Yoshindor said:
Empy this passions basterd can sit on it and rotate I have been on overr 100 Haku runs god knows how many hats came out of that. easily close to 800 hats.
I never once bitched or took this attitude of if I don't get anything I'm not helping.
People like him who bitch piss and whine and moan about everything, and want something for nothng and don't realize their place, are the reason why things are soo hard to get done, because no one will ever help lest you give them something.
Oh and yeah I still don't have an Ohat.
This is a logical fallacy. While it may be true, though I personally think you're a liar, that you did 800 hakutaku runs, that doesn't truly qualify you to criticize other people's interpretation of value of the reward itself. Nor does it qualify you to judge other people based on your experience alone. It would be like me saying, "I've volunteered to work for charity many times, how dare you work for money?!?! You fucking greedy asshole!"
Not to say the two are the same exactly, but this is an exact duplication of your logic with simply a different subject in its place. By you doing something kind it doesn't mean that others can't do the same thing for profit. All you really can say is, "Let me take Passions place, I'll do it and won't ask for a hat." If so, go ahead, and everyone will be happy, if not... well, what business do you have in the discussion really?
I've been reading this board for many months, over a year for sure and constantly I'm shocked to read from board members gross misconceptions of what it means to be a mage. I think I can speak with some authority, as I've leveled 2 mage jobs and 2 non-mage jobs, and played through many different phases and aspects of FF, from the early ages when mages and melees were thought of as relatively similar to when population differences and demands seemed to cause natural splinters in the way of thinking.
The first thing I'll say is that with gear, you as a melee can't look at a mage wanting melee gear as useless as you wanting mage gear.
90 Elemental Magic on your Dark Knight or 100, it doesn't particulary matter. As a damage source, you will always have your melee damage as the most efficient. A dark knight does not use nuking to solo(though they may use enfeebling magic for sleeping).
A mage on the other hand may find a lot of value to beefing up their melee capacity to be more independant. Independance is an important issue to someone who's only job leveled is a mage, as their solo capacity is limited, and their exp gear will actually hinder them. Look at errant for example, filled with -str/-vit/-agi/-dex.
Another misconception is that mages have it easier, so to speak.
In reality, in terms of need for strategy and attention, I'd rank mages towards the top ring, with perhaps Ninja requiring more relative skill in most cases. I am always shocked to hear someone say playing a mage job is "easy". There are obviously varying levels of skill among different players, but in truth some of the mage jobs have a lot of depth to their strategy. I would have assumed this obvious but some people are oblivious to reality around them.
I think I'll use this post to say my piece on this whole matter. Unfortunately, Optical Hats are a small part of a larger issue, which I'll attempt to address.
Optical Hats are perhaps for most the first end-game activity they take part in. So people's attitude's towards optical hats is usually a good base point to how they feel in general.
You can look at Optical Hats in 2 ways:
1. Melees obviously need it more(true), therefore melees should get it first.
2. Mages could find a lot of use out of it(true as well), why should the mage be treated worse?
The first thing I will say is, in an endgame shell, you will get your optical hat, be you a mage or a melee, you will get it.
In my humble opinion, people prefer not to give mages perks like optical hats in a normal run to force them into an endgame shell if they want it. Seemingly paranoid? Admittedly, but a conclusion based on lots of experience.
What people don't realize, is that for all the Rostrum Pumps, there are 10 different Optical Hats. And quite frankly, you are most likely not getting Rostrum Pumps outside of a shell.
And the reason why...?
In all honesty, most melee don't really cares about mages. They care that they come, they care that they participate, but they don't care that they get the things they want. Many melee look at mages like servants. Notice the strong attitudes of many melees on this post as to the rightful owner of the next optical hat.
Examine sky, mages are lumped into one abjuration class for all of us. For each job there is one acceptable piece of gear. Melees get Osode, Nepturnal, Hecatomb, most of them able to dip into multiple abjurations and at the same time getting the ex/rare that drops directly from the gods.
Where is the payoff? Sea? Land Gods?
No, the melees are by that point long gone with their sky gear, afterall they 'earned' it.
This is a generalization, it doesn't apply to all melees, but it applies to quite a few, and this attitude is all over this board. Notice a few posts back, the asshole melee talking about how the melee "deserves" the Optical Hat. It's no longer even an argument of needing it more, to them, simply being melee entitled them. Mages are entitled to what? A 10 pages flame for stepping out of line?
The problem with slipping in ideas with need being more important than greed is that you never promised to be around the handle the mage's lesser needs afterwards.
Need over Greed really is a great functional concept, but it's a guiding principle not a fucking rule! If you want to incorporate it, incorporate it, but don't use it as a crutch to guilt mages.
If you were to say, "We'll do this every Saturday. 6 hats, until all participating members have their hat." Then obviously, give the melees their hats first. However all you say is, "I'm a level 68 dragoon, I've never done this run once, and I'm entitled to the first hat. You're a mage, therefore, YOU DON'T NEED IT."
The problem is, the mages help different sets of melees over and over again, when do the melees come in to help the mages? This is a very substandard setup, because it incorporates priority without any eventual restitution.
Furthermore, the general attitude hurts more than even the poor situation. People should at least be apologetic, understanding and sensitive to the issue of mage priority. Instead people ask for help, when recieving a request by a mage, they respond with anger and inflammatory remarks. There is obviously a feeling of superiority by so many melees on this board over mages, and it's pretty stupid, because we're all just human beings playing a game. Not to take the admittedly low-brow insult but... honestly, if you get a thrill by feeling like you are somehow superior based on your job class you must have serious real life issues.
I admit to having in the past(and probably will in the future) boasting about the strength of the BLM job class, but in all honestly I talk about game balance and job strength not about feeling like I am better than anyone else as a player because of it. I'm merely trying to relay my experiences as that job fitting into different situations.
So as stated, in something like a LS situation, priority is fine(to a point), because you can expect as a mage in a LS to get your Optical Hat after the melees get theirs. But in a QCDN Event Schedule, quite frankly, to anyone who is going to say "Well this guy is a melee, that guy is a mage, let's prioritize them as such..."
Seriously... forget who needs the item. Think about one thing only, who do you need to actually beat the NM?
And quite honestly, Passions doesn't really need you. He could go organize a Hakutaku run without you, and they'd all be done 1 hat sooner and I doubt they'd miss your presence, as you said yourself, you are useless for this fight. Think about being grateful for the help you're recieving, try and help others as much as possible(regardless of how YOU percieve THEIR need) and try and make sure everyone is having fun. If people continue to treat mages badly, more and more will take a bitter cynical perspective and cooperation will go down as people are forced to look out only for themselves.
But I'm sure none of this really matters to you, as long as you get your hat first.
Firestreak.... out.
