Anderithe, the main problem with a mage having to walk someone through a zone and keep Sneak/Invis on that person all the time is that recasting those spells puts the mage in danger (Invis wears off when you cast), especially if you're nearby Arcane (magic-aggro) mobs. Now, if you're in a zone where nothing aggros sight (or at least, in a room with no sight aggro), and there's nothing arcane nearby, I can understand wanting a mage to use Sneak on you if it wears off. But if the zone has a lot of sight aggro, and you want me to Sneak/Invis you, I'm gonna take my time finding a safe spot to cast from, and if you get aggro and die before I get to a safe spot, that's just tough luck. Should've brought your own powder and oil, because I'm not risking my life just becuase you weren't prepared.
Ok, that's it, if you want S+I, bring Powders and Oils!
I'm poor as shit and still have oils on me, shinobi-tabi takes care of the rest.
Poor or not, there is NO excuse.
all it takes is one person to be cruel and teach you a lesson, like leaving you in the middle of Sea Serpent Grotto during the Utsusemi quest while your sneak is wearing off . . . next time you bring the oil for yourself.
I hate you Palum
:lol:
Poor or not, there is NO excuse.
all it takes is one person to be cruel and teach you a lesson, like leaving you in the middle of Sea Serpent Grotto during the Utsusemi quest while your sneak is wearing off . . . next time you bring the oil for yourself.
I hate you Palum
:lol:
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yanno, there is no reason that you guys can't carry them around just in case. I dont mind doing it when we'rre running from say, altepa to altepa, or somewhere like that were there is a low chance of aggro, but in areas such as teh crawlers nest and that big room, theres a huge risk of shit wearing off and getting aggro. I've died trying to keep people sneak/invis, and it sucks.
The oils are more reliable, and yeah the price does suck on them, but its not like you need to buy 4 stacks every time you go out - at the most you're going to use 2-3 of them to get to a camp, so stop your fucking bitching and cough up the money.
The oils are more reliable, and yeah the price does suck on them, but its not like you need to buy 4 stacks every time you go out - at the most you're going to use 2-3 of them to get to a camp, so stop your fucking bitching and cough up the money.
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vang said:People who play this game are worthless. 90% of the players are garbage pail kids who only want the next level and can't stop to grab a few of the essentials to make everything more smoothe. If BST wasn't such a boring job I swear to christ I would have been one just to avoid parties. I will never make it to 70+ with my lack of patience for idiots.
So let's get this straight, you melee want to buy a stack of 20k food so your not missing every other attack (like usual) but you can't buy items to get to your camp safe and sound so people like me and the other 4 who had their items don't have to wait another 20 minutes and raise your dumbasses? Retarded fucks. You want your mage who has half the HP, Defense, and prime target for an aggro snack to come hold your hand and help you to camp you dependant losers?
Stop being so fucking lazy, most of you melee never get invites but every other month anyways so why don't you make the most of the time you have and do something for yourself for once. Leave fucking lower, go outside, and make some gil please. Sick of all of you in my way, lagging up the game in Jeuno when I need to buy something and your just fucking windowbrowsing the AH every 5 seconds like a fat drooling kid who keeps doublechecking the refridgerator for a cheeseburger to magically appear.
I swear it's the job you play, my beloved old Ranger brothers always have these items on hand, Ninjas do, Thfs do, and the rest are a toss up..
I have never seen a PLD with sneaks or invis, then again I never pegged PLD to be a job played by the most intelligent, coordinated people on the server.(/equip "Flame Shield +1)
But really, from my experience, most melee are lazy and selfish and way to cocky for how replaceable they are. Deny it all you want, call me a dick all you want, just stating my opinion. I will say one thing and believe me Im not kissing up, I have yet to party with a QCDN melee who has let me down.
I love MY PLD!! Majorhavoc ALWAYS carries oils/powders on him. Hell...half the time Jewellee and/or I will go to cast sneak/invis on him at the beginning of a zone only to have him using his items at the exact same time...lol
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Anderithe said:
When said people are together in an organized group its not an issue in the slightest. I rather like the skillups, when people fall behind and expect me to wait for them or kill myself saving them from their stupidity...
I normally would make a comment about how this topic has been beaten to death. HOWEVER, there are sooooo many people that don't get this.
DUH.
Jezza casts sneak and invisible on 3 different people. Jezza takes off through Onzozo. Jezza starts getting yelled at by some melee in the middle of 3 gobs and a big ol octopussy thing about sneak wearing. Jezza searches frantically for said melee. Jezza recasts. Jezza's invisible drops. Jezza recasts on herself. Melee #2 comes running around the corner whining about Invisible dropping. Jezza recasts on melee and self. Jezza takes off for camp....again. Melee #3 had sneak drop early, had to zone..and now is standing near the gobs at the front asking for sneak and inviso. Jezza trots back to the entrance...recasts. Ele aggro. Whm is irritated because melee #2 is stuck against some wall somewhere but can't tell where. Melee #1 wants to know what's taking so long and if he/she can pull yet. Jezza wants to poke a spork in someones anus. Jezza's inviso begins to wear. She uses a powder because there's that damn ele again. Melee #3 starts to panic because sneak is wearing. Sneak wears...and melee #2 is there...had run up to get buffs but didn't notice the gob. 2 HOUR! Chainspell/escape. Sit outside on the beach and get a tan...heal...convert...
Melee #1 and Whm decide that it's been too long a wait and they want dinner. Say they'll be afk for a while to order pizza/walk the dog/take a dump. Jezza is chainsmoking. Jezza wonders what happened to the 6th party member. D/C, was apparantly waiting at the zone entrance because of no map and poor connection. Why is it always the blm that d/c's?
30 mintues later the WHM comes back. In the meantime...the rest of the party has made it (slowly) to camp. Melee #3 says that he's sorry, but it's taken to long and he has to go now kthxbi.
Jezza runs across the room and bangs her head into a wall. The rest of the party agrees that this just won't work out.
THIS is based on the last 2 times I've attempted to exp. 2-3 hours of fucking around for nothing...because we can't even get to camp.
I hate people today ><
DUH.
Jezza casts sneak and invisible on 3 different people. Jezza takes off through Onzozo. Jezza starts getting yelled at by some melee in the middle of 3 gobs and a big ol octopussy thing about sneak wearing. Jezza searches frantically for said melee. Jezza recasts. Jezza's invisible drops. Jezza recasts on herself. Melee #2 comes running around the corner whining about Invisible dropping. Jezza recasts on melee and self. Jezza takes off for camp....again. Melee #3 had sneak drop early, had to zone..and now is standing near the gobs at the front asking for sneak and inviso. Jezza trots back to the entrance...recasts. Ele aggro. Whm is irritated because melee #2 is stuck against some wall somewhere but can't tell where. Melee #1 wants to know what's taking so long and if he/she can pull yet. Jezza wants to poke a spork in someones anus. Jezza's inviso begins to wear. She uses a powder because there's that damn ele again. Melee #3 starts to panic because sneak is wearing. Sneak wears...and melee #2 is there...had run up to get buffs but didn't notice the gob. 2 HOUR! Chainspell/escape. Sit outside on the beach and get a tan...heal...convert...
Melee #1 and Whm decide that it's been too long a wait and they want dinner. Say they'll be afk for a while to order pizza/walk the dog/take a dump. Jezza is chainsmoking. Jezza wonders what happened to the 6th party member. D/C, was apparantly waiting at the zone entrance because of no map and poor connection. Why is it always the blm that d/c's?
30 mintues later the WHM comes back. In the meantime...the rest of the party has made it (slowly) to camp. Melee #3 says that he's sorry, but it's taken to long and he has to go now kthxbi.
Jezza runs across the room and bangs her head into a wall. The rest of the party agrees that this just won't work out.
THIS is based on the last 2 times I've attempted to exp. 2-3 hours of fucking around for nothing...because we can't even get to camp.
I hate people today ><
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ThatGuyYouKnow said:
Well since you feel this way, I'm sure you won't mind bringing your own Reraisers and crap, since we're such heartless bastards and all.
And to the people thinking sneaking 2-3 people isn't a challenge - it's a 10-second recast. Us casting kills our invis, so we hafto try not to agro a gob within that ten seconds. And in some cases, when we're in a party where we're TOTALLY SCREWED, we hafto sneak/invis all 6 people. That's a full minute to give everyone the status. And these statuses can wear off as soon as 5 seconds. Do that math.
I've heard that MND effects how long the two statuses work on you (as well as if gear is equipped), and both seem to be true, but I dunno..
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OMG, been there done that too many times to count!!!! Perfect rendition Jezza!!!! Dammit people, FARM the friggin' gil for your echo drops, oils and powders. They are JUST as important as food. I cannot stress this enough!!!!!!
Jezza said:
This has happen to me so many times! I just feel like saying "Im not your Invis/Sneak Bitch, buy some Oils and Powders like I do."
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And Cythe, kma!!! I luv ya, but you are soooo wrong in thinking that way. I've said this before and I'll say it again. I NEVER leave home without my echo drops, oils and powders. You wanna know when I use them most? When I have some stupid ass melee that didn't bring any and I need to cast on them and then use the oils and powders on myself cuz we're in a pickle and I don't have time to wait for the recast time.
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I don't have a problem tossing out sneak and invisi, and as long as it's no danger to me I'll help recast it for you. I think you should carry one or two sneak and invisi items, for those rare moments, or pick a few more up if you know you are going somewhere like LoO or going to go fight garuda. But normally, it's not needed. I can get someone through kuftal tunnel easily, there are a lot of "safe" spots on the way to Cape, but if we are going to xp deeper inside, they best have a few of the items themselves. Anyways, you guys are blowing it a bit too big, you shouldn't expect melee to have their own sneak and invisi items, it's BS. You should expect them to have a few, in case you're right in the middle of gobs and invsi starts wearing for them or something. But unless it's a situation like that, I gladly cast and recast both. I fully believe a good mage uses ALL of their spells to the best benifit of the pt. I have refresh, mages COULD buy a ton of yagudo drinks and I wouldn't have to cast refresh. But why? I have the god damn spell, I can cast it on you instead.
I'm usually the last to head out to camp as a mage because I stay behind to cast sneak and invisi for everyone (less now as rdm, since the whm or smn usually takes care of it now), and the other mages running with the melee watch their backs.
Before long rdm will be complaing about mages not having their own refresh items for the few times when they are busy trying to keep a mob sleeping, or healing because the healer died. And then we'll complain about tanks and melee not having a ton of potions for when an add rips a ton of hp off people and the whm ends up wasting far more mp then normal and runs out.
Really, some spells are a small given or a big expected. I don't want to add price tags to every melee job, if I'm playing melee I'll usually have a few invisi powder and oil I cooked up, but by god damn I expect the mages to provide me with sneak and invsi, it's not a lot of mp and I'd boot the lazy ass mage who says "No, better start asking around for some oils, or just make a run for it. I'll be glad to raise your dead body"
I'm usually the last to head out to camp as a mage because I stay behind to cast sneak and invisi for everyone (less now as rdm, since the whm or smn usually takes care of it now), and the other mages running with the melee watch their backs.
Before long rdm will be complaing about mages not having their own refresh items for the few times when they are busy trying to keep a mob sleeping, or healing because the healer died. And then we'll complain about tanks and melee not having a ton of potions for when an add rips a ton of hp off people and the whm ends up wasting far more mp then normal and runs out.
Really, some spells are a small given or a big expected. I don't want to add price tags to every melee job, if I'm playing melee I'll usually have a few invisi powder and oil I cooked up, but by god damn I expect the mages to provide me with sneak and invsi, it's not a lot of mp and I'd boot the lazy ass mage who says "No, better start asking around for some oils, or just make a run for it. I'll be glad to raise your dead body"
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Sanjo..i haven't seen any mages bitch about the mp cost. What they are bitching about is the possibility of dieing yourself. I personally don't mind casting it..BUT you DAMNED well better have some oils/powders for those "just in case" situations. I carry them as well.
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Mishaela said:
?Kat, I did not say I disagree, I just have no sympathy. I always have my oils and powders on me. Every mage here is making it sound like the melee's are the retards when it comes to the sneak/invis thing, but there are occasional moron mages too, who seem to like to stare at you for about 5 minutes before casting the spell. I'd rather rely on my items then the spell.
However, I still have no sympathy. Those items are freakin expensive! Those spells are not. If you cast sneak on me, and some other idiot in my party gets aggro, it's ok for me to voke the thing and let the spell drop. But when I keep using my items and dropping my sneak/invis, I'm wasting an assload of gil because someone else got aggro. And it's not always the melee.
And don't tell me I don't know how it is to keep 2-3+ people's sneak on. I've done it plenty in this game to understand how it's such a pain. But I think of the damn prices I pay for those items, and don't mind it so much. Yes, when people are retarded and get lost, it's irritating. If I run out of oil/powders, or forget them, I stick to my mages like glue. Hell, I do it anyway. I'm a PLD. If I need a sneak or invis in that case, the mage merely has to turn around, and hit a macro, cuz I'm right there. And if something goes wrong in that case? It's ok! The TANK is right in front of you.
As for the heartless bastard comment, I dunno who pissed in your cheerios, but I was just saying I have no sympathy. I would not be one of the people pissing you off with OMGZSNAEKISWARING!!! I just think until prices on items go down, people should be a little more welcoming to those who ask for sneak/invis. I've seen mages flip out of people for asking for a 'free' sneak and invis right after zoning into a dangerous area. That's fucking ridiculous.
_____
Cythe - Rank 10
Hume Male
73 Paladin
However, I still have no sympathy. Those items are freakin expensive! Those spells are not. If you cast sneak on me, and some other idiot in my party gets aggro, it's ok for me to voke the thing and let the spell drop. But when I keep using my items and dropping my sneak/invis, I'm wasting an assload of gil because someone else got aggro. And it's not always the melee.
And don't tell me I don't know how it is to keep 2-3+ people's sneak on. I've done it plenty in this game to understand how it's such a pain. But I think of the damn prices I pay for those items, and don't mind it so much. Yes, when people are retarded and get lost, it's irritating. If I run out of oil/powders, or forget them, I stick to my mages like glue. Hell, I do it anyway. I'm a PLD. If I need a sneak or invis in that case, the mage merely has to turn around, and hit a macro, cuz I'm right there. And if something goes wrong in that case? It's ok! The TANK is right in front of you.
As for the heartless bastard comment, I dunno who pissed in your cheerios, but I was just saying I have no sympathy. I would not be one of the people pissing you off with OMGZSNAEKISWARING!!! I just think until prices on items go down, people should be a little more welcoming to those who ask for sneak/invis. I've seen mages flip out of people for asking for a 'free' sneak and invis right after zoning into a dangerous area. That's fucking ridiculous.
_____
Cythe - Rank 10
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73 Paladin
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Should...probably ignore that.... DX
And I'm simply adding costs to melee classes.
Tank - 3gil per 1dmg taken
NIN - 50gil per Utsusemi
Provoke - 100gil
Sneak Attack - 200gil
Trick Attack - 400gil
Soul Eater - 100gil per 10 damage self-inflicted
aaand I'm gonna sht u, it just seems silly to think of..
And Cythe, sorry to cut in...but just to give an opinion, nearly every mage I know of subs rdm or whm (or IS rdm or whm), and thusly can sneak/invis themself...unless it's the somewhat-rare BLM/SMN...which I've only seen one of, and they actually did simply ask.. =P
And I'm simply adding costs to melee classes.
Tank - 3gil per 1dmg taken
NIN - 50gil per Utsusemi
Provoke - 100gil
Sneak Attack - 200gil
Trick Attack - 400gil
Soul Eater - 100gil per 10 damage self-inflicted
aaand I'm gonna sht u, it just seems silly to think of..
And Cythe, sorry to cut in...but just to give an opinion, nearly every mage I know of subs rdm or whm (or IS rdm or whm), and thusly can sneak/invis themself...unless it's the somewhat-rare BLM/SMN...which I've only seen one of, and they actually did simply ask.. =P
Not saying the mages can't sneak or invis themselves...Just saying, it's not always the melee who are the idiots, and get aggro, and slow the whole party down. I had a party in Boyahda Tree where the Black Mage died 3 times on the way to camp.
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Yess Jezza I think we have all been there... Stupid fucken melle... Dar I am a melle... I hit things....
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Vang said:
Hey now. I always carry oil/powder on myself, usually more than one stack in the off chance we might do a mission and it's necessary because of the large number of players, but I will admit that I've seen a LOT of idiot PLDs, more than any other job it seems. I'm guessing they just have the common Allakhazam mentality of "I'm the tank, you need me, so help me there or I leave your PT without a tank 8)."