Acc, STR, and DEX balance

All of them, I figured. I've gotten big damage jumps without doing a double attack on gekko and Kasha, so I attributed that to a critical hit. The only WS I knew of that could never crit was Asuran Fists, I thought everything else could. They don't increase their chance to crit with TP, but it can still happen; I'd never heard otherwise.
 
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From everything I've experienced and read on various sites, the only weapon skills that can critical are those which have a 'Chance of critical hit varies with TP' description.

As far as SAM WS goes, Y/G/K are an all-or-nothing one-hits; Accuracy is fairly important for these.
 
Just want to mention that sometime i also see big number. But then i notice i got a increase gain in TP too. So i attribute it to my double attack kicking in. But a double attack does not boost a damage up by like 200+ so it might be because the SECOND hit is a extra CRITICAL hit OR the first hit is critical. I don't know. ~.~

I am into the school of thought siimilar to Baja that all ws can critical except asuran fists. But even if this school of thought is false, it does not mean the 2nd hit cant be critical!

Personally why I dont mind the 13 Dex is precisely because it is a one hit WS and the probability that one hit is a critical is not extremely high. I prefer consistent damage > Spike damage.
 
NO WS has been found to crit that does not include one of the following: "Crit varies by TP", SA or Mighty Strikes. "Big jumps" is called pDIF range, not to mention a lot of pDIF factors like berserk, dia II, angon, etc will distort your perception of "jumps" that don't include DAs. You want to prove it wrong? SA YGK a monster outside of home nations a few times to get an average crit WS. With the same gear, go YGK the monsters and if you find one that matches the SA YGK, you win the game.

Your double attacks do more than 200 extra damage because YGK have 75% STR mods, this applies to ALL hits in WS including DAs. What does 75% STR mean? 75% of your STR, floored, times 0.83 (assuming you're at lv75), floored again, is the damage added to your weapon (fSTR adds another 10-16 depending on your STR).

One hit WS don't need a lot of ACC, first hit of YGK (and possibly generalized to all WS) has increased ACC. ACC+9~ or STR+4 is the only difference between AF+1 and Alkys. If you parse (which I hope you do), look at your WS ACC% with AF+1, if it's capped try using Alkys over AF+1, if it's still capped after an EXP session, there's your answer on which is better.
 
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What Redshift said would be correct, otherwise you would see NINs using Blade: Ku over Blade: Jin due to Ku being a 5 hit WS as opposed to Jins 3 hit. If it doesn't say Crit is affected by TP then the WS will not crit unless it is forced through SA or Mighty Strikes.
 
Yea, I did quite a bit of Steel Cyclone testing a long time ago to try to see if crit hits effected it...and they didn't there which is why I would have been surprised to see the similar weaponskills GK offers be able to Crit.
 
Not saying you guys are wrong, but I just find it very hard to believe that when I get a 2-300+ boost to my WS numbers without any additional TP returns, that I'm just "hitting higher in the pdif range." Maybe if my gear sucked so I was usually hitting in the lower part of the range, it'd make more sense, but I'm using some pretty good gear. And yes, I'm factoring in things liek dia, agnon, berserk/warcry, minuet's, etc.
 
How much TP are you using during WS? I doubt it would be the same every time. Even if you do happen to WS with the exact same amount of TP everytime your damage will fluctuate no matter what you do. Also mob lvls have to be taken into consideration as they are not always constant even when in the same camp.
 
Usually 100-101% TP with a Hagun.

There's obviously going to be some fluctuations, but this is a major outlier with no easily explainable cause. Unless I just ran into a mob that's far under what the rest of them are, but not enough so that my melee hits show much difference, the level isn't likely. Like I said, I could be wrong about the crit-ability, and according to you guys I am, but I can't think of any other reason why I'd see large jumps in my weapon skill numbers.
 
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It doesn't matter if your gear sucks or is Jesus +1, there's still a +/- pDIF for all pDIF values; this is why your melee hits don't hit for the same damage every time. (excluding when they borked the game and everyone hit for the same)

Function for pDIF http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/ffxi/images/4/45/PDIF.gif
 
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Redshift said:
It doesn't matter if your gear sucks or is Jesus +1, there's still a +/- pDIF for all pDIF values; this is why your melee hits don't hit for the same damage every time. (excluding when they borked the game and everyone hit for the same)

Function for pDIF http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/ffxi/images/4/45/PDIF.gif
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It's a range, and like every range, there is a limit. If you're geared well, you're going to be staying in the upper portion of that limit. Yes, you're never going to stay up at the very top, but when you have great gear, you're going to stay there more often than not. You're still not explaining why I'd see a massive damage increase, other than just a graph of damage ranges which doesn't discount what I'm saying.
 
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The only word that describes what I feel is facepalm.

EDIT: Let me try this again, but slowly...

Your ATK is compared to the monsters DEF in a ratio, ATK/DEF. For example, if you have 100ATK and the monster has 100DEF, it's 100/100 = 1.0

If the monster is EM or lower, cRatio = ATK/DEF (what I said above)
If the monster is higher level than you, cRatio = ATK/DEF - 0.05 x level difference

cRatio caps at 2.0, so if you're fighting a monster EM or lower, you need exactly twice its DEF to cap cRatio. Wut dos dis meen 4me? If DEF of the monster is the same, but the level increases, you need more ATK to cap out compared to EM or lower.

After you find your cRatio, you plug it into the pDIF function, which I posted. I don't feel like posting the function at different intervals of cRatio, so let's just look at when cRatio is high.

Between 5/6 and 2 cRatio, the MAX pDIF value is equal to 1.2 x cRatio. pDIF cannot exceed 2.4 for regular melee attacks. A crit is just pDIF +1.0 and the cap is increased to 3.0 for critical hits.

Between 1.5 and 2 cRatio, the MIN pDIF value is equal to 1.2 x cRatio - 0.8

What is pDIF? pDIF is used in calculating your melee damage, which is just pDIF x D, where D is your weapon damage + fSTR. For WS, D = (weapon damage + WSC + fSTR) x fTP, where WSC is your mods.

So... let's say you are uber skeet shit and you have your ATK capped in a merit party, which means your cRatio is 2.0. Your pDIF still ranges from 1.6 to 2.4 pDIF, more attack does nothing to increase your damage.

EDIT2: This is for one handed weapons (and was two handed for prepatch), but the function of pDIF is different for two handed weapons. It's approximated by old pDIF x 1.05. For example, the crit cap for two handed weapons is 3.15 instead of 3.0
 
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Redshift said:
The only word that describes what I feel is facepalm.
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Taking the words right out of my mouth.

All you're doing is explaining what PDIF means, which is completely meaningless for what is being talked about. Yes, it's a formula that factors in many different stats together to give you a damage calculation. No it really doesn't matter to what's being discussed.

Congrats on copying Wikipedia and acting like it makes you smart. You're still not explaining why I'm seeing much higher damage numbers, even on the same monster. But go ahead and post more explanations of the damage formulas like you're actually proving a point.

The only thing you're doing is fueling my argument. If you're nearing the cap for cRatio, then the ONLY way to see a sizable jump in damage is through a crit. That's what your needless explanations of the damage formulas are saying.
 
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Bajaratt said:
The only thing you're doing is fueling my argument. If you're nearing the cap for cRatio, then the ONLY way to see a sizable jump in damage is through a crit. That's what your needless explanations of the damage formulas are saying.
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Can't crit a SAM WS.
 
Gunnerx said:
Can't crit a SAM WS.
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So I hear, but there's still no other good explanation for why I'm seeing such large jumps in my WS numbers. Redshift's going with either I'm blind or I'm gimp, what's your explanation?
 
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Do you get the same TP each swing? Not sure what SAM gets for each swing but lets say you get 20-21-20-21-20TP. If it does change like this maybe because of the Store TP and how it works your WS swung for 20TP and a DA kicked in which would mean you would get a 21TP return. In that situation it looks like a normal TP return but yea...Hope this is making sense but maybe that could account for the big jump. Obviously you would have to either be subbing WAR or wearing a Brutal during WS
 
Itachiii said:
Do you get the same TP each swing? Not sure what SAM gets for each swing but lets say you get 20-21-20-21-20TP. If it does change like this maybe because of the Store TP and how it works your WS swung for 20TP and a DA kicked in which would mean you would get a 21TP return. In that situation it looks like a normal TP return but yea...Hope this is making sense but maybe that could account for the big jump. Obviously you would have to either be subbing WAR or wearing a Brutal during WS
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17 TP every time. If I get 18 TP back, then I did a double attack which explains why my damage is much higher. I knew it wasn't a double attack just from looking at the TP.

That wouldn't even effect the return from a weapon skill. It's true that I might be getting say 17.5 TP per hit, so 2 hits gives me 35 TP; but when I WS, I lose all of the TP I had, so it'd reset me back down to 0. Any unshown decimal places would never be shown.
 
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All you're doing is explaining what PDIF means, which is completely meaningless for what is being talked about.
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NO. It is the ENTIRE reason why your WS varies so greatly on the SAME monsters with the SAME DEF/EVA/LV/VIT/MOONPHASE/DIRECTION, I explained it to you clearly and concisely.

Congrats on copying Wikipedia and acting like it makes you smart.
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How does 10th grade math make me look smart? If I was unable to do simple calculations while in university studying physics, I should just stop my degree. There is absolutely nothing difficult in the damage equation, no derivatives, no integrals, no limits, nothing at all, it's just plug in the numbers and compute.

The only thing you're doing is fueling my argument. If you're nearing the cap for cRatio, then the ONLY way to see a sizable jump in damage is through a crit. That's what your needless explanations of the damage formulas are saying.
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No, like I've already emphasized many times, even if your cRatio (YOUR ATK) is capped, there is still a big range, from 1.6 to 2.4. Nothing you can do will ever make it favored being closer to 2.4 instead of 1.6 pDIF, basically your pDIF is in the range of 2.0 +/- 0.4 at capped attack.

BIG NUMBERS x (2.0 +/- 0.4) = BIG RANGE

And again, YGK CANNOT crit. Go to Ronfaure, SAWS a rabbit a few times to get crit damage. Then go WS them over and over until you see a similar number. Your crit rate will be capped at 20% (or 24% with merits), you should see one soon if it exists. BUT -GASP- IT DOES NOT!

You are neglecting true and valid facts, like the damage equations. If you neglect true and valid facts, your either trolling, flaming baiting or completely retarded.

Redshift's going with either I'm blind or I'm gimp, what's your explanation?
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My explanation is clear and concise. You either failed grade 10 math or messing with me.
 
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