/sigh

I don't get what everyone is saying. You say Answa did not heal after he said he did heal even though he didn't want to. If you read the flame, it's not about whether or not summoners can main heal or not. It's obvious that they can. Nor is it an argument about whether or not summoners should main heal. It's about the fact that he was annoyed that he wasn't asked about it before he was invited when his search comment said he wouldn't. It's about the dumbass party leader. This guy (nameless) is getting flamed because he can't read. He can't see that the smn he invited doesn't want to main heal. He can't read when the tank says "afk". He can't read when the healer says "afk". And people got killed because of the leaders stupidity. That's what the flame was about.

I feel you're allowed to play any job any way you want if (and only if) you find 5 other people willing to accept that. If you can wait for 8 hours to find a party that doesn't ask you to main heal as smn, you don't have to main heal. Plain and simple. If you want to wait around for a party that likes blm/smn, you can play blm/smn. If you can wait for a party to take you in as a bst, you can party with bst. But people usually don't like waiting around for days finding a party, so they accept what their job is expected to do and they do it.
 
People should pay attention to search comments. But if people can't even distinguish a person seeking a party from a person who isn't, what hope does that leave you that they went a step further and read a search comment? People don't pay attention. They toss together parties of the first 5 people they can get in the hopes of making 1k an hour. You could've been a smn/drg, and you'd still have been invited to main heal. People don't seem to be putting much thought into good parties these days.
 
Answa wasn't flamed for how he does his SMN job, he was flamed mainly for his shitty attitude in the party.

Read again.
 
Seawolf said:
Answa wasn't flamed for how he does his SMN job, he was flamed mainly for his shitty attitude in the party.

Read again.
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It doesn't really matter. It was mostly because of the SMN healing thing. The shitty attitude I don't take as flaming, because since I admitted it, I don't care what people tell me about it, I already said it, and apologized to the BLM today. The THF didn't even notice, I think, and no one else seemed mad at me. So it's all in the past, but I'm still 2k tnl. >.>
 
You still haven't said what you do between blood pacts if you aren't healing :p

The original post says something about getting closer to 70, which means you aren't 70, which means you DONT HAVE the big damage blood pacts yet. So... Yeah.

*wanders out of the thread with a dazed look*
 
And, Rones, back off. Post 70 we get the BPs that deal massive damage. And WHM is never a waste in a party. I assure you.
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I'm sorry you will be a bit disappointed when you hit 70 with that train of thought. Yes you can do some nice dmg with them, but not near enough to make you a DD leaving you still as a healer.

Whm is a waste in many party setups, I have enough experience with it to know that. Any party with a rdm&brd does not need a whm. Any party with a nin tank does not need a whm. Any party with a rdm & 2+blms does not need a whm. Any party with a smn and refresher does not need a whm. The only time a whm is necessary is pld tank with either rdm or brd support but not both.

I still don't see why you got mad at the leader. If I saw a pld with a comment that said "I don't tank", I would take it as a joke and still invite him with the intention of him tanking if I couldn't find anyone else. Same thing with smn, smn has no other function that warrents a party slot, so why shouldn't the leader expect you to main heal and use bps? If you really don't like healing, you are playing the wrong job.
 
Yeah, people don't pay attention to the search comments a lot. If someone who does their job doesn't feel like healing, you can't make them heal. If a war/nin has to emergency tank when a pld or nin cannot regain hate on a mob, you can't them use their 'voke macro, can you? The point is... if you don't like how one plays their character, then leave them be. I see the point of why the thread was created. If you don't like healing with your smn, fine, you have every right not to heal with your smn. You like smn because of the avatars most likely which is cool. If you wanna sacrifice not getting as many invites as you are getting now, then be our guest.

People when making parties have their own preferences in what they want and you should respect that. And everyone has an expectation for every job in FFXI. Personally, I hate healing/refreshing (which is why i stopped lvling rdm at 41) and became a dragoon because of it.

But Answa, seriously... try to get used to the idea of healing a bit while using your BPs, I'm not saying to go on a healing rampage and get hate or anything. Just give it a shot. imho, a smn not trying to healing while smning BPs is like a blink tank using utsusemi only and not even attacking with their weapons.

Just be careful though in the future, if you play as another job and invite a smn who only uses BPs don't get pissed... otherwise... well, you know... ^^;
 
Cous100: I never said I don't heal between BPs... I never said I did, either, but I do, just to clear it up.

Rones: I'm not going to keep discussing it. I don't like it. You don't force-feed people to eat shit even if you like it, do you? Don't make me heal, then. I see your points, I respect your opinion, but I frankly don't care much. And the PLD "No tank" comment, funny shit, crappy example. And I've heard enough of the "You're playing the wrong job" thing.

I just got back from healing in another party. This time, the leader was considerate, and asked me first. I agreed. The party went along fine... though the tank sucked. There were two deaths, one was a link, the other I was mid-cast on carby to use Healing Ruby II because with NIN tank I get too much hate from Curaga. I got my level, got a huge buffer, I'm happy. I healed, and it went fine.

The thing is that I get mad when they don't ask me first... that's just me. Do you NOT see what I'm saying yet? Do you need a map? (Regional humor, dunno if you guys'll understand.)
 
The thing is that I get mad when they don't ask me first... that's just me. Do you NOT see what I'm saying yet?
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Do you ask a rdm if he will refresh? Do you ask a mnk if he will punch? Do you ask a whm if he will cure? Do you ask a blm if he will nuke? Do you ask a pld if he will tank? Do you ask a smn if he will cure? No to all of those because it's what the job does. There is no reason a party leader should have to ask a memeber to do a basic duty of the job.

I am still very curious what it is you are doing between your blood pacts that doesn't involve curing, is beneficial to the party, and so much fun. I'm not asking for a complicated strategy, just a few simple activites you are performing.
 
i understand what you're saying... just play the game the way you feel comfortable with, that's all I can say. You shouldn't be 'forced' so to speak to play a way you don't feel at all happy with. :D
 
Answa~ said:
And Rones, SMN is not boring when done right. I'm always doing something. I can't really come up with stats or anything because I don't like to put much thought into a GAME, but I know that everytime I party while no mainhealing, everyone in my party has fun.
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You don't like main healing, thats your choice. I didn't even read most of the posts in this thread so this may have been asked.

But, umm, what do you do between the 1 min bloodpacts other than do a whms job...? Just wondering...
 
I mostly Release and use Carbuncle while having my mitts on and use Assault every 8 seconds to boost the Blood Pact delay. Yes, 8 seconds, not 10, because when you macro it it's actually shorter in time, and don't argue me about this. I heal when necessary. When I see the Blood Pact timer going down, I Release and use whatever is necessary.

If there's a MB, I leave the Avatar meleeing for a few seconds so it can gain TP, then MB.

If I'm buffing, which are generally costly BPs, I use the buff and sit down and rest MP and help heal if necessary. I've lately taken a liking to using Ecliptic Howl or Growl, whatever the party decides, and keeping Fenrir out and using Eclipse Bite. But it all depends on party setting.

I say dynamic and fun, because I'm used to the BP timer, so it goes by in no time. I can solve a lot of problems in a party. I can use Earthen Ward with blink tanks, MB if there's no BLM or if I have the extra time/MP, finish off the mobs with almost any melee BP, but particularly Eclipse Bite and Double Slap. I can Sleepga, I can Hastega, I can use Healing Ruby II for those bastard flies. I can do a whole lot of shit that does not involve main healing.

And it's fun, and it works. And no, it's not a basic duty in a party. I can easily take away the sub, and it's no longer basic, is it?

I remember one time, my leader asked me to use BLM sub... and the party went along great. It was fun. FUN. (|Do you need it?|)

Now, please, stop changing the theme, I did not intend this to be yet another "Should SMN heal" discussion, READ THE FIRST LINE OF THE INITIAL POST AND SHUT UP, PLEASE.
 
Cous1000 said:
i understand what you're saying... just play the game the way you feel comfortable with, that's all I can say. You shouldn't be 'forced' so to speak to play a way you don't feel at all happy with. :D
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This is true, except for the fact that he's being "forced" to play the way every other smn plays. It's how they are expected to play in a party. If they don't want to meet those party expectations, they can try soloing.
 
Bajaratt said:
Cous1000 said:
i understand what you're saying... just play the game the way you feel comfortable with, that's all I can say. You shouldn't be 'forced' so to speak to play a way you don't feel at all happy with. :D
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This is true, except for the fact that he's being "forced" to play the way every other smn plays. It's how they are expected to play in a party. If they don't want to meet those party expectations, they can try soloing.
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Not everyone is so narrow minded. I get plenty of invites to not heal. I've actually had more invites to not heal than to do it this month, I think like 2 to heal and.... 10 to not?
 
At the same time, the 430 Eclipse Bites every minute + 10-15 damage a round (if he hit) with Carby wasn't exactly turning heads either.
 
Then you were replacing a blm or something. Healing is one of the two uses for summoners, so deal with it. I'm leveling my summoner as well, and I would much rather heal than play DD, especially when I'm doing crap for damage even with BP's. When there's a whm in the party, I pull out carby and go DD. When there isn't one, I don't bitch or be an ass, I just cure the people.
 
I'm not going to keep on defending myself, this is overwhelming. Just shut up about this debate...

And, Cubswoo, you partied with me once. You saw. I pulled off the Meteorite MBs and damaging with Eclipse Bite when needed. I think, to be safe, that it was like 800+ dmg per battle? And that's a very broad "+"... There was no BLM, yet we kept massacering (sp?) the lizards. And I managed to keep the pt buffed when they needed. Forgot? Fenrir hits for 35-58 dmg per attack, and Carbuncle for much lower, but I only use him (if I actually use him) to help me keep pace with the Blood Pact timer or, when I partied with you, I kept him out all the time for TP gain to MB Meteorite for over 500 dmg and then Release.

And I was an ass, for the billionth time, Bajaratt, because I was let down to get an invite to heal while being excited for having a controller again, while having my Search comment on specifically saying I didn't want to, and the guy didn't even answer my question ever, just kept up filling the spots with no WHM. And I was only an ass to the leader.

Now pleaaaase stop it. How the hell do I lock this? Or who do I ask to lock this?
 
The way you lock it is by not posting anymore and forgetting about it then eventually people will run out of stuff to say and it will be buried from lack of activity. The only reason it hasn't died yet is because you keep responding ;)
 
And no, it's not a basic duty in a party. I can easily take away the sub, and it's no longer basic, is it?
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Same can be said of many jobs. Take away pld or nin's sub. Take away my brd's sub and I'm at 2/3 my usual power at best. Just because it is your sub job, doesn't make it not a duty. Some jobs depend on their sub for party play.
remember one time, my leader asked me to use BLM sub... and the party went along great. It was fun. FUN. (|Do you need it?|)
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I remember my last party with a smn/blm on my brd. *shudder* Complete waste of a party slot. Not only is blm subbed worthless for nuking, but it removed most of the point having the smn. We wiped twice when we got a link, me and the rdm ran out of mp to cure, however the smn/blm had 450+ unusable mp both times. :roll:
mostly Release and use Carbuncle while having my mitts on and use Assault...and don't argue me about this.
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You have your avatar melee...thanks for proving our point. A smn in a typical exp party doing nothing but BP's and meleeing is a waste of slot that would be better off replaced by almost any job. Also, if you can choose which topics people can and can't disagree with on, I'm going to say you can't disagree with any of my points. :P

Now pleaaaase stop it. How the hell do I lock this? Or who do I ask to lock this?
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That's the beauty of the flameboard, you can't. :wink: This also furthers the point that most flame threads backfire on the maker. Think long and hard about what you hope to accomplish before starting a flame thread, otherwise it will take an unintended direction like this has.
 
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