New update information: Ranged attacks and utsusemi.

[Lecan]

Well, figured I'd check out the POL website today to find some news that could be either good or bad (most will probably deem it as bad, I think it's kinda 50/50)

http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/information/0630.html

note: Forgive me if the link doesn't work, sometimes I suck at teh entarnets.

"Changes to Utsusemi and Ranged Attacks

The next version update will make battle more strategic for players who use Utsusemi or ranged attacks.

*Changes to the ninjutsu "Utsusemi"
In the next update, the player's enmity will decrease when a shadow image created by Utsusemi is absorbed by an attack.

*Changes to Ranged Attacks
Soon, the distance of the monster from the player will determine the damage and accuracy of ranged attacks. This determination will vary from weapon to weapon, as will the ideal distance for maximum damage. In addition, the higher the monster's level is with regard to the player, the less damage will be dealt with a ranged attack. This system is similar to that of melee attacks, but the difference in damage will not be as great.

A score of new material and exciting new improvements awaits in the next version update in mid-July, so keep checking this site for details as the time approaches!"

On a bad note, it looks like NIN tanks will become a thing of the past. They don't seem to hold hate all that well to begin with (Then again I stopped partying at level 41 on DRG, so forgive me if this is a false statement) and with this nerf to Utsu it could make it even harder to hold hate for them. Perhaps we will see more DD NIN soon (which in my opinion is what they were more or less intended to do, but a moot point).

On a Semi-good note, it seems that Rangers (and those who used ranged attacks) are getting nerfed a bit, making it so that their attacks aren't quite as effective. While I'm sure this might piss off a few rangers (and undoubtedly the people who swear by "throwing more RNG" at any given mob) I kind of think this is a good thing, considering how overpowerd a RNG or THF can be in ballista with a good stock of bloody/sleep bolts.

 

[Spriggan]

Cool thanks for shareing it
The new ranged attack system sounds pritty cool, and i would hardly call it a nerf Hopefuly this does'nt mean i gotta stand back to do more damage to a mob, coz i like using my daggers to gain TP. But for the Ut: Ichi change, now that spells trouble for me in a Nin tank party! I mean Nins (not all of them) have a hard enough time tanking as it is.... poor buggers

 

[Tyrath]

Soon, the distance of the monster from the player will determine the damage and accuracy of ranged attacks. This determination will vary from weapon to weapon, as will the ideal distance for maximum damage. In addition, the higher the monster's level is with regard to the player, the less damage will be dealt with a ranged attack. This system is similar to that of melee attacks, but the difference in damage will not be as great.

Damn, for a second I thought they were gonna nerf Rangers. Damn SE :roll: But...maybe if its more dmg from afar they will have to stand back and gain tp slower without there daggers? ahaha >.> Or they might just spam ranged...I dunno <.<

In the next update, the player's enmity will decrease when a shadow image created by Utsusemi is absorbed by an attack.

Umm, won't that make Nin tanking even harder? >.> Though it might help at lower lvl by removing hate from them to recast Ichi.

 

[Rorschach]

If they do this, and effectivly make NIN tanks a thing of the past, wont that mean that PLDs' be the only viable tank for us? Not that i have anything against PLDs, I love a good PLD over a nin tank, but we have very few PLD's on our server as it is so wont this make starting a party even harder?

Lets just hope that Nins dont loose too much hate from using Utsusemi.

 

[Mai Ikari]

Since everyone's gonna flip out over this, let's get some perspective...

Normal tank: Loses hate every hit due to, well, getting hit.

Ninja tank: Loses no hate every hit, takes no damage.

Now:

Normal tank: Same.

Ninja tank: Loses hate every hit, takes no damage, has harder time keeping hate.

Looks like they're balancing blinktanking at the higher levels in preparation for something... :San, perhaps?

 

[kodi]

Having just recently started playing PLD on the side, I gotta say this sounds pretty good to me. In my 32 levels of PLD so far, I have seen a lot of nin/war, war/nin combinations - all wanting to tank in parties. I ended up droping out of a few parties when everyone wanted the Ninja to tank. I mean if the PLD doesn't tank he can hardly be a DD instead.

 

[Tyrath]

Since everyone's gonna flip out over this, let's get some perspective...

Normal tank: Loses hate every hit due to, well, getting hit.

Ninja tank: Loses no hate every hit, takes no damage.

Now:

Normal tank: Same.

Ninja tank: Loses hate every hit, takes no damage, has harder time keeping hate.

Looks like they're balancing blinktanking at the higher levels in preparation for something... :San, perhaps?

Its not a balance because, well a normal tank(pld) would keep hate a lot better so losing some by getting hate doesn't affect them much. Now nins, usually cant keep hate as well as pld so losing hate is gonna hurt them. Not much of a balance to me >.>

 

[Dayner]

the return of war\mnk tanks maybe ?

 

[Killerclown]

http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=13668

 

[CmdrFly]

the return of war\mnk tanks maybe ?

I just creamed in my pants.

 

[metalryu]

the return of war\mnk tanks maybe ?

I just creamed in my pants.

... amazin....

 

[Sanjo Renomitsu]

Can someone say rng gimp? Score!... yessssss

 

[Eladamiri]

Soon, the distance of the monster from the player will determine the damage and accuracy of ranged attacks. This determination will vary from weapon to weapon, as will the ideal distance for maximum damage. In addition, the higher the monster's level is with regard to the player, the less damage will be dealt with a ranged attack. This system is similar to that of melee attacks, but the difference in damage will not be as great.

Damn, for a second I thought they were gonna nerf Rangers. Damn SE :roll: But...maybe if its more dmg from afar they will have to stand back and gain tp slower without there daggers? ahaha >.> Or they might just spam ranged...I dunno <.<

In the next update, the player's enmity will decrease when a shadow image created by Utsusemi is absorbed by an attack.

Umm, won't that make Nin tanking even harder? >.> Though it might help at lower lvl by removing hate from them to recast Ichi.

i hope they gimp dark knights

 

[Sanjo Renomitsu]

And of course it means rng have to stand back now to obtain optimal damage. What? S-E going to make standing up close max damage for a ranged attack? BS. What this means ladies and gentlemen, for just about every ranged attack will weaken by gaining and closing distance, since rng have to keep in that optimal range to do the damage they do now in any range. As for the higher level mob damage... eh, pretty pointless, except now they'll do a bit less damage against xp mobs now comparable to melee PC level VS Mob level.

Mmm, I can smell the ballista burning, hopefully it isn't like a -10 damage thing, would be nice to be able to flee up to a rng and have them more or less helpless because their damage output hit the gutter. Mmm... Would make them have to stand back now, and truly make them less of a "melee" since melee attack is close range combat anyways.

 

[Ecks]

i hope they gimp dark knights

Yeah, because we soooooo need to be gimped. :roll:

 

[takinori]

Ninja's will not be a thing of the past. Its just time for we ninja to pull out our Arhat gear. And we can wear Eris' Earrings.

 

[Peregrine]

Ranger may have to balance accuracy and damage, which is what meleers have been doing for years. Moving back may lower accuracy but improve damage or something. It may also force them to stay within AoE range, but that's something most rangers already do anyway. There are too many rangers on the server for SE to nerf them now. I do wonder what rangers will hit IT mobs for now though. It'll be interesting to see if it's a significant reduction.

As far as Nin goes, this won't be the end of ninja tanks. If they can't hold hate, I'll make them do it any day of the week. Also, if SE wanted nin tanks gone, they'd have gotten rid of them long ago. Ninjas are just plain better tanks than paladins in xp parties, and that certainly wasn't intended. Ninja might have needed a slight nerf like this. They were basically immune to losing hate via damage. It's nothing some enmity+swap-ins won't fix. I don't know of many nins who bother with equipment macros. Join the club, nins!

 

[Rappa]

I don't see what the fuss is about. It makes logical sense for rangers to be back away from the fights picking away mobs with their bows. Screw the "bonus" tp for meleeing, get back there and do what you're supposed to do. This game needed more balance between melee jobs and hopefully this will help out.

The Utsusemi thing kinda makes sense and if you think about it, jobs like thf and even rng will benefit from it. Now when you rangers are standing back plucking at the mobs, if you pull hate the mob will run over, eat a few shadows, and you'll lose enough hate for it to go back to the tank. It just means that ninja tanking isn't going to be a mindless routine of going back and forth between the U:Ni and U:Ichi macros like some people like to play it (note I said some ppl, not all ppl).

 

[Lecan]

http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=13668

I just wanted to note KC, that if you look in the thread you just linked, you'll see that I had posted this literally at the same time that he did. or rather I was posting it as he was, and by the time I had hit submit his was already up.

 

[Taurothar]

Any RNG who gets his/her panties in a twist about this update should do themselves a favor and quit that job now. I have had a long time knowledge of the Ranger class in DnD and other MMO's, and ours was the ONLY one who didn't have a penalty for fighting too close to a mob. It's logical that you can't fire a bow at a 3 foot range, and that a crossbow would be effective most under a certain distance. Medeival archers were always so far away from the fight even. This concept isn't making the game any worse, it's making it more realistic.

Speculations:
Bow will increase in damage and acc while at a larger range, and decrease if you get too close.
Gun will have low acc and damage at a distance, but higher both when closer.
XBow will be a medium, and have a broader range of effectiveness.

As for the utsusemi thing, NIN tanks have always had horrible hate-control abilities, and only the really good ones will remain, unless we see most pts having a NIN/WAR and a secondary tank. This part of the update is to account for non-tanks taking hits such as RNG/NIN, as said previously, making their hate drop faster so the tank can take back over. Ninjas are just gonna hafta find new ways of hate control, or more skilled BLM/RNG combos to make hate less of an issue. Perhaps this is a lead in to more +enmity gear, and/or a new ability for NIN.

IMHO
Everyone I'm seeing talk about this is thinking about NIN main only it seems, but think again that NIN is the most popular subjob for WAR THF RNG and the rare RDM who solos/ballistas. A lot of this update is SE trying to make it a better subjob for those classes and maybe for the future ones to be added. I think the new jobs will include a new tank and a new buff/debuff class at least. This will counter the complete imbalance in those departments, as there are almost 4 viable options for the other roles, and only 2 each of those. Sure WAR/NIN is a viable tank, before mid range and after 74, but theres a long span where they are best used for their damage output. I also think SE would like to see the return of WAR/MNKs that almost all melee start out as. Only time can tell how right/wrong I am with all of this, but as far as I can see, this is the only reasoning I can come up with, and sorry for the text wall.