NARUTO DOESNT START UNTIL NEXT WEEK! AHH!

Elemmire said:
I hate so many anime fans.. the ones that love the "Subs" shit. Why is subs better? cause it is in Japanese?
Click to expand...


Because in the American version it is edited for content (IE they remove the blood, alcohol, smoking, more graphic scenes, sexual refrences, and re-write the plot to make it more kid friendly) and they get old women to play a teenage male voice. Also the names of special moves seemed... butcherd... when translated to English.

There are some shows that I think they dubbed well. IE Full metal Panic, cowboy beebop, trigun, but then there are the Gundam Seeds, the Kenshin (They edited out one of the greatest fights EVER), and the One Pieces. Take Yu-gi-oh, the fucker goes out at night and kills people in the JPN version! Sailor moon was basicaly a lesbian fest.

Now I fully enjoy watching shows that are dubbed well in english, the unedited versions at least, but that usuly requires me to buy a DVD. Or I can DL it subbed the day after it airs in japan. As we speak I am happily waiting on episode 47 of Gundam Seed Destiny to be released, it aired in japan 12 hours ago. It will probaly be at least a year before a heavily edited version of it makes it way onto Toonami. (They edited the INTRO of the first season for content, 2/3s gone.)

Hmmm.... Let me do that math... Free the next day, unedited and with the seal of aproval from the original artist, or months to years latter with a sometimes horribale voice with entire episodes cut out by American censorship bullshit. Or pay lots and lots of money to buy them on DVD with the same months to years wait.
 
you have a problem with a woman playing a kid's voice? So you hate the simpsons eh? gg!

And I don't see much editted out when CN gets a hold of it for adult swim. They keep most of the blood in (Like you need it to be much better anyways :roll: ) I still see smoking all over the place in CN shows (atleast at night). And the plots have all been EXACTLY the same. In fact.. the ONLY show I've seen on air so far that was horribly butchered is One Piece. Every other single anime was fine. I bet you don't consider anime a cartoon do you? And the only reason the names of special moves seemed butchered is because of the different accents. They tend to be Japanese names for moves and so a Japanese person will have the accent for it where as an American voice actor won't. Still... most things sound just fine to me. DBZ was butchered but that was out before CN got it. Fox and WB really screw anime over. CN gets it and tries to have it somewhat editted (like in Gundam Wing it was pretty much fine.. they just editted out the excessive blood that wasn't necessary but still kept some blood in for effectiveness.. or same with Cowboy Bebeop).

I just don't find Naruto that bad in English. It seems fine to me. Now if only they'd put Ranma on air. It's already translated.
 
Damn no edit button...

about the intro to Anime.. who gives a fuck? It's nothing important. Same with the ending music. They edit it for the sake of TIME. They still have to take in account that they have sponsors that want their commercials aired.. cause that's how they pay for their network. Japan DOES NOT have to take in that account cause Japanese TV is Governmental run. 1 Episode of Cowboy Bebop with the music is, on average, 27 minutes. That'd leave 3 minutes of commercials for CN. So they editted the end songs for the sake of time. Without that editting they'd be out more money than I think most take into account.. and we wouldn't even have the luxery of having CN around. As I said.. WB and Fox butcher anime.. but seriously.. Yu-Gi-OH and Sailor Moon and DBZ and most of that shit in the Japanese versions STILL suck. Stupid ideas over all.. too long.. or just plain corny.
 
People say the subs are better because they aren't altered like the dubs. The dialogue is ALWAYS better, there's no changing of names or cutting out lines/scenes. With the subtitles, it's usually a literal translation of the dialogue, or as close as it can be, while the dubs have to be edited to fit time and the animations. There's also stupid mispronounciations that occur in the dubs (Geneen instead of Genin in Naruto is a great example) that would take half a second to fix and would show some effort was put into the dubbing. This goes for any media that's translated into another language, something is always lost, it's not just japanese media.

Cartoon network also doesn't edit/dub anything, they just play stuff that another company has liscensed, editied and dubbed. It's the companies that can butcher the anime, the ones that air on fox and WB are done by companies that liscense kids' shows, so they don't care as much about doing it well.

The dubs of naruto are a lot better than I thought they'd be, which I'm really happy about that. Ranma would be awesome for them to show, but I doubt they would solely because of the rare topless girl ranma.
 
pfft.. they'd put a top on Ranma.. they've done it before. Look at Tenchi.
 
it'd be kinda hard to explain why the "man among men" is wearing a bra.
 
I really need an edit button to add things >.> anyways.. Baja.. you will never ever have a direct translation or have something sound the same when you go from one translation to another. No language can be translated to another EXACLTY the same. Each language has its own ways of doing things, and some things just can't be translated. So it's not like you're going to catch that even if you do read it rather than listening to it.

Now.. Saying something is lost from the Japanese to English translation still seems like saying you are really missing a lot when you convert from one music file to say.. MP3.. you do actually lose some background noises and such. But does it really sound that bad? Nope.. it's just fine the way it is and you get the overall feeling of the music and what's being said. Same with Anime.. you still get the story. In fact.. Dub is better cause atleast you can listen to the story and fully watch the emotions of the characters's faces and all that's being shown. And don't say you can when you are reading a Sub. that's utter bullshit. You have to watch it a few times to fully get everything in subbed versions. And ya.. if you have a problem with a woman doing a young boys voice.. you really don't like a LOT of anime in both Japanese and American voice actors.
 
Bajaratt said:
it'd be kinda hard to explain why the "man among men" is wearing a bra.
Click to expand...

who said a bra? he was wearing an undershirt D: or they can cut off the stuff from boobs and below..they've done that kinda editting before too. It's not hard to do.. though I say just leave them topless. I don't really mind.
 
Elemmire said:
you have a problem with a woman playing a kid's voice? So you hate the simpsons eh? gg!

And I don't see much editted out when CN gets a hold of it for adult swim. They keep most of the blood in (Like you need it to be much better anyways :roll: ) I still see smoking all over the place in CN shows (atleast at night). And the plots have all been EXACTLY the same. In fact.. the ONLY show I've seen on air so far that was horribly butchered is One Piece. Every other single anime was fine. I bet you don't consider anime a cartoon do you? And the only reason the names of special moves seemed butchered is because of the different accents. They tend to be Japanese names for moves and so a Japanese person will have the accent for it where as an American voice actor won't. Still... most things sound just fine to me. DBZ was butchered but that was out before CN got it. Fox and WB really screw anime over. CN gets it and tries to have it somewhat editted (like in Gundam Wing it was pretty much fine.. they just editted out the excessive blood that wasn't necessary but still kept some blood in for effectiveness.. or same with Cowboy Bebeop).

I just don't find Naruto that bad in English. It seems fine to me. Now if only they'd put Ranma on air. It's already translated.
Click to expand...


The voice acting for the simpsons is fine with a women because bart is supposed to be like 9 years old. A bit diffrent then a 14ish year old naruto.

ESPECIALY after hearing how the original voice sounds it makes it very very hard to reconcile with the fact that Naruto now sounds like somone is repatedly kicking him in the balls. It seems all the world like one of those badly dubbed jackie chan movies. You know the old school ones before he learnt english. Go back and watch, say Drunken Master after watching Rush Hour or something and try not cringing everytime you hear his voice. I get the same reaction from most dubbed animes. Some animes I like particular voices better in English, Full Metal Panic and Inuyasha come to mind, most however....

Adult Swim is actualy independent of Cartoon Network, they really just rent out the time from them and are on their own standards. (Which thank god they keep to an adult lvl) But even they do edit out some things. A bit was edited out of say, Shost in the Shell. I do not know the list offhand but it is there. Evangalion had more then a few episodes cut out of it altogether.

Yes, they are better. But even then. You seem fine with them editing for content, that is your preference, me if they even remove one drop of blood I hold it against them.
 
And your right, I really do not consider Anime a cartoon... Anime is anime a cartoon is more like bugs bunny or some of those other shows I watched as a little kid. The ones that never actualy went anywhere and just kinda existed for the half an hour they where on.

Don't know how to properly put it... anime... is just...diffrent...
 
Direwolf said:
And your right, I really do not consider Anime a cartoon... Anime is anime a cartoon is more like bugs bunny or some of those other shows I watched as a little kid. The ones that never actualy went anywhere and just kinda existed for the half an hour they where on.

Don't know how to properly put it... anime... is just...diffrent...
Click to expand...

Sort of like how people in their 30's that collect dolls claim they are "Action Figures"? :lol:
 
Anime is a cartoon ^^ however it has a different style of art from an AMERICAN made Cartoon.... By the way.. you think Anime isn't a cartoon cause of its adult content and/or because its from Japan? Guess you don't think Spawn, The Animated Series, or Daria, or other more "adult related" animated shows are cartoons. They are cartoons. They just aren't COMICAL Cartoons.

And I don't know about you.. but I think a 9 year old and a 14 year old are gonna sound roughly the same.. (By the way.. bart is 11 or so). Puberty only really hits in around 12-13 for a male. And even then their voices don't go through such a dramatic change like Yu-Gay-oh's shitty character.

And you really fucking think 1 drop of blood changes the content OF THE STORY!? You, sir, are a fool. Changing something like that is irrelevant to the over all story and concept of what's going on. And I there's a HUGE difference between dubbing an animated movie/show and editting a live action kinda film/show.
 
Direwolf said:
And your right, I really do not consider Anime a cartoon... Anime is anime a cartoon is more like bugs bunny or some of those other shows I watched as a little kid. The ones that never actualy went anywhere and just kinda existed for the half an hour they where on.

Don't know how to properly put it... anime... is just...diffrent...
Click to expand...

Oh, wow.... I just had a long chat with Raenef (if not obvious by Elemmire's signature, her boyfriend) on this same subject not even a few weeks ago. I take it you have never talked to anyone inside of Japan about your oh-so-precious non-cartoon. Seriously, ask any Japanese person who isn't familiar with the American culture about anime - you'll get a funny look until you use the word cartoon rather than the term anime. That alone is proof enough for me on the subject. However, most Japanophiles who worship anything Japanese seem to not be able to get that through their brains because, well, it's Japanese, and if it is Japanese, it must be better than anything that is American and is much more mature.

To further prove my above point, I would like to quote a little something called the dictionary:

[quote="Dictionary]Japanimation (noun): a style of cartoon or animation made in Japan that focuses on futuristic themes and robotlike characters; also called anime.[/quote]

See, the reason you don't know how to put it properly is because nobody can. I don't really care if you call it anime, as that is a slang word someone coined, but seriously, all anime is is a damned cartoon (I'd almost go as far as saying a Japanese cartoon, but if you've even looked at the television lately, there are now non-Japanese people making the same crap and calling it anime; the catch? IT LOOKS EXACTLY THE SAME).

I could just as easily claim the same bs about anime by pointing out the Japanese created such crap as Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, Beyblades, Digimon, and whatnot (oh, yes, I can already hear you starting to tell me that the ones I just named aren't anime - please, go ahead), then turn around and point out that America created X-Men, Spiderman, Spawn, and Striperella. But of course, that sounds biased (and if you're not following alone... THAT'S MY POINT - your opinion is very biased from what I'm reading). There are just as many crappy 'anime' out there as there are 'cartoons.'

Call it whatever you want to, I don't care. Just don't try to defend that anime isn't a cartoon. By definition, you're wrong if you say that an anime is not a cartoon. I'll stick with calling 'anime' Japanese cartoons (and yes, that is the term I actually use when talking about Cowboy Bebop, Full Metal Alchemist, Tenchi Universe, etc) and you can stick with calling it anime. Just don't jump all over my case when I call it a cartoon - it has happened to me, personally, multiple times, and not the first damned 'anime != cartoon" fan has been able to really make a point proving otherwise. Honestly, I think the whole topic arises in people who are too insecure about themselves (mainly in the field of maturity) to say that they watch cartoons. I know full-grown men who still watch stuff like Power Rangers and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, but at least they don't go out and try to cover it up with a fancier word.

Oh, and it's probably obvious as hell as to who told me to read this thread. I promised not to post, but there has been one too many ignorant statements in this thread. I could give a rat's ass if my reputation is shot for this... I plan on starting up Beastmaster soon, anyway.
 
Elemmire said:
And you really fucking think 1 drop of blood changes the content OF THE STORY!? You, sir, are a fool. Changing something like that is irrelevant to the over all story and concept of what's going on. And I there's a HUGE difference between dubbing an animated movie/show and editting a live action kinda film/show.
Click to expand...

Its changed, that is enough for me. I am not watching the original I am watching what the networks want me to see. THAT pisses me off. And if one thing is edited then what else is? You know there is going to be more. Entire episodes of series have been left on the cutting room floor, how the hell can I say that watching the regurgitated version of a once beloved show now made "Americanized" do anything other then piss me off. Maybe I am a "fool" but hey, at least I am not choosing stupid quibles to put off the real argument. You want to call something a cartoon, it is a cartoon, you want to call it anime it is anime, you want to call it some magical made up word, be my guest, words have what meaning we give them. You want to get in an argument over what people call a specific thing do not go to England. I say anime so people know off the bat what I am talking about. I could say I play computer games. Or even more specificly I play an MMoRPG, but no I say I play FF XI. Be as specific as I can with as few words as I can.

Really calling anime anime is jsut being more specific, but in the end it is a fucken word. The fact that you go through all this morale bullshit about how somebody labels a god damn TV show is pathetic. The asian people I ahev talked to all refer to it as anime, maybe they where Americanized, beats me.

The fact that you get your panties in a twist and COMPLETELY IGNORE the part I said about why ppl get bitchy over the edited/dubbed versions proves that I am right. How is their a huge diffrence? Peoples voices are there voices, animated or not. After you watch 150 episodes hearing one voice and then you hear a high pitch whiney voice, how the hell do I NOT grit my teeth. Not my fault that the voice acting pool in the US is really limited and there is a total lack of options.

And Antor... Why the flying fuck would I, or anyone else for that matter, care if you posted in this thread? You have an opinion you feel strongly about... OK... fine... I really do not think people are going to say, "Hey look its Antor, he used to be cool but then he posted about cartoons so now he is a n00b with no life."
 
Meh, the only reason I stated that was because I've literally been blacklisted for saying I dislike cats. And since it seems that most of the Final Fantasy XI player population is composed of idiots and people who like anime (or a combination of the two, really, which is where I'm getting at :P), I figured that might actually effect my ingame reputation.

I have nothing against you as a person though. Hope you didn't take it that way. :P
 
so let me get this straight.. you don't like listening to an MP3 then. Because you do know that an MP3 cuts out things from the original sound track right? It's nothing big cut.. or missed.. and again.. even if a full episode is cut.. sometimes it's JUST NOT IMPORTANT. Like the over all episode of Outlaw Star they cut. They went to a hot bath planet to get more caster shells.. not important :\ It's interesting, yes, and even quite amusing. However, it is not important to the over all story. And there's a difference between MMORPG and FFXI. In terms that MMORPG is a genre where as FFXI is a name. Anime and Cartoons are both genre which mean the same thing. Animated Series or Movie. And how can you sit and listen to all those high pitched Japanese voice actors? they don't make you cringe? And watch the dubbed DBZ.. they go through 4 or so people for each character pretty much. I don't have a big deal with it. Cause most of the time they atleast PORTRAY the emotions of the character well enough that I'm pleased with it. And again.. you might hear the voices.. but you just sitting there and reading subs is making you MISS the animation that's going on. Maybe not all of it. But you are missing some. And that little bit can be quite annoying to miss. Might be something important in the background.. or the facial expressions of people. I just hate when people think a Dub is soo bad because it isn't EXACTLY as they heard it when they watched it in subs. It's no big fucking deal as long as the person atleast portrays the character's emotions well enough. Hell.. Inuyasha dubbed is pretty good compared to subbed.. most of the subbed people's voices are just.. annoying. The only person I don't like in the dubbed version is Kagome and that's cause it is rather high pitched and whiney but she does a good job at portraying when she's happy and sad and sick and all those things. SO where's the problem with the dubs?
 
I am not a Japanese wanna-be, I just don't like watching any sort of film which needs to be edited from the original in any sort of fashion. Agreed sometimes it can be good, but a majority of the time its annoying and terrible. My main problem with anime being dubbed is the fact its like a kung fu movie with a voice over. I hear the words but the lips don't match and the voices sound as if the actors are just reading the script for the first time. You could even compare the voices to the rejects on American idle, they are sometimes that bad.

The only reason I mentioned the missing blood was because when Naruto used his Harem-no-jutsu on Ebisu, he went flying back into the air, but in the original, he was spraying blood from his nose. To me there was no need to edit that out. Its also the fact that they did change it. If they found this minor piece necessitating editing, then what else will get cut? I am sure a few major fight scenes will get edited for content and a lot of people won't like that. I bet even key storyline components will get cut just because some exec finds it unsuitable. I like a good action scene as much as the next, but once you starting fucking with the story, you've gone too far.

Like I said earlier, anime often deals with adult topics and/or situations and American audiences only see cartoons for children. Someone mentions shows like Stripparella(sp?) but shows like this that target adults are almost always short lived. The very few that do survive longer than a season, are almost 100% comedies. And of those that are comedies, I think the Simpsons is the only one that has lasted more than the average life span of a tv show.
 
The only, ONLY, time I've ever seen key factors in an anime editted is with 4Kids which sucks ass. They haven't gotten their hold on Naruto and can't now.. so Naruto will not likely be butchered in that sense. Minor blood details is really meaningless to have a problem over. If you have a problem with that it boggles my mind why you don't have a problem with MP3s or other music files that are on your computer most likely because those all are lacking certain background noises that the original soundtrack had.
 
Okay, so the audience is different... therefore it isn't the same thing? It just so happens that some (it isn't all) Japanese Cartoons deal with topics that aren't usually in American Cartoons. Does the subject matter instantly change what the material type is?

No. That's like saying that lesbian porn isn't porn because it doesn't target gay men. That's like saying South Park isn't a cartoon because it doesn't target children.

If you don't quite understand why anime is editted in America, you should start looking at the asses that live here rather than just getting mad at why it is editted. Honestly, I can see why most of it being editted (yeah, sure, Ebisu's nose wasn't bleeding, but it still portrayed the same image - Ebisu was knocked the fuuuuuuck out). It's not necessary. And to be quite frank with you, after seeing a child's penis on Japanese television, I'm kind of glad it isn't allowed here.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top