD gear.

Kept hate over a kraken club war doing the above at lvl 68ish. Haste gear is nice, but only when you can stack it to some degree. 3% haste isn't going to accomplish anything.

NIN is a powerful job capable of tanking anything. Its alot of hard work, money, and time to build it up and chances are you will never be completely done. But being able to out DD nearly everyone and still tank without getting hit is hella fun.
 
Tymon said:
NEVER overlook Jubaku. It's expensive for a reason, and that reason is it's a rediculously potent paralyze. Your debuffs are one of your most powerful weapons.

Until around level 60 you should be spamming the elemental wheel and debuffing the mob with hojo kurayami and jubaku unless a mage is doing it too with more accuracy, but still spam the elemental wheel. at level 60 you get kind of a DD upgrade in hauby/byrnie and blade:jin, your damage alone will put up more than elemental wheel, so you still want to use it, just not spam.
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Also DW4 at 60 if i remeber right
 
I only leveled NIN to 40, but I did notice Jubaku landing well, kicking in a lot, and drawing a good bit of hate. The quest is easy, just a trip to Norg and a trip to Horlais Peak if I'm thinking of the right quest. Just a bit of running around and it'll save you that 500k.
 
I'm just NIN 50, but what these guys have been saying is true. Not having Jubaku... right up there with WHM not having Erase. Or perhaps a better example would be BLM not having Aero IV (that's the really expensive one, right?). And Jubaku is an easy quest, buy the damp scroll for 10k or whatever it is on AH.

Voke - Juba - Kura - Hojo, recast Utsu, and then start melee. Up until 50, the pure evasion route works. But somewhere between 50 and 60, it stops working, and you need a bunch of DD ability to keep hate. Besides Hauby and certain katanas, the gear isn't all that expensive. Well, compared to your tool cost, anyway.


As for leveling parry... stack parry gear and AGI, fill any slot you can with -evasion, and go find targets that match your parry skill's level, not your level. If it's 75-ish, go to Yhoator. 100-ish, Garliage. Get the idea?
 
IMO, if you cant afford Jubaku, you shouldnt be playing ninja. Its an expensive job, it will always be an expensive job. Its why alot of nins have popped up in the last year or so, because people reached 75 with one job and developed the income to be able to properly support ninja. Don't become "just another nin that can't hold hate," or "can only tank slow mobs with poor acc." NIN can tank anything, and I mean anything. Do it right, please.
 
Zoolander said:
IMO, if you cant afford Jubaku, you shouldnt be playing ninja. Its an expensive job, it will always be an expensive job. Its why alot of nins have popped up in the last year or so, because people reached 75 with one job and developed the income to be able to properly support ninja. Don't become "just another nin that can't hold hate," or "can only tank slow mobs with poor acc." NIN can tank anything, and I mean anything. Do it right, please.
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Seriously, holding hate with a ninja isn't all that diffiicult. And to all you people who say ninja needs a thf to hold hate, that means you are just lazy. I've been in a party with 3 mnks and still managed to hold hate, not gonna say i had it 100% of the time, but it was close to around 85-90% of the time. And it wasn't your average everyday mnk, It was mnks with merits and perfect DD gear for the level. Rainer and Darth.. both of which can take hate at will from almost any tank.

All I'm saying is don't be afraid to throw your gil around if you're gonna level ninja. In the long run you'll keep hate better and get a great rep.

P.S. Zoolander can't keep hate off my whm.. how the hell did he keep it off that K.club war :D j/k bud
 
Numa said:
As for shadows, I recast Ichi Before pulls.
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I'm only 40NIN, so take my advice with a grain of salt. But I would also recommend casting :Ni between pulls, as that one extra shadow seems to go a really long way. There's been a number of occurences during my static where I could tank the entire fight with only Utsu:Ni.

Personally I prefer to open with Kurayami as the Blindness really seems to help extend my shadows, but I static with a THF so opening with the bigger hate-grab is not as pertinent of an issue.
 
Actually with Ichi you'll have more shadows.

Let me explain.

Ni > Ni, 8 shadows.

Ichi > Ichi > Ni, 10 shadows.

Because you can't cast Ichi over Ni but you can cast Ni over Ichi. Starting with Ichi will take you the furthest before requiring a Ni>Ichi potentially risky movement. When you're casting over you really can't be hit.

>> Also the Ichi timer is less than Ni.

Than Ni > Ichi > Ni and you can run out of shadows before the timer is up. Ichi > Ni > Ichi is a very short chance of that.

Hence Ichi > Ichi > Ni > your Ichi is probably back up by now. The timer being shorter and Ni giving you an extra shadow. Ni > Ichi > Ni, there's no telling if you'll have your timer up in time or not.
 
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