What happened to musical icons?

Taurothar said:
He united country fans with rock and roll with popular music. Same story really with the Beetles. Bands like Metallica and Tool, while talented in their own right, aren't able to boast that they brought together fans of several genres.
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QFT. As much as I fucking love Tool, they just aren't as insanely big as Jackson or Elvis or the Beatles were... Metallica's great, and probably the biggest metal band we'll live to see, but even they have a weak following compared to some of those others.

I think Zeppelin should be considered an icon, they influenced so much that came after them.


Ryuoho said:
WTH is wrong with Eminem?
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I -HATE- rap.
 
Taurothar said:
You guys are beginning to see my issue with this topic, there's just nobody that can really fill, say, Elvis' shoes for the current generation.

He united country fans with rock and roll with popular music. Same story really with the Beetles. Bands like Metallica and Tool, while talented in their own right, aren't able to boast that they brought together fans of several genres.

I'm beginning to fear for the future of music. What are we gonna have 30-40 years from now when we want to listen to music from our time? I doubt we'll be in our 60s and still listening to metal or w/e. It must be insanely hard to grow into a unique sound now with everything that has happened already in the music world. There's only so much that can be done with an instrument.

Look at pop culture related to music, piano grew from classical to ragtime, guitar grew from classical to rock and roll, so what's next? What instrument can fill the shoes of the likes of the piano and the guitar to give music a new direction?
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None can. Most of this new groups have at some point or another used their predecesor's music. And guess what? Most of the time it turns out to be their biggest hit! I liked their renditions, but I always will wonder what would've been of them if they never usd that material.

Limp Bizkit - Faith (originaly from George Michael - hit that put them in the spotlight)
Mariliyn Manson - Sweet Dreams (originaly from Eurythmics - same)
Lacuna Coil - Enjoy the Silence (originaly from Depeche Mode, greatest group ever)
Orgy - Blue Monday (originaly from New Order - breakout hit, put them in the spotlight)

The list goes on, but this are the ones I remember atm.
 
Yes Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, all are icons in my mind, but we're talking about new bands here.

What I don't understand here is you guys saying a group needs to combine two types of music to be an icon. Know what I have to say to that? FUCK that. I don't wanna hear fucking country mixed with my metal, or any other genre for that matter (although S&M from Metallica was a badass album). The reason groups live The Beatles and Elvis were so huge was because that's all there fucking was. There were two types of music back then: music that adults listened to, and music kids listened to. There were no genre's like metal or rap, or all the countless subgenres of rock. If you were a kid wanting to listen to something cool you had all of one or two choices. That's why these people were "icons", because everyone listened to them because that's all there was to listen to.

If you wanna talk about icons today you have to pick a genre to talk about. There are no more universal icons because people like different things. To the pop world...idk, Britney Spears or n'sync or w/e are the latest icons. To the country world it's...idk, whoever is the latest in country. To the rap world...idk, 50 Cent? Eminem? ICP is really big around here. To the metal world it's not Metallica, I'll tell ya that right now. Metallica had their day back in the 80's, 99/100 metal fans today don't like Metallica anymore. Anyways, icons in metal today are System of a Down, Tool, Slipknot and Mudvayne are pretty big, Mushroomhead, Disturbed, Godsmack, Rob Zombie, plus dozens more I could name. In "alternative", there's bands like Sublime or Orgy.

I could go into a few other genre's but I think you guys get the point.
 
Negorissimo said:
You, "new generation" all have your 4 icons as you chose it in the 90's!

Britney, Christina, Nsync and BSB...
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You forgot the Spice Girls! They didn't have a movie called Spice World for nothing!
 
The biggest problem with this is you're comparing icons of today to other's that started up to 50 years ago. I think you're best bet's for icons are going to be Metallica of the 80's and early 90's(that stuff is still sick to listen too today and Nirvanna(same reasons as mentioned before). I'm only going with rock bands because admitedly that is the genre of music I love the most. Can't say for other genres.

Fact is though we arn't going to know 'till much farthur down the road. I doubt anyone could forsee Elvis, The Beetles, or The Rolling Stones music withstanding the test of time like they have.
 
Bjork.


'Nuff said.
 
I was going to suggest Pearl Jam, but then realized that they don't fit #2. They have a pretty big following iirc and their music is pretty diverse (w/i their genre of music)ie. Jeremy doesn't sound like Given to Fly, Do the Evolution doest sound like Black.

Now adays, music is too classified to give it any 1 icon. You have to break it down or else everyone will put in people who "you" dont think is an Icon and vice versa. People today usually dont try to reinvent themselves/cross genre because record labels wont let them. Most labels don't want their artists rocking the boat and maybe make an album that doesn't sell. IMO the only reason that Timberlake did the different genre's that he did was because between the steps he took, it wasn't too much of a stretch. N'Sync's style was poppy enough, and had enough range where you could BS your way to R&B and from R&B to the "rap" or w/e he sings now isnt much of a stretch where a lable would wet their pants.

What kinda makes me laugh is how people keep praising Elvis. Now dont get me wrong, he was a great guitarist/singer but lets be honest here, he STOLE blues. I mean S T O L E the blues. It was on a documentary that his producer or the head of the label at the time said "If we could only get a white boy with the 'negro sound' we'd be millionaires" /enter Elvis. Hell, "Hound dog" was originally written/sung by a middle aged black woman.
 
I agree with Rorschach. The record industry holds quite a bit of sway over artists. The formula for producing a modern superstar seems to have evolved into a science going by what i hear on the radio. I mean generally speaking, most of the vocal timbres, chord progressions and, beats I've heard in the last 10 years sound awfuly similar. Like a reiteration of the same set of songs with different titles, maybe some levels tweaked during production.

I think some of the sound issue has to do with sampling and other types of electronic equipment used in producing music today. It's not something i consider absolutely evil, but i think it kinda distances the human touch on an instrument. And there's nothing like touching your instrument.

Also, for what it's worth, I think Britney Spears was grown in a petri dish.

:old: :2cents:
 
romperstomper said:
Metallica isn't an icon either. I think we all know why too.
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I've been trying to forget that whole thing ever happened. I've been infatuated with the band ever since Load came out (first time I ever heard them, for some reason they never played Enter Sandman on my redneck radio stations) but even I have to admit I lost a lot of respect for them, namely Lars, as soon as they had their little DRM-PMS session.

Taurothar said:
I'm beginning to fear for the future of music. What are we gonna have 30-40 years from now when we want to listen to music from our time? I doubt we'll be in our 60s and still listening to metal or w/e. It must be insanely hard to grow into a unique sound now with everything that has happened already in the music world. There's only so much that can be done with an instrument.
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Everything started bombing in the early 80s. If you look at some of the chart-toppers from the 60-70 years, the records are phenomenal - didn't Steppenwolf or Pink Floyd hold #1 in the US charts for something like 40-50 weeks with one of their songs?

Was trying to find proof but came up with nothing, maybe that was just a little while lie on one of those "Rockin' Rockbobbles from the 70s!!" cd compilations.
 
CmdrFly said:
Everything started bombing in the early 80s. If you look at some of the chart-toppers from the 60-70 years, the records are phenomenal - didn't Steppenwolf or Pink Floyd hold #1 in the US charts for something like 40-50 weeks with one of their songs?
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Dark Side of the Moon spent more than 700 weeks in the top 200 record charts. That's what you're thinking of.
 
Heh... I saw that, you went to the same Wiki I did looking for answers. However I'm talking about individual tracks and not entire albums, I know I've seen numbers indicating that a bunch of bands had songs that stayed #1 for 40+ weeks.

I think the highest I saw was 72 weeks... but this was all on one of those awesome infomercials so who knows where they were pulling their data from.
 
Taurothar said:
So here's the criteria I've come up with:
1. Huge following
2. Started touring in the last 15 years at most
3. Musical diversity, not just one singular sound or genre able to define them
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Easy Answer: The Red Hot Chili Peppers

1. Recenty went to a concert, and had kids that were like 16 to ppl in there late 40s. (Sold out as well)
2. Started in 1983 (My birth year)
3. They've had many different sounds in there carrer, to punk rock, light rap/rok, classical, easy going.

They fit the list easily and there still going around today making number #1 hit albums and breaking record charts.
 
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Excalibr said:
Yes Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, all are icons in my mind, but we're talking about new bands here.

What I don't understand here is you guys saying a group needs to combine two types of music to be an icon. Know what I have to say to that? FUCK that. I don't wanna hear fucking country mixed with my metal, or any other genre for that matter (although S&M from Metallica was a badass album). The reason groups live The Beatles and Elvis were so huge was because that's all there fucking was. There were two types of music back then: music that adults listened to, and music kids listened to. There were no genre's like metal or rap, or all the countless subgenres of rock. If you were a kid wanting to listen to something cool you had all of one or two choices. That's why these people were "icons", because everyone listened to them because that's all there was to listen to.

If you wanna talk about icons today you have to pick a genre to talk about. There are no more universal icons because people like different things. To the pop world...idk, Britney Spears or n'sync or w/e are the latest icons. To the country world it's...idk, whoever is the latest in country. To the rap world...idk, 50 Cent? Eminem? ICP is really big around here. To the metal world it's not Metallica, I'll tell ya that right now. Metallica had their day back in the 80's, 99/100 metal fans today don't like Metallica anymore. Anyways, icons in metal today are System of a Down, Tool, Slipknot (with Kory) and Mudvayne are pretty big, Mushroomhead, Disturbed, Godsmack, Rob Zombie, plus dozens more I could name. In "alternative", there's bands like Sublime or Orgy.

I could go into a few other genre's but I think you guys get the point.
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Mudvayne love something I so rarely see. Mushroomhead I guess can be seen as an icon I am not a big fan. Disturbed probably they have their own sound but are just really good. Godsmack who doesn't like Godsmack. Even metal heads like them. Zombie(White Zombie as well) hell fucking yes. Danzig although they're kind of an old band I just love the sound.

How are we forgetting Slayer?

cmdrfly said:
I've been trying to forget that whole thing ever happened. I've been infatuated with the band ever since Load came out (first time I ever heard them, for some reason they never played Enter Sandman on my redneck radio stations) but even I have to admit I lost a lot of respect for them, namely Lars, as soon as they had their little DRM-PMS session.
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Yes that is something I was hinting at, but my big thing is I lost all respect for them when they cut their hair. Also when they made Some Kind of Monster. That is just begging for attention. A movie of them recording St. Anger and how troubled the band was. MAYBE they shouldn't have kicked out Dave Mustaine. I also believe that Lars didn't do the drumming on Injustice for All. Saw them in concert a few years ago and they played some I.f.A Lars seemed off.
 
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Outkast
Snoop Dogg
Dr. Dre

Red Hot Chili Peppers (good call calv)
Nirvana
Radiohead

Dave Matthews Band
Phish
Widespread Panic

These are our icons. Love em or hate em, everyone reading this knows who they are. These musicians span the collective interests of likely 99% of people living in america from age 20-30.

Then you have those people that don't care about music and all they want is to find the next "big thing". Anything they listen to is awesome, new, and no one else has ever heard of it. If a band actually makes it, the same person calls em sellouts and talks about how they used to be cool, back when they were playin at Blue Cats on the strip.

In spite of all this... no one. ever. ever ever never ever never... will be anywhere near as big as the beatles were. The melodies and lyrics will survive the times as well as anything ever written or composed by the greatest playwrites, composers and bards the world has ever known.

Mozart ain't got nothin on Lennon/McCartney. It's unfair to compare any artists to them on any level.
 
Trippyhippy said:
Outkast
Snoop Dogg
Dr. Dre

Red Hot Chili Peppers (good call calv)
Nirvana
Radiohead

Dave Matthews Band
Phish
Widespread Panic

These are our icons. Love em or hate em, everyone reading this knows who they are. These musicians span the collective interests of likely 99% of people living in america from age 20-30.

Then you have those people that don't care about music and all they want is to find the next "big thing". Anything they listen to is awesome, new, and no one else has ever heard of it. If a band actually makes it, the same person calls em sellouts and talks about how they used to be cool, back when they were playin at Blue Cats on the strip.

In spite of all this... no one. ever. ever ever never ever never... will be anywhere near as big as the beatles were. The melodies and lyrics will survive the times as well as anything ever written or composed by the greatest playwrites, composers and bards the world has ever known.

Mozart ain't got nothin on Lennon/McCartney. It's unfair to compare any artists to them on any level.
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Mozart was making symphonies when he was 7. Your move.
 
romperstomper said:
Mozart was making symphonies when he was 7. Your move.
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That's all well and good, but this is one of the few times that I made a post only to state my opinion. I'm not looking to argue the point or i'd look up facts and numbers proving that the beatles wrote more music, and in Lennons case, he also wrote poetry and lyrics. I would also cite numbers that state that the beatles have sold over 1 billion records world wide, which is more than any other musician in history.

The also got high before they went to be knighted, which is just funny. And they were knighted.
 
Trippyhippy said:
Outkast
Snoop Dogg
Dr. Dre

Red Hot Chili Peppers (good call calv)
Nirvana
Radiohead

Dave Matthews Band
Phish
Widespread Panic

These are our icons. Love em or hate em, everyone reading this knows who they are. These musicians span the collective interests of likely 99% of people living in america from age 20-30.
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Having 99% of people know who you are doesn't make you an icon.

Outkast? If everyone knows who they are, it's because "Hey Ya" and "Bombs Over Baghdad" got over-played to the max.

I'll give you Snoop, Dre, RHCP, and maybe Radeohead. Dave Matthews Band has one type of fan, and that fan grows out of his music.

Nev said U2, which is a pretty good suggestion. Personally, I can't stand them, but they are definitely one of the most famous bands on the planet, and have been for a while.

I think its too early to pick our icons. Its a lot easier to pick icons from older generations, but as someone said earlier, there wasn't nearly as much to listen to.
 
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