Revolution's virtual console not just for Nintendo systems.

[Marajade]

Just because you suck at adapting to use of a control pad, doesn't mean the games are bad.

no, he has a point. I went from Console FPS to PC FPS, and i can say that while the dynamics of the game dont change, the advangage of a mouse is redily apparent.
While not to say that Console stick controll is "bad" But the mouse has a distinct advantage over it.

 

[Rones]

Just because you suck at adapting to use of a control pad, doesn't mean the games are bad.

I never said the games were bad. I said I don't consider them because of the horrid controls. CoD2 is a great game on console and pc for example. I just finished it on veteran mode a couple weeks ago on pc. However, I can't beat the russian campaign on the easiest setting with the aim help on the xbox 360. There is a huge difference in what the controls let you do. After you master using a mouse to aim, anything else short of a light gun makes you feel like a cripple in comparison at best. A master at joystick/console style aiming will still get beat by a mediocre player with a mouse.

 

[Skaw]

However, unlike Rockstar Games, Nintendo has a gaming console it also runs. If Rockstar Games had its own game console, it would likely lack child oriented games, which would be a valid complaint. Why is it invalid though against Nintendo? If they want to claim their system is for all ages, they should provide for all ages. Otherwise, then it is a child targeted system and people shouldn't be so defensive about that.

It would likely lack child oriented games because of brand recognition. Rockstar is notorious for pushing the line when it comes to mature titles. They have thier fanbase locked down, should they release a child-friendly game, its sales would brick worse than a masonry.

Ofcourse, the same applies to Nintendo. Nintendo has plenty of first party and second party games that aren't for kids. But brand recognition, they're the longest lasting console and software producing company in thier field. You played thier games as a child, thus you still see every one of thier games as child-friendly.

 

[Yoshindor]

Just because you suck at adapting to use of a control pad, doesn't mean the games are bad.

No he's right.

Onlya hand full of games have gotten it right on consoles, 2 were on N64 perfect dark and Golden eye, but they still can't hold a candle to a mouse and keyboard.

Keyboard and Mouse > Controler

GAME OVER!

 

[Tagrineth]

I stand by my previous statement.

I know people who used to play Quake3 on the Dreamcast with PC players and win matches. Using the Dreamcast's controller. Not a DC kb/mouse.

Controllers are more difficult to aim with, but if you're that fucking elite at FPS, you shouldn't be THAT pathetically gimped by a controller. L 2 P, my friends. L 2 P.

 

[Rones]

I stand by my previous statement.

I know people who used to play Quake3 on the Dreamcast with PC players and win matches. Using the Dreamcast's controller. Not a DC kb/mouse.

Back in the day I played Quake3 on my DC online constantly with a controller because I didn't have a gaming pc. I got good...for using a controller, but it was always obvious when my oppenent used a mouse+keyboard. It was like a cheat, they just add that much advantage. This is especially true in rail gun matches where everything depends on quick accuracy while charge&spray tactics fail.

I enjoy games when I feel like I am playing good given my experience level. When I play a shooter, I have a lot of experience I feel, but on a console I play like garbage compared to what I can do on a pc. Thus, it is not enjoyable. Back when the only thing I knew was console style of golden eye and perfect dark, it was fine. Ignorance is bliss perhaps.

Before telling me to "learn to play" maybe you should learn what its like playing fps on pc. Spend a few weeks playing halo dm for pc with a mouse and keyboard, then try to go back to use a controller on the console version (I've done this). It just doesn't work. You feel like a blind, slow, gimp that can't hit jack even if your controller skill is the same as it was before. The gameplay is supposed to be the fun challenge, not the control system (my biggest complaint with old RE games). After you see what is possible with a mouse, you see the challenge of a console fps lies solely in the controls. That is why when console fps are ported to pc they have to up the difficulty so much. The challenge of the controls no longer exists (or it's at least minimized until we find something better than a mouse+keyboard).

On a plus note, I think fps on Revolution have a lot of potential given the new controller. The one instantce I think it will work fairly well is shooters as we have always lacked real good light guns. If it was shaped a little better for a shooter I would be happier, but it still has much potential. Now we wait to see if Nintendo will deliver on the games. See, its not the console fps I criticize, but the old style of control used with them. :wink:

 

[mastershake]

o.o

I just found this thread.........OH HELL YES!



So, anyone up for a game of super dodge ball????????

 

[Tagrineth]

Rones, I played almost nothing but Tribes for an entire year (similar to religious FFXI play now! ), I've owned UT99 for a long time, and I preordered UT2004 - still have it installed on my system, and I use the headset that came with it out of convenience.

I'm not some PC FPS nub... thanks for making that assumption, though.

 

[Rones]

I'm not some PC FPS nub... thanks for making that assumption, though.

Actually, I was just turning your own assumption back on you. If you are so experienced with pc fps, then you should have understood what I was refering to from the start.

 

[Tagrineth]

Actually, I was just turning your own assumption back on you. If you are so experienced with pc fps, then you should have understood what I was refering to from the start.

I did, and do understand, but being good at FPS on PC and Console are two different skills, and you really shouldn't bash console FPS just because they use different controls. It's possible to snipe headshots in Timesplitters 2 (autoaim off, of course) using a GCN Hori controller with practice.

 

[Rones]

you really shouldn't bash console FPS just because they use different controls.

That is a poorely worded sentence. You again accuse me of bashing the games when I'm not and have not. Then you accuse me of attacking the controls solely because they are different. I've never criticized them solely for being different. I even compilmented the Revolution's new controller in its potential to improve fps gaming, which is a very different controller from the mouse. It is the fact that the controllers are bad for fps that I criticize them. Why you insist in disagreeing with me over that I do not understand. You even agreed the mouse is superior.

 

[Tagrineth]

Killer7 from what I can see is just a cell shaded console fps. Fps on console = nuisance.

Instant dismissal of Killer7 without knowing a thing about the game, based on an assumption that surely came from screenshots, along with the idea that console fps = bad bad bad?

 

[Rones]

Instant dismissal of Killer7 without knowing a thing about the game, based on an assumption that surely came from screenshots, along with the idea that console fps = bad bad bad?

I was basing it on an old gamepro article I read about it. Couldn't remember everything, just that it wans't anything special. Where did I say bad? I said nuisance because of the control system required to play it...like I've said over and over. Why do you continue to accuse me of bashing the game when I am bashing the control system which spoils the game? This is just getting rediculous. Stop trying to put words in my mouth.

 

[Andreva]

As much as it pains me to say this, Rones has a point (It's not that it pains me to agree with Rones, it's that it pains me to admit the superiority of mouse to gamepad). You just don't have the same degree of control and speed with a gamepad. If you turn the sensitivity down far enough to give yourself the hairline control you need to snipe, you lose any type of quick turning and movement you could hope for. If you set it for good movement, any slight pressure on the stick will cause your crosshair to jump about in blocks, making fine control nigh impossible. Which is not to say you can't make a good FPS with a game pad (See: Goldeneye, Halo) but it's just a completely different ballgame then with a mouse/board setup (i.e. Starsiege Tribes (Which I'll still argue is one of the greatest FPSs ever, and not just because I kicked ass at it. Well, mostly cause I kicked ass at it.)) So just take everything for it is, and rather then arguing about the shortcomings of one v another, or which is better, or who is a noob, just play and enjoy your game. Seriously, that's what they're here for.

 

[Chasym]

well i have to disagree with mouse to controller. i SUCK with mouse and keyboard. And i have tried my best to get good at it but it just doesnt work for me.
I install a controller and i pwn. Even against mouse and key players.
Example is the game F.E.A.R. that ive been playing latley. I had to set up my own controls so it was a lil odd to get used to, but i play much better with the controller than i did before and i dont gotta hear "get outta here noob" anymore!
Halo2. You can increase the sensitivity to 10 on there which is insane and just as fast as a pc spin, and for most people its hard to control which is why its labled insane.
Back when i first started playing halo 2 i thought it would make me cool to be set on a 10, cause in firefights i could jump over the person and spin around faster than them and hear them scream WHERE THE HELL DID HE GO!? that was fun, but i stopped playing for awhile...and when i went back, Jumping from FFXI to HALO2 throws you off cause the ffxi controls are much much slower.
so i could no longer play on a 10 because of that and dropped to a 6 or a 7, and i still play just as well, sniping and all. Even against the mouse keyboard players.
yes, there are those hookups on xbox for those who prefer it.
But in my personal expierience, ive never had someone with a mouse/keyboard play better than me when i play on controller. Its all about how well you get with the tools you have and build skill off it, if your good playing that way, no one has an advantage. But thats my personal expierience cause i just get good with the controls i wanna use.

 

[Rones]

High sensitivity on a controller is all well and good for close quarters combat, but makes making small adjustments for medium to long range shooting impossible. Mouse lets you have accurate and fast aiming for all distance. You can quick turn without losing the ability to make small adustments to your aim for long range shots.

 

[Chasym]

i have no problems at any range. In fact my higest skills are in sniping, long range stickies and close range battles cause of my quick mid shot beat downs. I have no issues with any range of battle in any game ive played. Im quite the high level (40, 10 away from cap) sniper. and im also a master of no scoping!

 

[Yoshindor]

Instant dismissal of Killer7 without knowing a thing about the game, based on an assumption that surely came from screenshots, along with the idea that console fps = bad bad bad?

Sorry but Killer 7 just tried too hard to be something it was not, there was too much plot and not enough shooting, hence why I say it was in the wrong genre. They should have billed it as an action drama with FPS bits added in. not an FPS with drama and action.

 

[Tagrineth]

Games like Timesplitters series have two different aiming modes for a reason...

And look speed isn't static on a gamepad. Analogue sticks are used for a reason..

 

[Ecks]

((I haven't logged on in a while.. catching up)) As far as my personal experience goes.. most console FPS's handling is just a bit wierd, or too slow/too fast in responce, mostly because.. its not as easy to aim with just your thumb as opposed to having your whole hand on a mouse in control of aiming.

That isn't to say there aren't some really great console FPS's. Though I think the best one ive enjoyed in recent years was the Metroid Prime series, the lock on feature as well as the overall game play just made the games completely fun and provided no real hassle when trying to shoot something you wanted to shoot.

When Goldeneye first came out on the N64 I rented it and loved it. Though a few years ago I picked the game up after not really playing it and my god the controls were so hard and akward. I pretty much used to be great at playing it on the N64 and then bleh.. I couldn't believe I sucked so much at it the last time I played it. I think PC FPS's have probably spoiled me somewhat, since they.. well.. generally are much better.. even the badly made ones.. (gameplay-wise).