When is it time to leave an endgame shell?

one more bump lol, Olro how do you like your ethereal? :D
 
heheh loving it jya, thanks^^ Yeah I mean there ARE fun times and ways to make any event fun I agree (derail!) but idk its just sometimes i still catch myself looking at the time remaining on my hourglass, I'm not leaving my dyna shell.. but I know everyone, or mostly everyone has done this at least once. 3-3,1/2 hours is a long time, not including gather time. This goes for almost all dynanot everyone is always ontime, myself included.
 
FleistLoC said:
Actually the funny thing is that people like to complicate the simplest concepts.
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I always remember too late why I hate participating in serious discussions on QCDN. Expanded ideas are dismissed with the greatest of ease. Thats ok though, cause as I said, I'll never have this problem and can therefore stick with the simplest solution of all. I'll leave when I feel my debt to the linkshell is paid.
 
Just remember when you leave don't burn your bridges. You never know when something will be changed, or added to an end game activity.

However the way I see it I would continue to go because of the people in the shell. Make sure people got what they wanted, needs and to hang out. Listen to jokes, humor, and just have fun.

I love my Dynamis shell it's the only end game activity that I do, the only one that I find fun.
 
Its a game do what you want. Just try and not be a dick and leave a reasonable amount of time after your goals have been met.
 
Ho-Ley-Crap, it's Rabidsquirrel :D
 
Lavi said:
Except a sky shell can rarely leave sky with the revolving door of members. You can cut back on sky and try other things, but it's very difficult to do that unless ALL your members stick around.
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If the Sky Shell has nothing to offer it's members when they have their Sky Gear, then they should be expecting their members to move on. The reason they have a "revolving door of members" in general is because they're not offering their members anything other than Sky Gear.

Dynamis is worse. One of the Dynamis Shells I'm in though does have a lot to offer members after they have their AF. In fact, about 25% of the Shell is never lotting AF2, and having that 25% of experienced members still coming makes the Shell function better, keeps AF2 queues shorter, and keeps the turnaround in the shell to a minimum. In short, it keeps the Shell far stronger than it otherwise would be.

Understanding what motivates people to come (and it's different for different people) is the secret to keeping them coming, and a lot of shells just don't bother...
 
Arct, my quote was not meant to "dismiss expanded ideas" and in no way was directed at you, though it was in response to what I feel is your pulse on my way of thinking. It's just my opinion that people complicate things to rationalize a "good reason" for leaving a shell, where others may make negative judgements about that person.

My initial quote referred to the concept of a moral obligation to return a favor. Though the concept of moral obligation is different among members and leaders, the theory is "one thing for one thing". Perhaps rarity of the drop isn't the best index to value a drop you receive . . . I'd rather use the number of hours I ask other people to spend helping me get something I would otherwise not have.

Simplistic? Probably. Applicable to an LS' core idealogy? Most definitely.

Perhaps I don't quite understand how, in your example, 1 Ridell = 30YYR. If I gave a SMN a Ridell or a WAR a YYR, just because it's rare doesn't increase that member's value on the item because they can't use it. On the contrary, getting a SMN his YYR and a WAR his Ridell is equal to each other in my alternate universe. Counter-camping aside, I would assume that the amount of time it takes to kill either mob would not be significantly different, and it would provide equal usefulness to both those jobs in a manner of speaking.

Still, I advocate the idea that you pay it forward until you feel you've paid enough.
 
Courtney said:
If the Sky Shell has nothing to offer it's members when they have their Sky Gear, then they should be expecting their members to move on. The reason they have a "revolving door of members" in general is because they're not offering their members anything other than Sky Gear.

Dynamis is worse. One of the Dynamis Shells I'm in though does have a lot to offer members after they have their AF. In fact, about 25% of the Shell is never lotting AF2, and having that 25% of experienced members still coming makes the Shell function better, keeps AF2 queues shorter, and keeps the turnaround in the shell to a minimum. In short, it keeps the Shell far stronger than it otherwise would be.

Understanding what motivates people to come (and it's different for different people) is the secret to keeping them coming, and a lot of shells just don't bother...
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not to mention it makes the runs shorter having those experienced players :D
 
Eilistrae said:
not to mention it makes the runs shorter having those experienced players :D
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Yep, and you get more drops, because you kill more stuff. We usually have low 40s and we normally clear the 4 basic cities, and are getting close to clearing the normal mobs in Beaucedine. Makes Dynamis much less of a grind, and a lot easier to setup because you have the same people on every week.
 
When the event the linkshell hosts is no longer fun and feels more monotonous than contributing, that is the time to leave. Also when unexpected things in real life are more important than digital achievements (those once in a lifetime changes that happen suddenly). Regardless of the situation, people will get their feelings hurt by the decision or feel like you have abandoned them. Be honest and most of them will be forgiving.

Leaving on a good note usually means better networking opportunities in the future for other events/end-game content/parties/etc. If they are good players over all, it does not hurt to have a decent list of players for the smaller things in FFXI. And if these random people happen to play on another mmo or you happen to meet them by chance (rare but possible), it could open up new opportunities.
 
lol they leave early because they get bored?
 
Courtney said:
If the Sky Shell has nothing to offer it's members when they have their Sky Gear, then they should be expecting their members to move on. The reason they have a "revolving door of members" in general is because they're not offering their members anything other than Sky Gear.

Dynamis is worse. One of the Dynamis Shells I'm in though does have a lot to offer members after they have their AF. In fact, about 25% of the Shell is never lotting AF2, and having that 25% of experienced members still coming makes the Shell function better, keeps AF2 queues shorter, and keeps the turnaround in the shell to a minimum. In short, it keeps the Shell far stronger than it otherwise would be.

Understanding what motivates people to come (and it's different for different people) is the secret to keeping them coming, and a lot of shells just don't bother...
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If it was that easy, why isn't there many old sky shells remaing?
 
Lavi said:
If it was that easy, why isn't there many old sky shells remaing?
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Probably because of this part:

Courtney said:
Understanding what motivates people to come (and it's different for different people) is the secret to keeping them coming, and a lot of shells just don't bother...
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The older sky shells have all moved to be more than just a sky shell, meaning they know what motivates people and acted to keep them interested. The newer shells are the revolving doors, because they don't.
 
Bajaratt said:
Probably because of this part:


The older sky shells have all moved to be more than just a sky shell, meaning they know what motivates people and acted to keep them interested. The newer shells are the revolving doors, because they don't.
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That's not entirely true and you know it. A majority of the shells that moved out of sky are mainly comprised of members that were not even present when the shell was only doing sky. In fact, the shells you see today, changed pearls at one point or another between when they did solely sky and what events they do now (sky, sea, HNM, etc.). There are very very few shells that have remained generally the same and it's not that a majority of members have quit, but they've moved onto other shells. A lot of it has to do with shells breaking on part because leaders too, but I am left wondering, had members stuck around longer, would those shells still thrive today? After all, the members really only look out for their end of the agreement to help the shell, but a leader makes the agreement with everyone in the shell, not just for himself.
 
The best time to leave a shell is when it no longer has anything to offer you, be that friendship, good times, gil or mad lootz. This might have already been said but whateve's
 
IMO your obligation is up when you've had your item and helped the shell progress to where they don't need you to have that particular item. For instance, in sky it's pretty much assumed a shell's first w.legs go to the main PLD to kite Kirin with. Well if the first PLD jets after he gets his W.Legs, that's pretty jacked up since the shell was going to rely on them to kite. If the first PLD gets his W.Legs and stays around until 3-4 more PLD's are kiting the Kirins around with W.Legs on and he's pretty much retired then its not such a big deal.

It is frustrating for a shell to work for an item they intend to utilize for shell benefit and the person that wins it just jets off after getting it. If the shell no longer needs you and you no longer need the shell, then by all means leave.

Sidenote: Courtney we clear Glacier every now and then :)
 
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Lavi said:
That's not entirely true and you know it. A majority of the shells that moved out of sky are mainly comprised of members that were not even present when the shell was only doing sky. In fact, the shells you see today, changed pearls at one point or another between when they did solely sky and what events they do now (sky, sea, HNM, etc.). There are very very few shells that have remained generally the same and it's not that a majority of members have quit, but they've moved onto other shells. A lot of it has to do with shells breaking on part because leaders too, but I am left wondering, had members stuck around longer, would those shells still thrive today? After all, the members really only look out for their end of the agreement to help the shell, but a leader makes the agreement with everyone in the shell, not just for himself.
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Yes, most of the bigger linkshells have people who started in other linkshells that did sky, but that's all they did and that's why people left. As I said in my first post here, the only situation this question comes up is when you're in a linkshell with a single purpose, for a single event. All of the sky linkshells that were born and died, died because they didn't do anything else; people would get their gear, get sick of doing sky with no reward, and go join another group who did something they were interested in.

That's where understanding what motivates people comes in; if you don't care why they're there and don't try to maintain their interest, it's going to wander away and their character will follow. Even if their sole motivation is a new carrot to dangle in front of them, it's something to keep them coming back. That's why the bigger multi-purpose linkshells keep most of their members for so long; because there's a whole lot there to motivate their members.
 
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