Orz O.o;;

[Cladius]

So my friend asks me to check the price on Utsusemi Ni today. He says it should be about 550k~ I take a look at the AH. Some idiot or desperate person decides to buy (or sell) it for 700k... orz @_@. I check the name, my windower isnt working so I'll just give the data: May 16, 2005 8:31:50pm Anmitu->Garret [700,000]. So I think the persons either desperate or a gil buyer. I head down the Port Jeuno AH to check a few things, make a few /pokes, /waves, /laugh, etc.

Then I see someone /anon with the name (Garret). aha so thats our intrepid buyer (or whatever he did). I do a /check on him out of pure curiousity and his title = New Adventurer. I can understand why someone would use a mule to craft and to buy things. But to buy an item thats really not all that expensive (you could argue but its only like a few days farming) for a charcter thats level 37 with a mule. All kind of pointless really and I may be reading into it too much. Some gilbuyer who wants to keep his 'rep' in game or something. Either way its incredibly fishy and overall pathetic.

It could be a misunderstanding but feel free to /laugh, /point, /poke, /laugh (yeah I said it twice) at this person for either being a complete dumbass for over charging 150k on an item or for being a n00b gilbuyer who spent his poor hard earned RL money on a fantasy game. Oh yeah heres a pic:

 

[Rones]

Looks like a fake price hike. Put item on ah for big price increase, buy it with your other character. Lose the ah fee, but potentially raise price temporarily for the next couple buyers who are too lazy to start bidding from the bottom.

 

[Cladius]

hahaha, yeah forgot to put that in too, and btw I forgot the last t in my post for the name for anyone who feels like catching that :þ. I kinda want to see how far people will go with this price hike. I'm hoping most people are smart enough not to go with the most recent price, lmao :lol:

 

[Rones]

Considering I need to do that quest soon and sell it I wouldn't mind that price sticking. :twisted:

 

[Mistaya]

Ustsusemi:NI isnt quested BCNM drop I think <.<;

again with the "OMG GILBUYER BURN THE WITCH"

Rones is probably right on the nose, if you buyout yourself with a different name you can set a price higher than the market may have been willing to go. It's not uncommon at all.

 

[Jemanie]

Considering I need to do that quest soon and sell it I wouldn't mind that price sticking. :twisted:

Just to set the record straight for ya

Ustsusemi:Ichi is the Norg quest.

Ustsusemi:Ni is the BCNM40, possible others aswell I dont know.

 

[Mortanius]

But sometimes BCNMs are referred to as quests. I've heard it more than once.

 

[Yakuzaangel]

You know you CAN get the "New Adventurer" title back... I mean hey, I've seen a lv70SAM running around with "New Adventurer"

 

[Anderithe]

Probably a attempt at a price hike. Think about it. Sells to himself and loses a little money. But if he just did some bcnms and got a few scrolls of Ni then he stands to MAKE 150k more on each subsequent sale.

Keep your eye on the AH. If it keeps at this price we know who to blame don't we?

 

[Cladius]

Yah, I still feel sorry for the poor saps who fall for it, hahaha.

 

[Answa~]

I'm a SMN... like I care about Utsusemi:Ni. Let him hike the price, I'm not buying it just the same. And whoever does... well, feh. If he can afford such a thing, then let him be happy and ignorant with his new toy. Feh.

 

[Bajaratt]

I'm a SMN... like I care about Utsusemi:Ni. Let him hike the price, I'm not buying it just the same. And whoever does... well, feh. If he can afford such a thing, then let him be happy and ignorant with his new toy. Feh.

Yeah, I think I'm going to go hike up the price of the austere gear. I'm not a smn, so why should I care if any and all future smn's get screwed by my actions? That kind of attitude is contributing to the rising prices, you don't need it, so you don't care that you're charging an arm and a leg for it. Your whole post was pointless, and just showed that you're part of the problem.

 

[Twille]

. . .

i am SO gonna change my title back to New Adventurer now that i'm lvl 75, just for the hell of it, besides, its good to remember that we were ALL noobs at some point....

 

[anesly]

I can understand why someone would use a mule to craft and to buy things. But to buy an item thats really not all that expensive (you could argue but its only like a few days farming) for a charcter thats level 37 with a mule. All kind of pointless really and I may be reading into it too much. Some gilbuyer who wants to keep his 'rep' in game or something. Either way its incredibly fishy and overall pathetic.

Yes, clearly anyone doesn't stick to Cladius' rules for what is and isn't reasonable to buy with a mule must be a gil buyer.

 

[Cladius]

Meh we cant always be right My imagination gets the best of me sometimes

 

[Rones]

I'm a SMN... like I care about Utsusemi:Ni. Let him hike the price, I'm not buying it just the same. And whoever does... well, feh. If he can afford such a thing, then let him be happy and ignorant with his new toy. Feh.

Yeah, I think I'm going to go hike up the price of the austere gear. I'm not a smn, so why should I care if any and all future smn's get screwed by my actions? That kind of attitude is contributing to the rising prices, you don't need it, so you don't care that you're charging an arm and a leg for it. Your whole post was pointless, and just showed that you're part of the problem.

Answa's comments are actually right in line with the economic philosophy of Adam Smith. His invisible hand theory encourages Answa's attitude and explains how it is actually beneficial for society and the economy if all act that way. Doing what brings the most profit to the individual is best for the economy without them ever intending that. Just to explain further here is a quote from Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations:

The Invisible Hand:

"...But the annual revenue of every society is always precisely equal to the exchangeable value of the whole annual produce of its industry, or rather is precisely the same thing with that exchangeable value. As every individual, therefore, endeavours as much as he can both to employ his capital in the support of domestic industry, and so to direct that industry that its produce may be of the greatest value; every individual necessarily labours to render the annual revenue of the society as great as he can. He generally, indeed, neither intends to promote the public interest, nor knows how much he is promoting it. By preferring the support of domestic to that of foreign industry, he intends only his own security; and by directing that industry in such a manner as its produce may be of the greatest value, he intends only his own gain, and he is in this, as in many other cases, led by an invisible hand to promote an end which was no part of his intention.

"Nor is it always the worse for the society that it was no part of it. By pursuing his own interest he frequently promotes that of the society more effectually than when he really intends to promote it. I have never known much good done by those who affected to trade for the public good. It is an affectation, indeed, not very common among merchants, and very few words need be employed in dissuading them from it..."

Adam Smith is one of my favorite economics philosophers.

 

[xKronox]

I'm a SMN... like I care about Utsusemi:Ni. Let him hike the price, I'm not buying it just the same. And whoever does... well, feh. If he can afford such a thing, then let him be happy and ignorant with his new toy. Feh.

Yeah, I think I'm going to go hike up the price of the austere gear. I'm not a smn, so why should I care if any and all future smn's get screwed by my actions? That kind of attitude is contributing to the rising prices, you don't need it, so you don't care that you're charging an arm and a leg for it. Your whole post was pointless, and just showed that you're part of the problem.

Answa's comments are actually right in line with the economic philosophy of Adam Smith. His invisible hand theory encourages Answa's attitude and explains how it is actually beneficial for society and the economy if all act that way. Doing what brings the most profit to the individual is best for the economy without them ever intending that. Just to explain further here is a quote from Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations:

The Invisible Hand:

"...But the annual revenue of every society is always precisely equal to the exchangeable value of the whole annual produce of its industry, or rather is precisely the same thing with that exchangeable value. As every individual, therefore, endeavours as much as he can both to employ his capital in the support of domestic industry, and so to direct that industry that its produce may be of the greatest value; every individual necessarily labours to render the annual revenue of the society as great as he can. He generally, indeed, neither intends to promote the public interest, nor knows how much he is promoting it. By preferring the support of domestic to that of foreign industry, he intends only his own security; and by directing that industry in such a manner as its produce may be of the greatest value, he intends only his own gain, and he is in this, as in many other cases, led by an invisible hand to promote an end which was no part of his intention.

"Nor is it always the worse for the society that it was no part of it. By pursuing his own interest he frequently promotes that of the society more effectually than when he really intends to promote it. I have never known much good done by those who affected to trade for the public good. It is an affectation, indeed, not very common among merchants, and very few words need be employed in dissuading them from it..."

Adam Smith is one of my favorite economics philosophers.

Reading this I now know why I failed economics. :lol: I just simple cannot comprehend it.

 

[Bajaratt]

It seems to be an economical backing of the reasoning of Atlas Shrugged. Everyone works for themselves, and society benefits. There's only one thing in that quote that I'm questioning, and that's only if I'm reading it correctly.

"Adam Smith"]"...But the annual revenue of every society is always precisely equal to the exchangeable value of the whole annual produce of its industry, or rather is precisely the same thing with that exchangeable value. As every individual, therefore, endeavours as much as he can both to employ his capital in the support of domestic industry, and so to direct that industry that its produce may be of the greatest value; every individual necessarily labours to render the annual revenue of the society as great as he can

My problem is the anual revenue part of the text, it seems to be dealing with the GDP of a society. I don't think that XI's economy is advanced or complicated enough to the point where GDP is even measured, let alone cared about. I can see how marketing for just yourself and not for the public good would boost a GDP, but I don't think it really applies to XI's economy.

 

[Cladius]

Another reason that differs with FFXI's currency is the fact that it is not printed in a mint that regulates how much money goes out each year. All the game money is ficticious and is made in other sources like shops that in reality do not have a set amount of gil. There is no way to regulate how much is produced and made for each person. Then you also have the introduction of the outside world, RL, in which people use money from there to buy gil in the game. If you wanted to keep a real economic system in the game you would have to eliminate these outside sources because people in the game can just get lots of money really quickly for no real reason. Overall gil buying defeats the point of the game in general. Then you have the flood of gilsellers making it more difficult for people who actually want to play the game and its economic system to actually make money and keep updated equip.

Lucky for us most gilsellers are morons with bad engrish "you will dead" who try to mpk and FAIL at it (peaceenvoy). Lets see, drawing mobs to me while i'm sneaked and invis, good job! At any rate I always have a fail safe with me, Invincible and instant warp scroll.

As for economical purposes the price hike is a common tactic for someone who wants to gain a quick buck. I'm mostly a novice when it comes to economics though, I dont get into it as much as others that play this game. It can be a very lucrative thing to get into if you can play it smart though.

 

[Rones]

"Adam Smith"]"...But the annual revenue of every society is always precisely equal to the exchangeable value of the whole annual produce of its industry, or rather is precisely the same thing with that exchangeable value. As every individual, therefore, endeavours as much as he can both to employ his capital in the support of domestic industry, and so to direct that industry that its produce may be of the greatest value; every individual necessarily labours to render the annual revenue of the society as great as he can

My problem is the anual revenue part of the text, it seems to be dealing with the GDP of a society. I don't think that XI's economy is advanced or complicated enough to the point where GDP is even measured, let alone cared about. I can see how marketing for just yourself and not for the public good would boost a GDP, but I don't think it really applies to XI's economy.

Its basically saying that whenever an individual tries to make the greastest profit for themselves personally, the overall average for everyone else is also improved since everyone is acting the same way. Of course no one follows or cares about the actual GDP, but having a higher one does result from that practice and is beneficial without you having to be aware of it. That's the very beauty of Adam Smith's ideals, you don't have to pay attention to anything outside your own little world and you are improving things for everyone.

Overall gil buying defeats the point of the game in general.

Gilbuying has no effect on the economy. That money has already been created and was part of the economy. Take gilsellers selling archer rings on the ah. They take the money out and then put it right back in when someone buys gil from them. The only time gil sellers really hurt the economy is when they sell goods to npcs which causes inflation (drop of money value), but this isn't as common since the hat trick in rabao got nerfed. Receiving money rewards for your rank quests worsens inflation too. :wink: Yet, inflation doesn't really counter Adam Smith's ideas. His economic practices can still function with inflation occuring.

About the only way SE could seal off the creation of money is stopping all npcs from buying goods, cash rewards for ranks/quests, mob dropped gil, etc. This would probably do more harm than good and eventually deflation from things like dynamsis and chocobos would cause a stagnate economy. Value of money would be rising so quickly that no one would want to spend their money on equipment because when they turn around to sell it they would get less money in return. This would be worse than our rampent inflation we are experiencing which encourages investment of gil in products that can be resold without lose of value to inflation (eg: buy leaping lizzy boots for 600k, sell them back in a couple months for 800k as inflation grows verus a deflating economy where you buy them for 600k and have to sell them for 400k in a couple months).