How do I deal? (Warning: Long Post)

[Alereth]

A short version to the next 5 million paragraphs can be found in bold at the bottom of the post.

So I need a little help here, because I'm not quite sure if I'm justified in feeling the way I am.

Background: About 10 months (October 2006) before I joined the military, my dad split on my mom. He cites reasons such as "needing to do his own thing" and "living life without being married" and such. He maintains he didn't abandon us kids, and he's tried to keep in our lives. I have 2 younger siblings. Despite the reasons he cited, he moved in with this women he worked with. On a side note, she is a total bitch. I mean the kind that TRIES to be a home-wrecker.

Last year around this time, he calls me up to tell me the "great news" that he's getting married to said bitch. I really had no idea what to say, and I was honestly beset with extreme anger that still hasn't subsided. His reasons for leaving my mom seem to have been nothing but lies. I was stunned silent on the phone and quickly ended the call with him.

Now, about a month ago, I get another call from him saying she's pregnant. He, of course, presents this as wonderful news that I should be excited for them about. The same thing as last year; I couldn't find words (or rather, the polite words) to say and had to quickly end the call again before I said anything I hadn't thought through. My anger is mounting even more and I feel this is a slap in the face to not only my mother, but our entire family.

He's changed alot, and it all seems to be because of her. It's as if she's that little devil whispering in his ear, turning him against my sister, whom was the "favorite" for as long as I can remember. (Which I didn't have a problem with.)

My sister is 19, moved out with her boyfriend. (He's cool and treats her right. I'm not concerned.) My little brother is 12 and is taking the biggest hit from all of this. He's too scared to say what he's really feeling to my dad and he despises being over at their place. (My parents switch off weekly.)

Me being stationed away from home is making it a little easier on me, but I still don't know how I'm supposed to deal with this. I've talked to anger managment specialists, psychologists, etc. etc. But they just want to analyze why I'm angry rather than help me deal with the situation.

Ever since he left, I've been using the "He's my father, I have to keep trying" excuse when it comes to keeping him in my life or breaking off all contact.

I've done the best I can in remaining civil and trying to manage. I still went over to his place for some holidays and I endure her horrible existance, but I feel like I'm at the limit for what I can take, and this whole pregnancy thing has topped it off.

My personal perspective: I hate him. I hate what he's done to my mother, what he's doing to my family and how he's continuing to be a thorn in my side. He isn't the father I knew when I was being raised and it's really taking a toll on our family. Family friends aren't even associating with him and even most of our extended family don't want to deal with him. The "He's my father" excuse can only go so far, but I need to know if I'm justified in feeling this way.

Short version: Am I justified in hating my father and breaking off all contact with him because he's a liar and has left my entire family in ruins and even continues to be a problem for us?

 

[Ecks]

Based on the short version, yes. Sound pretty justified to hate the guy even if he is your dad. Sounds like he's a pretty miserable human being.

 

[Dancingweapon]

"Secret lovers become public enemies"

 

[Lucki]

Short version: Am I justified in hating my father and breaking off all contact with him because he's a liar and has left my entire family in ruins and even continues to be a problem for us?

short answer: no, not really

From what I've gathered, you haven't told your father how you feel about everything. If this is true than you aren't justified in breaking off all contact with him (but are in hating him). I know it's shitty what he put you're family through, but you still need to be the bigger person and tell him what you're feeling.

I'm going to play the devil's advocate here and try and look at things from his point of view, so bare with me. It sounds like he wasn't happy being with your mother, and this other woman did make him happy. He probably told you those things to try and protect you and your siblings feelings, even if it was done in a completely shitty way. Thinking that everything was more or less cool with you, he proceeded to call you when was marrying this woman, as well as when she was going to have a baby. Since he's now happy, and hasn't heard anything that may lead him to believe otherwise from you, he would naturally think you're happy for him.

I can only imagine how much this sucks, but you need to tell him exactly how you feel. Then, if you still want to break all contact with him, do it. He knows how you feel now, and you've gotten the closure that you need.

 

[Uzor]

imo, it depends. Exactly how did he leave you in ruins? Did he take all of your family's money with him? How is he still a problem to your family?

Reality is, love don't always last forever. It's sad but true. If your father don't love your mother anymore, it would be wrong of you to demand he pretends he still do and live with it. He's a human being too, with the right to live his own life. You and your sister are both adults and can't demand he stays with your mother just because you like it that way. Your brother may be twelve, so that's another story, but you can't demand they should stay together just because of him. While parental duties are important, no one can demand that he should give up his entire life. He has the right to spend time with someone he loves.

I also have to ask you this; In what way has he changed? How is she a bad influence over him? You in no way has to like his choice in a new partner, but you should at least respect that he has the right to choose a new partner. You can't demand that he stay single for his entire life just because he's no longer with your mother, just like you can't demand your mother stays single. You have to consider this though; do you dislike her because of her personality, or are you unable to see past your initial hatred over her because you believe he left your mother for her?

You don't have to be happy that he's getting married, nor do you have to like his partner, but you should at least be happy for him that he's found someone. You dpn't have to be happy that she's pregnant, but you should at least be happy for your father that he's getting another kid. Like it or not, that child is a sibling of yours - whether or not its with your mother doesn't really matter in that situation. You have to consider it for what it is; a brother or sister, who will likely look up to you. Are you going to dislike the child just because you're angry at your father for leaving your mother? It's not his or her fault.

He tries to stay in touch with you - he even made sure to let you know that he still loves you and want to keep in touch with you. He called you to reveal to what him is good news, and hoped you would too. And what do you do, shoot it down? How do you think that makes him feel? Try to look at it from his point of view. Have you tried letting him know that you don't hate him, but you disapprove of his choice of a partner? You know, telling him how you feel, that you feel like she tries to split him and you up?

And before you ask, yes, I'm awfully familiar with the situation myself. My cousin's mother split from a relationship and started dating someone we all consider to be an asshat, who everyone dislikes and who managed to ruin my grandmother's funeral. We've told her how we feel, but we have to let her live her own life, despite said asshole pushing my cousins away and openly letting them know how much he dislike them, resulting in them rarely being over at their mother's house. This following part applies to your situation too:

You can say that its their own fault for choosing a bad partner, but you should still respect that it is someone they love. My cousins have let their mother know that they love her and want to spend time with her, but don't want to because they don't feel welcome when they're home. She knows that, and attempts her best to spend time with them, such as taking vacations with only them, going out to eat with them, or spending time with them whenever her new husband is not at home. You, too, should let your father know how you feel, that it feels like she's changing him and that you don't recognize him anymore. He might get defensive about it, but he's your father. He's let you know that he love you, and I'm absolutely positive that he'll take it under consideration. As long as you don't make unfair demands or ultimatums such as "Leave her or I refuse to talk to you", I'm sure he'll listen and take it in consideration. You need to be diplomatic, though.

Truth be told, to me it seem like you have lingering feelings of abandonment and disappointment towards your father. There also seem to be a tension because you feel he lied to you about the whole situation. You need to remember, though, that he didn't abandon you. He no longer has strong feelings towards your mother, but neither do you towards your exes. He didn't pack his bags and leave without a word, breaking all contact with you. What he said about wanting to live life as single may or may not be a lie, but he didn't lie about not abandoning you.

As for him changing, we all change when we spend time with someone. You're different around your parents and siblings than when you're at work or with your friends. We all change from day to day. You're different now than from four years ago. It would be naïve to think your father would be the exact same he was four years ago, especially with a new partner, and in my opinion it would be unfair of you to demand he stays exactly the same.

 

[Eilistrae]

You'll feel a LOT better when you get your emotions out there in the open. I agree with Lucki, you should tell your father how you feel. Even if it hurts HIS feelings, his ignorance to how he has made the rest of your family feel, shouldn't be taken into consideration in my opinion. You're a grown man, so step up and say what you and the rest of your family are thinking and feeling about the whole situation.

 

[Ecks]

After having read the whole thing, I take some of what I said back. I thought by "leaving my family in ruins" you meant something finiancial as in he stole money and then bailed.

Since this is not the case, I can sympathize and understand your situation a bit more. My own parents finally divorced when I was 17 (now 29) and I was the oldest of 4 boys. More than a year before that, my mother suspected him of cheating on her and finally caught him, first on the phone, where she then beat the shit out of him with a frying pan (so she has stated). Then, a bit later, one dramatic morning she packed us all up and confronted him at the naval barracks where he had apparently spent the night with the woman he had been cheating on her with. It wasn't pretty, and I don't remember much other than a lot of yelling and screaming and crying.

They apparently went to marriage counseling after that and when I was 16 tried to work it out a year which just didn't end up working. I have not been pleased with what my Dad did and for a long time I didn't want to talk to him, and I didn't.

But yeah, he is my Dad and while he did screw up big time I think everyone has moved on and tried to make the best of the situation. He and my Mom still talk on occasion and are able to be friendly towards each other. He has been married to the same woman he cheated on my Mom with for quite some time now. He can't have any more children though, thanks to a certain surgery. So at least I don't have to worry about any additional siblings popping up.

I talk to him on occasions. Usually holidays and his birthday and my birthday. I've hung up on him before and probably will in the future as well depending on how the conversations go. He's a pretty big alcoholic since he's been with his new wife so.. sometimes he calls me drunk, which leads to conversations I don't enjoy, hence the hang-ups. But he's still my Dad, and he'll always be there for me because I'm his son and despite all he's done he still loves me. I've learned to return that love as well. That doesn't mean I agree with everything he says and does, but oh well. That's life.

You will hate your Dad at first for what he's done and I still think you're okay to stop talking to him for a while. Eventually, when you're ready, you'll talk to him and maybe you can work things out and come to some kind of understanding. It's obvious things were not working out between him and your mother, or else he would never have wanted to do what he did. My own father was an idiot, a very vain man who lost interest in my mother from the time she was pregnant with me. My mom was smoking hot before she had me, and even afterwards (from the pictures I've seen) she was still an attractive woman, yet my father thought she was ugly for having gained weight and apparently he never truly was able to move on past that. My mom, bless her heart, though still got bigger and bigger after every child though she never changed to me. I mean sure, she's overweight right now but she's still my Mom and I'll always love her no matter what she looks like.

TL;DR version: I pretty much went through the same situation and things are okay now. I didn't talk to my Dad nor want to for a long time but I've moved on and things are better now. Sure, life would have been better had they stay together, but that's not what happened. I had to deal with it at some point.

 

[ShomeGhuye]

Confront him about how you feel and don't beat around the bush. His response should help you decide.

 

[Alereth]

Talking with him is alot easier said than done. It's not a matter of being scared, it's just that any way I try to approach him, he instantly gets angry and defensive. It's one of those "refuse to be wrong" kind of deals, and it makes it difficult to say what I want/have to say.

The last time I tried, I only got a few sentences out before he started going off on how I should just accept it and be happy for him.

And I apologize for being vauge. When I say ruined, I mean emotionally. (Though financial burden has increased significantly on my mother while he goes to vegas and buys a new house.)

If I can just say what I have to say and that be the end of it, that would be great. It just isn't that easy when you get shot down at every turn.

 

[Lucki]

I know emailing something like this isn't the best idea, but since you can't get a word in when he gets angry, you may not have a choice.

 

[ShomeGhuye]

Talking with him is alot easier said than done. It's not a matter of being scared, it's just that any way I try to approach him, he instantly gets angry and defensive. It's one of those "refuse to be wrong" kind of deals, and it makes it difficult to say what I want/have to say.

My brother is exactly the same way. I can provide numerous reasons for why he's wrong, but he eventually just explodes, and doing/believing what he believes is right, even though it's obvious to everyone around him that it's wrong. With him, yelling louder than him sometimes gets him to stfu and listen, but he normally opts to just walk away. I doubt that'd work with your father though.

Were I in your position, I'd break communication. That is if you truly do hate him. Not much of a reason to stay in contact with somebody you hate. Might not get to see your step-sibling if you do though.

 

[Hexx]

As others have said, you have a right to be angry, but at the same time there isn't much you can do. Parents rarely see it from their kid's side, and most feel like their children really should have no say in what they do since they are older and such. It does sound like some emotions need to be brought out in the open on your part and if he gets defensive right away it might mean that he knows he fucked up, but is afraid/unwilling to own up to it at this point. My recommendation would be to either A) do as Lucki said and email him, or B) if you know of any close friends of his or other relatives that he would be willing to listen to that you can use as "mediators" for your talk with him, get a hold of them and ask for their help.

At this point your father may not know exactly how you feel, or may think you're acting impulsively because he hurt your mother. Calm down some before you make any rash decisions, he IS your father after all, and most of us tend to have only one of those in our lifetime.

 

[Alereth]

Calm down some before you make any rash decisions, he IS your father after all, and most of us tend to have only one of those in our lifetime.

This is the excuse I've been using for four years now. I think he's worn it out a bit too much at this point.

 

[Hexx]

This is the excuse I've been using for four years now. I think he's worn it out a bit too much at this point.

Regardless man, the issue stands that he is your father. Had he abandoned you, your siblings, and your mother from a very young age I would see it differently, but what he just pulled is recent. Remember that saying "let those who are without sin cast the first stone"? Yeah man, until he does something on the extreme end, I think you should keep trying. Just my opinion though.

 

[Zyndara]

There is no cut and dry answer to this question you're asking. And I say this from experience, as I have lived through something almost exactly the same.

After almost 25 years of marriage, my mother discovered that my father had been cheating. My sister was married and lived away from it, my brother was in college, but I was 14 and still living at home at the time. It sent shockwaves through our lives, mostly because my father said though he loved us all, he was in love with this other woman. The next few years was my mother trying to salvage her marriage and our family, but my father moved in with his mistress (who was also married to someone else when all this garbage began), and was married to her before the ink was dry on my parents' divorce papers (aka the same day - Vegas style).

Being the only one left at home, I got to watch the fallout up close and personal. I got to witness my mother emotionally shattered, we had to sell our house and move into an apartment and she had to work three jobs to make ends meet because she wasn't willing to damage us kids any further with a nasty shark-lawyer divorce. I *hated* my father for what he had done. I didn't speak to him for the larger part of a year. I didn't want anything to do with him. I felt that he had not only abandoned her, but abandoned us... walked away from his family. This chick had three kids of her own - her eldest was my age and I was the baby of the family - and now he was off to play daddy to them?

Meanwhile, all I ever got when my father had to deal with my pissy mood toward him was "This is the way it is. You will accept it because you don't have a choice." So I largely avoided him. Until one day I had to ask him for money for something important (which I never did before) and he responded (with his "wife" looking on) with sarcasm and reproach about how he was giving my mother money every month and where was she spending it. I lost my fucking mind. I started screaming, "You know where she goddamned spends it? Putting food on the table. Paying fucking rent. Paying the bills you dumped on her. Buying me what I need for school. You think I see that money? Are you kidding me?" At first I thought he was going to take my head off, but then he kind of blinked a couple of times and just sat there, like for the first time he had some inclination of what my mother and I had been through.

I'm not going to tell you that after that was all hearts and flowers, because it wasn't. Not even close. But things were different between me and my Dad after that. It kind of opened the dialogue - look, you are an adult and can do whatever you want, but you hurt me and you broke our family, and I'm not ready to forgive you. It's been over ten years now, and my relationship with him has come a long way. Maybe it would have been different if my father had kids with his new wife, I don't know. But what I do know is that, ten years later, I realize a lot of things I didn't then: that yes, it is possible for you to love more than one person at a time (how you handle it is what separates the assholes from the agonizers); that your parent leaving is not about you and them, it's about your other parent and them (which is a REAL hard one to believe when you're in it); and that although life is short, regrets are very long. It took me a long time to accept my Dad as is. I don't introduce his wife as my step-mother and I never will. But she's done a lot to make me feel welcome over the years (as she should), and she truly loves and cares for my father. And at the end of the day, I guess that has to be good enough. I had a good childhood. I have a million wonderful memories of my father. The truth is, I don't talk to him every day or even every week. But I can tell you that I think of him, and when too much time goes by without seeing him, I miss him.

tl,dr: You're hurt and angry, and you have every right to be. But understand that your father, whom you've no doubt idolized at one point in your life, is a human being like the rest of us, and free will's a bitch. If having him in your life is important to you then open up the dialog (no matter how you have to do it), separate your relationship with your Mom from your relationship with your Dad (you HAVE to), and start the healing process. If it's not important to you, then you have to let it go. But make damned sure that's what you want, or someday that regret will eat you alive. Take it from someone who's been there.

 

[Alereth]

Until one day I had to ask him for money for something important (which I never did before) and he responded (with his "wife" looking on) with sarcasm and reproach about how he was giving my mother money every month and where was she spending it.

This is the same attitude he constantly has with my sister and anytime our conversations drift towards my mother. It's angering and annoying. And:

I lost my fucking mind. I started screaming, "You know where she goddamned spends it? Putting food on the table. Paying fucking rent. Paying the bills you dumped on her. Buying me what I need for school. You think I see that money? Are you kidding me?" At first I thought he was going to take my head off, but then he kind of blinked a couple of times and just sat there, like for the first time he had some inclination of what my mother and I had been through.

Maybe this is exactly what NEEDS to happen. My sister won't do it for sure and my little brother is too scared. But maybe this is what I need to do to really get through to him. He knows we're all angry, but maybe he just doesn't understand how angry we really are.

This may be exactly what I need to do.

Also, to clarify: I'm not so much pissed about him actually leaving (even though I'm still pissed) than I am about him making all these excuses about wanting to be single and not having a family tying him down only to be married again and have a kid on the way before the divorce papers were hardly in.

 

[Hexx]

Also, to clarify: I'm not so much pissed about him actually leaving (even though I'm still pissed) than I am about him making all these excuses about wanting to be single and not having a family tying him down only to be married again and have a kid on the way before the divorce papers were hardly in.

See this I understand on your part, the fact that the divorce wasnt even final and he had already gone on to do other shit. You have all the right to be pissed and to express those feelings, but until he is willing to sit down and listen, instead of being selfish and only focusing on himself, everything you say will fall on deaf ears.

 

[Uzor]

Talking with him is alot easier said than done. It's not a matter of being scared, it's just that any way I try to approach him, he instantly gets angry and defensive. It's one of those "refuse to be wrong" kind of deals, and it makes it difficult to say what I want/have to say.

The last time I tried, I only got a few sentences out before he started going off on how I should just accept it and be happy for him.

And I apologize for being vauge. When I say ruined, I mean emotionally. (Though financial burden has increased significantly on my mother while he goes to vegas and buys a new house.)

If I can just say what I have to say and that be the end of it, that would be great. It just isn't that easy when you get shot down at every turn.

Of course he gets defensive, I even said so in my post. People are always defensive when you criticize them. Everyone believes they're not the criminal. It takes a very strong person to admit they're wrong, and most get upset, angry and defensive when you approach them about it - especially if its someone not in authority. Its why you need to be diplomatic. Its a natural human response to criticism, and most people do it without actually thinking or being aware of it.

The reason is usually that a lot of people take it as an insult, even if it is true. Its also because most everyone has a subconscious deep fear of rejection, and rejection activates the same part of the brain that physical pain and death do, which naturally triggers a self-defense and/or fight-or-flight response.