POL News: All Worlds Maintenance

That you still send packets can't be used as a proof that its not a backbone problem. If you pull your internet cord out, you'd still send. As a matter of fact, you pretty much always send data. Your computer will still attempt to send data even if you don't have a network connection at all.

No, but its proved that SE recieves the data, because your character was indeed moved. I've d/ced from a modem getting unplugged. And even through i crossed most of the zone, i was back where i was when the modem shut off regardless of how far i moved.
 
The reason you can't decrypt corrupted stuff is essentially the same reason you can't unZIP a corrupt ZIP file. The decryption program does something like this:

"Ok let's see here, I'll unecrypt this chunk and I'm expecting this result."
"Great that worked, next chunk."
"Worked again, next"
"Wait a minute, the next chunk was supposed to be encrypted text aabbcc but it's xxxxxx instead!"
"Ok, I gotta stop. Someone has either tampered with the file, or it has become corrupted. Either way I can't make sense of this and can't assure you that the end result is going to be correct."
Program exits and spits out error, decryption failed.

Bytes got messed up and there are mechinisms built in to detect that and exit the program or discard the packet because the integrity of the data has been comprimised, by accident or on purpose. The only way to set it right is to find out exactly which bits have been flipped and put them back as they should be, something that's pretty much impossible (break out the backup tapes, we need a restore!), or to retransmit.


Think of it like this, your FFXI data is sweet sweet honey. You want to mail some honey to your honey but you don't want those Post Office Bears to get your honey while it's in transit. So what do you do? Put it in a unbreakable jar with a lock, protect it, shield it, hide it. Our situation is the same but the jar is encryption, not a glass jug. We are putting our FFXI data (honey) into it's locked jar (encryption) and shooting it over the network to the client. This is all done on SE's end, before the packet even touches a network.

So our FFXI honey jar shoots out over the network and hits a router, ahhh the Bear got the honey! But our bear is a good one and does the right thing and sends the honey on its way without tampering with it. He doesn't care what's in the jar, he just wants to get home and and rest his feet so he pushes it to it's next destination without and second thought.

Now what if he was an insane bear (bad router) and decided he wanted whatever the hell is in that jar? He would realize he doesn't know how to open the lock and he can't break the jar. The routers along the way don't know how to speak the FFXI-specific encryption protocol and like the bear they can't mess with or even view the contents of the encrypted packet. The Post Office Bears (routers) don't have the smarts to break into the jar/packet, and don't even try so we can rule this one out. Routers cannot decrypt packets.

The next hop is another insane bear but this one isn't greedy, he's clumsy. He drops packages and they break (he corrupts packets). He drops the honey jar and it gets a few scratches. When the jar arrives at its destination the person sees the scratches and realizes something is up. In the real world they would probably call the person who sent it and there would be no problem and honey for all. But in the computer world it's "Woah, something is wrong here." and they honey is thrown away.

But!

Our Post Office Bear seems to only be breaking the FFXI stuff. How could this bear (router) only break FFXI related stuff but seemingly breaks nothing else? That doesn't make sense to me, he's clumsy but only clumsy with FFXI stuff? Why hasn't he dropped any other jars? I think him only breaking FFXI honey jars is a longshot. If he's clumsy (broke router) then odds are he's going to also drop other things. And if this bear is a big important bear that all mail passes through (backbone router) then someone is SURE to notice.

In our situation either the honey is rancid (SE is creating bad honey!) or there is a clumsy bear along the way who keeps dropping the jars (packets that corrupt on their way to the client) but only the FFXI honey jars and nothing else!


What I gather is this: You decrypted the packet, which means the actual packet was ok or else you wouldn't be able to decrypt it in the first place. Inside you found the FFXI data and a checksum, and the checksum was incorrect.

The ONLY person that could have created that checksum and data is SE. The routers along the way never open or look at the data in a packet, the only look at the TCP/IP headers to see where to send the packet to next. Routers spitting out and corrupting packets in the real world is fairly rare, there are multiple mechinisms within TCP/IP, the router itself and FFXI itself that watch for problems. They're not looking for honey, they just want to move it along and get on to the next packet.

In short: If a router was corrupting the packets you wouldn't be able to decrypt them. But because you can we know the packets themselves are fine but the data (honey) is what's bad, and ONLY SE can make that honey.
 
And thanks a ton for letting us know Artum.

If you understand my crazy anology and it is indeed what's happening I would seriously consider reporting it to SE, anonymously if necessary.
 
This might be way off the topic but have you seen a router that got a cut (not unplug) network cable on it? like in a disaster situation such as 911.

It's funny to see the router still thinks there sockets established on that interface and continues to route messages through there and retries for the TCP packets lol

as if the cable is still there lol

Nope! That's weird though, I would assume they monitored physical link connectivity through some type of electricity so cutting the wire would break it but I guess not.

Did you have to sweep up all the data that fell out when it broke?
 
This got posted in another new thread, but it's the answer to a lot of our questions. Anyone following this thread might want to follow the link and read it.

http://www.qcdn.org/ffxi/showthread.php?t=42487

They said the same thing we've been saying, only shorter.

ICR Terrence J.: The problem isn't anything you can solve your self. The problem lies with the provider your ISP goes through.
ICR Terrence J.: It's not your ISP's problem. The problem lies with the people they go through. They told you it isn't their problem because it isn't. Their networks are working fine.
Lindsay **: *bangs head on desk* who can I call to get some kinda help then? Who do I tell that something is wrong?
ICR Terrence J.: Us. As a consumer, you have no access to the company that is having problem. As an Information Center tech, I have no access to them. This is all something that needs to be handle by the people above us.

see? saying the very same thing we've been saying for god knows how many pages.
 
That latest update did nothing, I still have R0 problems and trapped character, I got a response from a GM last night saying they couldnt move me from a stuck area either. Bull, throw me into Jeuno jail then and grant me a general pardon for the inconvience, I know GM's can move people there mighty fast if need be.
 
They said the same thing we've been saying, only shorter.



see? saying the very same thing we've been saying for god knows how many pages.

Not quite. You've been doing your damnest to absolve SE from being responsible and putting it on everyone to call their isp. That clearly states that not only can our respective isp's not do anything about it, and furthermore says the solution does in fact need to come from SE handling it. The techies don't appear to be able to handle it, but saying it needs to be handled from above them is a pretty clear indication a resolution has to be initiated from SE. Also, very contrary to what you've been telling everyone, there isn't anything at all we can do to fix it this side. Hardly "the very same thing" you've been saying for pages and pages. In fact, it's pretty much the opposite on just about every level.
 
No, it isn't at all, though your response is the most pretentious, self-important statement ever. I didn't say they'd get fixed in a day. I don't care how long it takes them to fix it, I care that it gets fixed. What I have a problem with is SE saying "Sorry, not our problem," and not giving us any real indication that this is being looked into seriously or any relative timetable for a solution. Them telling is to try to log in again later isn't a strong indication that they are working hard on fixing it.

careful zyn, not to point fingers, but your post is getting a touch pretensious too. It may very well be absolutely no fault of SE's. I do believe we agree however, that even so, SE has not handled the situation properly.
 
careful zyn, not to point fingers, but your post is getting a touch pretensious too. It may very well be absolutely no fault of SE's. I do believe we agree however, that even so, SE has not handled the situation properly.

I'm sorry, where is there pretension in anything I said there? I never once said it was SE's fault. Not once. I said it was SE's responsibility to see that it gets fixed asap. I haven't been the one trying to wow everyone with technical prowess here. The response you quoted, if you read it, was in reference to Artem's decision to call what I said the most retarded thing he'd ever heard simply because he didn't agree with me. Maybe your definition of pretentious is different, but I fail to see where you see that in anything I've said.

All I've been saying from the beginning is that SE is responsible - Not to blame for w/e is wrong, as we don't know what's wrong any more than they do apparently, but responsible for fixing it.
 
careful zyn, not to point fingers, but your post is getting a touch pretensious too. It may very well be absolutely no fault of SE's. I do believe we agree however, that even so, SE has not handled the situation properly.


I don't understand how SE has handled the situation properly. They had someone capable of making announcements working over the weekend, because we have had a few announcements listing the issues since the update.

One problem however, which is the most critical and most common problem that players are experiencing server wide, is the connectivity issue. This was confirmed by an SE technial support rep to be a problem that is the result of their 3rd party server, failing. He said that they were working on getting this resolved, but as you can see no one has bothered to post this anywhere on the official POL site, nor have the given players this information "officially".

So no, in my eyes SE hasn't handled the problem. If they had handled it, they would of had details about this connectivity problem players are experiencing mentioned on their site, they would of had an in-game notice and they would be assuring players that they are working on having this resolved. Instead, we had a message regarding another type of similar connectivity problem which they have claimed to be "no fault of their own".

Also, as with any company, a GOOD company will at least offer and try to help you with some troubleshooting instead of telling you "its not our problem, so we can't help".
 
One problem however, which is the most critical and most common problem that players are experiencing server wide, is the connectivity issue. This was confirmed by an SE technial support rep to be a problem that is the result of their 3rd party server, failing. He said that they were working on getting this resolved, but as you can see no one has bothered to post this anywhere on the official POL site, nor have the given players this information "officially".

Third Party means it actually isn't thiers. You do not connect directly to their servers from your home PC, as illustrated earlier. You get routed through the fastest path. They do not have control over whoever owns the server(s) that are causing problems, nor any authority to tell them to fix it.
 
I don't understand how SE has handled the situation properly. They had someone capable of making announcements working over the weekend, because we have had a few announcements listing the issues since the update.
lol read what I wrote again. read all my posts in this thread. I've said they handled it wrong all the way through lol
 
So what would you call your theory? speculation or fact?

All you base your theory on is that it happened to happen together with an update, and thus it have to be SE.

I stated that it was speculation, no one here knows what the real cause is. I simply said what is more likely? SE could completely be an innocent bystander in the matter, but the fact that this problem popped up directly after the update makes it look like a little more than mere coincidence. I'll admit it could just be a freak coincedence but that's not usually the case in life.
 
lol read what I wrote again. read all my posts in this thread. I've said they handled it wrong all the way through lol


My apologies, I misread what you posted.

And I understand that "3rd Party" means that it isn't SE, however the way that I was made to understand, is that SE designed it so that we would have to go through this "3rd party" in order to play the game, so they have the ability to get in touch with whom ever that is to have them resolve their problems.
 
Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\decidence>tracert www.playonline.com

Tracing route to www.playonline.com [43.253.220.30]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 13 ms 14 ms 17 ms dIPMASKED.bchsia.telus.net [IPMASKED]
3 17 ms 18 ms 12 ms NWMRBC01DR02.bb.telus.com [IPMASKED]
4 16 ms 12 ms 12 ms vancbc01gr01.bb.telus.com [IPMASKED]
5 38 ms 37 ms 37 ms IPMASKED
6 37 ms 37 ms 38 ms IIJ.plalca01gr00.bb.telus.com [IPMASKED]
7 39 ms 37 ms 44 ms plt001bb01.IIJ.net [216.98.96.229]
8 136 ms 136 ms 138 ms tky001bb01.IIJ.net [216.98.96.194]
9 135 ms 136 ms 138 ms tky001ipgw11.IIJ.Net [210.130.143.250]
10 138 ms 135 ms 139 ms tky007gate00a.IIJ.Net [58.138.100.250]
11 140 ms 140 ms 140 ms 43.253.1.1
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 144 ms 145 ms 144 ms host220-30.accelia.net [43.253.220.30]

Trace complete.



SE's Fault
 
And here's a second trace, this time no problem at SE's end. Notice how the IP Im tracing has changed though.

Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\decidence>tracert www.playonline.com

Tracing route to www.playonline.com [43.253.131.24]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 20 ms 98 ms 31 ms dIPMASKED.bchsia.telus.net [IPMASKED]
3 18 ms 12 ms 11 ms NWMRBC01DR02.bb.telus.com [IPMASKED]
4 18 ms 18 ms 12 ms vancbc01gr01.bb.telus.com [IPMASKED]
5 39 ms 38 ms 43 ms IPMASKED
6 38 ms 43 ms 43 ms IIJ.plalca01gr00.bb.telus.com [IPMASKED]
7 43 ms 40 ms 42 ms plt001bb01.IIJ.net [216.98.96.229]
8 134 ms 138 ms 138 ms tky001bb01.IIJ.net [216.98.96.194]
9 137 ms 142 ms 144 ms tky001ipgw10.IIJ.Net [210.130.143.242]
10 143 ms 143 ms 138 ms tky007gate00a.IIJ.Net [58.138.100.242]
11 135 ms 139 ms 134 ms 43.253.1.1
12 140 ms 140 ms 137 ms host131-24.accelia.net [43.253.131.24]

Trace complete.
 
Timeout doesn't necessarily indicate a whole lot though. Could mean the appliance in question simply has ICMP disabled. It can still pass ICMP requests through it, but it won't directly reply to it.
 
There's also the (huge) possibility that PlayOnline's website is on a completely different network from the game servers.
 
Ah well my character is free from promy-Mea now and the zones seem to so far not affect me anymore, so maybe the prob got quitely resolved. :)
 
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