"Good times?" Depends on your perspective I guess

[Zyndara]

Regarding this thread:
http://www.qcdn.org/ffxi/showthread.php?t=44827

So I am sorry if you disagree with my choice. RMT are scum and do nothing but ruin the game for everyone. If I can find a way to profit off them, i.e. making a gain for myself while making them lose out, I will definitely take it. Which is exactly what I did.

If you chose to spend 100 hours in sky to get one drop thats your deal. Maybe you plan on playing this game forever. Maybe you dont work and are still in school. Maybe this game is your life. I on the otherhand have alot of things to do outside this game and my time is very valuable and I will make this game enjoyable now because honestly, no I will not be playing this game forever. Which is why when RMT takes away the time I do have to get drops and enjoy the game I become quite angered.

I have a problem with people crashing genuine Good Times threads, too. And you're right, it probably should have been something someone addressed in another area. However, I don't think a display of poor sportsmanship/stealing/lying/manipulating is cause for celebration. And I think if you choose to make a celebration out of it, then you need to deal with the flack that results. The fact is, RMT has screwed over everyone in this game by simply being in this game. They've angered/frustrated a lot of people and made things difficult for legitimate players, to be certain. But to inflate yourself and what you did as some heroic action, or bristle at people who aren't for fast-food end game gear for criticizing you speaks a lot more of your character than it does of RMTs. We all know what they do. We all know they make the game unpleasant a lot of the time for a lot of people. But I don't call being as despicable as they are a triumph. And I'm pretty sure they don't see it as anything more than a minor inconvenience. The only thing you've accomplished is showing that people can and will be as manipulative, as underhanded, and as selfish as RMT are in accomplishing what they want. I'm sorry, but that's the reality of the situation.

 

[K. Ishitar]

Question: Do you think of this as the same level as RMT or think it less or more because it was a prejudiced act twoards RMT?

Is it to assume that this person would perform this to legit players, yes that is the reality of the situation that stealing is still stealing, but it's a bit much to assume it would be done to legit players the statement didnt say that but it seems to be leaning that way

 

[Kunel]

To each his own. As far as I am concerned this is over now.

 

[Zyndara]

Question: Do you think of this as the same level as RMT or think it less or more because it was a prejudiced act twoards RMT?

Is it to assume that this person would perform this to legit players, yes that is the reality of the situation that stealing is still stealing, but it's a bit much to assume it would be done to legit players the statement didnt say that but it seems to be leaning that way

I think that stealing is stealing regardless of who it's directed toward. And your question brings up pretty much the point I'm trying to make which is: Is really crappy behavior suddenly justified because we're talking about RMT? I'm not trying to villify Kunel. He's not the first person and he won't be the last to do something like this. And although I don't know him personally, I'd go out on a limb and say, he's probably a good guy who got pissed off and that no, he wouldn't do this to another legit player. I'm just saying I don't think stooping to the kind of behavior we condemn RMT for is the way to make a point or somehow get revenge. Especially if you somehow profit from it which, after all, is what they piss us off doing, correct?

 

[Kotsu]

lol @ two wrongs make a right? Let the kids enjoy their proud moment Zyn, after all they probably feel like they finally beat daddy in a game of one-on-one with this shit. They'll grow up eventually.

 

[Garvin]

What applies to players does not necessarily apply to non-players.
Gil farmers are not players.

Everything you're saying would be 100% absolutely true if RMT had the slightest hint of legitimacy to them. They do not.

 

[Zyndara]

Well I think that's bullshit. But I wasn't brought up to shit on someone because you don't like them. I think they're scum too. If I see one dead, I don't raise them. But I don't compromise myself as an ethical player to screw them. I guess if that's the kind of thing people get off on it's their business. I just think that sucks.

 

[RaidrX]

RMT Have feelings? Since when....

On a more serious note, although i do think its funny, i agree that it is still kind of a shitty thing to do. Not that normal players would ever sell god shit like this but if they did and he jacked them people would be furious. Sure RMT are lolRMT but its still a dick move.

 

[Garvin]

Well I think that's bullshit. But I wasn't brought up to shit on someone because you don't like them. I think they're scum too. If I see one dead, I don't raise them. But I don't compromise myself as an ethical player to screw them. I guess if that's the kind of thing people get off on it's their business. I just think that sucks.

You're misunderstanding what I'm saying.
They aren't players. They aren't playing FFXI for any reason. They exist, as a tool, to break the rules, nothing more.

They SHOULD have their access to the game revoked, something "worse" than just stealing from them.

I think the whole misunderstanding is that you're mistaking multiple people using a character to do nothing more than break the rules for a single person who is actually playing the game.

Again, the only questionable aspect of this is that he gave them some money.

 

[Kerowynn]

I guess I look at this as more of a triumph because I view RMT as more similar to a type of mob, not players.

 

[Romper]

I am on the fence. It's stealing, and yes he did pay 500k for the pants. Then again it is RMT, and come on it was slightly cool. I just wont say much except we all have our opinions now lets MPK the fuckers at Despot.

 

[Skaw]

But I don't compromise myself as an ethical player to screw them.

But they'll do the same to you in a heartbeat, with cheats. Doing it to them legitimately still makes you a ethical player.

Maybe you dont work and are still in school.

Okay. So they don't work, and they're in school. Like the difference of one free hour a day between your standard Employee(8,) and your standard Student(6.5+.5~ from homework) is SO GREAT that the ability to spend 100 hours in sky is miraculously concieved like the baby Jesus.

Theres a reason why being a Teacher is a full time job, because being a Student is virtually one as well.

 

[Isac]

Zyn id love to test your "ethics" in this matter.

Say RMT used hacks and cheats to consistantly on a daily basis, halt you from ever obtaining a very important pice of gear to you. Would you still hold true to your honar and look the other way our would you do whatever it takes to get the job done?

(cus essensially thats what happed here)

Im sry but i cant for a second believe you would still think this way if the situation actually caused you some physical harm.

Suvival of the fitest sweet heart.

(and plz dont argue symantics about the term "physical harm", to deffend your opinion, you know what im talking about)

 

[Rhaddy]

Zyn id love to test your "ethics" in this matter.

Say RMT used hacks and cheats to consistantly on a daily basis, halt you from ever obtaining a very important pice of gear to you. Would you still hold true to your honar and look the other way our would you do whatever it takes to get the job done?

(cus essensially thats what happed here)

Im sry but i cant for a second believe you would still think this way if the situation actually caused you some physical harm.

Suvival of the fitest sweet heart.

(and plz dont argue symantics about the term "physical harm", to deffend your opinion, you know what im talking about)

stop posting.

 

[Bajaratt]

Zyn id love to test your "ethics" in this matter.

Say RMT used hacks and cheats to consistantly on a daily basis, halt you from ever obtaining a very important pice of gear to you. Would you still hold true to your honar and look the other way our would you do whatever it takes to get the job done?

(cus essensially thats what happed here)

Im sry but i cant for a second believe you would still think this way if the situation actually caused you some physical harm.

Suvival of the fitest sweet heart.

(and plz dont argue symantics about the term "physical harm", to deffend your opinion, you know what im talking about)

Considering how Zyn hasn't ripped off the gil sellers; so by your own "logic" obviously Zyn's ethics are still intact. Hundreds of people have been directly hurt by gil sellers counter camping them and almost none of them have ripped off the gil sellers, so stop acting like they're the norm and people who think that stealing is wrong are in the minority.

 

[Zyndara]

Zyn id love to test your "ethics" in this matter.

Say RMT used hacks and cheats to consistantly on a daily basis, halt you from ever obtaining a very important pice of gear to you. Would you still hold true to your honar and look the other way our would you do something about it?

(cus essensially thats what happed here)

Im sry but i cant for a second believe you would still think this way if the situation actually caused you some physical harm.

(and plz dont argue symantics about the term "physical harm", to deffend your opinion, you know what im talking about)

You're kidding yourself if you think RMT hasn't done this to one degree or another to anyone who wants anything from sky, hnms, nms. Look around. This affects everyone. So yes, it has affected me. It did when they were monopolizing Ulli and it does now they're trying to monopolize Despot. So let's not act like I don't know what I'm talking about or have no personal experience here. I'm not unlike anyone who has worked for a piece of gear. And I've been farming sky for a hell of a lot longer than 100 hours over my time in this game. So don't give me that "if it affected you it would be different" garbage.

And to answer your question, yes, some people actually hold to their honor and stick to it. Even when it hurts. That's why it's called honor. It isn't easy and it isn't convenient. Some people believe in staying true even when it means they aren't happy having to do it. If not compromising myself makes me weak in anyone's eyes, then so be it.

 

[Rappa]

Spoilers: sky pop items aren't hard to get, and the rmt aren't stopping you from getting them yourself.

 

[Isac]

Fare enough zyn, im only sceptic of peoples word considering most are full of shit till the time comes to actually prove themselfs.

Baj: i never said people who think stealing form RMT is in the minority or that they are wrong for being so, i only agree with what he did since its kind of a smack back in the face for all the destruction they caused in the first place, as little as it may be, its still a hit, and any hit is good enough for me.

and..

stop posting.

ya, good one, stop posting yourself unless your gona back up your point.

 

[Valandil]

Zyn id love to test your "ethics" in this matter.

Say RMT used hacks and cheats to consistantly on a daily basis, halt you from ever obtaining a very important pice of gear to you. Would you still hold true to your honar and look the other way our would you do whatever it takes to get the job done?

(cus essensially thats what happed here)

Im sry but i cant for a second believe you would still think this way if the situation actually caused you some physical harm.

Suvival of the fitest sweet heart.

(and plz dont argue symantics about the term "physical harm", to deffend your opinion, you know what im talking about)

I share the same attitude as Zyn on this matter. It's precisely this "win at all costs" mentality that enables RMT. If people did not feel it necessary to define themselves as individuals/players by the items they possess, then there would be no RMT because no one would need to buy gil in order to buy the items to make themselves feel more complete or adequate. Does better gear improve your gameplay? Absolutely. But you can still be one hell of an effective player without having the most sought after gear.

My attitude towards the way I play this game has always been this: Which is going to last longer after this game is no longer active; people remembering the "1337" gear I had or people remembering the way I played the game. This is the very essence of the honor that Zy referred to.

I am also of the opinion that once you adopt the mentality of your enemies (i.e. it's okay to steal gear or it's okay to blow up innocent civilizian) you've already taken the first and the largest step to becoming that which you are fighting against. Does this mean I think Kunel is equal to an RMT? Of course not, but it's a very slippery slope. Once you do it the first time, it becomes progressively easier to rationalize. Pretty soon you can justify doing it to a legit player that you just don't like or hardly know. Before you know it, you're doing it all the time to virtually anyone you can con. Just ask anyone who has used cheats/hacks on a regular basis in the past.

I am not a Christian, but perhaps Zyn and others who agree with her are. Being as such, there is one Christian doctrine that I do have a great deal of respect for (when it's upheld) and that is the doctrine that all sin is equal in the eyes of God. There is no distinction between the degree of the sin nor to whom the inequity is performed against. Even if you're not a Chrisitian, the consistency principle of this moral premise carries a lot of weight because sin could just easily be replace with the breaking of a secular law or any other religious/moral code and the absolution of its wrongness is not dimished in the least.

 

[Skaw]

Spoilers: sky pop items aren't hard to get, and the rmt aren't stopping you from getting them yourself.

Fuck you Rappa, I didn't finish the book yet

It's precisely this "win at all costs" mentality that enables RMT.

Actually, it's more of a "win with disregards to cost" mentality that enables RMT.