Handling Misconduct (Jan. 22)

I don't know, I think the full-on banhammer was the right course.

They had people combing logs for a couple of months, going back more than a year. SE also says that exploiting glitches and the like can merit immediate and severe reaction.

Here's my two cents: The folks who heard about the glitch and went to try it, or maybe found it on accident (Though I don't know how you accidentally break alliance, change leaders then lot) got off with the warning. But a huge number of people banned permanently were hit with the LM-17, which required you to call SE to get the sentence from a live person.

I think SE took this personally. You know there had to be someone who was going on about how easy this way, or how they'd get away with it, or something stupid that would have pissed off a GM or developer somewhere.

First offense might only warrant a temp ban or warning but a lot of the people guilty got away with murder, so that's what SE charged them for. Murder = life/death penalty.

I can't say I feel bad for anyone who took advantage of it; Claiming it was SE's own fault for writing bad code that caused the patch is as stupid as saying it was okay to kill someone because hey, the knife went right through his skin. Their fault for not being tougher, right?

Edit: Mercury posted while I was writing and summed up my feelings about a million times better than I did here, even if he did use the words "perfidious" and "tho" in the same sentence. =p
 
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i think SE just doing this for warning, not trying to actually get all the people that cheated.

i wonder will people exploit again after this.

idk if that Minidragon's post is true or not, but funny how he said he dont bot, but only on his mules.
I wonder if all those people with best possible gears and multiple relic cheated some how. just look at all the relics that got banned. and wonder did they get those best gears by cheating, or they cheat because they spent all the time to get those best gears already.
 
Uzor said:
We're up to 67 relics, 2 mythics and 10 LS leaders now, not counting this server.
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We had 2 mythics? lol I didn't even know that.
 
Tyrath said:
We had 2 mythics? lol I didn't even know that.
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I think we stopped caring once we learned how terrible the first one was.

Hey, maybe that was a dry run to see how we'd react? Maybe we can get some real mythic weapons now that the cheater's one is gone...

...that's sarcasm.

But yeah, as far as I know NA had 2 mythics.

Keyword is "had."
 
Had at least 3, two pld swords and a blu sword...prolly more than that but people dont always run straight to BG. Some guy is/was almost done with the MNK h2h (they actually could use acc...so maybe it wont be so bad? /hope)

You guys are kidding yourselves if you think a lot of those people simply used some cheat and that made everything easy for them and that's why they were so successful. Besides the fact you are just kicking people while they are down (they got fucking perma-banned, they payed the price), somehow nullifying everything else they did is just ignorant and ridiculous.

Does this shit make Kaeko's contributions to the entire ffxi world any less bad ass? I know I for one am thankful for all the research he(?) has done over the years and everyone in ffxi loses without people like that around. Hell, we all owe a decent amount to Kisada/Kaizen for perfecting the NIN/DRK and Fire resists setup on Tiamat (and other HNMs). Yea, it would have been discovered by someone else eventually (well more than likely), but at the time it was incredibly revolutionary and personally helped me a ton with developing strategies for tanking these HNMs in their earlier years. Everyone who ends up getting banned payed a very large price and doesn't need to be ridiculed by others (and no, not one friend I know got banned, temp or otherwise, this is just how I feel about it).
 
Zoolander said:
You guys are kidding yourselves if you think a lot of those people simply used some cheat and that made everything easy for them and that's why they were so successful. Besides the fact you are just kicking people while they are down (they got fucking perma-banned, they payed the price), somehow nullifying everything else they did is just ignorant and ridiculous.

Does this shit make Kaeko's contributions to the entire ffxi world any less bad ass? I know I for one am thankful for all the research he(?) has done over the years and everyone in ffxi loses without people like that around. Hell, we all owe a decent amount to Kisada/Kaizen for perfecting the NIN/DRK and Fire resists setup on Tiamat (and other HNMs). Yea, it would have been discovered by someone else eventually (well more than likely), but at the time it was incredibly revolutionary and personally helped me a ton with developing strategies for tanking these HNMs in their earlier years. Everyone who ends up getting banned payed a very large price and doesn't need to be ridiculed by others (and no, not one friend I know got banned, temp or otherwise, this is just how I feel about it).
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I'm sorry, they don't deserve ridicule? I don't care if you invented the strategies on every hnm there is, if you cheat, you cheat. Especially if they're one of those who wanted to act like they hold everyone to a standard of straight and narrow, and get caught cheating, then you're damn straight, they deserve all the ridicule they get.

The fact is if someone cheats in one area, you have no way of knowing where else they did it. So all their glorious accomplishments? They have to be questioned. That's the unfortunate side-effect of lying or cheating - if you've done it once, there's more than a good chance you've done it more than once.
 
I don't know about everyone else, but I've been thoroughly enjoying the past two days.
Hilarious.
 
Zoolander said:
Had at least 3, two pld swords and a blu sword...prolly more than that but people dont always run straight to BG. Some guy is/was almost done with the MNK h2h (they actually could use acc...so maybe it wont be so bad? /hope)

You guys are kidding yourselves if you think a lot of those people simply used some cheat and that made everything easy for them and that's why they were so successful. Besides the fact you are just kicking people while they are down (they got fucking perma-banned, they payed the price), somehow nullifying everything else they did is just ignorant and ridiculous.

Does this shit make Kaeko's contributions to the entire ffxi world any less bad ass? I know I for one am thankful for all the research he(?) has done over the years and everyone in ffxi loses without people like that around. Hell, we all owe a decent amount to Kisada/Kaizen for perfecting the NIN/DRK and Fire resists setup on Tiamat (and other HNMs). Yea, it would have been discovered by someone else eventually (well more than likely), but at the time it was incredibly revolutionary and personally helped me a ton with developing strategies for tanking these HNMs in their earlier years. Everyone who ends up getting banned payed a very large price and doesn't need to be ridiculed by others (and no, not one friend I know got banned, temp or otherwise, this is just how I feel about it).
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Seriously, you of all people should give them a good swift kick in the ass if not for your own treatment, but the way they treated your LS members.
 
Zoolander said:
You guys are kidding yourselves if you think a lot of those people simply used some cheat and that made everything easy for them and that's why they were so successful.
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From what I see, if you check the BG threads, you see a lot of people in HNMLs that got hit with a ban. It's not a coincidence IMO. From what I observed, those people claimed that everyone they knew that did salvage knew the trick. It seems to me that there was some internet site or "network" or something alike that all the trash endgamers were checking regularely on which the trick was revealed and kept secret. Hence why people of different server knew it. I mean I've done salvage for very long and checked a lot of salvage related topics on forums and never heard of this glitch.





I think it's safe to say that all/most those who got banned are aware and use(d) cheat tools through this network to get their stuff (or part of) done. This mass-ban proves that salvage was done this way. It's probably only the top of the icebreg. What about botting in Dragon'aery etc.

Anyone knows where all those people initially learned the trick ? :p That's be intersting.
 
Xalioniaf said:
I don't know about everyone else, but I've been thoroughly enjoying the past two days.
Hilarious.
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Exactly this.

Also, agreeing with the above signed. Finding out new job combos and builds and research does not make you exempt from being a cheater. There is no getting off easy because you contributed to the environment around you; criminal is criminal.

Apples to oranges, but if your awesome friendly neighbor was a counterfeiter, you couldn't tell the cops he lent you his keg tap and expect him to get off easy.

You'd just keep his keg tap for your next party.
 
pchan said:
What about botting in Dragon'aery etc.

Anyone knows where all those people initially learned the trick ? :p That's be intersting.
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I would make an educated guess and say it was discovered by accident by different people on different servers and spread around through word of mouth. People on different servers talk to each other as well, so only takes one person talking to another for it to eventually spread to another server.

And botting in DA is already pretty well established as a very harsh reality, although in all honesty this server is not nearly as rampant in terms of botting as others.


Lavi you make a good point, but I harbor most of the anger for the crap "they" pulled on others(who I think have since left the game, some anyway), not specifically those who are rumored to be gone. Plus its kind of in the past and like I previously said, I wouldn't wish permabans on anyone.

Edit:

Lyall said:
Exactly this.

Also, agreeing with the above signed. Finding out new job combos and builds and research does not make you exempt from being a cheater. There is no getting off easy because you contributed to the environment around you; criminal is criminal.
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I didn't say they shouldn't be exempt, please point out where I said that. I did however say that they paid the price for their actions and I for one don't view things in such absolute, black and white terms as apparently you do. Of course, you are prolly one of those people who thinks windower is a cheat as well and we should all be banned.
 
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pchan said:
Anyone knows where all those people initially learned the trick ? :p That's be intersting.
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Its a glitch; someone found it out by accident. There's no way someone willingly thought they would break alliance, change party leaders and lot.

Its kind of like finding out how Missingno. worked in the original pokemon games. (Yeah, I went there.) Totally nonsensical series of events SOMEONE found out how to do.
 
I feel the ban hammer was the right choice and am glad to see the back of these people. Them walking around in salvage gear was a kick in the teeth to the people that earned it.
 
One of my friends on Hades said that 2 of his Dynamis leaders, the shellholder, and their Dynamis bank all got the permaban hammer. 30 mil in gil gone for them.
 
I personally think a perma is far too serious for this.
If they planned to give out perma bans they should of atleast given a clear warning specifying if you do this your in risk of a perma ban.
In my opinion the problem should of been fixed asap.
And a good solution would be temp/ possibility of gear being taken away.
 
Zoolander said:
I didn't say they shouldn't be exempt, please point out where I said that. I did however say that they paid the price for their actions and I for one don't view things in such absolute, black and white terms as apparently you do. Of course, you are prolly one of those people who thinks windower is a cheat as well and we should all be banned.
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You're right, you didn't say that. I'm reading a ton of posts at once and sorta /made up/ the part where you said people should be exempt. Confused what was on BG somewhere.

Also, wtf does "one of those people" mean? I was unaware that thinking people should get punished for breaking ToS was outrageous and away from the norm. Do I use Windower? No, but I don't have any problems against it. TParty? Useful. Parser information? Handy at times. Distance? Cool for mages.

You're damn right I see this as a black and white situation; There is breaking the rules and not breaking the rules. For no reason is it okay for someone to exploit something because at no point is excelling in this game a necessity. When the Windower has a gil-dispensing or gear-duping extension I'll have a problem with it.

But you're probably one of those people who thinks its okay because it doesn't hurt anyone, amirite?

...See what I did there?
 
Ata said:
I personally think a perma is far too serious for this.
If they planned to give out perma bans they should of atleast given a clear warning specifying if you do this your in risk of a perma ban.
In my opinion the problem should of been fixed asap.
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They gave plenty of warning, its in the Terms of Service agreement no one reads until shit like this happens.
 
I realise its in the ToS; but saying that, use of third party tools and RMT activities are also in the ToS, and they nearly always (99%) of the time get a temp ban/warning first before moving into permanent.
 
They did the cheat multiple times. They used up thier warnings when they repeated the duping.
 
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