Tier IV ZNM Discussion Thread

[Desan]

Didn't see a thread on these guys so I thought I would make it. I haven't had the pleasure if fighting these babies yet like some of you have. I was just wandering if how the strategies differ from their ToAU King counterparts. I was also wandering how they differed from them other than them being able to 2hr. Like are they just weaker versions of the ToAU Kings w/ just 2hrs pretty much?

 

[Auron X]

Didn't see a thread on these guys so I thought I would make it. I haven't had the pleasure if fighting these babies yet like some of you have. I was just wandering if how the strategies differ from their ToAU King counterparts. I was also wandering how they differed from them other than them being able to 2hr. Like are they just weaker versions of the ToAU Kings w/ just 2hrs pretty much?

Sarameya is a lot stronger then Cerberus due to his ability to Chainspell GoH which is very annoying...he also gains 1%/tick when he has hoplon up and from what I saw his normal GoHs can't be stunned.

 

[Sanoske]

You can Stun his GoH, however he builds resistance almost immediately. Therefore Stun should not be counted on for anything, really. If it lands and stops a GoH, that's great... don't count on it.

 

[Rappa]

There was way more than enough time to get out of the way of GoH but your tanks will have to eat it. Fire resist ftw.

 

[Falsey]

There was way more than enough time to get out of the way of GoH but your tanks will have to eat it. Fire resist ftw.

Preach the truth brotha.

 

[Ewok]

You can Stun his GoH, however he builds resistance almost immediately. Therefore Stun should not be counted on for anything, really. If it lands and stops a GoH, that's great... don't count on it.

Anyone tried equipping thunder staff + dark magic skill gear on the stunners? Idk if this is commonplace, I normally don't use when I'm stunning mobs. Maybe have blu/thf or dnc/thf try stunning it, like with Kirin.

 

[Tristam Green]

Anyone tried equipping thunder staff + dark magic skill gear on the stunners? Idk if this is commonplace, I normally don't use when I'm stunning mobs.

lol, I've been building a Dark Magic Skill+ set on my Dark Knight for just such a thing. I'm still missing a couple pieces yet (Abyss Flanchard and Dark Torque are the main pieces), so I've yet to use it fully, but I'd be willing to give it a go sometime to see if it worked a little more effectively :thumbsup:

 

[jamal]

Anyone tried equipping thunder staff + dark magic skill gear on the stunners? Idk if this is commonplace, I normally don't use when I'm stunning mobs. Maybe have blu/thf or dnc/thf try stunning it, like with Kirin.

When stun is resisted, it's not worth counting on. As Sano has said, it builds a resistance, but what hasn't been said is there an unstunnable pattern as well.

The biggest problem with Sara is that hate is reset every 3-5 minutes when he goes into the pattern:

Howl (Hate reset)
Ululation (Para AOE Huge Range)
Firaga III (or Gates of Hades <25%)
Hoplon
Howl (Hate reset)

As I mentioned, he is completely immune to stun here, and also resets hate on the entire alliance. This makes ensuring that very little damage is done by Gates or Firaga III EXTREMELY important, so that tanks can easily recover hate without too much mob movement. This is also why I'd recommend WHM+BRD in any melee party as well for the additional fire resist. Sara is all about surviving enough to do damage, properly geared, it can't do much damage to you whatsoever.

As for the other mobs, Tinnin is slightly more difficult than it's Hydra counterpart, as Crit's are not the key to winning. It gains an incredible regen whenever it loses a head, so it's almost easier to not kill the heads. Tyger (Khim) is manageable only because of the area you fight in having a cliff to avoid the weaponskills it uses, much like the normal fight.

 

[Desan]

Whats the drop rate like on the PW pop items?

 

[Shady]

Anyone fought the hydra Tinnin? If so can you give me advice as to how I should set my alliance up (job-wise), and maybe some do's/don'ts in the battle? Any kiting involved, does grav, bind or stun land? How many healing jobs would I need to bring, really just share with your experiences, getting a T4 pop is hard and I really want to be as prepared for this fight as I can if I'm going to lead my shell next week. Thanks!

 

[jamal]

Tinnin uses draw-in + immediate WS, you're not going to want to kite. If you have a full alliance, 2x's PLD/NIN with SC + MB dmg works well (Tinnin isn't highly resistant to magic dmg like Hydra).

Otherwise he can be DD tanked (used MNK + WAR combo once with Subtle Blow + Crit Rolls with THF in tank party), however if one DD is decidedly stronger than the other and holds the majority of hate, you can run into trouble.

PW Items seem to be 20-25% with TH4, we've gotten 2 sara's out of 8 kills, 1/6 on Tinnin, 1/3 (maybe more kills, can't remember off the top of my head).

 

[LadyKiKi]

Blah I typed up a long version and accidently hit back, lost it all.

I'll retype it, but not as detailed:

Tank Party: PLD/NINx2, BRD, WHM WHM RDM
Melees: 2 SAMs are sufficient, or DD subbing SAM
Mages: 3-4 BLMs, RDM (MP wasn't a big issue)

When you pop it, it will be at 50% HP with one head, wait 5 odd minutes for it to Regen to 100% (and 3 heads) before attempting to hurt it.

Tinnin's pattern of attacks:

Melee -> Polar/Pyric Bulwark [Gains Magical/Physical Shield respectively] -> Immediately performs an AoE Curse+Poison move (tanks need to be cursna'd and poisona'd immediately here) -> momentarily "stunned" -> melee

It cannot be kited. It draws in. Take care to NOT trigger draw in, each time it does it will perform a special move outside of the pattern above which will cause unexpected damage/curing. Also, if someone does get hate and Tinnin turns, respostion immediately or it'll use a Spike Flail type move called "Serpentine Tail" which is a single target move doing 2000+ damage. Hate needs to be managed good. Tanks should Cure IV themselves after they are uncursed for hate.

If you trigger draw in it will either use: Barofield, Trembling or Serpentine Tail (depending on what happens).

Tinnin can be Slow2 and Elegy'd, making tanking quite simple. Best to have a primary tank tanking with the 2nd on curing duty incase the first tank goes down. But if you don't trigger draw in much one tank is quite sufficient. Backup is always nice.

Otherwise, 2 DDs should try to Trick Attack onto the tanks and perform a skillchain for the BLMs to burst off from as the main source of damage. If all goes well the battle should only take around 1 hour.

 

[jamal]

Blah I typed up a long version and accidently hit back, lost it all.

I'll retype it, but not as detailed:

Tank Party: PLD/NINx2, BRD, WHM WHM RDM
Melees: 2 SAMs are sufficient, or DD subbing SAM
Mages: 3-4 BLMs, RDM (MP wasn't a big issue)

When you pop it, it will be at 50% HP with one head, wait 5 odd minutes for it to Regen to 100% (and 3 heads) before attempting to hurt it.

Tinnin's pattern of attacks:

Melee -> Polar/Pyric Bulwark [Gains Magical/Physical Shield respectively] -> Immediately performs an AoE Curse+Poison move (tanks need to be cursna'd and poisona'd immediately here) -> momentarily "stunned" -> melee

It cannot be kited. It draws in. Take care to NOT trigger draw in, each time it does it will perform a special move outside of the pattern above which will cause unexpected damage/curing. Also, if someone does get hate and Tinnin turns, respostion immediately or it'll use a Spike Flail type move called "Serpentine Tail" which is a single target move doing 2000+ damage. Hate needs to be managed good. Tanks should Cure IV themselves after they are uncursed for hate.

If you trigger draw in it will either use: Barofield, Trembling or Serpentine Tail (depending on what happens).

Tinnin can be Slow2 and Elegy'd, making tanking quite simple. Best to have a primary tank tanking with the 2nd on curing duty incase the first tank goes down. But if you don't trigger draw in much one tank is quite sufficient. Backup is always nice.

Otherwise, 2 DDs should try to Trick Attack onto the tanks and perform a skillchain for the BLMs to burst off from as the main source of damage. If all goes well the battle should only take around 1 hour.

Yea, you can drastically reduce the battle time with multiple sam/thf and/or thf/sam...although too many Nukes will obviously start building some hate for the blms:

 

[Falsey]

I took that damage like a pro!

 

[LadyKiKi]

That happened to me too, but I didn't screenshot it. Instead I sat back and pleasuribly (spelling?) watch everyone die! XD

 

[jamal]

Found a weakness on Tinnin:

It's weak to Jamal's >.>

2/3 on second PW pop

 

[Xalioniaf]

Dude... 11 messages... why?

 

[Falsey]

He's ignoring me that's why

 

[Tyrath]

Sarameya is a lot stronger then Cerberus due to his ability to Chainspell GoH which is very annoying...he also gains 1%/tick when he has hoplon up and from what I saw his normal GoHs can't be stunned.

Uh...from what I remember the time I fought Sarameya he was a bit of a joke compared to normal cerb. Sure chainspell GoH is annoying, but his GoH seemed a lot weaker than the normal ones. And his lack of hp I'd say makes him much easier overall.

The only one I feel like might be harder than the original is Tinnin, but then again I've never fought the real Hydra. I just hear he can be killed with 6 D:

 

[Darklion]

Uh...from what I remember the time I fought Sarameya he was a bit of a joke compared to normal cerb. Sure chainspell GoH is annoying, but his GoH seemed a lot weaker than the normal ones. And his lack of hp I'd say makes him much easier overall.

The only one I feel like might be harder than the original is Tinnin, but then again I've never fought the real Hydra. I just hear he can be killed with 6 D:

Cerb is a joke compared to sara, With Sara You can't stun his agas or GoHs. He will build resist to stun real fast so you have to take most of its spells, and GoHs stright. With Cerb all you need is enough stuns and its pretty much won.