..rdm/smn.. Pros/Cons.. plz post..

Nibble

Nibble

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im kinda lvling my rdm right now and ive been going as rdm/smn.. but i see ppl saying that its not as useful as rdm/blm or rdm/whm.. i just want to know the pros and cons of this choice..

the only ones i can really think of are..

Pros: more mp, eventually get smn mp regen, eventually get evatar AoE spells like AoE haste and Blink and stoneskin and crap.. um.. yea..

Cons: dont deal as much elemental dmg as /blm (is there that big of a difference?), dont get curaga or other whm spells like poisona and such (this is kinda a big one but for how much more MP /smn will get at higher levels, shouldnt the added MP make up for it?)..

anyhow let me know..

~nib

p.s. ..must.. have.. rdm.. af.. pants..!! lol..
 
Try this thread. What works for whms also applies pretty well to rdms (except rdm have the option of subbing whm). Smn sub pre autofresh (eg: pre 50) is a waste. Whm and blm sub will outperform it in every with just a little less mp. You don't use smn sub for avatar abilties inside exp parties, they are not mp efficient.
 
Subbing SMN, the only useful BP you'll get is Aerial Armour. Hastega and Earthen Ward are too high level. Pluse, without our enormous MP pool, I doubt you could justify the MP cost of them anyway (they cost a bit :P).

With Refresh and Convert I doubt you will have MP issues bad enough to warrant the +1 MP per tick from auto-refresh.

BLM gives you Conserve MP, ESCAPE (chainspell escape is the ultimate dungeon party life-saver), Drain, Aspir, Warp and the BLM elemental debuffs.

WHM gives you status cures, and AoE healing/buffing spells.

BLM seems to be the best choice, but WHM is nice to have levelled for the times when you have to do more healing than usual.
 
After about 65 subbing WHM really starts to outshine BLM. The number of nasty single target and especially AoE status effects really makes essential that more than just the WHM can handle status cures...

KRT in particular it helps to have three people on status cures...
 
Since the other already said what you benefit from different subs.. one thing I would like to add is..

It all depends on the camp and mobs the PT going to fight, and mages should always have a suitable sub ready for change if needed.

For smn sub, yes you can take it with you if the PT already got the -na spells or escape it needs, it all depends on what the PT setup is.
Rdm is a flexible job IMO ^.^. Just see what the Pt needs then take your role~

You just cannot ONLY have smn lvled for your sub if you are rdm. (/sigh I really met 2 60ish lv rdms that told me they only have smn lvled for sub..)
So there is never a "best" sub for rdm, if you sub the right job for the pt to go smoothly then you do the right job.
 
Blowy said:
After about 65 subbing WHM really starts to outshine BLM. The number of nasty single target and especially AoE status effects really makes essential that more than just the WHM can handle status cures...

KRT in particular it helps to have three people on status cures...
Click to expand...
this is true unless you have a static that lacks a blm and you do have a whm main healer. I often wish I could help the whm with -na and erase, however, my xp party has /nin for the most part (and lacks a blm like I mentioned already) so I'd much rather be able to help with MBs and have elemental debuffs to help melees out.

Anyway, point being, its good to have /whm and /blm sub jobs available depending on what situation you intend to play your character in.
 
As said, and simply put, /smn is virtually useless since you get Convert (which, if stuff is done right, you can technically have unlimited MP)

Bloodpact-wise, only good things you'll get is Aerial Armor, Shining Ruby and Rolling Thunder, all of which have small uses but nothing good enough to really point out beyond that.

WHM is good for Curaga, -na spells, and MND-based enfeebs, BLM is good for -ga nukes, escape and warp, as well as Magic Attack Bonus and Conserve MP. I personally see RDM/BLM as the best, mainly because most parties I see have a WHM or SMN/WHM or BLM/WHM in them as is.
 
While having another mage to help kill off AoE status effects can be beneficial, I still have to say that BLM sub for RDM is still overall stronger. Having done a few parties doing both recently, the conserve MP trait, not to mention Aspir on appropriate mobs allowing you to perform other duties more efficiently is more valuable that being able to fully recover a part twice as fast (which, btw, there is NOTHING wrong with a BLM tossing one maybe two -na spells). If worse comes to worse, RDM who should be available to back-up heal in any situation, can cover one-two cures while the WHM gets the PT back up. Only one status effect comes to mind where /WHM comes in handy for a RDM, and that's an AoE Petrify (Float Eyes type mobs love to do Lv5 Petrify to instantly petrify anone with a lv in a multiple of 5). But until you hit levels where fighting them won't get the PT killed you'll have more overall benefits from /BLM
 
Simply put, /WHM has its situational usefulness and /BLM has its situational usefulness and you're best off having both levelled. There is no commonplace exp situation where you won't be perfectly fine with one or the other of those (depending mostly on what you're fighting and what other jobs/subs are in the party).

/SMN and (much though I *still* think it subs horribly) /BRD again have situational usefulness but they're MUCH more specific situations. And generally in any situation that would even allow you to benefit *at all* from one of those ... the benefit is fairly minimal at best and you should think long and hard about passing up all the varying utilities of the more common /WHM and /BLM subs.

/DRK is not useful for exp, nor is /NIN, but they both have their uses for other things. RDM/DRK is quite helpful for certain HNMs (for Stun and for Chainspell Stun), including Dynamis Lord in Dynamis-Xarcabard. RDM/NIN is, of course, amazing for soloing, but an exp party ain't soloing and you won't be getting much if any use of the things that come in handy when soloing. To a lesser extent, RDM/WAR also has its uses when soloing. RDM/RNG can use Sidewinder if you skillup your archery. But none of these are remotely useful for exp.

Level WHM sub to exp with. Level BLM sub to exp with. If you want to, level other subs as well, but do not level the other subs to *avoid* levelling the more general-purpose subs. They are second priority, not first. Whatever subs you have levelled, note them in your search comment, on the off chance your party leader has some reason to *want* you to use a sub other than WHM or BLM.
 
deathsvengeance said:
this is true unless you have a static that lacks a blm and you do have a whm main healer. I often wish I could help the whm with -na and erase, however, my xp party has /nin for the most part (and lacks a blm like I mentioned already) so I'd much rather be able to help with MBs and have elemental debuffs to help melees out.

Anyway, point being, its good to have /whm and /blm sub jobs available depending on what situation you intend to play your character in.
Click to expand...

Actually, subbing WHM Over BLM has no negative effect on Nuking/Magic Bursting. You have the same nukes, and the Same Magic Attack Bonuses either way. You do miss out on the elemental debuffs though, but they're pretty unreliable as a RDM and you'd still want at least four of the RDM enfeebles on before you worried about the elemental ones...
 
I dont see MP being a problem for RDM really. I am lvl 50 atm and have about +120 MP from gear and if I use rolenberry pie thats another +50 MP. Total brings me to about 550 with BLM sub. This MP can last me through several fights(situation based, sometimes its 3 fights sometimes its 20) where I main heal(theres usually a BRD or BLM and a PLD tank), debuff, buff, and MB(if I am not too busy). This is only possible because of convert though. This being said I dont see how /SMN can help much at all considering I dont exactly have MP problems without it. Afterall if I sub BLM and can do this then subbing WHM I could do it too.

Basically my point is /SMN isnt that usful and you really shouldent try it. Like others said the avys wouldent be much use anyway.
 
/blm against crabs

/whm against anything with aoe TP moves or status effects

/drk for chain stun against gods/HNM

/nin when you want to solo an EM for half an hour

/smn... ummmm, for blinkga against gods or HNM I suppose is possible, whm use it in tank parties, rdm in tank party can do the same.
 
..

well i appreciate all the comments.. this just means i'll have to lvl up BLM and WHM x.x my whm is only lv19 and my BLM is lvl9 lol.. im not a mage person so.. ugh this may be a trying time for my rdm.. which is the only mage im remotely interested in playing.. ..someone's gotta show those RDM's how to keep a freaking PLD refreshed LOL..

your comments were a big help.. thx
~nib

p.s. im in the process of moving so if im not on for awhile.. dont forget me ^^ and i AM NOT QUITTING.. so.. yea.. toodles ^.~
 
For things weak against thunder I did find rolling thunder was good especially with a monk and a nin and things that get 2 hits in hehe

also when no whm around I did find that /smn with a brd post 56 was easy main healing +7 mp a tic and the brd covered some -nas if needed
 
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