Stop buying Ulli stones, you *#%*tards

[Sneakypants]

If the seller isn't named, "Wnjklshuinppp", then the name should be easy enough to recall.

 

[jamal]

Idk how old you are, but I'm old enough to know Kaizen's not a Gimp ls...

That's fine. But...to me and obviously to Cel: If they buy from RMT... they are gimp. I don't really know anyone from kaizen, but ive heard theyre "so great" lol. If so great, why would they need to buy from RMT?

If I was a regular on Rawr and found out we decided to buy stones... I'd be embarrassed.

I'd be embarassed too considering Rawrs only focus is sky. There's more to the game then sky. Kaizen uses funds from other things they do INGAME to pay for the stones (paraphrased from Alm's post earlier).

 

[Bajaratt]

yes because you know all this? please...i know for a FACT cel posted this because he was tired of RMT at sky and because he was tired of gimp LS's (apparently kaizen) buying stones from RMT and contributing to the cheating sellers. Cel was not taking a stab at kaizen. i know cel and i go w/ rawr LS occasiionally. Read his post before you say he made this thread to deliberately take stabs at people... no.. he wants people to stop doing this.. again, his opinion.. not a "dumbass" thing to do. geez how old are we guys.

I'm talking to YOU Kaizen and Boondocksaints. Yes, I'm calling you out.

I've heard from current and former members of your LSes that you have paid gil to RMT because apparenty you're too damned lazy to camp for claim yourselves.

I'm sick and tired of pretending it doesn't happen. Is my LS seriously the last sky shell that does not buy autumnstones?

You people are only perpetuating the problem. If you stop giving them gil RMT WILL STOP CAMPING ULLI because it'll be a waste of their time.


You people make me sick.

BIG, HUGE, MASSIVELY LARGE EDIT: Fury did not belong on this list at all. I was mistaken, and have apologized to the LS leaders that I could find online.

Funny, the underlined parts, along with calling them fucktards in the title of the thread(although he censored it like a wimp) sounds an awful lot like taking a stab at both kaizen and BDS. He's your friend and you have to defend him, but seriously this thread was just a way for people to bandwagon flame linkshells who wouldn't do it by themselves.

Yes, everyone wants RMT out of sky, but if they didn't sell the stones they'd still camp the NM's and either keep or sell the drops to people. This thread is pointless in that all that was accomplished is whining about the situation; not even trying to do anything to fix it. It's not like anything is going to happen just because someone makes a flame about it.

 

[jamal]

Funny, the underlined parts, along with calling them fucktards in the title of the thread(although he censored it like a wimp) sounds an awful lot like taking a stab at both kaizen and BDS. He's your friend and you have to defend him, but seriously this thread was just a way for people to bandwagon flame linkshells who wouldn't do it by themselves.

Yes, everyone wants RMT out of sky, but if they didn't sell the stones they'd still camp the NM's and either keep or sell the drops to people. This thread is pointless in that all that was accomplished is whining about the situation; not even trying to do anything to fix it. It's not like anything is going to happen just because someone makes a flame about it.

qft baj

 

[Raesvelg]

And here is my point, first we aren't buying from mules named sdjbsdfsd as many of you like to think. Secondly buying Ulli stones is not morally wrong, buying Ulli stones from RMT is considered morally wrong. You left out quite a big part in that sentence. And trying to compare the morality of buying Ulli stones from unknown Bazaars to botting and flee hacking is quite hilarious. You know what is also morally wrong? MPKing.

Not all RMT are simply random strings of letters, they've wised up and tend to pick slightly more normal names on a fairly regular basis these days.

Probably because we tend to MPK people whose names are random strings of letters.

Unless you know the person and/or can read Japanese, you really have no idea who you're buying your stones from when it comes to mules.

On the subject of MPKing, I'm not really sure what you're implying... I've never MPK'd anyone in my game career aside from RMT and Vang. Well, maybe Necrosis and Hmkiroko too, I do like to hear the Taru death squeak.

Edit: To expand upon/counter the AH/Kotes argument as well as my own earlier point in this post, you actually can't prove where those JP got their stones from either. For all you know, they bought them from RMT for 2-3 mil, marked them up to 5, and sold them for a profit.

 

[Master Honcho]

Funny, the underlined parts, along with calling them fucktards in the title of the thread(although he censored it like a wimp) sounds an awful lot like taking a stab at both kaizen and BDS. He's your friend and you have to defend him, but seriously this thread was just a way for people to bandwagon flame linkshells who wouldn't do it by themselves.

Yes, everyone wants RMT out of sky, but if they didn't sell the stones they'd still camp the NM's and either keep or sell the drops to people. This thread is pointless in that all that was accomplished is whining about the situation; not even trying to do anything to fix it. It's not like anything is going to happen just because someone makes a flame about it.

>.> lol ok. i agree that cel shouldve handled it better. i know hes been really pissed about all this jazz. but i bet if he could take back the name calling, he would because he really is a good person. And again. He is calling people out for buying stones. Its different than taking a stab in my point of view. Also, he probably made this thread to yes, get people to stop doing this lol hence make a difference. xD hence the name "stop buying... yadayada."

 

[Zyndara]

Because this bottleneck around Uli exists. Previously, there were less LS's up in sky, so an 8 hour Uli was an inconvienience, not the norm. And due to less Ls's, less people actualy trying for it. When i started sky with RevESP, we could just send 6 people to Uli and kill PH's. Once sky got too crowded, you usualy had to send a larger group up to watch for the pop while others killed. Now with the addition of Gilsellers that are there 97% of the time, the amout of "free" Ulli's is down to zero.

99.99% of stones you see for sale, will be GS mules. To believe anything else is willfull ignorance.

Just quoting this for truth value. The fact is, so many of you are bitching about how Ulli takes too long, hours and hours of camping, better things to do, blah blah blah. Then you're turning around and trying to make people actually believe that the majority of these bought stones are coming from legitimate sources who just happened to be exping in Ulli camp, stayed long enough to earn claim then just sold the stone. Riiiiiight. Where I come from, that's called talking out of both sides of your mouth.

To say buying from ah is the same as purchasing these stones from bazaars is the weakest argument I've ever heard. The ah serves the whole player base and everyone sells their goods there, farmed, crafted, etc, as it is the most widely used marketing method in the game. You have a hell of a lot higher "chance" of having an RMT Autumnstone then you have of purchasing RMT ah goods because almost all Autumnstones in bazaars are the sales of gillsellers.

The fact is, I don't care what linkshell does it. The argument has been made and can't be refuted: All of you buying these Autumnstones saying "it saves time, we have better things to do" - to you I say, fine, but then follow suit and stfu about a random player who buys gil to progress in game. They are taking shortcuts just like you, and if you're doing this, you have no room to talk whatsoever.

I have no ill will about anyone playing their game how they want. It's your money, it's your business how you spend your time. What I have a problem with is hypocrasy. Don't act holier than thou then turn around and be guilty of the same type of garbage you're busy criticizing others for.

 

[Rappa]

I have a crazy solution to this problem. How about S-E finally fixes the goddamn game to where the same hacks that RMT and non-RMT alike have been using for over 3 years DON'T WORK ANYMORE? It seems like the majority of the hate in this topic is because the RMT cheat, not because they are RMT. So I ask you this, if S-E finally made these hacks no longer work, would this topic even exist?

 

[Sirelrohir]

maybe you wouldn't make shit up, i do, however, think you're just about the dumbest motherfucker on these forums, somewhere around blazn's level. it's pretty damned obvious by your sad-ass attempts of logic and trying to incriminate us that you've got the equivalent brainpower of a cockroach. i think it's just more the probability that you helped someone whose name started with a K. or maybe it had a K in it. let's put a Z and a T there for good measure, even though none of those are in my name.

the thought that i would willingly take help from anyone fucking involved in the joke of a linkshell called OH is beyond laughable, but i still laughed anyway.

and sorry, but just cause i don't post about every single accomplishment i've had in this game all over goodtimes, just like you and your former linkshells and your idiot cunts, doesn't mean i haven't accomplished things. if i went and made good times posts like you fucking tards always did i'd be down at your level, and i just couldn't have that. yeah, i was one of the first people to gain access to sea with my own ls's help and long before you did, i'd venture. however, unlike you and your cronies, i never gave a damn about posting that shit all over the forums trying to impress the qcdn populace. maybe you and your cunts should really try to refrain from opening your mouths, at least we'd only have to see you look like retards, and not hear it.


anyway back on topic:

we've been saying it like this "siyrol-orz-whors-eeyore."

good enough, i've decided.

OMG.. he got me... he, uh... cant pronounce my name... um yeah.

namecalling to discredit? seems like there are plenty of people out there that have the same view as myself. Its funny how people dont read, and pull things out of thin air.

1) i have never been in OH or anteres. Do u understand? i honestly dont think i could dumb it down for you any more. In fact, at the time we were doing sea, not one person was in OH. Cyro and sesho was in thousand swords. I was in a shell called hyper notorious. Areia ran w/ jp. Gilga and zebix were in a completly different shell, who's name i forget.

2) I was in sea a long long time ago. The only other group that was their ahead of us was villarums group. So you would venture wrong. We did help you get into the palace.

3) Try labeling me as blazn all you would like. I think most people would disagree with that assessment, even people in your own ls (of course they might be pissed and want to fling insults). I know where i stand in regards to intelligence; you calling me retarded wont change that.

4) Almaut incriminated you. He stated that your ls buys uli stones. People that actually go to sky have a understanding of the uli stone distribution. This is because they have a vested interest in RMT activity there. You on the other hand, just want to take the easy way out of sky. Which is fine if you want to be lazy.

heres an example: lets say 14 stones drop in a week. lets say legit ls get maybe 4 of those stones. A random party gets 1 (im being generous here). RMT get 9. There is a 90% chance you are buying from rmt.

In all actuallity, what it really boild down to up there is legit ls vs. rmt. The occasional party that gets a stone is an anomoly. The person that wins the lot from that party is, like i said before, most likely keep it for his own ls, or sell it to a friends ls.

by the way its Sir Elrohir. hooked on phonix worked for me, but apparantly it doesnt work for everyone. ~.O

 

[Zalbag]

I think the issue here is hypocrasy. Everyone seems to be saying that they don't mind people buying from rmt as long as you don't be a hypocrate in the process.

 

[Sirelrohir]

It was a dumbass thing to do. Like you said someone "told" him. Was it a fact or a rumor? He posted because it was a stab at Kaizen. That or he dislikes the shell so he figured it was a good chance to flame them.

too funny. Coke came out of my nose i was laughing so hard.

 

[Raesvelg]

I think the issue here is hypocrasy. Everyone seems to be saying that they don't mind people buying from rmt as long as you don't be a hypocrate in the process.

Actually, I mind people buying Ulli stones because it encourages RMT to camp the fucker, and that makes my time there even less enjoyable than it already is.

The hypocrisy thing is Fire's point.

I'll just continue to hope that SE quietly puts spyware in the system and bans accounts they find cheating in one massive day of blood and fire. It would amuse me to see how many people turn up missing for the 72 or so hours after that blessed event.

 

[Bajaratt]

Just quoting this for truth value. The fact is, so many of you are bitching about how Ulli takes too long, hours and hours of camping, better things to do, blah blah blah. Then you're turning around and trying to make people actually believe that the majority of these bought stones are coming from legitimate sources who just happened to be exping in Ulli camp, stayed long enough to earn claim then just sold the stone. Riiiiiight. Where I come from, that's called talking out of both sides of your mouth.

To say buying from ah is the same as purchasing these stones from bazaars is the weakest argument I've ever heard. The ah serves the whole player base and everyone sells their goods there, farmed, crafted, etc, as it is the most widely used marketing method in the game. You have a hell of a lot higher "chance" of having an RMT Autumnstone then you have of purchasing RMT ah goods because almost all Autumnstones in bazaars are the sales of gillsellers.

The fact is, I don't care what linkshell does it. The argument has been made and can't be refuted: All of you buying these Autumnstones saying "it saves time, we have better things to do" - to you I say, fine, but then follow suit and stfu about a random player who buys gil to progress in game. They are taking shortcuts just like you, and if you're doing this, you have no room to talk whatsoever.

I have no ill will about anyone playing their game how they want. It's your money, it's your business how you spend your time. What I have a problem with is hypocrasy. Don't act holier than thou then turn around and be guilty of the same type of garbage you're busy criticizing others for.

Buying an autumn stone is closer to buying anything off the AH than buying gil; because it's the exact same process done for the exact same reason. You don't have the time to camp it, so you do something else, get the money and just buy it; you're trading time for time, effort for effort. You spend your time farming or crafting rather than camping, and no one cares that you happen to buy the item from RMT off the AH; no one says that you "didn't earn" that item.

Equating it to buying gil is flawed in that you're not actually working for anything in-game. You're just magically getting gil, at the expense of your real money, so you in effect haven't earned anything in-game; that and the fact that they often fuck up prices is why people hate gil buyers. I'd be much more understanding of someone who bought a million or two gil for decent gear because they don't have enough time to farm than all of the gil buyers who do it for all-HQ gear and to hit level 100 crafts in 5 days. As far as I am aware, there aren't any gil buyers like that though, they all buy tons of gil and pimp themselves out(and have zero skill to match) or fuck up the prices on crafting items; so of course no one likes them.

The only real problem with RMT camping NM's is the fact that they cheat like there's no tomorrow. If they didn't cheat then no one would give a shit what they did with the item or the gil they make.

 

[Khajit]

SO much crap has been posted i cant find the post my blazeofury and baja that im responding to atm.

Anyways. Ok so you say that a person in an exp paty can somehow claim ulli and sell the stone cause they feel like it?

OK so lets look at the odds against that.
This is from my experience in sky from when i first went in this summer so i only know about recent stuff. My first ls brokeup and i decided to take a break fom sky for a monthish maybe more.

Lets think of the likleyhood of being able to get an exp party to make it to ulli.
You gotta somehow convince them to not go to a TAU zone in which you can wimply warp over and get more exp per hour than at the ulli camp. You will also waste at least half an hour going into sky just to get the exp when you could have gotten at least 5k+ in TAU. Then you have to outclaim the competition(aka botting gilsellers and real players) to ulli once it pops. Oh wait you arent NM camping are you? You're in there for Goddamned EXP. You will spend most of the time in that room fighting and if the puller takes more than 30 seconds to pull to search for ulli you need to fire him and 30 seconds is being lenient. So now you have a 30 second window to claim a NM which can pop anytime during your fights right or after you pull and beat people that are dedicated to beating you and everyone else to the claim all with only one puller vs an entire ls minimum.
Recently there has been almost no CC vs RMT in the room so atm you only have to worry about outclaiming botters with only a fraction of your time CCing them dedicated to claiming.
Then one more thing. The people in the exp party did NOT come over to make YOU money. People are not going to follow you to the ulli room to make you 10 mil. thats another strike against people even bothering to kill ulli if the money isnt split.
Now after all that theres another thing. Gems and seals aren't transferable via delivery box. I'll take a wild guess and assume that the stone isnt either. so in order to get the stone into mule you have to get someone else to trade to you then trade it back to the mule. Sounds like more trouble than simply selling it on your main character to me. For an RMT that would be an advantage selling it on mule because if the farming character is banned then the stone is still there to sell and vice versa.
Stuff is tranfered to mule for overnight afk sales for convenience so with selling the stone on mule being so inconvenient it would make no sense to sell it on mule for a non RMT player and then the rmt lv 1 character parades around jueno shouting about stones for sale. What? You cant shout on your main character that just got the stone for a sale? this is without ignoring the fact that it can be more profitable to USE the stone. even if you are a mage that gets nothing from byakko. I doubt a ls would deny a request for a the ability to lot on a specifit item you wanted if you cme out of the blue with a byakko pop. I'm sure a shining cloth if youre whm or osode if you're brd would be on your wishlist. Byakko=kirin fight. the other 3 gods are easy to get since the pop item NM tend to be ignored almost completely during the ulli window.
What does this add up to? The chance of a person randomly claiming ulli in an exp party and getting stone to sell if they decided to exp party at ulli is slim at the very best. then factor in ALL the ulli claims RMT gets while you werent ccing in that exp party vs that one lucky chance and how unlikley those "lv 1 mules" youre buying from were transfered to the mule by a person who could easily just sell it on the main character and you would have to be one of the most optomistic people on the planet to honestly beleive that there wasn't a giant overwhelming chance said stones being sold werent rmt stones?

Until the day after celvantes posted the ulli room had been exclusively populated by RMT with no CC except rawr before and during rawr hours outside of a random ls popping in once in a while for at least a month.(read almost never as in maybe once a week on a busy week). If you see linkshells not camping ulli during thier regular hours that they go into sky or at all in sky camping NM yet somehow still fighting byakko or kirin what conclusion are you going to draw? Buying stones is the logical conclusion and the overwhelming majority of stones are sold by RMT.
Japanese camping stones to sell for gil? ok so JP fighting RMT for claim in a group when they dont need said items from byakko or kirin that decide to sell a stone cheaper than the items that can drop not counting ABJ and god gear for gil transactions which means a bigger profit from joining together for a random fight and selling to the stupid NA. Yeah you found some retarded JP.
The instances used to claim that its probably not RMT are exceptional cases that are unlikley to happen. It's saying 1+1=10 and holding out for the day all math is taught in binary.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that Celvantes and others had been told by members of kaizen that they buy stones. Who sells the majority(since we cant say 99%) of ull stones? Ill let you figure that out. Just pionting out why what he was saying was a logical conclusion.

 

[Trelution]

There are ways to go about changing people's mind. Usually depends on how much respect you treat the person you're arguing with to if they're going to listen to what you're saying or simply search through your post for a way to counter your argument.

Ohhh my first Firestreak reply. I feel like an offical member of QCDN now This is very true if we are talking about reasoning individuals. But we all know as soon as someone gets on a message board they are god of all knowledge and cannot be disproven. It usally always boils down to "You suck!" "No YOU suck!!1!" until people get bored, and move on to the new "You suck" thread. And hey I'm not complaining makes for some good reads most times

I am guessing that several linkshells that don't buy stones have the means to be able to. Especially at the prices Artmen claims you get them at. If you want to talk about efficient time use as reasoning that's fine. All I'm saying is don't rant at other people, ever, who are involved with RMT if they're simply trying to use their time more efficiently cause they see it as a business.

Exactly my point. If Shells had the means to buy all the ullis they wanted/needed comfortably, you can't tell me they wouldn't. And I don't think I have ever ranted about other people on here for... much of anything actually, much less if they are associated with RMT. What you do with your playtime is your own business. No skin off my nose.

I don't see it as the same as buying gil, from the most important standpoint in that you're not breaking the Terms of Service at any time. It's not against the rules to buy from RMT or even camp with RMT, merely to be a RMT. However it is an association, so as long as we can agree that association doesn't transfer guilt then we agree you're not actually guilty. However that's not the stand your people have been taking.

I have never implied that is was the "Moral high road" just simply the best return for time invested. There are still a lot of things I want to do in this game before I retire from this mad world, and spending 10+ hours at Ulli isn't one of them.

People have only said level 1 mules selling stones are almost all RMT. People have been arguing there are level 1 mules they have that aren't RMT. Well, they aren't selling stones. People have argued they've seen Japanese selling stones... well... they aren't level 1... You're building a straw man argument out of what's being said, making the claim more ridiculous so you can more easily refute it. That's alright though, it's your standards and it's up to YOU what you want to do. My own standards say, buy from whoever sells cheapest. Those are my standards.

That was more of an outrageous claim for all the people who seem to know who owns all those mules out there. Until you can prove who owns what mules, I dont see how anyone can say with any certainty who sells what. And for another matter who should care.

I'd argue that it's silly how much we all PLAY an online game in the first place. I beat mself up over it all the time, but yeah... when you're the one on the hot seat it seems a lot sillier than when you're the one on the attack.

I will agree with you 100% on that first statement heh; however, Its silly all the time. Don't care what its about, arguing this much over a game is downright silly. I Always have said that, just don't post it 7543 times a day as you can tell by my massive post count heh.

 

[Zion]

Buying an autumn stone is closer to buying anything off the AH than buying gil; because it's the exact same process done for the exact same reason.

Bitch please, I mean are you acting or you playing stupid... Seriously. Again. Would you join to a party and level up with name as "hasgdkjas" "abdchga" or would you join party with people with decent names? Same as mules. Don't play stupid. You know that a RMT mule. :wacko:

 

[Zalbag]

heres an example: lets say 14 stones drop in a week. lets say legit ls get maybe 4 of those stones. A random party gets 1 (im being generous here). RMT get 9. There is a 90% chance you are buying from rmt.

Lets assume this equation is right. So rmt get 9 stones a week. 4 weeks a month 12 months a year. Lets say rmt have been trying for ulli for 1 year. 4 weeks at 9 stones a week is about 36 stones a month. 36 stones a month would be about 432 stones a year? We've bought UNDER 10 this last year. We got 3 from a disbanding jp ls if i recall correctly and one from someone just after our tiamat fight.

That leaves about 4-5 unaccounted stones from different bazaars. Lets just say for the sack of arguement we bought those from rmt. Thats 5/432. Where are the other 427? Lets find out and bring them into this.

 

[Sirelrohir]

Funny, the underlined parts, along with calling them fucktards in the title of the thread(although he censored it like a wimp) sounds an awful lot like taking a stab at both kaizen and BDS. He's your friend and you have to defend him, but seriously this thread was just a way for people to bandwagon flame linkshells who wouldn't do it by themselves.

Yes, everyone wants RMT out of sky, but if they didn't sell the stones they'd still camp the NM's and either keep or sell the drops to people. This thread is pointless in that all that was accomplished is whining about the situation; not even trying to do anything to fix it. It's not like anything is going to happen just because someone makes a flame about it.

Well, this thread has become about hypocrasy imo. You have all these people, some from kaizen, some who used to be in kaizen get on here and attemp to flame people based on nothing. Then when their beloved shell gets busted buying uli stones (which the majority of people believe to be from rmt, who, everyone agrees hack to get these stones), the things they called out on other people is somehow ok.

 

[Crosis]

You read what you want to read Sire and make up shit in between. I don't see any majority believing we buy from RMT. I see you and Firestreak, some people from other LS's who bot, flee hack or MPK others and thats about it.

 

[Sneakypants]

So who is the seller of the stones?