Seeking Advice for low-mid range Ninja

S

Sandria

Kitty Power!
Adventurer
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Messages
382
Main Job
WhiteMage-Female
Secondary Job
Summoner-Female
Third Job
Ninja-Female
Server
Quetzalcoatl
Let me start out by saying that my Ninja is level 38 and that I am mithra race. I am getting used to Ni at this point. I am trying to figure out the best means to adjust my stats to tank effectively. Is there such a thing as too much evasion? Should I be boosting attack or accuarcy/combination of both?

I don't always have the option of a SATA due to availability of jobs seeking. Am I better off ensuring that I have a THF in party? I notice that sometimes it is easier to hold hate than other times. However, I've noticed grabbing hate back at times can be nearly impossible. Someone mentioned to me FFXI Assist to be a must for ninja. Is this true and what exactly is it? I truly enjoy the ninja job and have come to respect most end-game ninjas. So, I am wanting to do my job the best I can even despite the given level.

Any advice is greatly welcomed. Thank you.
 
At 40 your hate be much easier from 40-61 ele wheel helps alot some stop at 50 but i would stop at 61 as AM+1 plus DW4
 
Thank you very much. That is a lot of valuable information! /bow
 
..

at lv40 the "elemental wheel" can help to hold hate, its pretty good from 40-60'ish as blazn previously stated, however it'll quadruple the money you are already putting into ninja..

i personally used the elemental wheel and didnt lose hate often.. however i've also seen ninjas 40-60 NOT using the elemental wheel and not having issues holding hate.. usually they have a few acc items and such to compliment their evasion.. im a lv70 ninja and i still use the lv30 parrying earring.. some ppl may dissagree with me on this one but, depending on your parrying skill, +3 parrying skill helps.. i notice i parry alot more than i did before i got one.. i'd like the +3 evasion skill earring but its kinda pricy.. but if you can afford it, its always good to get..

this is the basic breakdown of how someone explained it to me: evasion skill >> evasion >> agi
while this is all fine and dandy.. i still think drone earrings are better than evasion earrings.. ive tried both at my lower levels and i do believe drones to be the more helpful (agi helps trigger evasion and parrying)

um ok.. where was i..

ah.. keeping hate w/o sata.....
this can be tricky but if you try hard enough you can do it lol.. i was keeping hate from a full AF wearing galka warrior a few weeks ago.. and i was mighty proud of myself.. because usually ppl say "warrior wearing full af vs ninja tank, the warrior will end up tanking most of the time".. so keeping hate from any job or ability or spell is possible..

the basic breakdown of hate is like this:
deal 50 dmg: gain 50 hate
take 50 dmg: lose 50 hate
cure 50 HP : gain 100 hate

so as you can see, with weaker armor than paladins, ninjas need to get hit ALOT less lol.. to accomplish this you generally "count shadows" via changing your chat filters to show when you evade an attack and when your foe misses an attack.. personally i like to keep on 'special actions on/by you" so i can see when my Kuryami, Hojo, and Jaibaku (spelling? w/e) stick.. and when my utsusemi was last cast if i lose count of my shadows (honestly its harder to count from 1 to 4 than most people think, especially while trying to do 30 other things lol)

oh oh and..
some ninjas i have found, dont know how to correctly cast utsusemi:ichi after they get utsusemi:ni..

here is how to do that properly:
when counting shadows, if you have 1 shadow left on Utsusemi:Ni, and its not ready again.. cast Utsusemi:Ichi, and at about 50-60% cancel your current shadow.. this makes your shadows go down for like, 1 second.. then your Ichi hits.. and shadows are up again.. this may help you get hit less..

oh and as to answer your question about "is there too much evasion?" i can honestly say yes.. your job is to keep hate while taking no dmg.. but its harder to keep hate if you fill your 'accuracy item' slots up with evasion items.. get a snipers ring.. get a life belt.. there is a throwing item that adds +3 acc that i use (i forget the name) but it helps.. thats +18 accuracy right there.. for me thats good enough.. some ppl may use more.. some less.. but 3 spots for +18 accuracy is pretty damn good IMO..

anyhow, gl with ninja.. its a great job after Utsusemi:Ni, which im sure you figured out lol.. (i hated it lv1-36.. omg i hated it -.-)

~nib

p.s. about the /assist thing they told you to do.. i found it easier on myself to make every ALT+1 of my macro lists say /target <bt> it'll make you target the main mob your puller pulled.. thats the only time i use it is at the beginning of a fight.. it works, its easier than /assist (because you have to change /assist every single party and if you forget, your screwed)
 
Nibble said:
p.s. about the /assist thing they told you to do.. i found it easier on myself to make every ALT+1 of my macro lists say /target <bt> it'll make you target the main mob your puller pulled.
Click to expand...
I use that too, although mine is Ctrl+1 next to voke.

40 is where nin gets insane, with the elemental ni's. I almost never voked with a worthwhile thief in the party through the 40's. Engage as mob is arriving at camp, line up behind as initial voker vokes, and start casting kurayami and hojo, then spin through the elemental wheel once, recasting utsu as needed in the process. You'll do more damage than almost any other DD, which along with a hard SATA will cement hate onto you for the entire fight.

In an initial voke setup I would mess with a lot less evasion. The fight is a whole lot different when someone else tanks the first 5 seconds and you don't get hate until after the mob is enfeebled.

When you start spinning the elemental wheel INT will help you more than anything else, although there's not a lot available to ninja in the 40's. Wisdom rings macro'ed into your ni nukes is a nice boost, and you can swap back out with another macro when you finish the wheel. 1 INT is 1 damage to your nuke, when unresisted.
 
magic attack bouns earring from lab can help
 
oi..

please do NOT get +INT rings and the magic attk bonus earrings for NINJA unless you go NIN/BLM.. please i beg of you do not lol..

sure it'll help a tad.. but you know what? MAKES IT WAYYYYYYYY TOO COMPLICATED...

seriously, stay focused.. concentrate on the basics.. DONT GET HIT & KEEP HATE (via elemental wheel or melee, your choice)

every fight for me goes down almost the same..

THF/RNG pulls
i hit ALT+1 to target the mob..
>>> /target <bt>
i engage the mob
provoke when the mob is within range via CTRL+1 provoke macro
>>> /ja provoke <t>
>>> /p Ninja[Provoke] [<t>]
>>> /wait 29
>>> /echo Provoke is ready.
cast kuriyami:Ni
cast hojo:ni
cast jaibaku:ichi
usually have to recast Utsusemi:Ni by this time..
i melee till provoke macro informs me i can provoke again (which is usually after i recast Utsusemi)
i recast any debuffs that dont stick, Ichi or Ni whichever ones are up..
keep provoking and meleeing till fight is finished..

i hope that helps you some.. btw after you start getting AF get NIGHT TIME EQUIPMENT and DAYTIME EQUIPMENT.. your AF pants are really great but only work at night..

~nib
 
Here is my gear from 30-40... but i think basically you should pile on the evasion... i tried the macro'in in INT stuff and MAB stuff for elemental nukes, and its pretty much not worth it... the damage difference is not much maybe 10 more or less damage with war sub... but here was my gear throughout the 30's and 40's...

at level 30 i was wearing...

food: Jack o Lanterns

head: Emp Pin
neck: Spike Necklace
body: Chain Mail
back: nomad's
hands: Custom M Gloves (Hume)
waist: Warrior's Belt +1
legs: Chain hose
feet: Leaping Boots
rings: i switched from 2 Balance rings to 2 Reflex rings or a mixture
earrings: Dodge x 2
ranged: X

at level 40 i was wearing...

food: Jack o Lanterns

head: Emp Pin
neck: Spirit Torque
body: Ryl.Sqr. Chainmail
back: nomad's
hands: Custom M Gloves (Hume)
waist: Survival Belt
legs: Silver Hose or royal squires breeches... i think thats what they are called.
feet: Leaping Boots
rings: Deft Ring x 2 or sniper's or sniper/venerer
earrings: Dodge x 2
ranged: Jr Mskt Chakrm
 
Actually, I think they meant a 3rd party program but I was not too sure.

Assisting like in dynamis is just too.. um.. unreliable. So my ALT1 is /target <bt> /wait 1 /attack. I normally try to blind before voke as it is coming into camp. The last puller that I had used to get very annoyed by this tactic although admittingly, it seemed from my perspective to be more overall benificial. It helped a great deal when I had only Ichi, although now that I have Ni perhaps I should try another alternative. Pullers have /nin.. Is it bad form for me to let them to use their shadows?

I was over zealous abouit evasion. I think I have about 30 evasion and even considered spending 900 mil just to up that with a belt. Seeing the advice now will save me a good bit of gil that I can use in tools. I guess with the formulas given I could have went with o.kote over h.kote. However, there quite a rush in being able to solo a tough (without my good ole carbuncle).

At 40 when Jujitsu gi becomes available, should I use that? I've got a Nanban now as well as a Fed Gi. Is there a common balance I should consider in relation to Acc and Att? I noticed that Att stat is actually better than STR stat-- or is that only when not using a WS?
 
what that shadow counter thing is that not FFXI assit?
 
Wow.. I had window up too long and missed a bit of stuff. I have the wisdom and the earring from having a magic background, although, personally I am not sure if I would feel completely comfortable using that route. The constant gear swaping drives me insane and can honestly do more harm than good in some cases depending the given sittuation.

Nibb, I noticed you do the provoke with echo recast.. do you recomend not macroing in your magic? I was getting heavy into adding /recast into my macros to keep me updated on what would come available.

Edit: Blaz: I am assuming so-- but alas, I don't know.
 
thats my personal playing style.. i tend to always have either CTRL+J or CTRL+M opened so i can see the EXACT SECOND my utsusemi timers are up.. and usually i have one utsusemi or the other 'readied' which means i cilcked once on the CTRL+M screen, and if i click again it'll begin casting..

to each their own but i like the CTRL+M screens.. also.. some macros tend to lag in high lag areas..

~nib

p.s. im on aim if you want to talk further in detail, my aim name: Desired Mithra
 
Nibble said:
please do NOT get +INT rings and the magic attk bonus earrings for NINJA unless you go NIN/BLM.. please i beg of you do not lol..
Click to expand...
Why wouldn't you pop on 6 INT for the 20 seconds you take to spin through 6 spells? Yeah, if you don't use the elemental ni's, then int is worthless, but if you're casting 6 a fight, and they're taking your damage from 80 a pop to 86 a pop, what else is more useful in your ring slots while you're casting? Moldy earring works without blm sub, it's a 5% bonus to your nukes btw, another thing that you might as well macro in for ni nukes if you have it, but by the time you can use it you'll be spinning the wheel a little less.
 
do what you need to do.. if you want to use +INT go for it.. im simply suggesting NOT to use it because, again, every job needs to stay focused.. btw agi rings help trigger evasion.. so "what can help more than +INT when casting elemental Ni's?" id rather keep shadows up longer, having to recast utsusemi less, which overall makes me get hit less, which in turn makes me lose less hate.. than gain +32 dmg..

~nib

p.s. if you wish to discuss this more PLEASE aim me, i hate having to carry a conversation on qcdn: Desired Mithra
 
Stouter said:
Why wouldn't you pop on 6 INT for the 20 seconds you take to spin through 6 spells? Yeah, if you don't use the elemental ni's, then int is worthless, but if you're casting 6 a fight, and they're taking your damage from 80 a pop to 86 a pop, what else is more useful in your ring slots while you're casting? Moldy earring works without blm sub, it's a 5% bonus to your nukes btw, another thing that you might as well macro in for ni nukes if you have it, but by the time you can use it you'll be spinning the wheel a little less.
Click to expand...

Could macro it in during the casting.

/nin "XXXX: Ni" <t>
/equip l.ear "Moldavite Earring"
/wait 1-2(however long it takes to get the spell off)
/equip l.ear "XXXXXXX"

You don't need the earring on during the casting animation, just once casting finishes. Not too complicated, and having it on you for the times you do use one of the elementals is a bonus, if you have the spare inventory. Figure it's atleast +5% to magic bursting them as well.

Full Yasha/Osode, Moldavite, and Uggalepih Pendant could make some decent magic bursts.

And Nibble, it's all about timing. You could completely swap for INT/MAB gear, land your Ninjutsu, then swap back before the mob ever gets his next attack cycle off. Even more so if they're slowed, which they should be.
 
Last edited:
you COULD do that, but again, i make things easier and simpler on myself by only really using 1 macro..

~nib

p.s. i wish they'd fix macros so they could all run seperately.. say.. use /wait in a macro and have it go off even if you use another macro in the meantime.. oh well.. le sigh..
 
Nibble said:
you COULD do that, but again, i make things easier and simpler on myself by only really using 1 macro..

~nib

p.s. i wish they'd fix macros so they could all run seperately.. say.. use /wait in a macro and have it go off even if you use another macro in the meantime.. oh well.. le sigh..
Click to expand...

Maybe you should train yourself by having more than one then. Why settle for being Average when you could be someone people remember when they party?
 
Skaw said:
Could macro it in during the casting.

/nin "XXXX: Ni" <t>
/equip l.ear "Moldavite Earring"
/wait 1-2(however long it takes to get the spell off)
/equip l.ear "XXXXXXX"
Click to expand...
That's a lot of "equipment changed" spamming through the chat log, making it more difficult to count shadows. I swapped in gear with every ni macro, so I would only see the gear change on the first one, and not on each successive one, with gear change back in a seperate macro.

6 AGI isn't going to make that huge of a difference in your evasion, you'll evade what, 1 more time every half hour with that? If you need to cast utsu more than twice during the fight, and once between fights, then you're overcamping. This is when that 6 AGI might help, but you shouldn't be in that situation to begin with.
 
Okay, few things.

#1: All evasion = You can't keep hate. Balance is key. Keep a good amount of attack, accuracy, and evasion gear on you, adapt as needed. Fighting a slow squishy? Drop the evasion, pile on the attack. Party overhunting because "OMGWEGOTZANIN!!1!"? Every bit of evasion counts, and it's the only time you should be wearing full evasion. AGI rings are almost completely useless outside of those ZOMGOVERHUNT parties, use Sniper's or something else accuracy to keep hate.

#2: Jack o Lantern = NO. If you want evasion, eat Navarin, or however that sheep food is spelled. You want accuracy, eat sushi. Dorado if you have trouble keeping hate, Sole or Squid if you're not. You want damage, eat a Sis Kebabi or something similar, NIN has very nice accuracy with the right gear.

#3: INT gear for casting... Wonderful in theory, a pain in practice. Unless you can fit it all into one macro, chances are you'll end up standing around in INT gear when you're trying to recast utsusemi, and that doesn't work so well. (Skaw don't offer advice on a job you'll never level. :P)

#4: Forget about a recast on your provoke macro. You wanna know what time is left on provoke? Push the button and find out, if it goes off, it's up, if it's not, it gives you a little text saying how much time is left. For utsusemi and such, I found a really nice way to do it is /recast "Utsusmi: Ni" /nin "Utsusemi: Ni" <stpc>. That way you can just hit the macro to see if utsu is up, but it won't trigger the casting, you have to hit enter/X to confirm the cast.

#5: Weapon skill macro is important, it's the difference between a 50 damage WS due to mostly evasion gear, and a 100+ WS from proper gear.


*edit* Oh yea, and one other trick... Put a -massive- echo in your Utsu macros.
/recast "Utsusemi: Ni"
/nin "Utsusemi: Ni" <stpc>
/echo -------------------NI-----------------------

No matter how much spam is in the log, you can't miss it.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top