RMT: Behind the Scenes

[Princemercury]

Isn't selling something you don't have the rights to(virtual items) for money a definition of being a thief? Well, it's technically fencing, but you're still using something that doesn't belong to you.

Anyway. I feel about as much for them as I do celebrities hitting the Scientology craze. They're both participating in a giant con pyramid scheme thats only going to make one persons life better. Hint: Not theirs.

I use the word thieves as in stealing other people's gear and accounts.

Gil, yeah that doesn't belong to them which makes them thieves but I'm talking about the actual account and items.

 

[Tomasello]

How about the people who buy gil? I don't care how much money you have, you are one pathetic loser if you would swap a single dollar out of your pocket for gil.

It's a video game. It's not even something tangible. Your buying pixels in a piece of software. It's just so sad......

 

[Princemercury]

How about the people who buy gil? I don't care how much money you have, you are one pathetic loser if you would swap a single dollar out of your pocket for gil.

It's a video game. It's not even something tangible. Your buying pixels in a piece of software. It's just so sad......

Chances are you just called out 50 - 80% of the people you know D;.

There's a reason RMT is so predetermined to keep making new accounts by the hundreds / thousands and farming up gil. The demand is there and the incentives are more than large enough to support their efforts. Reasoning: If half the people who buy gil stopped, the farmers would still be around.

 

[Euphacent]

The deal with purchasing game currency is you can either:

a) Spend weeks/months farming to buy an item

or

b) Work an extra hour or two at work to get the exact same thing

I'm not condoning buying currency, but that's just how a lot of (older) people look at it. Farming is boring, but having cool items and killing stuff is fun.

 

[Tomasello]

The deal with purchasing game currency is you can either:

a) Spend weeks/months farming to buy an item

or

b) Work an extra hour or two at work to get the exact same thing

I'm not condoning buying currency, but that's just how a lot of (older) people look at it. Farming is boring, but having cool items and killing stuff is fun.

You forgot the third choice:

c) Get a life, take your what would of been otherwise wasted money, go out and have a fucking good time with your friends

I stand by my pathetic as hell stance. It's one thing to play a video game for fun, it's another to buy video games objects like some tool bag. If you don't have the time to play the game then don't play. Simple as that.


Your question might as well be:


The deal with getting laid is you can either:

a) Spend weeks/months going to bars/clubs trying to pick up a cute chick

or

b) Work an extra hour or two at work and pay for a hooker

 

[Xzerper]

The deal with getting laid is you can either:

a) Spend weeks/months going to bars/clubs trying to pick up a cute chick

or

b) Work an extra hour or two at work and pay for a hooker

I just had to lol@that sorry. lol

 

[Princemercury]

They're both right... just depends on the person and whatever he/she wants to do with their money is their choice..

 

[matchuu]

well the RMTs being interviewed are for WoW and not for FFXI, so him asking for a little space in WoW isn't that big of a deal cause probaly he just farms items and NPCs them. The sad thing about WoW is... its easy as hell to make gold even as a casual gamer. While its a bigger problem in FFXI cause NMs ect pop like once a day and SE has nerfed near every farming item now(because of RMT exploits), that's probably why the hatred is more in FFXI.

 

[Guyfox]

I don't agree with RMT. I do understand that it is a job for a lot of people. I'm moderately cool with that. What irks me, however, are the ones who hack accounts to sell off everything on the character.

 

[Xzerper]

well the RMTs being interviewed are for WoW and not for FFXI, so him asking for a little space in WoW isn't that big of a deal cause probaly he just farms items and NPCs them. The sad thing about WoW is... its easy as hell to make gold even as a casual gamer. While its a bigger problem in FFXI cause NMs ect pop like once a day and SE has nerfed near every farming item now(because of RMT exploits), that's probably why the hatred is more in FFXI.

You can most likely guess that the people don't just do it for one game only, I wouldn't doubt them doing with more than just WoW itself.

 

[Moggie]

nah. I agree with Euphacent. And really, you have to have a life to understand where Euphacent is coming from. And NO, simply having a job, or going to school, or just having a girlfriend isnt having a life. Having a life means: Owning a house + owning a car/cars (with the payments for insurance) +dealing with a Mortgage + having a wife + having 3 kids+paying Alimony,+working 12 hrs in your career (albeit not by choice ><). When you meet the above criteria you can respond as you like. If you dont, then your flames mean nothing. Anyways, yes, its easy to see why someone with a LIFE, would want to come home after all that hard work and just simply pay rl money, to have gil, which in turn makes the virtual life go round. Those kinds of people, with a rl life, that still choose to play this game, don't have the time required to camp certain NMs, goto sky with an ls at a certain odd time, do endgame, etc etc for those awesome items, like the rest of us do(and we ALL know, having time = having the good items, if you dont, shame on you lol-quit right now.). Ofcourse, not having a real life allows US to stay up countless hours, stay ontop of ToDs, Farm, everything else that makes us obtain legit money.

I can understand; who the hell wants to come home after dealing with work for 12-16 hrs, +dealing with the wife,+ dealing with the kids, and finally when you have but like 1-2 hrs to play max (ofcourse these people have a right to play the game, as they see fit, to enjoy the game after all it IS a game) why would they come only to farm for the rest of their time? Who does that? Its my personal opinion, if i had to do that, to hell with that, i woudlnt even play this game. To hell with buying gill. I already think its lame to have to pay money every month to play a game anyway. But for those who have the means and the want. Who the hell are we to judge? sure it ruins my game, and AH prices skyrocket, but ultimately it isnt the gilbuyers fault, it isnt the gil sellers fault, they just a squirrel trying to get a nut. Blame Square Enix. I dont believe that you are naiive enough to think that a company like Square Enix CANT afford to I dunno, have GMs investigate EVERY single gill trade transaction, or atleast print up some sort of report weekly, or monthly of high gill trade transactions? do you? Because if you DO believe they cant, you must be young. I personally blame SE for the RMT problem, having some programming experience myself i know it can and SHOULD be done. Does Square Enix do it? NO its not convenient to SE. I'm positively sure that atleast 40% of the ffxi population buys gil. Will that 40% admit to it? hell no. WIll square enix Delete 40% of their Potential earnings/ month? hell no. Flamers: Please read First paragraph. laters man im out this piece.

 

[Xalioniaf]

nah. I agree with Euphacent. And really, you have to have a life to understand where Euphacent is coming from. And NO, simply having a job, or going to school, or just having a girlfriend isnt having a life. Having a life means: Owning a house + owning a car/cars (with the payments for insurance) +dealing with a Mortgage + having a wife + having 3 kids+paying Alimony,+working 12 hrs in your career (albeit not by choice ><). When you meet the above criteria you can respond as you like. If you dont, then your flames mean nothing. Anyways, yes, its easy to see why someone with a LIFE, would want to come home after all that hard work and just simply pay rl money, to have gil, which in turn makes the virtual life go round. Those kinds of people, with a rl life, that still choose to play this game, don't have the time required to camp certain NMs, goto sky with an ls at a certain odd time, do endgame, etc etc for those awesome items, like the rest of us do(and we ALL know, having time = having the good items, if you dont, shame on you lol-quit right now.). Ofcourse, not having a real life allows US to stay up countless hours, stay ontop of ToDs, Farm, everything else that makes us obtain legit money.

I can understand; who the hell wants to come home after dealing with work for 12-16 hrs, +dealing with the wife,+ dealing with the kids, and finally when you have but like 1-2 hrs to play max (ofcourse these people have a right to play the game, as they see fit, to enjoy the game after all it IS a game) why would they come only to farm for the rest of their time? Who does that? Its my personal opinion, if i had to do that, to hell with that, i woudlnt even play this game. To hell with buying gill. I already think its lame to have to pay money every month to play a game anyway. But for those who have the means and the want. Who the hell are we to judge? sure it ruins my game, and AH prices skyrocket, but ultimately it isnt the gilbuyers fault, it isnt the gil sellers fault, they just a squirrel trying to get a nut. Blame Square Enix. I dont believe that you are naiive enough to think that a company like Square Enix CANT afford to I dunno, have GMs investigate EVERY single gill trade transaction, or atleast print up some sort of report weekly, or monthly of high gill trade transactions? do you? Because if you DO believe they cant, you must be young. I personally blame SE for the RMT problem, having some programming experience myself i know it can and SHOULD be done. Does Square Enix do it? NO its not convenient to SE. I'm positively sure that atleast 40% of the ffxi population buys gil. Will that 40% admit to it? hell no. WIll square enix Delete 40% of their Potential earnings/ month? hell no. Flamers: Please read First paragraph. laters man im out this piece.

All that shouldn't matter. This game requires some vague idea of commitment, as sinful as it may seem to commit to a game. If you can't roll with that, you can always play something that allows you, not someone else, to regulate what happens and when. MMOs are not for people who, as you so crudely put it, have a life.
I do find it offensive that you'd discount anyone who isn't some blue-collar working man as not having a life. That's a level beyond ignorance.

 

[Linhjah]

nah. I agree with Euphacent. And really, you have to have a life to understand where Euphacent is coming from. And NO, simply having a job, or going to school, or just having a girlfriend isnt having a life. Having a life means: Owning a house + owning a car/cars (with the payments for insurance) +dealing with a Mortgage + having a wife + having 3 kids+paying Alimony,+working 12 hrs in your career (albeit not by choice ><). When you meet the above criteria you can respond as you like. If you dont, then your flames mean nothing. Anyways, yes, its easy to see why someone with a LIFE, would want to come home after all that hard work and just simply pay rl money, to have gil, which in turn makes the virtual life go round.

My husband and I both play. We have 5 kids between us, a house, cars, bills, etc, so I think I'm good to "respond as I like".

Those kinds of people, with a rl life, that still choose to play this game, don't have the time required to camp certain NMs, goto sky with an ls at a certain odd time, do endgame, etc etc for those awesome items, like the rest of us do(and we ALL know, having time = having the good items, if you dont, shame on you lol-quit right now.).

That is completely inaccurate. It may take us longer to accomplish some things, but it is totally possible to have the "good items". Its all about finding a shell or even just a group of friends that fits.

Of course, not having a real life allows US to stay up countless hours, stay ontop of ToDs, Farm, everything else that makes us obtain legit money.

It really kind of sounds like you're implying those people who have lives (as you defined above) and still play must all buy gil. Its kind of offensive, tbh.

I can understand; who the hell wants to come home after dealing with work for 12-16 hrs, +dealing with the wife,+ dealing with the kids, and finally when you have but like 1-2 hrs to play max (ofcourse these people have a right to play the game, as they see fit, to enjoy the game after all it IS a game) why would they come only to farm for the rest of their time? Who does that?

Plenty of people do just that. There are people who really enjoy farming or crafting. I am having trouble understanding where all these stereotypes are coming from.

Its my personal opinion, if i had to do that, to hell with that, i woudlnt even play this game. To hell with buying gill. I already think its lame to have to pay money every month to play a game anyway. But for those who have the means and the want. Who the hell are we to judge? sure it ruins my game, and AH prices skyrocket, but ultimately it isnt the gilbuyers fault, it isnt the gil sellers fault, they just a squirrel trying to get a nut.

Who are we to be upset when the actions of others negatively impact the recreational activity we pay for monthly? Really? Legitimate players are completely justified in any negative feelings we may harbor against RMT just like we are with hackers.

Blame Square Enix. I dont believe that you are naiive enough to think that a company like Square Enix CANT afford to I dunno, have GMs investigate EVERY single gill trade transaction, or atleast print up some sort of report weekly, or monthly of high gill trade transactions? do you? Because if you DO believe they cant, you must be young.

Can they? Sure. Would it be a smart move financially for them to invest the necessary manpower to accomplish it? Probably not. If your assumption that 40% of all players are involved in RMT is anywhere near accurate, the number of people they'd need to do the regular, large-scale investigation you're proposing would be, well, a lot. A fucking lot. And, while I'm not sure what type of salary SE employees get at any level, I'm pretty sure its above minimum wage.

SE may shoulder a portion of the blame for RMT activities, but that in no way, shape, or form absolves gilbuyers or gilsellers of their part in the whole deal.

 

[Jingizu]

it isnt the gilbuyers fault, it isnt the gil sellers fault.

It IS buyers' and sellers' fault, and it's also YOUR fault for not caring. I am so tired of people not owning up to wrong doing. If I steal something from you, is it not my fault? Would it not be the choice which I made?

It is their fault, NOT SE's fault that there are weenies in this game who want to pay even more money to someone else to cheat the rest of us out of our chosen form of enjoyment.

My favorite argument is sure to come up soon. The 'it's just a game'. *scoff*
These are the people that willingly fork over real cash for in game items, whether it be paying hundreds or even thousands of dollars for a bot, or paying 40 bucks for a million gil. It is no longer 'just a game' when you feel that material world items are outweighed by virtual currency. Any arguments from just such people are null and void, because, if it were 'just a game' to you, why do you pay to play in the first place? Just a game is something like solitaire, or scrabble, you buy the game or deck of cards once and play at will without monthly investments.

As for feeling sorry for supposed RMT sweatshops......I don't see myself feeling that magnanimous. I bust my ass all day every day. I may not always like a job I have, but, that's life, and that's entirely MY choice. These people, like myself are not forced at gunpoint to accept a job. The people aren't conscripted into working for a company that strives to cheat and deceive. It all boils down to culpability and being responsible for the CHOICES one makes in life.

The arguments of saying, they have only that choice to make money to pay for their family or starve isn't feasible. By saying that that is the only option for these people, you're fooling yourself, there are always other options.

That goes the same to anyone and everyone. There are always other options to take. Do we HAVE to play this game? no, that's a choice we make. Do we HAVE to have a crappy job we hate? no, that's a choice we make(although, one may have to be in a job they hate for a time, they have the choice to seek better employment or just stagnate and bitch about their existing job)

For me, I will continue to report suspected RMT, and, I'll probably continue to bitch about them, but, then again, that's my choice. :wink:

 

[Basellios]

All that shouldn't matter. This game requires some vague idea of commitment, as sinful as it may seem to commit to a game. If you can't roll with that, you can always play something that allows you, not someone else, to regulate what happens and when. MMOs are not for people who, as you so crudely put it, have a life.
I do find it offensive that you'd discount anyone who isn't some blue-collar working man as not having a life. That's a level beyond ignorance.

This is what commitment will get you
http://shamayaasura.livejournal.com/
edit: well at least on the asura server
Question: duping???

 

[Tsaku]

nah. I agree with Euphacent. And really, you have to have a life to understand where Euphacent is coming from. And NO, simply having a job, or going to school, or just having a girlfriend isnt having a life. Having a life means: Owning a house + owning a car/cars (with the payments for insurance) +dealing with a Mortgage + having a wife + having 3 kids+paying Alimony,+working 12 hrs in your career (albeit not by choice ><). When you meet the above criteria you can respond as you like. If you dont, then your flames mean nothing. Anyways, yes, its easy to see why someone with a LIFE, would want to come home after all that hard work and just simply pay rl money, to have gil, which in turn makes the virtual life go round. Those kinds of people, with a rl life, that still choose to play this game, don't have the time required to camp certain NMs, goto sky with an ls at a certain odd time, do endgame, etc etc for those awesome items, like the rest of us do(and we ALL know, having time = having the good items, if you dont, shame on you lol-quit right now.). Ofcourse, not having a real life allows US to stay up countless hours, stay ontop of ToDs, Farm, everything else that makes us obtain legit money.

I can understand; who the hell wants to come home after dealing with work for 12-16 hrs, +dealing with the wife,+ dealing with the kids, and finally when you have but like 1-2 hrs to play max (ofcourse these people have a right to play the game, as they see fit, to enjoy the game after all it IS a game) why would they come only to farm for the rest of their time? Who does that? Its my personal opinion, if i had to do that, to hell with that, i woudlnt even play this game. To hell with buying gill. I already think its lame to have to pay money every month to play a game anyway. But for those who have the means and the want. Who the hell are we to judge? sure it ruins my game, and AH prices skyrocket, but ultimately it isnt the gilbuyers fault, it isnt the gil sellers fault, they just a squirrel trying to get a nut. Blame Square Enix. I dont believe that you are naiive enough to think that a company like Square Enix CANT afford to I dunno, have GMs investigate EVERY single gill trade transaction, or atleast print up some sort of report weekly, or monthly of high gill trade transactions? do you? Because if you DO believe they cant, you must be young. I personally blame SE for the RMT problem, having some programming experience myself i know it can and SHOULD be done. Does Square Enix do it? NO its not convenient to SE. I'm positively sure that atleast 40% of the ffxi population buys gil. Will that 40% admit to it? hell no. WIll square enix Delete 40% of their Potential earnings/ month? hell no. Flamers: Please read First paragraph. laters man im out this piece.

I'll admit I bought gil once, felt dirty about it ever since, so bad in fact that I had problems with a friend giving me 30K gil to start out Thalin when I was w/o Tsaku. Now I currently work 40hrs a week at MS, another 20-25 hrs a week at Massage Envy, and have a hour commute each way to get too and from work. I am fortunate in the fact that there's a two hour window between my two jobs, so I get about an hour to an hour and a half each day to play. Do I own a house, no; do I have a wife, no; do I have kids, no; do I have a real life, yes and frankly I'm appalled that you would suggest that anyone without the "requirement's" you listed would not have a real life.

 

[Amerie]

Anyone notice the constant hostility between japanese and chinese players?

Does this have anything to do with RMT? I've always wondered what that was about. I have chinese friends who play FFXI and they dont sell gil (or claim not to) but they claim people who mknow they are chinese are constantly assuming they are rmt.

Sorry if that was off topic.

 

[Tsaku]

Anyone notice the constant hostility between japanese and chinese players?

Does this have anything to do with RMT? I've always wondered what that was about. I have chinese friends who play FFXI and they dont sell gil (or claim not to) but they claim people who mknow they are chinese are constantly assuming they are rmt.

Sorry if that was off topic.

Continuing with the slight derail, I would imagine the hostility between Japanese and Chinese players is primarily due to both nations cultures. If I recall my history correctly Japan was originally an island where China sent their 'less desirable' people. Consequently the Chinese and Japanese people have never really liked each other. I'm really simplifying here there's a little more to it then just this, but I believe this is where the animosity originates from.

 

[Vandoura]

I would imagine the hostility between Japanese and Chinese players is primarily due to both nations cultures. If I recall my history correctly Japan was originally an island where China sent their 'less desirable' people.

Actually, Japan invaded China during one of the World War II where Japanese basicly kill all Chinese insight and trying to take over.

I think is more of Chinese dislike Japanese because of that history

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Japanese_War_(1937-1945)

Edit: If the USA never bomb Japan with their Nuclear bomb, China wouldn't be China anymore.. it'll be like "New Japan"

 

[ds083roadkill]

I'll admit I bought gil once, felt dirty about it ever since, so bad in fact that I had problems with a friend giving me 30K gil to start out Thalin when I was w/o Tsaku. Now I currently work 40hrs a week at MS, another 20-25 hrs a week at Massage Envy, and have a hour commute each way to get too and from work. I am fortunate in the fact that there's a two hour window between my two jobs, so I get about an hour to an hour and a half each day to play. Do I own a house, no; do I have a wife, no; do I have kids, no; do I have a real life, yes and frankly I'm appalled that you would suggest that anyone without the "requirement's" you listed would not have a real life.

it's funny, too most, NOT having a wife and kids would be considered having a life rather then not having one. amen