Whm/Rdm.... >.> really?

C

Crisis

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Now, so many discussions have been made and argued about the best SJ for Whm mainly being /blm, /smn, heck even /brd. I was thinking and even testing with Whm/Rdm. Now, I never even considered this as a good SJ post 30 mainly since /smn gets autorefresh and massive mp, /blm gets conserve mp, clearmind, and great extra spells, /brd gets ballad.... woo (I personally don't like this one except for a manaburn).

Now let's analyze what /rdm gives you:
Fast Cast
More Mind
Some MP
Some Extra Enfeebles

That's about it. But what csme to mind is the extra Mind and Fast Cast. Now, if you can cast heals faster and your cures have more potency, you can more effectively utilize your time and healing capabilities. This would allow you to /heal more and use your time more effectively. Personally, conserve mp won't help with spells that cost barely mp (if your playing Whm properly) though clear mind is a very nice addition. Yeah, the extra mp from /smn is ok, but once the party is going you aren't getting full mp...ever; but autorefresh is a very helpful ability. I'm not going to even cover /brd since I have personal fews on that and this is not meant to be a flame war ;).

I just feel that /rdm doesn't get the consideration that this combo potentially has. Faster casting, better cure spells, stronger cure spells, more time to /heal. It just seems like a good option after 30. Any input, even if it rips me apart, would be appreciated. I was just considering leveling as Whm/Rdm so I can have Whm as a sub for Bst and Brd later on. Thank you!
 
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I think the utility of /BLM spells and Elemental Seal far outweighs the meager amount of Fast Cast you're likely to get. Gear can give you enough MND to land enfeebles if you don't have a RDM in your party; you're not going to get much MND benefit to your Cures until Cure V.

Gear + Cookies > /RDM as far as WHM efficiency goes.
 
Crisis said:
Angelofcrisis
1 War, 1 Thf, 1 Mnk, 24 Rdm, 1 Blm, 31 Whm, 17 Bst (noob!)
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im sorry... but get to 60+ on whm then come back and ask this question again. pre 40 you can sub whatever you want, there is no overwhelming effect of the sub at the point you are at based on your sig. once you get to a higher level that will all chnage and you will see why most whm use /blm or on rare occasions /smn. but /smn is very rare occasions.
 
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Thanks for the feedback! I never really did /rdm on my old character so I thought I would just get some other opinions on it. I like to experiment with all the different logical options. Just was making sure I was going to use one of the more efficient Whm choices. Thanks again!
 
Crisis said:
Old Character: Xonius (dead)
75 Brd, 60 Whm, 40 Blm, 25 Bst
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This is my old character's info just so everyone knows I have done this before. Thanks!
 
Rdm is not a useful sub for whm. Fast cast is a toy, casting efficiency is vastly outperformed by conserve MP from /blm and auto-refresh from /smn. Your cure spells won't be any stronger at higher levels, one you reach the soft cap for them, which will happen as you level. Your gear will impact your enfeebles more than /rdm ever will. I find /brd to be far more useful than /rdm, but /brd is mainly situational.

The only reason to sub rdm would be if you need a dispel that badly.
 
also to add fast cast tier 1 isnt very noticeable its best at its full power from a sub 70+ when rdms get tier II every little bit helps but you get much more from other subs

either way dont think rdm should be subbed just for that since most of our abilities from a sub are dispensable
 
well ive seen whm sub rdm before the fast cast is noticeable. It more a spur moment type sub. For things like sky/sea farming and fun. Also you forgot phalanx. Also remember whm has alot haste gear already
 
Whm/drg 4tw. /rdm isnt used enough by brds either.
 
The only time I would see a blatant need for /rdm is soloing and, as others have said, any party where you don't already have a rdm main. Gravity + Dispel are almost necessary on some xp mobs.

As for the supposed Clear Mind bonus from /blm... I don't think there's any level range where /blm's CM will override whm's CM. They don't stack, and whm by default gets up to CM...3?
 
only times I sub RDM is for soloing... fast cast is really rather useless at 75 with loquarious earring, rostrum pumps and cure cast merits
 
as a WHM/RDM you do get phalanx which should help you live longer if you pull hate (for some reason) :P so there's a plus other then enfeebles and the MND :P
 
Elemmire said:
as a WHM/RDM you do get phalanx which should help you live longer if you pull hate (for some reason) :P so there's a plus other then enfeebles and the MND :P
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Well, if you sub RDM for Phalanx in order to live longer yourself, that's kind of selfish. Conserve MP and Auto Refresh will benefit the group as a whole to a larger extent then Phalanx.

I'd reccomend getting a Templar Mace and using a Genbu's Shield in off-hand, since that will benefit the group and yourself more then RDM sub ever will.
 
If you're getting hit enough to be in danger of dying, the 15-20 per hit Phalanx will prevent is unlikely to save you.
 
/RDM is OK for goofing off and not much else. WHM gets horrible (C-?) enfeebling, so you're likely to get resists unless the monster is weak to wind magic to begin with. Dispel can be useful, but more times than not you'll have a RDM or BRD who should be covering that anyways.

/SMN gives more MP and MND than /RDM, and /BLM actually gives a better choice of extra spells than /RDM to boot (rasp/choke/etc, warp, escape, tractor, sleep/ga, elemental seal...)
 
C flat enfeeble. Rdm (Too weak)

I was gonna ask the mnd boost on /smn compared to /rdm... I havent levelled rdm yet so couldnt compare myself. So smn is more? I know it's pretty massive, I think my base mnd at 67 with /smn is 72 or 75 or something. Higher than my str on war at that level, I know that much.
 
Yeah, /SMN gives a huge MND and INT boost when subbed; it's the best sub when you're going for one of those stats specifically. /BLM is still better in my opinion, but /SMN does have it's uses.
 
yep rdm int and mnd stats are just average imo below average

while smn mnd and int are above average

blm has crazy int with poor mind

whm has crazy mnd with poor int
 
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