American Flag 'Offensive'... in America

[Falsey]

There's more to this story than what is being told in the article. There's no way that the flag is considered offensive by itself since "the flag flying outside the hospital building would have to suffice." If there was a problem with the flag inside, why wouldn't they remove the one outside? I'm guessing it's more along the lines of the size and people were concerned for safety reasons.

pretty much.

i'm not originally from this country, but america is my home now. all these people with their patriotism kinda strike me as odd, not because they are patriotic but rather they push their patriotism onto others.

this whole thing could have been avoided if she wore a "proud to be an american" pin with a us flag on it.

 

[Malagra]

I dunno, someone who lived in Vietnam but moved to America might find that flag offensive.

Also, if she was really patriotic, she would be proud of the ethnic diversity and accommodating to others needs, since she knows other people don't think like she does, and that it is a good thing not everyone thinks the same.
And proud of the free speech that is written into the very constitution, and that if someone is allowed to complain about a flag, that America works.

Bugs me that she says she was "never afforded the opportunity" to put up a smaller flag. I have to think she never asked.

 

[Excalibur]

It's largely a moot point, because she's been allowed to hang it again.

It is now. It was the overwhelming size of the thing, not the thing itself. Which is totally understandable. Thread over.

 

[Tristam Green]

i'm not originally from this country, but america is my home now. all these people with their patriotism kinda strike me as odd, not because they are patriotic but rather they push their patriotism onto others.

The same type of people drive massive SUVs recklessly with stickers that read "my real treasure is in Heaven" or "What would Jesus do?"

Bugs me that she says she was "never afforded the opportunity" to put up a smaller flag. I have to think she never asked.

Fuck no, she shouldn't have to either! This is the land of the entitled, and the home of the handout! [/sarcasm]

 

[masterorion]

I disagree. There are plenty of situations I can think of where someone putting up a U.S. flag would be offensive.

If, for example, McLucas regularly goes around harping on how super-uber-awesome the United States is and that it's okay to waterboard terrorists because Dubya Was Keeping Us Safe™, rails constantly about how immigrants are destroying the country and can't understand why her African co-worker might be offended, and says her liberal co-workers are crazy for voting for Obama, and just regularly feels the need to out-patriot everyone, and then one day I walked into the office and saw her beaming over some big ol' flag she took it upon herself to display in my area, patriotism would fly out the window because the first words out of my mouth would be "Fuck, Debbie. Can't you give it a rest?"

your talking about the government of this country. im never a fan of politicians, in fact, i would say i dislike all of them. but i love the country i live, the abilities/opportunities, and alot of the people in it. the american flag doesnt symbolize politics. it is a sign of your country and its people

lets look over the situation and why the flag was put up. and i will give counter examples for this.
first, we can all agree that the holiday for this occasion was to honor dead soldiers...right? on this day, you cannot go anywhere and NOT see a flag. in fact, you cant go anywhere on any day and not see one.
the flag as a symbol is not offensive in any way either. if you think it is, perhaps you think the russian, iraqi, and the german flags are offensive also. they arent. they are the symbol for that particular country.
here is the three examples i thought of on the way home today. first, just for halfri...the gay pride flag. if you were to put that up, would you say its offensive? i know i wouldnt. offensive is a harsh word. would i say it should be taken down. maybe. but on the same token, if that flag was put up on gay pride day, then what would u think? i would imagine there would be those that think it should be taken down because it isnt what all people have in common and people are prejudice. but in all, something like that shows your pride in something as does the american flag flown on such a holiday. the american flag does have something in common with everyone. they all live in this country. it isnt offensive by any sense of the word.
the term offensive is labeled to something, i dunno, like the nazi flag. now, that is an offensive symbol.
also, depending on the persons opinion, the dixie flag is borderline. now, keep in mind..i said depending on the person you talk to. southerners dont think its offensive. but alot of northerners see it as a symbol of slavery. and this is because it was a nations symbol for the southern states during the civil war.

you really have to take a step back and think of symbols or banners that symbolize what is offensive. normal country flags are not part of that list. especially when you live in that particular country. now, something that big, perhaps may be gaudy, a nuisance, or more of an eyesore . but, offensive by dictionary term...no.

 

[Hexx]

It pretty much comes down to a case of he-said-she-said as to what the real reason was. I honestly doubt that she was told to take it down because it offended someone.

On one side, the flag is big, but not so big that it would obstruct depending on how you hang it. If you pin up against a wall, or on an upright pole, all it will do is occupy at most 2-4 square inches of space.

On the other side, if someone WAS offended BECAUSE it was an american flag, get a fuckin clue, ur in america, deal with it. You dont like the american flag flying all over the place, go back to where you came from. I am a naturalized citizen (originally from mexico) and as much as i love my home country, i love america even more for i wouldnt be where i am now if it werent for the opportunities this land provided to my parents and myself.

Political correctness has reached new extremes this day and age, to the point where you have to say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" otherwise you risk offending someone. Pull the stick outta ur ass!


End rant.

 

[Halifirien]

Political correctness has reached new extremes this day and age, to the point where you have to say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" otherwise you risk offending someone. Pull the stick outta ur ass!

You're late to the party. We debated the War on Christmas™ back in December.

 

[Hexx]

You're late to the party. We debated the War on Christmas™ back in December.

No shit sherlock, funny how you ONLY singled out that comment. It was thrown in there as an example and nothing more, get over yourself and try to find a better way to argue your side k?:facepalm:

 

[Thelona]

No shit sherlock, funny how you ONLY singled out that comment. It was thrown in there as an example and nothing more, get over yourself and try to find a better way to argue your side k?:facepalm:

yes, but its much easier to pick and choose lil tidbits of information to argue your point.

just how its easier to not care about a woman being told she cant display a flag, if we just ASSUME that shes some bible bashing, bush loving, torture loving neo-con just trying to shove her patriotism down everyone's throat, without actually knowing anything about the woman. also easier if we ASSUME that the word offensive was never used and that the REAL reason someone complained was simply that it was to big.

funny how quickly people quit giving a shit about intolerance and "rights violations" when the victim is the your least favorite type of person. and to watch how much some people will dance to wrap a story around their own viewpoint of the situation.

i dont know all the facts, its a fucked up situation and i agree the flag may have been a little big, but is it really worth it to tell a woman she cant display her american flag, just because someone finds it "annoying" or "obstructive", especially when its just for a few days around memorial day?

oh wait that question was answered as soon as the story hit the media and the hospital found out that telling a woman to take down an American flag on memorial day indeed WASN'T worth it. wow, who coulda seen that coming?


E: really this whole thing seems to come up because of people being insensitive on both sides, yeah the woman didn't have to bring in such a honkin huge flag, but from the story i saw they never even asked her to take it down, she came back from a lunch break to find the flag on the floor, if that's true the hospital couldn't have found a more insensitive and insulting way to go about things.

 

[Halifirien]

just how its easier to not care about a woman being told she cant display a flag, if we just ASSUME that shes some bible bashing, bush loving, torture loving neo-con just trying to shove her patriotism down everyone's throat, without actually knowing anything about the woman.

It's worth pointing out that I don't assume that's what the woman is like. When people argue there's no way hanging a U.S. flag could ever be considered offensive, I begged to differ and brought out a hypothetical example of how it could be. Your milage may vary based on experience.

 

[Thelona]

She can feel on her own time in her own home. The workplace isn't always your time or your place to express your beliefs and opinions, unless it happens to match up with them such as a political field and such. A hospital is as mixed as you're going to get when it comes to viewpoints and thoughts. Personal feelings have absolutely no place within it's walls.

in that case shouldn't the exact same principal be applied to the "personal feelings" of whoever filed the complaint about the flag?
This isnt about having "personal feelings" in a workplace, its about whos "personal feelings" take precedence. Which i think is a debate that will have no winners and will only get real ugly real fast.

also i wouldn't think that you'd have to think about the "mixed viewpoints and thoughts" of the people in your office when it comes to putting up and American flag.

what happened to that liberal ideal of tolerance, i mean how intolerant do you have to be to not be able to tolerate an American flag (and in texas of all states)


Edit:: to half's post. yeah i know you used it as an example but some people seem to have taking that example and run with it, and even given that example i don't see how an American flag would be "offensive", an annoyance maybe.

the only example I've seen in this thread where i can really imagine someone being "offended" was the one about someone from Vietnam. but really if your a Vietnamese living in America who's still so bitter about the war that you can't stand the site of an American flag. your in the wrong place buddy

 

[Khajit]

Yup. In America everyone must bow down to your religious idols.. oops i mean pledge allegiance to the flag. For some reason Whenever Americans talk about anything a decent majority of the time related to America it sounds more like they're speaking about their religion than an actual country or some object.
Oh and as for finding the American flag offensive there are plenty of countries that have been the brunt of American foreign policies that wouldn't be too happy with an American blindly waving a flag without bothering to find out WHAT is being done in the name of it.
"American Indians" love for the creation and expansion of America through the genocide of their people and culture. discuss.

Oh and just because something makes you feel uncomfortable without actually harming you doesnt mean that it's right to force your opinion on another person.

 

[Thelona]

Yup. In America everyone must bow down to your religious idols.. oops i mean pledge allegiance to the flag. For some reason Whenever Americans talk about anything a decent majority of the time related to America it sounds more like they're speaking about their religion than an actual country or some object.
Oh and as for finding the American flag offensive there are plenty of countries that have been the brunt of American foreign policies that wouldn't be too happy with an American blindly waving a flag without bothering to find out WHAT is being done in the name of it.
"American Indians" love for the creation and expansion of America through the genocide of their people and culture. discuss.

Oh and just because something makes you feel uncomfortable without actually harming you doesnt mean that it's right to force your opinion on another person.

first off the part about "there's plenty of countries that have taking the brunt of American foreign policy" that's debatable but moot because that flag wasn't in any of those countries, it was in America.

exactly what "opinion" is being "forced" on other people by putting up an American flag in your office during memorial day?

you talk as tho simply having to SEE the American flag means your being force fed someones opinion. Thats what pisses me off, the people who claim that they're being "forced" or their rights are somehow violated just cause they have to SEE a flag. or a cross, or a Christmas tree or w/e.

America is made of so many diff beliefs, opinions, religions that if you cant stand simply having to SEE it, then you should prob just suck it up and get over it.

Its like the post was talking about the gay pride flag, if i was working in an office and the guy in the next cubical hung up a gay pride flag, sure, I wouldn't LIKE it or AGREE with it, but i wouldn't go running to the manager to try have have him forced to take it down. because that's just a dick move.

people need to learn how to deal with seeing something they don't necessarily agree with or believe in, cause guess what, there a shitload of people out there who don't think like you do, don't believe in what you believe, and if simply SEEING that is enough to get you all worked up and angry, then maybe that's your own problem.


"Yup. In America everyone must bow down to your religious idols.. oops i mean pledge allegiance to the flag."

that quote is pretty much what I'm talking about, no ones forced to "bow down to religious idols" or even to say the pledge of allegiance anymore. but somehow "i had to see a nativity scene on the way to work today" turns into "i was forced to bow down to someones religious idol today"

seriously, suck it up.

(edit:: also you talk as tho everyone should read up and "find out whats being done in the name of it" before having an American flag, yeah sure displaying the flag of your country means you agree with and support every fucking thing the country has ever done or is doing. lmfao
the American flag means different things to different people, noone really thinks america is perfect, and someone putting up an American flag doesn't automatically mean they support the war in Iraq, or like bush or like Obama or are republican or democrat or w/e. stop worrying about what other people believe/do and worry about your own beliefs

 

[Mirewen]

somehow "i had to see a nativity scene on the way to work today" turns into "i was forced to bow down to someones religious idol today"

seriously, suck it up.

Agree.

It's a flag, I highly doubt it was being that destructive in the office, or that it was that much of a nuisance.

 

[Acutie]

It's kinda funny hearing someone living and working in the county the flag represents say that it offends them. This is one of the few examples where I do believe that if you don't like that, get the fuck out.

I could buy it if someone put up an american flag in Canada and it was found offensive to someone.

 

[bigbroon]

Having an American flag hanging somewhere in America, and that flag being removed because it offended someone, is quite ludicrous to me. The same kind of story happened here, where someone hanging the Union Jack on their window in their own home was told to take it down because it offended foreign people living in the street.

In this case, I agree with a few people who have said that the mostly likely reason for this lady being told to remove the flag was the size of it. 5x3 feet is excessively large for something in an office, so the fact it was a flag of her own nation is quite frankly irrelevant. However, the arguments about an American flag being offensive in America are ridiculous. The flag belongs to that country, and if seeing the flag of the country you're in offends you, you need to get a grip - regardless of whether or not the person who owns the flag is a bible-bashing over-patriotic pig.

 

[masterorion]

It's kinda funny hearing someone living and working in the county the flag represents say that it offends them. This is one of the few examples where I do believe that if you don't like that, get the fuck out.

I could buy it if someone put up an american flag in Canada and it was found offensive to someone.

offensive still isnt the word that would be used in that instance. i would say its more along the lines of disrespectful when its something that large. now if it were a tiny flag on someones desk in canada. then not so much. ive seen a couple canadian flags flown in front of houses here in michigan, but they arent viewed as offensive to me. it shows that families nationaility

 

[Strid]

Having an American flag hanging somewhere in America, and that flag being removed because it offended someone, is quite ludicrous to me.

Me too, but you know our country caters to the idiots unfortunately.

The same kind of story happened here, where someone hanging the Union Jack on their window in their own home was told to take it down because it offended foreign people living in the street.

I bet that has somethin' to do with the Homeowner's Association. If not, then all the homeowner had to do was refuse to take it down. It's a pretty cut and dry deal there, just not sure if the area the guy lives in is under Homeowner's Association rules.

I agree though that the flag was too big. Like people have already said, wear a pin, put up a desktop flag, wear some flag socks, whatever floats your boat. The boss man must be an idiot, even if people did say they were offended by it, he should have had it removed for bein' inappropriately sized for the office place. Had he done that, he'd have won the battle when it escalated like it did.

 

[Tomasello]

I'm going to keep this concise because I'm just not going to waste my time debating latte drinking, socialist, liberal filth. (Yes I realize all those adjectives are redundant).

If your an American who finds the flag offensive then you truly are a piece of garbage...

And all you jealous foreigners making your stupid anti-American commentaries can kiss my American ass. No one gives a shit about you or your primitive countries... You would all be nothing without the United States.

 

[Morcheeba]

Hm... is it not possible that someone born to a country, any country, may not agree with what their country stands for?

Just going to throw this out there, but there was a huge number of Germans around during Nazi Germany that did not agree with what their country stood for at that time, and to this day it's nearly taboo to bring it up to some. I worked with a woman who was a child during those times that explained to me in detail the disgust that a large majority of Germans felt against their country, their Fuhrer at that time that wanted nothing more than to leave and detach themselves from their heritage.

I know that's an extreme, but you gotta think, there can and will be people who do not share pride in their country as others do.

People need to be a bit more realistic when thinking and considering the possibilities.

Yes it's a bit ridiculous to be 'offended' over a flag, but if they truly feel the object holds negative connotations for them, who is anyone else to judge. There could be some Americans, born and bred, that had some disastrous things happen where they then relied on their justice system that ultimately failed them and now feel nothing but disgust for this country, this freedom that was stolen.. so what then?

Put your own feelings aside for a second and brush aside any and all arrogance and consider what is possible.


E- it's like this, just because YOU love your country and believe it's the cats ass doesn't mean your brethren feel the same.

As far as the OP is concerned, if size was the issue it's perfectly logical she be asked to take it down or replace it with a more sensible and work appropriate object. I would be terribly disappointed in any supervisor or boss of mine if they said just about any flag or country insignia was/is offensive, or any co-worker for that matter.