Sneak and Invis. Simple? you would think so......

[asiamise]

For the love of all things holy and sacred on this earth, and the baby Jesus, If you lack the magical ability to Sneak and Invis yourself, bring your own Oils and Powders ..................... pleaseeeeeeee ??????

I am dog-ass tired of hearing this excuse:

"But I dont have the money for them"

Really? guess what? at lvl 60-ish, there are an assload of mobs you can kill to collect drops, in which you can sell. Its called "Farming". Hell, at any lvl there are more than enough mobs to slap to get drops.

If I dont have Oils and Powders, I dont seek pt, plain and simple.
Ive turned down invites (I wasnt seeking) because I lacked these materials.

I try to stay away from the Flameboard as much as possible, at least in a posting sense, but this topic deserves yet another moment in the sun.

So, in closing, to all melees who refuse to bring their own anti-aggro materials, please stop wasting my time. I simply dont have an extra hour to spend getting to camp and waiting because you died and need to be tractored / raised. Im usually the happiest girl in a Vader helmet, but if you die before we even start xp'ing due to lack of materials, I will chew you a new ass. Period.

That is all.

 

[Raivyn]

How about this one.

Just because you DO have the ability to magically sneak and invis yourself does not mean you shouldn't have oils and powders.

It's a little thing called magic aggro.

It is beyond frustrating to go party in Ro'maeve and say before leaving jeuno 'bring oils, the monsters aggro to magic' and have the mages - who have spent the past 70 levels telling me how to do my job/telling me to bring oils and powders etc; - not fucking do it.

Silent Oil is 15k a stack now, and whereas I do have the money to buy them if the stuck up mages don't feel like sneaking me out of courtesy (I do not want to die) I DO NOT have the money to waste when their dumbass gets aggro for casting sneak.

Even though I did. Because I'm stubborn, and I wanted my level -.-

At least the xp was alright afterwards.

 

[asiamise]

Good point ^^b

 

[Falsey]

I dont go out without atleast 7 pies, 7 echo drops, 7 silent oils, and 7 invis powders. Dont know why I chose 7, on day it sorta happened on its own, and well I stuck with it. Since then I buy supplies, and replish after each pt/mission/quest/whatever.

Yes I am a mage, and yes I am a responcible mage, probably one of very few.

When I hear a PLD say hey man I dont have oils help me out. I sneak him, and use an oil on myself to show him that even a BLM carries that with him.

Also Asia, this is a tiered topic on here, not to take away from your post but 90% of people who dont "have" the money, are usualy too cheap, and just dont care.

 

[Sethala]

I try my best to make sure I always have powder/oil with me when we go exping.

Sadly, my memory needs work, and I sometimes completely forget to take them out of my MH >.>; Which is why I've got several stacks now; I had to ask other party members to buy me a stack and bring it to me if they're still in Jeuno while I'm headed to the camp.

Anyway, I will use powder/oil when it's needed, but since it's so expensive, I'll always ask for it from a mage as long as I know that it's safe for him/her to cast it. Such as when entering a zone, or in a zone with no sight/magic aggro nearby. If it is unsafe for him/her to cast it on me, though, I'll use my own items.

And Asia, you probably shouldn't turn down invites just because you can't afford sneak/invis. Tell them that you're out and can't afford any next time they invite you while you're not lfg; if they really want you to join, they'll probably loan you a few (especially if they know you).

 

[Faedryth]

Yeah hot damn. One guy showed up for the party (Pld heh), and I wait for everyone to get sneaked/invised, then take off. Wussy gets lost, dies, and db's because of it.

Anyways, I have by this point given up on this. I am now pleasantly surprised when someone has them, but I never expect it. Having got Whm to 21 (barely), I am already annoyed with people asking me to sneak them (once), so now I understand why people expect melee to have them. <3 Tonko!

 

[asiamise]

I'm not perfect by any means, nor will I ever claim to be, but by 60 -ish
there should be a certain responsibilty instilled in a player to make sure your jobs shortcomings are covered.
I honestly dont like to have it cast on me, because it always wears off in the worst place, and the duration is shorter than if I use my own supplies.

Ive forgotten Oils and Powders, but after forgetting once and costing the pt an hour, and getting chewed out, the tendency for me to remember every time since is cemented. When someone honestly forgets, or runs out, I'll always give them some of mine ^^. Its really easy to tell when someone forgets, or just doesnt care.
When someone responds with a sarcastic "Oh yes sir!!!" or "Well I guess we cant all be perfect" after I kindly (and I do mean kindly, those that know me know that Im anything but an ass) suggest bringing them in the future, to those people my Flame goes.
I understand not having the gil, believe me I do, but then we need to step back weigh out our priorities, should I be xp'ing, or out farming so I can survive?

Mistakes are made, after all, to err is human.
But I have little tolerance left in this game for ignorance and outright, blatant stupidity. Please do not take this Flame the wrong way, it is solely
addressed to those that are genuinely stupid, and do nothing to correct their stupidity.Ive even seen melee yell at mages who dont cast on them fast enough, and then say they dont need to ever have Oils and Powders because thats what a mage is for :shock: :shock: :shock:

This type of crap only happens in pickup pt's with strangers, for me anyway. Because when I pt with friends we all make sure we have what we need and help those that dont, thats what friends are for after all.

Is it just me? am I being too nit-picky? I don't know, but this topic continues to be an issue, and if you think about it, its an issue easily resolved.

 

[Peregrine]

As long as you can cast sneak and invis on others, and it costs nothing to do so, I expect that whenever plausible, a mage help their party out. With as mage-heavy as typical parties are, usually more than one person will have the spell. Usually one person will have nin subbed as well. I respect a couple of mages who know how to get their peers through a zone safely for free--more than ones who demand that others do it on their own at a cost of around 10k a trip for the whole party.

Usually I can get by with one sneak. That'll get me to Dragon's Aery. That'll get me from the start of kuftal to half-way to the cloister. I usually have oils on me. I conserve them though, because mages are generally good and happy to sneak.

On a large quest? Bring them or don't come. On the way to camp? Ehhh in 90 percent of cases I would say that there's no merit to demand people pop oils and powders left and right.

 

[Falsey]

As long as you can cast sneak and invis on others, and it costs nothing to do so, I expect that whenever plausible, a mage help their party out. With as mage-heavy as typical parties are, usually more than one person will have the spell. Usually one person will have nin subbed as well. I respect a couple of mages who know how to get their peers through a zone safely for free--more than ones who demand that others do it on their own at a cost of around 10k a trip for the whole party.

Usually I can get by with one sneak. That'll get me to Dragon's Aery. That'll get me from the start of kuftal to half-way to the cloister. I usually have oils on me. I conserve them though, because mages are generally good and happy to sneak.

On a large quest? Bring them or don't come. On the way to camp? Ehhh in 90 percent of cases I would say that there's no merit to demand people pop oils and powders left and right.

Oh but yes there is. Yes I have the spell, but why do I cary my own supplies still?? I never, NEVER!!!! rely on my spell. If I'm running, and its starting to wear 30 seconds after cast, I pop an Oil. All the mele type say that we have the spell for a reason, well we do. But we paid money for it, as for many many other spells for which we will never get our money back. I think I've sunk way over 2 mil into spells alone, and when you have done the same, or any mele class, then they can tell me what to cast and what not to cast, and on whom. :roll:

 

[Veteran]

I have been carrying at least 13 oils and powders with me at all times since about level 50 I think--too many times I had seen mages have to run back and find the hapless melee cowering in a corner being stared at by 6 Elder Goobue. I always, always have my items with me, and I'll only ask a mage to reapply sneak/invis on me midway to camp if it is both an extremely safe spot and the mage is very close to me--if both of these conditions aren't satisfied, I pop another oil.8) It's common courtesy.

P.S. I still see about one melee per party (on average) who doesn't have oils/powders at level 69/70.:?

 

[Bajaratt]

I only ask for sneak/invis at the start of the aggro area, after that I've got oils/powders that I can use. I don't consider it rude, cheap or anything else other than prudent to just ask for 1 free sneak/invis per zone, especially when that might take you all the way where you're going. I've had sneak wear off 5 seconds after the mage casted it on me and I popped an oil. I'd had my free cast, it was time to use an item.

On that, I hate it when mages refuse to sneak me when I ask for it at the start. Yes, it's not their job to sneak me, but it's courtesy just like me voking a mob off them.

 

[Phoku]

i myself have started to realize that i need oils to get to certain areas safely. Lucky for me, all i need is oils cuz for ranger and thief i have tonko with nin sub.

 

[Prentice]

As long as you can cast sneak and invis on others, and it costs nothing to do so, I expect that whenever plausible, a mage help their party out. With as mage-heavy as typical parties are, usually more than one person will have the spell. Usually one person will have nin subbed as well. I respect a couple of mages who know how to get their peers through a zone safely for free--more than ones who demand that others do it on their own at a cost of around 10k a trip for the whole party.

I usually stay away from posting on the flameboard, but here I am posting twice tonight...

This topic is related to my pet peeve. I do not mind sneak/invis'ing PT members when it is safe to do so. But I am another mage that doesn't leave the house without 6hrs of food, a stack of echo drops, and a stack each of silent oil & prism powder. Sometimes it is safer to use the items, sometimes it is actually more convenient.

But my pet peeve related to this is that MOST melee's who don't bring their oils & powders start running as soon as you have sneak+invis'd them. They don't THINK about the fact that you are going to be delayed because you have to stealth someone else...at least yourself. I died quite a few times in Kuftal because of this idiocy--people would panic when sneak was about to wear and start screaming at the mages "where the f are you???" and make us come find wherever they had gotten off to (usually in the middle of a bunch of crabs) to re-sneak them. Typically I would somehow wind up in an unsafe situation where my sneak wore and I took their death.

If you are going to depend on a mage to stealth you, you better stay by that mage's side. If you run off ahead of me & I can't get to you in time, your gonna have to get Tractor and Raise I from me next.

 

[Bajaratt]

As long as you can cast sneak and invis on others, and it costs nothing to do so, I expect that whenever plausible, a mage help their party out. With as mage-heavy as typical parties are, usually more than one person will have the spell. Usually one person will have nin subbed as well. I respect a couple of mages who know how to get their peers through a zone safely for free--more than ones who demand that others do it on their own at a cost of around 10k a trip for the whole party.

I usually stay away from posting on the flameboard, but here I am posting twice tonight...

This topic is related to my pet peeve. I do not mind sneak/invis'ing PT members when it is safe to do so. But I am another mage that doesn't leave the house without 6hrs of food, a stack of echo drops, and a stack each of silent oil & prism powder. Sometimes it is safer to use the items, sometimes it is actually more convenient.

But my pet peeve related to this is that MOST melee's who don't bring their oils & powders start running as soon as you have sneak+invis'd them. They don't THINK about the fact that you are going to be delayed because you have to stealth someone else...at least yourself. I died quite a few times in Kuftal because of this idiocy--people would panic when sneak was about to wear and start screaming at the mages "where the f are you???" and make us come find wherever they had gotten off to (usually in the middle of a bunch of crabs) to re-sneak them. Typically I would somehow wind up in an unsafe situation where my sneak wore and I took their death.

If you are going to depend on a mage to stealth you, you better stay by that mage's side. If you run off ahead of me & I can't get to you in time, your gonna have to get Tractor and Raise I from me next.

Idiots who depend on mages solely to get around aside, they might be running as soon as they get sneak/invis so that they can get further before the spells wear off. Since sneak and invis has a random timer from any source other than tonko, they are probably trying to get as far as they can before they have to use an oil or get it recast.

People who don't bring the items and demand mages to hold their hand through the zones are idiots. I don't expect melee's to wait around me all the time, but if their sneak wears in the middle of some aggro mobs, then I'm just going to watch them die, unless there's enough people to kill it. I'll tractor and raise them, but I'm not sacrificing myself because someone was too cheap to buy the items or too stupid to avoid the aggro.

 

[Mistaya]

I don't remember many zones where it takes a recast to get where you are going, so i usually take off running when i get my application. the 2 i do remember are terrigan (theres a very nice rock to hide behind to recast) and boyadah, (recast right when you hit the goobue's on the way to the proc tunnel). I carry my own stuff always, but if the mage can save me 500g on a pot I'd appreciate it. (or w/e it costs now.)

The thing thats more frustrating to me than the lack of S/I items, is the lack of knowlege of the zone. Why don't you have a map, or if its something like a coffer you havent gotten, why don't you learn the basic zone. Kuftal is pretty much a straightshot, with big fat landmarks (theres an obvious scorp, or a tunnel goes up or down on a slant) LEARN TO RUN THE ZONE. There is no reason at all to be that much of a retard that you cannot remember how to walk from kuftal to terrigan and back. Or any other common exp zone. If you have exp'd more than 3x in this place, I expect you to know how to get to the camp. It's that simple.

And if you don't know the way, SAY SO as S/I is given the first time, and FOLLOW someone who does. and INFORM them you are following them. There is no reason ---ever--- to get lost in this game if you are smart. (Not counting solo'ing in odd places hehe.) Being new to an area is not a shameful secret, ask for directions and save yourself and your party a huge headache if you don't know the way.

I think the lack of S/I items is almost a coverup on the larger issue of people getting lost in a zone they've been to 1500 times... After all its when someone gets lost and dies in some god-knows-where corner that tempers fly. Not saying lack of powder/oil isn't an issue but theres more to it than just that.

 

[CubsWoo]

Exactly. A lot of the new areas I'm simply not familiar with (Terrigan, Onzozo, VoS) and the like, simply because I've never actually partied there.

But.

www.ffxi-atlas.com is a fucking lifesaver. If you're on PC, print the damn maps out. If you're on PS2, print them out anyway. If you don't know how to go somewhere, you do now.

 

[Sabia]

Second pic was a Dark Knight....yeah I just LOVE melee who can't sneak/invis themselves...even the BLM in the second party had a /SMN subjob and we had to sneak her too....

That was filled with sarcasm for all you peeps who didn't get it. Bring your own damn oils, I'll re-cast if it's safe and at the begining of a zone to save you money but I'm not killing myself nor running all the way back through an aggro heavy zone to collect your sorry tail. I carry powders and oils and you should too.

 

[Peregrine]

We've already established that that player is a certified numbskull. First and foremost, don't invite those types. Sneak oils were secondary to a primary mistake in that case.

 

[Raivyn]

I dont go out without atleast 7 pies, 7 echo drops, 7 silent oils, and 7 invis powders. Dont know why I chose 7, on day it sorta happened on its own, and well I stuck with it. Since then I buy supplies, and replish after each pt/mission/quest/whatever.

Yes I am a mage, and yes I am a responcible mage, probably one of very few.

When I hear a PLD say hey man I dont have oils help me out. I sneak him, and use an oil on myself to show him that even a BLM carries that with him.

Also Asia, this is a tiered topic on here, not to take away from your post but 90% of people who dont "have" the money, are usualy too cheap, and just dont care.

yaaaaaaay for falsey!!!

 

[wolfskymoon]

I agree to peregrine's first post.But yes... i did use my sneak oil but the mage lost her sneak then i voked and i died... this didn't happen 1 time it probably happened 30 times.So if there are lotsa mages who can sneak/invite ppl if they need it , in places like boyahada tree.But in den of rancor on zm 4 (they should carry their own oils).But when a mage refuses to sneak u right when u enter lab of onzozo just cuz he doesn't want to then he doesn't know how to play as a mage.... i sneak ppl all the time on my rdm =).