About Action Taken Against Third-Party Tool Users : POL NEWS

[Winklewil]

No, they can't detect Windower. The only ways they can are - JP text on NA client..

If they really do start going on the prowl for that alone, and I get caught up in it, I'm going to make life a living Hell for a few customer service agents. I actively use the IME plugin for Windower, and I make no apologies for it. Frankly, I find it utterly insulting that they'd literally leave the code for Japanese text input in game (which is basically what IME unlocks ... it doesn't "add" anything), yet disable it by force in any non-Japanese version. It's not like they did it to save space ... the code and feature itself is still in our version of the game. It's just locked.

They've made an assumption of intercultural ignorance and idiocy that doesn't sit right with me at all. I'm not saying it should have been an activatable feature within the game ... it would most likely have been an obscure, offline configuration file. Also, one would first need to have Japanese input enabled in their Windows lanaguage settings before using it.

Still, the fact that some smug-ass manager OUTRIGHT decided to completely remove the option of attempting to commune with the other half of the player base, the Japanese players, in their own language is not something I'm going to just take up the rear. They may have been frightened of kiddies toying around with characters they couldn't read to "look" cool, but the fear of Roman-letter gibberish doesn't seem to come into play with Chinese accounts. -_-;

For those of us (like me) with a small, barely-present, weak understanding of Japanese, it's irritating. For people (like Rhaddy) who are damn-near fluent, it's a slap in the face. I'm not speaking for him, of course, but that's how I'd feel if I were as good as him. T_T



God, if they start banning for that, even as a means of detecting Windower, I'll be pissed. I was under the impression, however, that they could not determine your client-type ... only the client you initially registered your account on.

and use of "feature-rich" plugins (one person got suspended for activating an FFAssist feature that triggered using an /echo - SE caught the /echo and had him in jail within a short time).

This is definitely taking things too far, to the point of zealotry. It's also confusingly over-analytical.

If they want to identify true problems, they can simply observe a few highly-contested HNM spots while invisible, prod people that have been fishing or mining for more than ten hours, or if they must do the "under cover" stuff, watch how much gil a certain character trades away (seemingly for 'free') over the course of one month, to whom, and compare it to how much they actually spend.

This is like spending thousands of man-hours, cracking out the microscope to analyze hair fibers and DNA samples in order to prosecute jay-walkers, while a gang of thugs are breaking into a convenience store in plain view across the street.


Stop with this CSI nonsense against "average" players, and just open your damn eyes to the Mafia gunfight happening ten feet away from you. >_<

 

[Garvin]

As far as I know, SE didn't have the licensing to distribute the IME they used outside of Japan.
Also, I'd read a long time ago that there was no windowed mode implemented due to Sony's demand that the PC release would have to be EXACTLY the same as the PS2 release, or they would drop PS2 support for it.
I'm not certain of the validity of these statements, but it really doesn't matter, because this mass banning had nothing to do with windower...

(PS: The windower itself is not cheating. Its plugins are.)

 

[Winklewil]

(PS: The windower itself is not cheating. Its plugins are.)

According to you.

According to Playlonline, the Windower itself IS cheating. They make no differentiation between the person who just wants to alt-tab, and the person who wants to time their blood pacts and use Japanese text. That's really just a line that you've drawn, in your own mind. As their opinion is really the only one that matters in the end, they're the ones that get to define it ... not me, but not you, either.

The notion that "just Windower" is okay, because it only allows you to do what you "should have been able to do anyway" is really no different than my assertion that the IME plugin shouldn't be considered a "cheat." It's a threshold you've created in your own mind, in order to justify using the Windower to yourself. We all do it, depending on how far we decide to go.

There are literally people around ... avid, hardcore players of MMORPGs ... that consider spoiler sites like Allakhazam or Somepage to be "cheats," and wholeheartedly feel that the major MMO companies should strive to shut them down.

Personally, I agree with Windower not really being a "cheat," but I'd extend that accepting attitude to include at least a couple of the plugins. You refuse to accept Playonline's full-screen restriction, because it was such a ridiculous thing to implement in the first place ... almost game-breaking. I feel exactly the same about the inability to access the Japanese input system without the IME plugin. I'm not equating the two in terms of level of mistake ... the locked full-screen thing was definitely a greater one. I'm just saying, it's the same concept.

 

[Bajaratt]

It's not silly, I was just stating that you could not compare using the windower on PC as the same as playing on a PS2. They are totally different scenarios.

It is the same, in that you get the exact same ability and use out of your computer by using the windower as someone who plays on PS2. Your point was you had another computer to do everything people use the windower for, but not everyone has access to or can afford a second computer; so your solution to the problem is not practical. The same goes for not everyone playing on PS2, so that doesn't work either. The only way that the vast majority of PC players can actually accomplish the same things you're doing is to use the windower.

I played for a year and a half before I even heard about the windower, and if SE ever found a way to permenantly disable the windower, I'd quit in an instant. It's unreasonable for one program to prevent any and all other use of a machine designed to multitask millions of operations a second. I think there's only been 2-3 games that I have ever played on my PC that wouldn't let me alt+tab and there's really no reason for it.

The windower gives me my computer back, not turn it into a giant paper weight that only lets me play XI.

 

[Garvin]

Personally, I agree with Windower not really being a "cheat," but your decision not to extend your accepting attitude to include the IME plugin isn't nearly as authoritative as you've presented it. You refuse to accept Playonline's full-screen restriction, because it was such a ridiculous thing to implement in the first place ... almost game-breaking. I feel exactly the same about the inability to access the Japanese input system without the IME plugin. I'm not equating the two in terms of level of mistake ... the locked full-screen thing was definitely a greater one. I'm just saying, it's the same concept.

Whoa whoa whoa.
The IME plugin falls into a completely different issue than the rest, for various reasons (especially licensing agreements that may or may not exist). That one's a bit more complex than most things, though I don't consider it a cheat (nor EXPwatch/Bloodpace entirely).

The biggest thing I was talking about, and the difference between a ToS violation and cheating...

Windower adds nothing to this game, as many have brought up. It doesn't give you special powers, it doesn't let you see new things. It just takes the game, without altering it in any way, and makes it windowed.
This is not cheating. There's no advantage within the game itself. It violates the user agreement with playonline, but that alone does not constitute a cheat. If Squeenix decides you are to be banned for it, them's the breaks.

If you take something such as TP plugin, or distance (especially), there is now an advantage. You, as a player, are privvy to information not intended for you to see. At this point, you are not only breaking the terms of the user agreement you have with Squeenix, but you are violating the rules of the game itself.

That's the major difference. Both violate an agreement that you have with SE, however only one of those actually bends or breaks the rules of the game itself.

 

[mugenteg]

I say we all quit and do a charge back on our credit cards. When the credit card company asks why just say "I din;t get the services i payed for".

 

[Canitoch]

I say we all quit and do a charge back on our credit cards. When the credit card company asks why just say "I din;t get the services i payed for".

Yes! I'm with you 110% Just let me get 75, do bunch of endgame, learn about backround info on the game that serves no use to me, have a good time with thinks like dynamis or ballista or something, talk with friends level other jobs, and 1337 gear.

 

[Blazeoffury]

Yes! I'm with you 110% Just let me get 75, do bunch of endgame, learn about backround info on the game that serves no use to me, have a good time with thinks like dynamis or ballista or something, talk with friends level other jobs, and 1337 gear.

Lol at good times in endgame [Drama & Time sink {Can you hear me?}].

 

[ultraseven]

Life playing FFXI on PC with Windower is Heavenly. I couldn't understand why I played the first 2 years of FFXI without it.

 

[Courtney]

I say we all quit and do a charge back on our credit cards. When the credit card company asks why just say "I din;t get the services i payed for".

Which service did you pay for that you didn't you get? You agree to not use windower everytime you log in...

 

[ForteTeppo]

Hey j/w will this stop botters? especially Gilseller Botters? :3

 

[Dowzer]

We have closed your PlayOnline account.
Please contact the PlayOnline Information
Center for further details. (LM-11)

LM-11 = only suspension?

 

[Kirayamato]

perma ban

 

[Halifirien]

Yes! I'm with you 110% Just let me get 75, do bunch of endgame, learn about backround info on the game that serves no use to me, have a good time with thinks like dynamis or ballista or something, talk with friends level other jobs, and 1337 gear.

That made my day. :biggrin:

 

[Dowzer]

perma ban

My last logon ended on a good note. Wouldn't have wanted to leave this game in any other way...Will see on the 24th (I was jailed on the 20th) whether it's about mpk or among the 2000. Really leaning towards mpk, from multiple offenses lol

Dead sellers on my trail was the way to go.

 

[Mishaela]

<3 Jammer Leeches


And a few people seem to not know what "cheating" exactly is. It's supposed to be a means that alters or otherwise gives you something that would give an uneven advantage in your favor, wether it be vs a player or NPC.

Packet sniffer = cheating
Vokebot = Cheating
Plugin to speak a different language = Not cheating
Being able to change windows = Not cheating
Running 2x faster than choco = Cheating
Being able to use Steal on a 5second timer = Cheating
Pulling Brutal Sheep to KA = Cheating
Walking across Misareuax Coat in 2 steps = Cheating
Using a stopwatch or RL clock to episode a pop time, even if it's boiled down to an exact number = Not cheating
Using a program that says "<call> POP" when a mob pops = Cheating



Yes, Windower and it's plug-ins were third party crap...but was it cheating? No. If you think that's cheating you better go and light some torches for people who "abuse" the hate reset that logging out gives as well as the technical problem of XP rings not getting a cooloff timer when they hit 0 charges.

*edit* Well, wait, no. God I suck at examples...my point is that there's lotsof non-third party things people do that still are more questionable than just being able to use one of the best Windows features inthe system.

 

[skreb]

I did! Gotta love a big screen TV where I could have half the screen with the PS2 up and the other half on TV. It must be a cheat! BAN ME!!!!

lol i got a 57" sony HDTv game on left side sat. tv on right >.>

 

[Skaw]

lol i got a 57" sony HDTv game on left side sat. tv on right >.>

You damn cheaters! FFXI was designed to hog up your entire TV. Even switching from PS2 to your Channels is cheating!

Computers are meant for multitasking. I don't buy the "we couldn't add minimizing because of the PS2" bullshit excuse. Last I checked, a PC isn't a PS2. They need to stop treating it as so.

 

[Aerdrie]

Well first of all, I haven't had an account for about 6 months now, so way ahead of you there. And for your information, breaking the rules is exactly how things get changed. There are casualties and martyrs just like anything else, but throughout history, if you don't like a rule, and the maker of the rule is too thickheaded to listen to you, then you break the rule to get their attention. Simple politics.


Here is the problem your trying to compare a game on a PRIVATE server to RL politics and your argument doesnt fly. You basicly come to play in SE's house and at the door you agree to certin rules regardless of if they are fair or not you agreed to them hence if you break them you must suffer the results.There is nothing "ilegal" about a private owner of a game having set up rules and expecting them to be followed.

Its like if you have house guests come over and you have a no smoking rule in your house. By your argument if they dont like it they should smoke anyways cause they want to excersie civil disobence because they feel your rule is stupid. As the house owner you can have any rule you like same as SE owning the server.

FF XI is not a democracy you play by thier rules or you choose to give your money to someone else its that simple. You can protest a rule you find unfair by not paying them that send them a messege too. But on thier property the have every and all right to enforce rules they set up.

Sure I think it sucks we lost some good players. At the same time I highly doubt there were 2000 innocent cases. I am sorry to see people get booted but the fact is regardless if you feel its a stupid rule its a rule you agreed to follow.

 

[K. Ishitar]

Lol at good times in endgame [Drama & Time sink {Can you hear me?}].

Lol very little true drama ingame

Most of it is just bullshit because some people refuse to go through puberty