Ok tell me why...

[Uzor]

if you dont have time to rest during a fight as a rdm, YOU are doing a terrible job -.- if you have time to rest BETWEEN them, your puller sucks.

no, because you start resting slightly before the mob is dead, which mean you can rest for 20 sec.

And in the middle of a fight you don't have time to rest for 20 sec unless you're slacking.

 

[LadyKiKi]

as I've said before, if you have time to hit 20 times in a row during a exp party, you are doing something wrong...

When you are meleeing as RDM, you WON'T have time to hit 20 tiems in a row. Hell, if you play the job right, you shouldn't have time to rest for 20 sec DURING a fight

20 was a rough estimate. Depends on the length of the fight too. I don't exactly know, but I guess I been in the dunes too much lately and we were swinging a lot on a crab, lol. But as someone said earlier (was it you? :wacko it's all about MP management. The attempts to melee can be used to rest a 1-2 ticks of MP for other uses, like throwing out another cure or magic burst. The purpose of this is to play another mage's role, typically the WHM. If WHM is dry for one reason or another, you can use remaining MP to take over, stoneskin, convert, continue, and continue refresh cycle.

By the time you're half drained of your MP, whm should be back up and doing everything again. At least that's what my mini static linkshell BLM, RDM(me) and WHM does. Works great, we sometimes lose the chain due to lack of monsters or take a bit too long to finish chain 5, but other than that, it's always worked for me.

 

[LadyKiKi]

no, because you start resting slightly before the mob is dead, which mean you can rest for 20 sec.

And in the middle of a fight you don't have time to rest for 20 sec unless you're slacking.

I sometimes fit a bit in, rarely, but then again, birds in Bibiki Bay don't need debuffing, so that's a lot more time for you than say, fighting a crawler or beetle or mage Beastmen.

 

[Uzor]

20 was a rough estimate. Depends on the length of the fight too. I don't exactly know, but I guess I been in the dunes too much lately and we were swinging a lot on a crab, lol. But as someone said earlier (was it you? :wacko it's all about MP management. The attempts to melee can be used to rest a 1-2 ticks of MP for other uses, like throwing out another cure or magic burst. The purpose of this is to play another mage's role, typically the WHM. If WHM is dry for one reason or another, you can use remaining MP to take over, stoneskin, convert, continue, and continue refresh cycle.

By the time you're half drained of your MP, whm should be back up and doing everything again. At least that's what my mini static linkshell BLM, RDM(me) and WHM does. Works great, we sometimes lose the chain due to lack of monsters or take a bit too long to finish chain 5, but other than that, it's always worked for me.

you're still not listening, you won't have time to heal a tick or two in the middle of a fight

 

[Darthyoda]

I said it earlier, people seemed to have missed it.

For the trouble of dealing like 100 damage through like 20 misses (throughout a fight), on a IT (the usual ...) monster, you're better off after doing everything to sit back and rest your MP back with a Dark Staff for 1-2 or maybe 3 if you're lucky (if Refresh doesn't wear off, if all debuffs are stuck, everything going smooth). Resting that 50+ MP back gives you one more refresh, and conserves your MP without resorting to Convert.

You'd be much more useful resting that MP back than going after and wasting time/attempts to land a hit on the monster. Afterall, you are using mage food (I hope ...). For the purposes of extending a chain, you can potentially accumlate enough MP, and not having to convert, then say the WHM is dry, you stick the refresh cycle around again, let WHM rest for one fight while you as the RDM main heal for one fight (regardless of PLD or NIN tank you don't need to use THAT much MP healing for one fight). With refresh on WHM and possibly the BLM backing you up a bit, and the aid of a Dark Staff and other correct foods, the WHM can get his/her MP back quickly, then you continue on.

I'm talking about me ... I don't have refresh yet, nor do I have the lvl to use my staves yet.. But when I do, as I said before chances are unless fights are taking waaay too long, or I have enough mp to balance out.. where's the argument then ?
Some of the better rdm's I've seen maintain close to full mp before next pull arrives without ever dropping a knee.

I'm a lvl 40 taru rdm right now with 500mp.. dead on the money, without food. After I get refresh tonight, and then get to use my staves again at 51, I'll probably have a different opinion, for the meantime I will continue to guage the party vs the mob, and if I have too much spare time, I'll continue to ask if I can melee.. unless there is another answer coming that will deter me.

 

[Shaidalyn]

Refresh self / Mob arrives / Refresh Pld / Paralyze, Slow, Blind, / Refresh Whm / Poison, Bio/Dia, Gravity / Refresh Blm / MB? / wait/ Refresh Drk/Smn if applicable.
Rest until next fight/buff drops.. stand, Refresh self / Mob arrives ... etc

 

[LadyKiKi]

Refresh self / Mob arrives / Refresh Pld / Paralyze, Slow, Blind, / Refresh Whm / Poison, Bio/Dia, Gravity / Refresh Blm / MB? / wait/ Refresh Drk/Smn if applicable.
Rest until next fight/buff drops.. stand, Refresh self / Mob arrives ... etc

Agreed.

Except mine looks more like:

Refresh Self
Mob arrives. Throw Blind and Gravity Out.
Refresh PLD
throw para, slow.
Refresh WHM
throw dia II
haste a melee if needed.
refresh BLM
dispel if needed, check if any enfeebles wore.
Throw out a cure maybe. Or something. Sleep Link.

And out of no where, Refresh the DRK.

Then there's this nice gap of time where you're idle. This is when I rest.

Sorry Uzor, it's not about that I'm not listening. It's just different play styles for all, I guess.

Darthyoda: In that case ... no comment.

 

[LadyKiKi]

Forgot to add, Magic Burst when ready. Typically this allows me at least 1 tick of rest. Depends on party setup too.

 

[Shaidalyn]

Agreed.

Except mine looks more like:

Refresh Self
Mob arrives. Throw Blind and Gravity Out.
Refresh PLD
throw para, slow.
Refresh WHM
throw dia II
haste a melee if needed.
refresh BLM
dispel if needed, check if any enfeebles wore.
Throw out a cure maybe. Or something. Sleep Link.

And out of no where, Refresh the DRK.

Then there's this nice gap of time where you're idle. This is when I rest.

Sorry Uzor, it's not about that I'm not listening. It's just different play styles for all, I guess.

Darthyoda: In that case ... no comment.

I only haste if the tank proves they are good enough to handle the hate.. if a Nin, no way. Never pt'd with a nin good enough to hold hate from everything and I am SICK of taking Plague Breath to the face -.-
And of course.. dispel/silence/sleep link if needed.. Raptors dont buff, have spells, nor have I ever had a link in Valley of Sorrows to date, so this is more recent a list

 

[LadyKiKi]

I only haste if the tank proves they are good enough to handle the hate.. if a Nin, no way. Never pt'd with a nin good enough to hold hate from everything and I am SICK of taking Plague Breath to the face -.-
And of course.. dispel/silence/sleep link if needed.. Raptors dont buff, have spells, nor have I ever had a link in Valley of Sorrows to date, so this is more recent a list

Likewise. I guess my priorities and style will change as I get further up.

 

[Passions]

I hate to disagree but...
Paralyze: 6
Slow: 15
Blind: 5
Thats 27 mp.. 9 ticks of refresh.
any other debuffs are a GIFT.. Gravity is situational, Silence, situational, Dispel, situational. If you need dispel HIGH chance you can Aspir.
I don't Bio, the BLM does. I don't Dia, the WHM does. I don't -ever- haste, the WHM has a job too. I don't cure, WHM job. I don't Poison, BLM job.
I do however toss up Stoneskin: 29mp and Refresh on myself: 40mp
.

Refresh self / Mob arrives / Refresh Pld / Paralyze, Slow, Blind, / Refresh Whm / Poison, Bio/Dia, Gravity / Refresh Blm / MB? / wait/ Refresh Drk/Smn if applicable.
Rest until next fight/buff drops.. stand, Refresh self / Mob arrives ... etc

I sence a bit of contradiction here??? also a smn is a mage that uses mp they should always be on the refresh cycle. and your comments on gravity taking forever on recast and people not understanding that you have recast timers. i always go refresh me haste me then continue down the line and everyone is hasted and refreshed that needs it befor the next mob gets there. then i enfebble and keep an eye on the mob and what wears ect. i repeat the same process after (or befor if were just starting after getting to camp or downtime) every fight so if your fight is lasting longer then 3-4 minutes you need to find out whats up with the melee and blm whatever.

Doing all of that doesn't give you time to melee and manage your mp in a EXPERIENCE PARTY.

healers job cure hmmm A+ in healing magic
pld/nin job tank hmmm A in def/evasion
melee (such as drk thf sam mnk drg) usually use weapons that are A or A+ hmmm
rdm A+ in enfebbeling magic and B+ in enhancing magic B in sword
blm A+ in elememental magic hmmm and they nuke the mob :/

seems like everyone knows what to do in there role in a xp party but a RDM!! follow the stats they dont lie. they gave you a sword with shitty damage and deley to protect yourself while exploring not for xping. Also untill your job that your doing in XP parties is carried over to endgame dont expect sympothy from me when i SATA your melee ass on my thf. RDM's dont melee unless solo or skillup parties. the only good ws you get is savage blade unless you sub /war which means your losing (yet again) more mp to do your job correctly.

 

[Passions]

I only haste if the tank proves they are good enough to handle the hate.. if a Nin, no way. Never pt'd with a nin good enough to hold hate from everything and I am SICK of taking Plague Breath to the face -.-

you don't haste the TANK!!! unless its SITUATIONAL O_O

Your fucking ninja can't handle it if they are 57 in VoS tanking raptors with no haste. Your a sad excuess for a rdm all you do is bitch about the job and neglect your priorities of it because you dont like they way someone is playing. BTW I held hate on a hundred fist in VoS just the other day but i guess all ninja's suck. I think before you start saying you don't like parties you need to rethink how your playing you job in the party. it only takes one to fuck up the xp for everyone. and i'd rather buy my whm or smn a few yag drinks then have some rdm leeching xp having the whm do all the curing hasting and enfebbeling. Honestly by your post thats exactly what i see that you do NOTHING BUT LEECH AND BITCH ABOUT OTHERS

 

[Shaidalyn]

I dont haste the tank, wtf do I look like a WhM? if you can read commas you can see.
Plus, you compare a RdM's job to a melee post. Um....
No thanks. Not gonna try to correct THAT many errors in two posts. Reread what was said where to what. ^^

 

[Uzor]

You should always haste a NIN tank... ALWAYS @.@

 

[Passions]

i pointed out your flaws now you can fix them or stop contradicting yourself saying that you dont do this and that then in another post saying you do.

I never set a certain job ahead of another like everyone else i went down my party list. I hasted and refreshed everyone that needed it (saves whm's mp) and it never droped and was always up befor a fight started so i never need to worry about it.

and my second quote proves that you are a "situational" or shitty rdm in general because you decide if the tank is worthy of refresh. i shouldn't have to EVER ask for it on ninja it should be a given. to many free loading nOObs make it to higher lvls and dont learn how to play.

keep soloing i'll take rdm's like zelock and tenchi and hellstorm that KNOW there jobs and knew them back in the day when i meet them. people exist that aren't 75 and still know how to play a job. just have to weed out the ones that dont which seems to be harder then it sounds

 

[Passions]

and my second quote proves that you are a "situational" or shitty rdm in general because you decide if the tank is worthy of haste.
bah angry typing typo's

 

[Passions]

also if your getting plague breath to the face then maybe tell the blm to stop spamming water 3 and blizzaga 2 or starting the fight with a nice water 3 yeah i'm really gonna hold it on that with only one voke as of yet. stupid blms and whm's can steal hate from even a good pld you ever so <3 but what does plague breath matter to you i mean you dont do anything anyways because the mob turned you dont think the tank needs any help at all

 

[Shaidalyn]

WOW do you not speak english as a first language? I DO NOT HASTE
THE TANK..
new sentence jesus christ.
I was referring to HASTING DD good god are you that blind? do you not see worth a shit? Shut up and fucking read.

 

[Shaidalyn]

Again, the WHM has a job to do, he hastes tank, I refresh. SIMPLE.

 

[Uzor]

Again, the WHM has a job to do, he hastes tank, I refresh. SIMPLE.

I usually haste half the party to lighten the load of the WHM and thus keep the chains going for longer =/

That is unless the WHM insists on hasting everyone alone.