PS3 price cut coming.

[Taurothar]

You left out cell processor and blu-ray.

Gimmick has a negative connotation to it, most often with this definition:

to equip or embellish with unnecessary features, esp. in order to increase salability, acceptance, etc.

Feature is a far better word for what you're intending. Gimmick is associated with almost worthless features that are only added to say that you have them.

Yes, but the Cell Processor is essential to the power of the system based on the design specs intended. Blu-Ray is essential to the size of the games and the graphics intended on putting out, in order to extend the life of the system. Rumble is an unnecessary feature, thus a gimmick. The Wii-mote is debatable because it is a design choice, but often isn't essential to gameplay.

The Wii-mote is only essential to a portion of the games out for the system. As for me only playing 6 games, I don't own a Wii personally so my experience is limited to what I play over friend's houses. I have played more than 6 though, but most I don't bother remembering or commenting on. Rayman was terrible, Warioware was literally the same thing over and over, multiplats that I've played are mostly bad tacked on controls though Godfather's choking was hilariously fun. I know DBZ Budokai Tenkaichi 2 was much better on the classic controller for me, which told me it was more fun on the ps2 since the controller was more comfortable.

For those who think that the Wii isn't graphically capable, it has a better graphics engine than the gamecube, which was better than the ps2, and includes full size disks so they're not limited like the 'cube was. Play RE4 and tell me that they can't make a quality graphics game, and that was a game that was made several years ago and ported over, just think if they developed it entirely for the Wii. I just think developers are going for cheap/simple games to profit the most off the least work, and since you're not expecting ps3 graphics, they can get away with it.

Wii will always be in the lead, but sadly it is likely the final Nintendo console. They put out an amazing system, with universal appeal and that's what counts. That isn't in question, but whether ps3 can catch and overtake 360 is. I believe it can, and it will. I think that the next 6 months will have a monumental effect on PS3 sales figures. Price drop, hardware cost drop (blu-ray is slowly getting cheaper and they're dropping the ps2 chip from the design so that it will pure emulation like foreign models), titles being released, more Six-Axis gameplay games, re-introduction of rumble (though I don't see the big deal), free online, and last but not least the Feb '09 swap to 16:9 format of TVs. That last bit is because more and more people will be buying HDTVs because of the coming change, since they're dropping in price. PS3 not only allows for gaming but also has a *shocker* blu-ray player that *also* upscales ps1/ps2/dvd movies all to 1080p. That's enough of a reason for me to have it. The dvds I have can be properly upscaled, along with the new blu-rays I'll eventually get.

As for Sony haters, I've always been a Sony lover (not fanboy, I do point out their faults when they have them). I wasn't surprised at all by the price tag of the PS3 when it was released. Everything Sony makes in my experience is highly reliable and usually of the best quality you can buy. The old Sony walkman? I still have a working one from the early 90's. Same with my original CD player, which would play heavily scratched cds with little if any skipping. They make all the parts of their TVs in house, so they don't chance parts not made by them. Sure you can expect to pay the premium of getting the best but that's what they offer. The only thing in their electronics lineup that I haven't ever suggested is their PC line, and that's because there's always better out there in that department, which is openly said by Sony who has stopped really pushing the VAIO line, and just makes them as long as they sell. They have recently been trying to bring their name back to the top, so much so that their TVs have technology in them that other companies can't even figure out. The PS3's success is a huge gamble for them, and if it doesn't pay out I'm sure they'd rather pull out of the race and just go the way of Sega post-dreamcast than push their name further through the dirt than it has been in the past while.

 

[Bajaratt]

Actually, aside from their TV's, Sony brand is rather poor in terms of quality when it comes to any home audio/video stuff. They have better name recognition with average people than they really have quality. They see Sony, think it's automatically the best when in it usually isn't. The best thing they make aside from TV's is DVD players, and they're still only about the middle of the pack there. Their TV's are also just DLP technology(not really a big mystery to other companies), they weren't the first to make it; nor are they the only ones making it. Their TV's are quality though.

I don't see how the Wii could possibly be Nintendo's final console, or what your reasoning is behind that. They're making a profit off every Wii sold and it's selling like crack-filled hot cakes, why would they decide "well our last console was an astounding success, let's just stop here." It's infinitely more likely that in five or so years, Nintendo will release the Wii2, with PS3-quality graphics/power and an even better wiimote, all for less than the PS3 is now. Then, all the people who think graphics is the greatest thing in gaming will likely get it and love the system.

I was right though, you hate party-style games, which has always been a large focus of Nintendo, so naturally you'd not like those games. It's like elemmire not liking any non-rpg game, it's a personal bias that overwrites any merit the game actually has and really should be left out.

 

[Antor]

It's infinitely more likely that in five or so years, Nintendo will release the Wii2, with PS3-quality graphics/power and an even better wiimote, all for less than the PS3 is now. Then, all the people who think graphics is the greatest thing in gaming will likely get it and love the system.

If their handheld division and their recent success with making money off of simplistic devices are any sort of indication to Nintendo's future this is extremely unlikely. That and people don't just like the 360/PS3 simply for its graphics; better technology allows for the potential for more complex games, something that the hardcore gaming crowd actually cares about, which sadly is something the Wii simply cannot do.

 

[Skaw]

Better technology and more complex? Like the same dual analog set up thats been used for 10 years?

Really, a new staple user interface device has been desperately needed for a while now. Wiimote isn't quite it, but it's a step in the right direction. Ofcourse, any direction is the right direction as long as it's going away from the tired Dual Analog.

 

[Taurothar]

Better technology and more complex? Like the same dual analog set up thats been used for 10 years?

Really, a new staple user interface device has been desperately needed for a while now. Wiimote isn't quite it, but it's a step in the right direction. Ofcourse, any direction is the right direction as long as it's going away from the tired Dual Analog.

Six-Axis enhanced the controller beyond just the dual analogs, but it has yet to see the full extent of its use. Motostorm gave us a hint of what will be done with it, but I think once developers get used to programming for it, it will become a really great way of playing and controlling games. Microshaft is the only one that didn't add anything with their controllers that wasn't already in last gen. Not to mention I find the PS1/2/3 controller to be the most comfortable controller so far, the Wii's nunchuck is a close second but the Wii-mote itself is too linear and my hand tends to cramp after long use of it.

I believe that Nintendo actually said something alluding to the fact that this is their last console, and they would likely restrict their future in hardware to handhelds, mostly due to the extreme popularity of handheld market in Japan. I could swear that it was said during E3 of last year, but I don't remember really.

As for me not liking party games, it's simply not true. I fully enjoy Mario Kart, and Super Smash Brothers, which to me are party games because in order to be fun for me, they need to be played against real opponents and not AI. Mario Party 8 has some interesting mini games that were a lot of fun, but they are overall really short and take up less than half the time playing the game due to the annoying board game premise. To me, any game that requires more than two players to be at the maximum fun, isn't going to see day to day use from me. I don't always have an extra couple friends over to fill in for P3 and P4 (my roommate and myself being P1 and P2). Which puts the Wii in a party or bust position for half their library for me.

The Wii games themselves don't solely consist of party games in my eyes. Racing games: Excite Truck was mediocre motion controls compared to even the six-axis mode of Motostorm, perhaps if I had used the steering wheel controller add on, I would be saying different. But I'll stop attacking Wii games.

 

[Skaw]

Six-Axis enhanced the controller beyond just the dual analogs, but it has yet to see the full extent of its use.

The actual design itself needs to be ditched in favor of a newer, more accessible one. Yeah, you can add more bells and whistles to it. But how much farther can it be taken beyond this point? Without throwing on more L and R buttons to the back of the device, that is. Stacking additions on to the basic controller isn't helpful, when the basic controller layout is the problem. Anything else piled up on it is just going to make it difficult to handle, and very awkward to play games with.

It was great in its time, but its time is at an end.

 

[Taurothar]

The actual design itself needs to be ditched in favor of a newer, more accessible one. Yeah, you can add more bells and whistles to it. But how much farther can it be taken beyond this point? Without throwing on more L and R buttons to the back of the device, that is. Stacking additions on to the basic controller isn't helpful, when the basic controller layout is the problem. Anything else piled up on it is just going to make it difficult to handle, and very awkward to play games with.

It was great in its time, but its time is at an end.

And I agree that it can't go forward much if any. My thought is that it is perfectly fine the way it is for this generation of games. I can't think of a new design that would be more comfortable to me, that boomerang was terrible and I'm glad they pulled that idea. What do you mean to make it more accessible? Do you want the buttons moved? I think they're fine where they are, in fact more so than the Wiimote when games require me to use 1 and 2, that's an awkward press when pointing the thing at the screen. I don't see a need for more buttons, as we're running out of fingers to use as it is. The 360 controller is more awkward than anything for me, though it did improve from the xbox. The size and placement of buttons is just uncomfortable for my hands due to the relative size.

 

[Skaw]

More accessible as in avoid having "HOLD R1 WHILE CLICKING R3 AND PRESSING A TO JUMP" that'll eventually come to the current design.

 

[Taurothar]

More accessible as in avoid having "HOLD R1 WHILE CLICKING R3 AND PRESSING A TO JUMP" that'll eventually come to the current design.

That's just negative thinking. I don't see any evidence of bad use of a controller like that unless it's the developer's problem. The controller itself is properly shaped (though some alterations could work out) and the buttons are in the proper places. I don't really like the R3/L3 buttons, but they're not that unusual to use.

If you need more controls than there are buttons, your game is overcomplicated for the system you're designing for and should reconsider the PC option, since there are more options. The other option is to simplify the games' controls schemes and that's more likely. Poor controls lead to failed games 9/10 times, so developers have no reason to use your outlandish example.

 

[Firestreak]

I haven't been home for a day, so let me just say LoL at Bajaratt saying that an upscaled DVD is almost as good as a bluray.

No wonder you don't care about graphics, you're fucking blind anyway.

And if graphics don't matter, and PS3 and 360 are only superior to their last generations based on graphics, then there's no reason for them to exist.

Fortunately, this isn't true and Baja is a dumbass. Hell off the top of my head try and imagine a hedgehog grenade on the Wii. It couldn't be done, and on the PS3 you can have 50 going off at once without the frame rate even dropping.

 

[Tagrineth]

I believe that Nintendo actually said something alluding to the fact that this is their last console

They've said absolutely nothing of the sort, whatsoever.

 

[Antor]

I remember hearing something along the lines of them focusing more on their handhelds than consoles, which would be an allusion to them eventually dropping consoles at a later date, but it's a rumor at best. It's more than likely incredibly inaccurate as well.

 

[Taurothar]

I remember hearing something along the lines of them focusing more on their handhelds than consoles, which would be an allusion to them eventually dropping consoles at a later date, but it's a rumor at best. It's more than likely incredibly inaccurate as well.

Well they didn't count on the success of the Wii when the hinting was made, so who knows.

 

[Elemmire]

well if they were thinking sales would be like the gamecube and such then maybe.. but who knows.

 

[Bajaratt]

I haven't been home for a day, so let me just say LoL at Bajaratt saying that an upscaled DVD is almost as good as a bluray.

No wonder you don't care about graphics, you're fucking blind anyway.

And if graphics don't matter, and PS3 and 360 are only superior to their last generations based on graphics, then there's no reason for them to exist.

Fortunately, this isn't true and Baja is a dumbass. Hell off the top of my head try and imagine a hedgehog grenade on the Wii. It couldn't be done, and on the PS3 you can have 50 going off at once without the frame rate even dropping.

Strid's right, you do just make shit up so you can try to sound intelligent when you reply. I never said it was almost as good as a blu-ray or an HD-DVD; only that blu-ray isn't $400 better. After seeing upscaling DVD's and blu-ray's; blu-ray is obviously better(like I already said), but the difference isn't big enough to spend 5 times more on just the player.

And how does a hedgehog grenade change the gameplay? You're going to die or get hurt if you're within a certain difference, same as the grenade physics they've been using for 15 years. Yeah, it calculates the physics of each piece of shrapnel, but it doesn't change anything. It's cool they can do that but if it's not actually changing how you play, then not being able to do a hedgehog grenade isn't a big deal.

 

[Bajaratt]

That's just negative thinking. I don't see any evidence of bad use of a controller like that unless it's the developer's problem. The controller itself is properly shaped (though some alterations could work out) and the buttons are in the proper places. I don't really like the R3/L3 buttons, but they're not that unusual to use.

If you need more controls than there are buttons, your game is overcomplicated for the system you're designing for and should reconsider the PC option, since there are more options. The other option is to simplify the games' controls schemes and that's more likely. Poor controls lead to failed games 9/10 times, so developers have no reason to use your outlandish example.

One thing I really love about the Wiimote+nunchuk setup is that I'm no longer forced to hold my hands close together if I don't want to. I'd love to have some more freedom of where/how I'd have to hold my hands for a normal controller, even without all of the motion sensing stuff.

 

[Firestreak]

I could spend 1/5 of the money on any blu-ray player on a upscaling DVD player and get a 1080p picture. Sure it wouldn't be quite the same quality, but blu-ray wouldn't be $400+ better.

This is you implying it's nearly the same quality.

As far as the hedgehog, as far as if it actually changes gameplay. We have just established that while I've made judgements after actually playing Wii, you're just full of shit.

Thanks for playing though.

As far as Twilight Princess is concerned. I haven't played the fucking thing in like half a year. I don't remember it at the same level as you do because quite frankly I've moved on from Wii to bigger and better things.

I swear to god, people like you who are probably over 20 and still playing pokemon... kinda sad.

 

[Bajaratt]

This is you implying it's nearly the same quality.

No, that's me saying it's a step up, it's not quite as good as blu-ray, but it's definitely a lot better than standard definition.

As far as the hedgehog, as far as if it actually changes gameplay. We have just established that while I've made judgements after actually playing Wii, you're just full of shit.

Thanks for playing though.

Yeah, because I've never played Resistance. Oh wait:

I was playing resistance the other day...

Seriously, what does a hedgehog grenade really add? It functions just like any other grenade in any other FPS, so aside from bragging rights that you can do that kind of thing, what are you really getting?

Resistance is a fun game, no one ever said otherwise; but there's really nothing special about it aside from being one of the few good PS3 games out there right now.

As far as Twilight Princess is concerned. I haven't played the fucking thing in like half a year. I don't remember it at the same level as you do because quite frankly I've moved on from Wii to bigger and better things.

I swear to god, people like you who are probably over 20 and still playing pokemon... kinda sad.

No kidding you moved on, being the only person to get stumped in the tutorial is a good reason to just give up and stop playing.

 

[Firestreak]

Let's be specific here.

"Sure it wouldn't be quite the same quality, but blu-ray wouldn't be $400+ better"

"Sure it wouldn't be quite the same quality"

"wouldn't be quite the same quality"

"quite the same quality"

This is a loaded phrase you're making here. You're implying that it's not the same quality, but it's only not "quite" the same quality, meaning that it's near the same quality. You do grasp the English language right? When you send out implications such as "an unscaled DVD is better but only by some small amount" in an undermining phrase of the blu-ray superiority, I'm going to pick up on it.

As for the Zelda tutorial, yada yada. It was shit and I'm sure there were plenty of people who got stuck. Millions of people bought the game, I'm sure thousands would have gotten stuck even if it wasn't a shitty design. Difference here is I got stuck and upon reading how to do it got angry because the puzzle was fucking random and stupid. I've put up with a lot of dumb video game puzzles and rarely did it piss me off.

 

[Bajaratt]

I'm surprised your jaw hasn't fallen off given how hard you're sucking on sony. Now I can't even say something's not as good as blu-ray without you taking it as a personal insult. Shit, I even agree that blu-ray is better(never even said otherwise) and you've still got a bug up your ass that I dared compare anything to it.

For those with learning disabilities(read: firestreak, although I'm not sure he can read at this point), blu-ray is better than upscaling. The difference between blu-ray and upscaling isn't worth 5x the price though. That's my opinion, but then, I don't jack off to having the highest graphical output possible.

Here's a crappy graph for those who can't read:

Blu-Ray ($500)
-
Upscaling ($100)
-
-
-
Standard Def DVD player ($30)