OHrly?

[Uzor]

If you would have taken the time to look that thread up and read it again since you obviously missed the point, you'd have saw that part about "Pushing back after we've been pushed from this point on. An eye for an eye type of deal" those aren't direct quotes, but mere reiterations. The thread in question was after the series of MPK's on our Nidhoggs. If you think Fafnir = Nidhogg, I'm not sure what to say to you.

Exactly, and MPK'ing someone back means they don't approve of MPK'ing?

 

[Bigboy]

So you're telling me you believe the GM lied to us saying Arcien was guilty in order to close the case and move on?

Obviously not. Now you're just making shit up to slant it. The GM would have had to have actually said someone was guilty for him to have lied. The GM makes no firm comments as to who is responsible. The GM doesn't even go so far as to say Halflife MPK'd people. It's obvious that was the method used, but the GM never makes a firm statement in the whole conversation. It's very common for them to not make any deffinate statements beyond their "I will look into this further."

 

[Firestreak]

If you would have taken the time to look that thread up and read it again since you obviously missed the point, you'd have saw that part about "Pushing back after we've been pushed from this point on. An eye for an eye type of deal" those aren't direct quotes, but mere reiterations. The thread in question was after the series of MPK's on our Nidhoggs. If you think Fafnir = Nidhogg, I'm not sure what to say to you.

Moral relativity. Nobody on this board is saying you guys are assholes for MPKing in retaliation. I wasn't talking to Neophytal as an attempt to insult Kaizen, just discussiong moral relativity.

I remember some months back Nasya wanted to have a little board where all the different endgame LS could try and talk out any differences and try to find universal common ground. She asked me if I was interested in joining to represent my views. I said yes and nothing ever came of it. It's a shame because I think if it had all of this would be coming out in a more constructive manner than we're in presently.

 

[meastoso]

Exactly, and MPK'ing someone back means they don't approve of MPK'ing?

Please find the thread and read it. Your making statements that are out of context.

 

[Firestreak]

Obviously not. Now you're just making shit up to slant it. The GM would have had to have actually said someone was guilty for him to have lied. The GM makes no firm comments as to who is responsible. The GM doesn't even go so far as to say Halflife MPK'd people. It's obvious that was the method used, but the GM never makes a firm statement in the whole conversation. It's very common for them to not make any deffinate statements beyond their "I will look into this further."

I'm not making shit out of thing air.

"halflife = arcien"

"Yeah I know all of halflife's characters"

What is he saying yes to?

 

[Uzor]

Please find the thread and read it. Your making statements that are out of context.

You just said they'd go by "Eye for an eye", which means MPK'ing back if they get MPK'd? Doesn't that, like I said, mean they'd aprove of MPK'ing? Reason I bring this up is because soemone said they don't approve of MPK'ing, which they apparently do if they will MPK back once they get MPK'd

 

[Bigboy]

I'm not making shit out of thing air.

"halflife = arcien"

"Yeah I know all of halflife's characters"

What is he saying yes to?

He isn't saying it to anything. It's like me going yeah, whatever. It's him acknowledging what was said, not stamping an approved fact mark on it.

 

[Uzor]

basically this is an announcement that at this point in time I have authorized my LS to MPK an LS that MPKs them to retrieve the stolen NM. Again, it is something that I am forcing to be contained; it will be on a camp to camp basis. If we get MPKed, we will turn around and do the same, to the group that did it to us. I am making this announcement so that other shells who are involved in these camps will understand what is going on, and not have to worry about being a target.

That sure doesn't sound like "We do not approve of it".

 

[Firestreak]

"halflife = arcien"

"Yeah I know all of halflife's characters"

This isn't stamping approval on it?

This is a confirmation to the statement that Halflife is Arcien, and then a explanation that he knows all of halflife's characters.

He didn't say, "Yeah, I'm looking into it."
He didn't say, "I know off of Halflife's characters."

He said, yeah, I know all of halflife's characters. What more do you need? Should we call a GM to to decrypt that unsolvable mystery?

 

[Bigboy]

I think we should Firestreak thats a good idea, get right on it.

Until the GM repeats back to Proph:

"Halflife = Arcian"

Or actually says the name Arcian once in all 5 of the screenshots you present as evidence, there is no proof they are one in the same.

Now the GS asked Proph if he was contacted or attempted to contact Halflife before the incident. If the GM believed at that time that they were one in the same, would he not also have included Arcien's name? He never asked if Arcien said anything, he never mentioned him once. Explain to me how the GM never speaking his name is saying they are the same person.

 

[Firestreak]

I think we should Firestreak thats a good idea, get right on it.

Until the GM repeats back to Proph:

"Halflife = Arcian"

Or actually says the name Arcian once in all 5 of the screenshots you present as evidence, there is no proof they are one in the same.

Now the GS asked Proph if he was contacted or attempted to contact Halflife before the incident. If the GM believed at that time that they were one in the same, would he not also have included Arcien's name? He never asked if Arcien said anything, he never mentioned him once. Explain to me how the GM never speaking his name is saying they are the same person.

Are you insane?

Firestreak: Is Halflife Arcien?
GM: Yes, yes he is.
Bigboy: The GM never said Arcians name! If it was Arcian he would have said to you, "Arcian is Halflife!"

 

[meastoso]

That sure doesn't sound like "We do not approve of it".

"We do not approve of it [MPK]" and the quote you bolded from Nasya are completely different things.

We do not allow any of our members to walk up to an NM that they did not claim and 'steal it' by any means and most importantly by MPK. Taking back a specific NM that we claimed FIRST and had taken from us, is the summary of Nasya's quote. Since everyone else seems to clearly understand, I'm done trying to untwist the words and quotes you toss around Uzor.

 

[Phraust]

You fail to see one valuable piece of logic here in bigboy's and yours' arguement:

Arcien has no binding's what so ever to the character Halflife. To somone that knows this as fact, the GM's statements look more like what Bigboy, and I am trying to explain to you.

Why would a GM say (in your words) "Yes [Arcien is Halflife] I know all Halflife's characters"? If Halflife's characters do NOT include Arcien?

Prophecy was brushed off, plain and simple. I know this and I will say it one more time so that you can understand:

Arcien is not Halflife. Arcien doesn't have any logical binding's to the character Halflife. Get over it. We didn't MPK JDA, nor did we MPK ourselves(lol).

 

[Uzor]

"We do not approve of it [MPK]" and the quote you bolded from Nasya are completely different things.

We do not allow any of our members to walk up to an NM that they did not claim and 'steal it' by any means and most importantly by MPK. Taking back a specific NM that we claimed FIRST and had taken from us, is the summary of Nasya's quote. Since everyone else seems to clearly understand, I'm done trying to untwist the words and quotes you toss around Uzor.

I know. But then again, why does the previous argument in this thread and the other thread exists, since by your logic using cheats that other LS's already use is allowed. Which you and many others said is not a valid argument.

So what's your point?

 

[Bigboy]

Are you insane?

Firestreak: Is Halflife Arcien?
GM: Yes, yes he is.
Bigboy: The GM never said Arcians name! If it was Arcian he would have said to you, "Arcian is Halflife!"

Hey it was your suggestion, don't call me insane if it doesn't pan out for you.

In all seriousness though, Not once does the GM adress the issue in that respect. You are basing the whole thing off 1 word the GM used. And it was used in the second part of the sentence that looked ot be an afterthought. It's not like NA GM's don't speak in a California dialect. They're only based in one of the better surf spots on the coast. It comes across pretty load and clear because I understand how it was written and the "Yeah" is just a filler word.

If you've seen officespace you can gleam a good example of that from the boss whenever he speaks to his Employees.

"Yeah, I'm gonna need you to move your desk into the basement."
"Yeah, I'm gonna need you to fill out those SPC1000 reports by tomorrow."
"Yeah, I don't think I'm gonna be comming into work tomorrow."

The word is not an affirmative in any of those situations and I see it being used in exactly the same way when the GM speaks. To paraphrase:

"Yeah, I think I have a better source than you."

Proph was mad, which is totally acceptable in those circumstances, but it was pretty obvious to the GM he wasn't gonna get anything but a rant if he so much as questioned the validity of his statements, so he thanked him, told him he would enact justice, and moved on.

What was the actual outcome of the whole thing? Did Arcien even get in trouble?

 

[Firestreak]

As to your question, I'm not an officer. I'm a sack holder. Sack holder doesn't neccesarily means I'm an officer. Just like the fact you have a dick doesn't neccesarily make you a man.

I'll also mention I'm in a similar position. I even am called Officer sometimes, but I don't have a clue what that means. I've never accepted a new member. I've never kicked a member. All I've ever done is at a time I helped with the sky point system. I've never even threatened a member with kicking. I don't officially represent OH. Prophecy doesn't even want me arguing here, cause he doesn't wanna make any enemies.

Sometimes I tell people what to do and what not to do. However, I don't threaten them, it is NOT in my personality to threaten or boot friends. My sack is if for nothing else for the convieniance of a trustworthy person who can distribute shells upon request.

 

[Firestreak]

You fail to see one valuable piece of logic here in bigboy's and yours' arguement:

Arcien has no binding's what so ever to the character Halflife. To somone that knows this as fact, the GM's statements look more like what Bigboy, and I am trying to explain to you.

Why would a GM say (in your words) "Yes [Arcien is Halflife] I know all Halflife's characters"? If Halflife's characters do NOT include Arcien?

Prophecy was brushed off, plain and simple. I know this and I will say it one more time so that you can understand:

Arcien is not Halflife. Arcien doesn't have any logical binding's to the character Halflife. Get over it. We didn't MPK JDA, nor did we MPK ourselves(lol).

You discount the possibility that the GM could know that Arcien and Halflife were the same because they are not on the same account. That doesn't mean they didn't log on with the same IP address.

 

[Firestreak]

Hey it was your suggestion, don't call me insane if it doesn't pan out for you.

In all seriousness though, Not once does the GM adress the issue in that respect. You are basing the whole thing off 1 word the GM used. And it was used in the second part of the sentence that looked ot be an afterthought. It's not like NA GM's don't speak in a California dialect. They're only based in one of the better surf spots on the coast. It comes across pretty load and clear because I understand how it was written and the "Yeah" is just a filler word.

If you've seen officespace you can gleam a good example of that from the boss whenever he speaks to his Employees.

"Yeah, I'm gonna need you to move your desk into the basement."
"Yeah, I'm gonna need you to fill out those SPC1000 reports by tomorrow."
"Yeah, I don't think I'm gonna be comming into work tomorrow."

The word is not an affirmative in any of those situations and I see it being used in exactly the same way when the GM speaks. To paraphrase:

"Yeah, I think I have a better source than you."

Proph was mad, which is totally acceptable in those circumstances, but it was pretty obvious to the GM he wasn't gonna get anything but a rant if he so much as questioned the validity of his statements, so he thanked him, told him he would enact justice, and moved on.

What was the actual outcome of the whole thing? Did Arcien even get in trouble?

I'm not on FF right now, and I'm about to leave my house at the moment, but we can try and see if any GMs now can respond to the incident still later. Until then I'm going to go with the actually meaning of what the GM said. And literally, he said that they are the same.

 

[kisada]

That sure doesn't sound like "We do not approve of it".

there's a stark difference between using MPK as a way to antagonize and harass other players, and using MPK to defend yourself.

we don't approve of it, and if someone from our ls mpk'd another ls intentionally then they would be punished heavily or kicked.

since i think you're really just bringing up that thread to show a supposed lack of logic, rather than actually reading it's content and intents, i'll explain it to you. jda had major history of mpk'ing us whenever they felt slighted by us. if you understood their definition of "slighted," it would range from checking one of their members to having an argument with one of serise's friends over a year ago. they are that shallow, and i addressed it in another thread but their reasoning is disgusting. there came a point in time where we said, we aren't going to let them mpk us any more and though it's unfortunate, our only defense was to train them back if they trained us. our intent wasn't to antagonize others for our benefit, like theirs was to them.

saying that you approve/don't approve is too broad, when you have to consider the actual context surrounding them. you can't ignore the intent and circumstances.

regardless, us MPK'ing isn't really the issue, well at least in my mind. the issues were that firestreak accused us of things which were simply not true, and his basis revolved around some very shoddy assumptions. the main issue is accusing alm of hacking, especially considering the facts about your ls's views and your ls's recent actions on cheating.

 

[Bigboy]

You discount the possibility that the GM could know that Arcien and Halflife were the same because they are not on the same account. That doesn't mean they didn't log on with the same IP address.

SE and the GMs know better than to base anything on an IP address. It is possible for me to piggy back someone else's IP and do stupid shit to make them look bad, and the information to do it has been around for years. Companies know better by now. On the same note, I jump from desktop, to laptop, to PS2 all the time and my GF jumps around on my machines in a similar fashion as well. It doesn't mean we are the same person. And with the increasing popularity of internet cafes yet another problem gets thrown into the mix. Lets face it, SE doesn't look at IP addresses anymore, they (Like everyone else) has learned that it often punishes far more people than were intended and doesn't actually proove anything deffinate.