Tyrath said:
it's a good source of income and items.
it's a good source of income and items.
CubsWoo said:
not really. i enjoy it up there.
CubsWoo said:
Cubs, i refer you to my Longwinded post on this thread:
http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=14715&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=255
In which i explain what rangers are upset about. You've the wrong idea on this one, and its not your fault really, From a Non-rng point of view i can understand why people are jumping to the "whiny bitches" conclusion. But i hope i explained it reasonably enough for all to understand.
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At least in an endgame point of view, this is my point:
Yes, MNK, RNG, and BLM can do comparable damage to gods. The biggest differences are temperence and changes in strategy.
Pre-patch, for a RNG to be a viable God DD, all they need to do is show up in their normal gear. Oh, they may use a Hellfire +1 or a Shigeto +1 instead of their O.Bow, or whatever, but by and large RNG endgame equipment is the same gear they go party with.
A Monk, on the other hand, has a drastic shift in their role. MNKs who want to deal that damage endgame need to level their WHM to 37, buy millions and millions in +MND gear (I personally built a mannequin just so I could get Mannequin Pumps - just for the +2 MND), have to eat a seperate food (Mushpots instead of the usual meat/sushi.)
And tactic-wise, things are much different. RNG, if I'm not mistaken, stand in the center while the tank kites along the edges and shoot. It seems very fire-and-forget.
Monks need a lot more help. For the most part, they're outside the alliance, boosting and keeping very close track of the # of Boosts and how much time they have left. They need to let the Bard know when to hit them with Etude, the leader when to invite them, and then close into range and fire. And getting 1300-1800 damage at once is very likely going to piss that God off, normally prompting either death or a quick temp log to reset hate. Rangers may not deal the most per shot, but they can keep firing for the hour or so it takes to kill Kirin.
Yes, MNK, RNG, and BLM can do comparable damage to gods. The biggest differences are temperence and changes in strategy.
Pre-patch, for a RNG to be a viable God DD, all they need to do is show up in their normal gear. Oh, they may use a Hellfire +1 or a Shigeto +1 instead of their O.Bow, or whatever, but by and large RNG endgame equipment is the same gear they go party with.
A Monk, on the other hand, has a drastic shift in their role. MNKs who want to deal that damage endgame need to level their WHM to 37, buy millions and millions in +MND gear (I personally built a mannequin just so I could get Mannequin Pumps - just for the +2 MND), have to eat a seperate food (Mushpots instead of the usual meat/sushi.)
And tactic-wise, things are much different. RNG, if I'm not mistaken, stand in the center while the tank kites along the edges and shoot. It seems very fire-and-forget.
Monks need a lot more help. For the most part, they're outside the alliance, boosting and keeping very close track of the # of Boosts and how much time they have left. They need to let the Bard know when to hit them with Etude, the leader when to invite them, and then close into range and fire. And getting 1300-1800 damage at once is very likely going to piss that God off, normally prompting either death or a quick temp log to reset hate. Rangers may not deal the most per shot, but they can keep firing for the hour or so it takes to kill Kirin.
Actually cubs, Kirin is a pain in the ass for rng. Kiting is around the entire outer wall of a large room, and rng has to chase While trying to get off a shot. Add a pld in wyrmal legs, and kirin is moving much faster than the rng. Its not easy. WS's are harder, if you use a ws while kirin is moving theres a very good chance hell be out of range by the time it registers through the lag, resulting in burned tp. Kirin stops only when casting a spell, Quake, Stonega 4, or Stone 5. This is when a rng usually uses barrage or a WS, BUT, only if its Stone 5 or Quake, which can be absorbed by shadows in the event of hate transfer from WS damage. GA 4 is a nono, as a rng in proper range to WS will be too close most times to outrun the spell, resulting in the death of not only him, but all others near him.
Also a key point on kirin, what to do if Tanks are down. Pre-patch, If both tanks went down for whatever reason (maybe suzie ate one and a whm missed an erase on the other), then the rngs would unload and kite for a while. No other job had the immediate means at their disposal to Grab hate Fast, and shadows to help kite while the tanks regrouped or a backup was brought in from outside. A nin could fill this role, but the insurance of hate is not there, if its more than 20 min into the fight and the nin is fresh from the bench.
The reason that most of the discussions are about gods is simple, that that is where Other people will feel the rng nerf the most, where it will effect Non-rngs in a detrimental way. For the rng, the worst part is SOLO, Alone, just you, the mob, and a weapon that needs to be fired from half a screen away to cause damage. Give me a solution to that that can be performed more than once every 5 minutes. There isnt one.
But back to your original point cubs, I am not in fact saying that other jobs are not unfairly innefective on kirin or what have you, i am instead pointing out exactly what you just said, but in different context.
Yes mnks have to change gear to be effective on Kirin or gods, it is a fundamental alteration to the way mnk works pre-endgame. Now a rng needs to adjust the same way, but not just in certain situations. You can still go out and punch say, a Birdie out in the gardens, or do like Imaginous and go MNK style on an elemental out there (solo). But while this change is necessary for you to be effective on gods, it is necessary for rng to be effective on Anything. And heres the part i dont think you're understanding (did you read my linked post?): When you go back to your mog after Kirin, change subs, change gear, and head out to farm/ballista/camp/goof off, you still do the same damage you always did, be it to too weaks or DC's. A rng does not, and cannot, and no amount of gear, no jobabilities they posess, no Skill whatsoever can change the fact that Solo a mob will be in your face no matter what. Shadowbind, 5 minute timer, lasts 0-20 seconds. That doesnt cut it..
If the above stipulation did not exist (ie nerf does not apply to EP or below) there would be some minor grumbling, then life would move on as usual. Its the loss of ability to do many things on their own. Congrats on soloing that Sea Horror cubs. Its something almost everyone tries out when they start to get "large and in charge". I fish on the boat alot, and ive seen many job combos do it, rdm/blm. war/nin, drk/nin, nin/thf.....
Rangers Used to be able to do it too. Now? No chance, trust me when i say that. Used to be a kick ass fight to the death, close call but not enough to be really scared. Cut the dmg you do in half? You're dead.
That is the whole point.
Anyway think about that and what it would mean to you, as a Person.
Also a key point on kirin, what to do if Tanks are down. Pre-patch, If both tanks went down for whatever reason (maybe suzie ate one and a whm missed an erase on the other), then the rngs would unload and kite for a while. No other job had the immediate means at their disposal to Grab hate Fast, and shadows to help kite while the tanks regrouped or a backup was brought in from outside. A nin could fill this role, but the insurance of hate is not there, if its more than 20 min into the fight and the nin is fresh from the bench.
The reason that most of the discussions are about gods is simple, that that is where Other people will feel the rng nerf the most, where it will effect Non-rngs in a detrimental way. For the rng, the worst part is SOLO, Alone, just you, the mob, and a weapon that needs to be fired from half a screen away to cause damage. Give me a solution to that that can be performed more than once every 5 minutes. There isnt one.
But back to your original point cubs, I am not in fact saying that other jobs are not unfairly innefective on kirin or what have you, i am instead pointing out exactly what you just said, but in different context.
Yes mnks have to change gear to be effective on Kirin or gods, it is a fundamental alteration to the way mnk works pre-endgame. Now a rng needs to adjust the same way, but not just in certain situations. You can still go out and punch say, a Birdie out in the gardens, or do like Imaginous and go MNK style on an elemental out there (solo). But while this change is necessary for you to be effective on gods, it is necessary for rng to be effective on Anything. And heres the part i dont think you're understanding (did you read my linked post?): When you go back to your mog after Kirin, change subs, change gear, and head out to farm/ballista/camp/goof off, you still do the same damage you always did, be it to too weaks or DC's. A rng does not, and cannot, and no amount of gear, no jobabilities they posess, no Skill whatsoever can change the fact that Solo a mob will be in your face no matter what. Shadowbind, 5 minute timer, lasts 0-20 seconds. That doesnt cut it..
If the above stipulation did not exist (ie nerf does not apply to EP or below) there would be some minor grumbling, then life would move on as usual. Its the loss of ability to do many things on their own. Congrats on soloing that Sea Horror cubs. Its something almost everyone tries out when they start to get "large and in charge". I fish on the boat alot, and ive seen many job combos do it, rdm/blm. war/nin, drk/nin, nin/thf.....
Rangers Used to be able to do it too. Now? No chance, trust me when i say that. Used to be a kick ass fight to the death, close call but not enough to be really scared. Cut the dmg you do in half? You're dead.
That is the whole point.
Anyway think about that and what it would mean to you, as a Person.
Taurothar said:
I only read to page 4, but as a pld/16thf I farm like a beast with very little downtime and with the right gear (espadon, amemit mantle, swordbelt, and some +accuracy gear.) and with a hercules' ring, you literally have no downtime.
kthxbye.
I got an idea. Why doesnt someone start a thread on the ranger nerf!!! :roll:
Damn if your a rng and you got nerfed just quit. Dont ever play another job dont do anything just quit. How long till we move on?
Damn if your a rng and you got nerfed just quit. Dont ever play another job dont do anything just quit. How long till we move on?
/em looks around. Flameboard? check. Logged in? check. Idiot with nothing useful to say? check. Therefore:
Who the fuck are you? Get out of my conversation, go over there (/points at seppeku) and choke on a dick, you rat-raping cockdumpster.
Ahh, felt good, spent too much time in general discussion lately.
oh and suck my dogs balls too. Dont forget the wasabi sauce.
Who the fuck are you? Get out of my conversation, go over there (/points at seppeku) and choke on a dick, you rat-raping cockdumpster.
Ahh, felt good, spent too much time in general discussion lately.
oh and suck my dogs balls too. Dont forget the wasabi sauce.
Sorry, but some people are tired of listening to you piss and moan like the cunt you are.
Grieve said:
awwww did SE make you cry too?
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[/quote]Simply perpetuating the problem with the creation of another thread. Everyone should be quite upset as they are right in saying this hurts all of us. This is a team based game and gimping one affects us all. Just wait and see how the next few god and hnm fights go without rngs dmg. Blms just went from worth their weight in gold to platnum.
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hmm im bored FUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKrnggotgimpedomfg!!!212FUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCK/cryFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKdamnrnggimpFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCK
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Eulore said:
What do you farm that's so amazing? At 60 I can't solo goobbues anywhere near as effective as a 60 THF, drop rate aside, he still kills twice if not three times the speed of me. Also, buying all that expensive gear for farming alone, that's just stupid when a PLD can easily do BCNM, ENM, or even craft with the time you'd spend farming 20k/hour.
kthnxbye.
Taurothar said:
Sanctuary of Zi'tah. Expensive gear? You mean a 4k amemit mantle, a 5k espadon, and a 6k sword belt? The venerer ring is for my other jobs, and so is my 8k spike necklace. Don't have a herc ring, but it helps in exp parties too, not just farming. I can farm a stack of cuttings in about 3 hours so that's like 30k+/hour, depending on how many other farmers. Also I hate doing BCNM, ENM, and crafting >_>
Maybe being level 70 changes things, but I kill faster than just about all jobs. Elvaan = high str, Paladin = high str, Swift blade = owns things, Magic = almost no downtime, Dark staff = even less downtime... pld make excellent farmers.
30K an hour :shock: are you kidding? I hope thats not good for you. I average about 20k 15 min. some times 100k in 30 depending on the drop rate.