GM [Do you have a purpose?]

[bigbroon]

Firstly, this isn't a flame as it's about all GM's, it's just a bit of curiosity on my part.

Ok, I'm very curious to find out other people's opinions on GMs. I believe that GMs, in principle, are a very good idea, but the power they have and the way they use it makes them, for me anyway, ineffective.

The last time I was able to check my stats, I had 35 GM calls since I started playing 4 years ago. Of those calls, not one of them have been successful in fixing the problem I reported. The calls varied from 75's training every mob in Sarutabaruta to people fleeing in a circle for about 5 minutes and MPK attempts. The responses of the GMs have varied, from "Thank you, I can understand why this is frustrating and I will look into it" to "I'm sorry, but this is not an offence."

Just a few weeks ago, on my new character, I was partying in Qufim. A 75NIN was standing with his weapons out, facing away from a crab. It was trying (and failing, of course) to hit him, and he hadn't disengaged, so it stayed blue. A minor grievance, if that, but it was GMd anyway. The GM said "Holding a monster IS against the rules, but only if certain criteria are met:

1) The monster has to be an NM.
2) They have to hold the monster for an extended period of time (30 minutes +) without doing ANY damage to it at all
3) There have to be other people showing an active interest in the monster.

So holding monsters is against the rules, but only if you manage to claim the monster without doing any damage, engage it but turn around, and wait for 30 minutes while other people stand around you.

My real beef, though, is that I can stand and watch people break the rules blatantly, and the GM won't do anything about it, but I've been on the receiving end of a GM once, and was forced into complying because my Linkshell name was "offensive." Of all the things I had seen being let go by GMs, I had to drop my LS while it had 15 people sitting in it talking, and had 5 minutes to do so.

I've chatted to GMs even when they couldn't help me, and I don't believe they set the parameters of what is allowed and what isn't, but it gets a little frustrating for me when I send calls for offenses and get nothing done, but I get a call against me and they're super-quick to jump on me and force me into action. Has anyone else had good/bad experiences with GMs? I'd be curious to find out other people's opinions on them. Right now I'm at the stage where, if anything bad happens, I won't even bother calling a GM because I'm pretty sure they'll fob me off with pleasantries or tell me there's nothing they can do. Is it just me?

 

[Dancingweapon]

It isn't just you, they don't really seem to do much. I remember when Justin got stuck under a bridge in Windy and he teleported him out. Was a friendly guy and let us get a screen shot and gave a bit of banter with us. That was about it though. They seem to be better at turning up to "Leaving FFXI parties" more than anything I find lol >_>; Which is kinda not what they should be doing but, I suppose if they have free time it's cool that they do a little /goodbye.

Oh I remember when that douche LS, the endgame one? Forget it's name, but they were talking shit while we was doing a sandworm and just generally being nuisances. Several of us called a GM and I remember just asking him to show his face of something, he did. They soon stopped bothering us after that.

I mean, I suppose it's not their fault as they obviously have guidelines to follow and they are just doing their job at the end of the day. But you would hope they'd have a little more power really.

 

[Raesvelg]

It depends often on the GM you get, sadly. They don't all follow the same set of guidelines, and sometimes I get the distinct impression that a number of the JP GMs don't like us.

One of the guys in my linkshell was banned for advocating a minor act of griefing. NOT ACTUALLY DOING IT, just saying that we should. But there was some minor trash talking going on, so a GM had apparently been called (the other folks were a largely JP linkshell that was taking forever to kill Khimaira), and he pulled our LS chat logs and used it as a justification for a ban.

 

[jyakotsu]

It honestly depends on how you approach them. Time after time I've seen people start into their problem IMMEDIATELY w/o even starting a conversation with them. This is usually how the conversation takes place.

GM: Hello PersonX, my name is GM i read that there was a problem in reference to "holding a mob"
PersonX: ZOMG FUCKING PERSON Y HAS BEEN HOLDING A CRAB FOREVER AND SHOULD BE BANNED IMMEDIATELY"
GM: ..... what the fuck man at least ask me how my day is, or at least calmly tell me what is going on....
PersonX: ZOMG BAN BANBAN HIM HE HAS BEEN HOLDING HIM FOR LIKE EVER!

Get my drift? Honestly, I've been cordial to every single GM i've talked to and 7/10 times they've done exactly what I've asked in the first place. Albeit the newer GMs seem to do ALOT less than they used to. The GMs in the past have given people 72 hour bans for MPKing lol. I remember on my old server this guy would train the Malboro(Something Rose) to the Yhoatar Zone line, where alot of lvl 30 parties would take place... Needless to say the malboro would walk all the way back and rape every person in its pathway... That person got a 72 hour ban within seconds of doing it.

 

[Xalioniaf]

I got jailed and warned once for following someone a few years ago.
Not too long ago, someone I called out for afk meleeing in a party I was in decided to just follow me around everywhere. It was kind of funny as he followed me for hours as I went to go do random things, but eventually one of my friends reminded me of my jail time, so I decided to report this guy and see what happens.
Apparently somewhere within the last few years, following someone stopped being an offense. Who knew?

It honestly depends on how you approach them. Time after time I've seen people start into their problem IMMEDIATELY w/o even starting a conversation with them. This is usually how the conversation takes place.

What else do you expect, though? While the reporter's speech in your example is extreme, the GMs do pretty much open with some variation of "can you please explain the problem"? I didn't ask for a GM to make conversation, I asked for one to report a problem.

 

[Eilistrae]

my first and ONLY experience with a GM was when I got stuck in a terrain glitch (when I first started playing, so, noob... no scrolls or port abilities) ... he ported me out, bam and done lol oh well

 

[Liefe]

The real solution is to not have a pop system that can be abused to grief other players easily.

 

[kicamo]

my only experience with a gm was when my name got flagged...gm thought it was funny but i still had to change it :|

 

[jyakotsu]

I got jailed and warned once for following someone a few years ago.
Not too long ago, someone I called out for afk meleeing in a party I was in decided to just follow me around everywhere. It was kind of funny as he followed me for hours as I went to go do random things, but eventually one of my friends reminded me of my jail time, so I decided to report this guy and see what happens.
Apparently somewhere within the last few years, following someone stopped being an offense. Who knew?

What else do you expect, though? While the reporter's speech in your example is extreme, the GMs do pretty much open with some variation of "can you please explain the problem"? I didn't ask for a GM to make conversation, I asked for one to report a problem.

I'm just telling you what works lol. If you approach a policeman with the same attitude I guarantee you he/she will slap you with a citation or a sobriety test.

 

[Xalioniaf]

If I call a cop because someone robbed my house, I'm not going to start our conversation by asking him how his day was. He may appreciate it if I do, but my shit was stolen and I'd like the criminal caught.

 

[Courtney]

You really believe that:

1) The monster has to be an NM.
2) They have to hold the monster for an extended period of time (30 minutes +) without doing ANY damage to it at all
3) There have to be other people showing an active interest in the monster.

equals:

So holding monsters is against the rules, but only if you manage to claim the monster without doing any damage, engage it but turn around, and wait for 30 minutes while other people stand around you.

I suspect that the GMs don't act on your complaints because you really don't understand either the purpose or the actual meaning of the rules of the game. GMing someone who isn't affecting anyone, because you think they might be "technically" breaking a rule certainly isn't what GMs are for. It must take them a good deal of self control to actually give you those pleasentries...

 

[bigbroon]

You really believe that:


equals:


I suspect that the GMs don't act on your complaints because you really don't understand either the purpose or the actual meaning of the rules of the game. GMing someone who isn't affecting anyone, because you think they might be "technically" breaking a rule certainly isn't what GMs are for. It must take them a good deal of self control to actually give you those pleasentries...

You seem to struggle reading. I don't recall ever saying I GM'd someone who wasn't affecting anyone, purely because they were breaking the rules. I said that someone broke a rule that I was aware of, that was negatively influencing me, and I reported them for it.

Then, after speaking to the GM, it became clear that their rule of "holding monsters is not allowed" isn't exactly what most people with any level of common sense would assume. My "equals" in my previous post is perfectly accurate, actually. "Holding a monster", by their standards anyway, is holding a Notorious Monster with no damage on it for 30 minutes+ with other people around you. GM's words, not mine.

I'm perfectly aware of the fact that approaching a GM nicely is a good way to get things done, and it's how I do it. If I need a GM to fix something (not that I reserve much hope) I'll talk to them politely and even enter into a brief conversation initially to engage their pleasantries. I never said, once again, that I sent a GM a /tell saying "fix this dude", as I know it wouldn't get anything done. My experience is that, no matter your grievance, it seems that GM's will fix the irrelevant and ignore the problem that is actually a violation of the rules. Therefore, I ask you, what is the point of them? If you're telling me you've only had positive experiences with GM's, fair enough, but accusing me of being at fault for GM's being impotent is way off the mark.

 

[Romper]

It honestly depends on how you approach them. Time after time I've seen people start into their problem IMMEDIATELY w/o even starting a conversation with them. This is usually how the conversation takes place.

GM: Hello PersonX, my name is GM i read that there was a problem in reference to "holding a mob"
PersonX: ZOMG FUCKING PERSON Y HAS BEEN HOLDING A CRAB FOREVER AND SHOULD BE BANNED IMMEDIATELY"
GM: ..... what the fuck man at least ask me how my day is, or at least calmly tell me what is going on....
PersonX: ZOMG BAN BANBAN HIM HE HAS BEEN HOLDING HIM FOR LIKE EVER!

Get my drift? Honestly, I've been cordial to every single GM i've talked to and 7/10 times they've done exactly what I've asked in the first place. Albeit the newer GMs seem to do ALOT less than they used to. The GMs in the past have given people 72 hour bans for MPKing lol. I remember on my old server this guy would train the Malboro(Something Rose) to the Yhoatar Zone line, where alot of lvl 30 parties would take place... Needless to say the malboro would walk all the way back and rape every person in its pathway... That person got a 72 hour ban within seconds of doing it.

Not trying to create a flame on you here, but customer service shouldn't be about small talk. Customer service is there to service problems of the customer. If I wanted small talk I'd hop on chat roulette, dodge the penises, and chit-chat with someone that isn't being paid to take care of problems.

 

[bigbroon]

Not trying to create a flame on you here, but customer service shouldn't be about small talk. Customer service is there to service problems of the customer. If I wanted small talk I'd hop on chat roulette, dodge the penises, and chit-chat with someone that isn't being paid to take care of problems.

Where or where hath mine green dot gone.

 

[Courtney]

You seem to struggle reading. I don't recall ever saying I GM'd someone who wasn't affecting anyone, purely because they were breaking the rules. I said that someone broke a rule that I was aware of, that was negatively influencing me, and I reported them for it.

Then, after speaking to the GM, it became clear that their rule of "holding monsters is not allowed" isn't exactly what most people with any level of common sense would assume. My "equals" in my previous post is perfectly accurate, actually. "Holding a monster", by their standards anyway, is holding a Notorious Monster with no damage on it for 30 minutes+ with other people around you. GM's words, not mine.

Actually I think you struggle remembering what you wrote. It's still there at the top if you need a refresher. You called him for holding a crab in an area with a very large number of crab spawns, not because he was affecting you in any way, lol.

Just a few weeks ago, on my new character, I was partying in Qufim. A 75NIN was standing with his weapons out, facing away from a crab. It was trying (and failing, of course) to hit him, and he hadn't disengaged, so it stayed blue. A minor grievance, if that, but it was GMd anyway.

Holding a mob wasn't originally against the rules. It became against the rules when people started holding HNMs (Fafnir and Aspid particularly) to keep them within certain time windows so that the holders group were the only people that got access to them. When merits made surviving HNMs easier people also used to claim them with only a couple of players and could hold the mob indefinitely, with no chance of actually killing the mob.

GMing a person for holding a low level crab in an area teeming with low level crabs is just being an ass...

 

[kicamo]

Firstly, this isn't a flame as it's about all GM's, it's just a bit of curiosity on my part.

Ok, I'm very curious to find out other people's opinions on GMs. I believe that GMs, in principle, are a very good idea, but the power they have and the way they use it makes them, for me anyway, ineffective.

The last time I was able to check my stats, I had 35 GM calls since I started playing 4 years ago. Of those calls, not one of them have been successful in fixing the problem I reported. The calls varied from 75's training every mob in Sarutabaruta to people fleeing in a circle for about 5 minutes and MPK attempts. The responses of the GMs have varied, from "Thank you, I can understand why this is frustrating and I will look into it" to "I'm sorry, but this is not an offence."

Just a few weeks ago, on my new character, I was partying in Qufim. A 75NIN was standing with his weapons out, facing away from a crab. It was trying (and failing, of course) to hit him, and he hadn't disengaged, so it stayed blue. A minor grievance, if that, but it was GMd anyway. The GM said "Holding a monster IS against the rules, but only if certain criteria are met:

1) The monster has to be an NM.
2) They have to hold the monster for an extended period of time (30 minutes +) without doing ANY damage to it at all
3) There have to be other people showing an active interest in the monster.

So holding monsters is against the rules, but only if you manage to claim the monster without doing any damage, engage it but turn around, and wait for 30 minutes while other people stand around you.

My real beef, though, is that I can stand and watch people break the rules blatantly, and the GM won't do anything about it, but I've been on the receiving end of a GM once, and was forced into complying because my Linkshell name was "offensive." Of all the things I had seen being let go by GMs, I had to drop my LS while it had 15 people sitting in it talking, and had 5 minutes to do so.

I've chatted to GMs even when they couldn't help me, and I don't believe they set the parameters of what is allowed and what isn't, but it gets a little frustrating for me when I send calls for offenses and get nothing done, but I get a call against me and they're super-quick to jump on me and force me into action. Has anyone else had good/bad experiences with GMs? I'd be curious to find out other people's opinions on them. Right now I'm at the stage where, if anything bad happens, I won't even bother calling a GM because I'm pretty sure they'll fob me off with pleasantries or tell me there's nothing they can do. Is it just me?

if the rule says the mob has to be a nm for it to be against the rules then how did he break them?

 

[bigbroon]

Actually I think you struggle remembering what you wrote. It's still there at the top if you need a refresher. You called him for holding a crab in an area with a very large number of crab spawns, not because he was affecting you in any way, lol.




Holding a mob wasn't originally against the rules. It became against the rules when people started holding HNMs (Fafnir and Aspid particularly) to keep them within certain time windows so that the holders group were the only people that got access to them. When merits made surviving HNMs easier people also used to claim them with only a couple of players and could hold the mob indefinitely, with no chance of actually killing the mob.

GMing a person for holding a low level crab in an area teeming with low level crabs is just being an ass...

You're obviously not interested in listening to other people's opinions, despite the fact that what may not be annoying to you may be very annoying to someone else. I took your advice and took a refresher - maybe you should do the same, now. The area may have been teaming with crabs, but (especially at night when your roaming capabilities are limited) competing with other parties is bad enough, without seeing the last available monster being held by some high-level person for absolutely no reason. Therefore, to say I GM'd someone for something that wasn't affecting me is far from the truth - and far from being an ass, also.

if the rule says the mob has to be a nm for it to be against the rules then how did he break them?

The rule doesn't "say" this, the rule says holding is not allowed, but the GM specified that it has to be an NM. Hence my complaint - I wasn't aware of the stipulations on this rule that I stated in a previous post. Like I said in my original post, GM's are anal about certain things and impotent when it comes to solving other issues.

 

[kicamo]

still callin a gm cuz someone is holding a crab in a place where lots pop is kinda weak.

 

[jyakotsu]

You're obviously not interested in listening to other people's opinions, despite the fact that what may not be annoying to you may be very annoying to someone else. I took your advice and took a refresher - maybe you should do the same, now. The area may have been teaming with crabs, but (especially at night when your roaming capabilities are limited) competing with other parties is bad enough, without seeing the last available monster being held by some high-level person for absolutely no reason. Therefore, to say I GM'd someone for something that wasn't affecting me is far from the truth - and far from being an ass, also.



The rule doesn't "say" this, the rule says holding is not allowed, but the GM specified that it has to be an NM. Hence my complaint - I wasn't aware of the stipulations on this rule that I stated in a previous post. Like I said in my original post, GM's are anal about certain things and impotent when it comes to solving other issues.

"But officer I didn't know the speed limit was 40 in this zone, I could have sworn that it was 55"
Officer: "Tough shit you still get a ticket."

 

[bigbroon]

still callin a gm cuz someone is holding a crab in a place where lots pop is kinda weak.

I wasn't aware your GM call had to be strong in everyone else's opinion. A rule is a rule, whether you think it "weak" or not.

"But officer I didn't know the speed limit was 40 in this zone, I could have sworn that it was 55"
Officer: "Tough shit you still get a ticket."

The relevance of this statement is? Some guy speeding in an area he doesn't know the limit of is comparable to me calling a GM for a rule they weren't specific about? That's a mighty weak analogy, even for you.

The holding a crab is just one example, there are many others. GM's, in my experience anyway, will fix the totally irrelevant but can't help you when you really need it.