Sanoske

[Morcheeba]

LOL wow, apparently Rappas not a big boy and needed you to post that shit then?

Touche, amirite Orinna? Tad bit hypocritical of you.

Sorry I jumped all over you for that but it's something I tend to do with friends.

I took the time to read all the posts before I replied and yours jumped right out at me as an attack when she had already made the attempt to clarify her intentions.

Again I'm sorry I jumped on you.

 

[Orinna]

Can you not read? Or did you not see that I wasn't insulting him? You just assume I would insult him because of the garbage he's said about me. Stop shitting on this thread.

Don't talk about him publicly and there won't be an issue..

Also.. Sorry Sano for shitting on the flame about you...Or something.

 

[Morcheeba]

No..He has you blacklisted.. And rather than let you say shit about him.. I thought maybe I should defend him, when obviously you have no idea what you're talking about.

She didn't attack him... WOW stop being so THICK.

Sorry Mire, you do this shit. I can't deal with more thick women.

 

[Xalioniaf]

What the hell...

 

[Mirewen]

lol Fucking hell, I can't even mention someone's name? Screw that. I won't say anything rude about him, but as far as "not being allowed" to say someone's name? Shove that where the sun doesn't shine.

 

[Peekaboo]

Some people seem to be taking my selling gil as a personal insult, which I don't understand. What I did really affected me, and no one else. You can say all you want about helping RMT, but when you log on tomorrow, things are going to be exactly the same.

I still think questioning my real life conduct is a far stretch. If you knew me irl and you saw a need to question how I lived, then that's one thing and we'd talk about it. But you don't. At this point it's just going to be more of Rappa attempting to insinuate things about my rl based on a video game, and me telling him otherwise. Such is life.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a meth lab to build.

i love you sano

 

[Sanoske]

i love you sano

Awww Peek! I've missed ya buddy. See, if I had just followed you and Trippy into Integral I could've gotten away from this life of drugs and robbing the elderly.

Or I could've followed Iso-cat to Cali. Which probably would've ended with more drugs and old ladies.

 

[Peekaboo]

Haha yeah it could all be better! Gonna go suck on an icecube for dinner now..lol

 

[Mistra]

At the end of it all, I think it's all purely what you chose to do with spent time. While the character, the items, the gil, the whatever in the game are not yours by property and are the host company's, it's the individual's vested time. It's their's. My time is not your time, hers is not his, and his is certainly not either of ours.

Various proposed breaches of morality have been slung about here and there, and that's all completely fine. Everyone has their own opinion. Whether or not someone is more vested in the game than the other person, I don't know if it's necessarily right to manifest any sort of claim towards someone's personal character in regards to actions performed while/after playing a game with people online. While true to some regard, there's really not a whole lot to base such an accusation on... I mean, here:

"You obviously cheat/steal/are a bad person because you needed money, and sold some things you invested your time into."

This statement is quite a bit different than,

"You obvious cheat/steal/are a bad person because you sold some things you invested your time into, and made a business out of it."

When using Real Money Trade as a comparison, well, obviously the trade as a whole does something to upset the general userbase that pays money for the amount of entertainment the game brings, but something as minor as the first in quotations doesn't entirely deserve the extremeness brought forward by a few here.

Questionable, sure. But immoral implications attached? A little overzealous, really.

To those scoffing at Sanoske's popularity versus the lack of scrutiny that is preparedly deserved, think about that again just a little bit. Someone close to the man has had the opportunity to get to know him/her to the point where an act like this actually is moot enough to overlook and perhaps even laugh at, as seen by some of the responses made. Think of your closest friend for a minute, or, perhaps just someone close to you. Quite few of you are gallant enough to cast someone close to you aside for doing, to most, what would be the equivalent of... well, I don't have a solid example, but it's minor really.

Granted there's more going on overall than just one's time, but officially detaching from the game is, I suppose, what readily comes to mind when making this sort of decision.

For the too long, didn't read weary: "I disagree, here's a reasonable reason as to why, and here's another way to look at it. Think before casting stones."

 

[Sneakypants]

I gotta say, the claimed relationship of game and RL character, based on one's actions, being essentially equal is ridiculous.

Game: An opportunity presents itself to get a large chunk of money for essentially nothing. You paid for the game and played it, and were happy with the arrangement just that way. Upon leaving you can take the large sum of money or not. No RL negative consequences will come of it. You take the money.

RL: An opportunity presents itself to get a large chunk of money, but you don't feel like dealing with Publisher's Clearing House right now, your lottery ticket isn't a winner, and pretty much everything else is too good to be true. So there's a catch. You don't really want to do something unethical. You don't really wanna go to RL GM jail.

In RL, we stop ourselves more often than not from doing things that are against the law. If it's petty theft (windower), robbery (gil trading), or murder (H4X), in RL people check themselves before they wreck themselves, because they do know right from wrong. They do understand that they have a lot more to lose than their FFXI account. During the time someone is actively playing, the value of an account is subjective. Some folks shudder to think that they might lose their account. To others, this is no big deal. Nobody with any kind of smarts would say that about RL crime and RL jail time. Those things are a big deal. As a result of the consequences being drastically different between FFXI and RL, people will conduct themselves differently.

Rules/laws aside, any self-respecting person cares more for their actual life than they do their FFXI account. As such, they will conduct their real lives better in every way.

The only way I'd agree with FFXI character = RL character is on the high level. You think someone's a massive tool IRL, and what do ya know?! Massive tool IRL. Not too many surprises there. Same could be said for someone who is known to be a "nice guy" in game. Usually, they end up being a nice guy IRL as well. Same could be said for those that take things too seriously in game, and/or are known for God "blessing" them with a little pencil dick. You know, hypothetically speaking of course.

 

[Zyndara]

Selling a character is selling something that doesn't belong to you. You're not selling the time; the time is spent and gone. You are selling access to something that belongs to someone else. You pay monthly for the access to play a character. When you stop playing that character and stop paying for that character, you give up the access to the information - SE's information. Never at any point does it "belong" to you. It is not, at any point, yours to sell.

It's like paying monthly access to the local gym and then putting their equiment up for sale on EBay because you don't use the membership anymore...

 

[Rappa]

The only way I'd agree with FFXI character = RL character is on the high level. You think someone's a massive tool IRL, and what do ya know?! Massive tool IRL. Not too many surprises there. Same could be said for someone who is known to be a "nice guy" in game. Usually, they end up being a nice guy IRL as well.

That's all I was ever really implying. Most people seemed to get it, a few didn't. I was basically saying "So you sold gil to make rl money, I hope you use your rl money in a good way". That doesn't at all mean gilsellers/buyers are rl terrorists or anything of the sort. It's kinda funny watching people take a basic concept and run with it though, lol.

 

[Sneakypants]

Exactly. I don't understand how you wouldn't take an offer for instant money. Rather then getting a second job to make then money that you can get from selling something that you wouldn't use again.

Aye. A 2nd job has no relation to what happened here. For something that is to be tossed and gone forever, you either take the money or not. You could take the money and get a 2nd job if you were really out to make some quick lunch money.

Let's say you have a 2nd, toy car that you don't have room for any more. You have to get rid of it. Options are to give it away as a donation, or otherwise get nothing for it, or charge for it and recover some of the money you put into it. We can't reference the rules we all agree on as the reason not to sell a character since nearly everyone breaks some form of the rules. This has not been a selfish act or an unethical one. Perhaps one you wouldn't make yourself, but that's where it ends.

 

[Sanoske]

That's all I was ever really implying. Most people seemed to get it, a few didn't. I was basically saying "So you sold gil to make rl money, I hope you use your rl money in a good way". That doesn't at all mean gilsellers/buyers are rl terrorists or anything of the sort. It's kinda funny watching people take a basic concept and run with it though, lol.

I would step back and say perhaps I misunderstood, but that "I hope your college degrees lead you down a better path", among other jabs, was pretty blatant. I mean you could have been wishing me well, and genuinely happy that FFXI was allowing me to further my education, which in turn would give me the opportunity to do well in the future. And that was all you hoped to achieve by posting in this thread.

But somehow I doubt it.

 

[Rappa]

Let's say you have a 2nd, toy car that you don't have room for any more.

I really don't want to post in this topic anymore, but I have to point out the flaw in logic behind this comparison. You OWN the 2nd toy car, you do NOT own your FFXI character. You can argue all day long on the distinction between the two, but it's still going to be there and be true. Your IDs are nothing but library cards to "check out" your character as long as you're willing to pay to do so. I don't feel like pulling out my instruction manual but the transfer of these IDs is not allowed. You've seen how legit sites like ebay will pull down these auctions in a heartbeat. Ebay will let you sell YOUR toy car all day long. That's the difference.

 

[Mistra]

That's all I was ever really implying. Most people seemed to get it, a few didn't. I was basically saying "So you sold gil to make rl money, I hope you use your rl money in a good way". That doesn't at all mean gilsellers/buyers are rl terrorists or anything of the sort. It's kinda funny watching people take a basic concept and run with it though, lol.

"I hope your college degrees lead you down a better path."

 

[Rappa]

I mean you could have been wishing me well, and genuinely happy that FFXI was allowing me to further my education, which in turn would give me the opportunity to do well in the future. And that was all you hoped to achieve by posting in this thread.

I don't hate or even dislike a single human being I've interacted with in FFXI, even Vang. I may hate the way they play the game or talk to people on QCDN, but I harbor no ill-will towards them and their lives outside of the game. I have no reason to and never will. When I wish someone luck RL, I mean it.

 

[Sneakypants]

That's all I was ever really implying. Most people seemed to get it, a few didn't. I was basically saying "So you sold gil to make rl money, I hope you use your rl money in a good way". That doesn't at all mean gilsellers/buyers are rl terrorists or anything of the sort. It's kinda funny watching people take a basic concept and run with it though, lol.

I would step back and say perhaps I misunderstood, but that "I hope your college degrees lead you down a better path", among other jabs, was pretty blatant. I mean you could have been wishing me well, and genuinely happy that FFXI was allowing me to further my education, which in turn would give me the opportunity to do well in the future. And that was all you hoped to achieve by posting in this thread.

But somehow I doubt it.

I have to agree with Sano here. However light you want to play it now, that's not what was initially implied. Nobody's really thinking of terrorists anyway, but it was never as high level and light-hearted as you're making it out to be now. There's really no room to lol at anyone that might be running with your basic concept. The way it was presented could have been and was taken this way. It's easy to see why, even if you truly didn't intend it to be like that.

 

[Rappa]

"I hope your college degrees lead you down a better path."

I didn't say "better", I said "straighter", as in "straight and narrow". It was a light jab at the fact that selling gil's a violation of the rules of the game and also (despite what many here seem to think) illegal. Odon's a big boy, he took the jab fine. Sano seems to not get it. Now stop cyber stalking me, Mistra.

 

[Sanoske]

I didn't say "better", I said "straighter", as in "straight and narrow". It was a light jab at the fact that selling gil's a violation of the rules of the game and also (despite what many here seem to think) illegal. Odon's a big boy, he took the jab fine. Sano seems to not get it. Now stop cyber stalking me, Mistra.

At least you admit it was an insult, rather than trying to play it off as well wishes. I couldn't care less on your opinion of me outside the game, but you of all people should stick to your guns... since that's what you're all about. If it's a jab, it's a jab.