Rude for no reason

[ThisIsHamburgler]

Ok so I have started collecting items for genkai 1 (horrible experience). Well, in order to have things move along a little faster, my party wanted to fill out our remaining spot with a higher lvl player because they wouldnt need the item and it would add to our survivability. I look for a higher lvl melee and find one that looks promising.

This is exactly (or close enough) how I asked, "I'm sorry to have to bother you, but would you like to help me and my friends find an exoray mold?" I knew this quest is quite an ordeal so I was as polite as I could possibly be... I just didnt expect the kind of answer I got.

The answer was either "Do I know you or your friends," or "I dont know you or your friends." I dont remember if it was a question or not, but after how polite I had just been to him he seemed to feel the need to be a complete ass to me. I really wasnt expecting him to jump at the chance to help us out or anything like that, but a simple no would have been fine.

What I did next was to tell him that no, he didnt know us and all I was doing was asking his help, and I thanked him ever so dearly for being so nice in his reply. I then told my party about this and they had very much the same reaction as me.

What I want to know is how many higher level players have this high and mighty attitude? How many of them think they are "too good" to help anyone or at least obey the golden rule. I dont remember the players name, heck maybe he was just having a bad day or something, I dont know, but I know that if someone shows respect to me they are at least deserving of the same courtesy from me, even if I dont want to go along on them for a quest or whatever.

Has anyone else ever had someone treat them like scum after you were as nice as possible?

I'm sorry for my rant... I just cant stand rudeness...

-Ham :shock:

 

[Tempes]

It is sad that some high levels have some very bad attitudes. I'm a level 61 drk and had helped a few people in trouble, one of them said to me I was the "coolest" high level he met since I actually helped them. I felt kinda bad by that, been there and know what he means by rude high levels.

Not all high levels are rude, hopefully one will help you get your item soon.

 

[Villarel]

The player who turned you down was me.

Saying that "I don't know you" is not rude, it is a fact.

I was not giving you any attitude no was I having a bad day. I was not being "high or mighty". I was just getting to the point.

Many people who have high level jobs get get flooded with request for help all day. I can not help everyone who asks me. I have to select and choose those I help.

I'll help those who I've PT with before. Those people I know. And anytime, I'll help by answering questions about quests and missions to the best of my knowlegde. But if you are a stranger to me, you must justify why I should help you over all the other people.
Vertern players wil agree with me that my response is typical. Random /tell for help must be justified to get a repsonse.

Would you rather have me just ignore you instead?

 

[GhostinmyShell]

Why should a high lvl help him get his item, you know back in the day a lot of us formed pts of our own around our lvls and got the genkei items. This even includes AF gear! Shock!

If your excuse is you have no friends or a lameass LS then thats your problem, not a high lvl saying no to you...

 

[DeviFoxx]

Well... being a Veteran player as well...

I can understand both where Hamburgler & Villarel are comming from.

In a sense, I have to say you're both right.

Villarel's right because high level (Or Veteran) players like us do get flooded with help requests...

I get flooded with Help Requests too, both for being a high Lv. Warrior & White Mage.

But Hamburgler is also right because well... your statement somewhat made it seem like you didn't want to be bothered, at all. And I can understand how Hamburgler would interpret that as being rude (What Villarel said was a true statement, but it just sounded a tad "off"), but I've known Villarel since FFXI came out for PC, so I know how Villarel is.

Anyway, honestly? I wouldn't be too worried about it, Hamburgler.

We aren't really "High & Mighty"... Let me put it this way. You're not the only one who asks us for requests. And I guess at times it can be bothersome. Please understand.

 

[Runekane]

If your excuse is you have no friends or a lameass LS then thats your problem, not a high lvl saying no to you...

I really don't think either of these are the problems... notice in Ham's post he said he was looking for a 6th person JUST to be safe. From my understanding, a party of 5 people should have no problem with even matches/toughs, even though I haven't completed Genkai yet. He was just looking for security, basically, in case if anything went wrong.

Ham is definitely a very likable guy online, as I'm sure he is in real life, and as for having a lameass LS? Hmm, BigFun must be doing something right if people keep asking for pearls, even in the 45+ range, which is pretty flattering for a level 48 player. To clarify, he didn't NEED the 6th... it was just an added security measure, and he chose to ask Villarel. Now Villarel didn't have to help of course, but the point is, GhostinmyShell, drop the "grandpa attitude" of "back in the day, we had to walk 30 miles in the snow"... I'm glad you were able to PT with people your level, and I'm sure it was more of a challenge and probably a hell of a lot more enjoyable. Doesn't do any good for your image to look down your nose at someone just because they have a certain option avaible for them (high level help, IF they want to help) that you didn't when you first started playing. Congrats on getting stuff done when it was more difficult! But times have changed...

 

[Daroth]

BigFun is teh 1337 LS. ^_^ anyways. I am tempted to make a kermit the frog and chewbaca statement but i will spre you guys of it. And back in the day was just 5 months ago in NA i think I cant remember but it really wasnt that long ago. Now back in the day OT- Me anf Falkner used to play pokemon cards out on his back step now that was back in the day almost 6 years ago.

 

[jazper]

Congrats on getting stuff done when it was more difficult! But times have changed...

Yes, times have changed.. but it seems that people have become super lazy . I can see where Villarel comes from because majority of the time (Speaking from experience) I get tells from people, I dont know. They would ask for help and didn't even fulfil the prerequisites or expect me to solo the NM for them without aid from at least a party. What bothers me is that once everything is over and done with, we are just tossed aside(Obvious exaggeration) without any offer of compensation for our time. (I normally don't accept any compensation but times are rough and damn.. Adaman armor is freaking expensive..lol)

The current trend as I see it is this: LowB levels (joins an LS > subjob > chocobo lic > advanced job) all the way to quasi HL status(50ish.. meleers..yeah you know you look good in Iron Musketeer gear, lol). TIME FOR AF! LowB realizes the pain in organizing parties for stupid coffer keys as well as other quests required of AF. LowB also realizes the difficulty in requesting uber HL help - they keep saying (I don't understand English). On top of AF, LowB also has to worry about Genkai items and leveling subs(playing with newbs.. ewww) - and gets very frustrated as well. LowB vows that once s/he gets to that status of official HL (60-69 in my book), s/he will help everyone who needs help so NOT to be like the stingy uber HL's that treated him/her so. LowB gets full AF, completes Genkai 1-3.. /cheer!!! But also realizes that a lot of his/her friends have quit due to the frustration of AF/Genkai . LowB helps out other lowerlevels (Linkshell members and perfect strangers) like a madperson.. and becomes very popular :wink:. LowB tries to relax now to enjoy other aspects of the world, but continuously gets requests for help(LS and outside) ...I guess LowB became more popular than s/he thought. LowB completes Genkai4(what a joke btw) and then later defeats Maat in record time!! /hurray BUT during this time still continues to get /tells and LS requests from strangers on a frequent basis. LowB starts realizing how rude a lot of the requestors are :? :? . LowB becomes more involved in Zilart Missions and HNM fights but still gets help requests from the newest crop of quasi HL strangers. LowB has bad experiences with assisting (More good than bad but for some reason, the bad seems to stick out more at this time) and decides to limit help to LS members/friends. Stranger requests help from LowB but gets (I'm sorry)(I don't understand English) response back. :shock: :shock: :shock:

I'll be honest, I base a lot of what I wrote on my experiences but also from a lot of experiences from my friends in game. I've never said I dont understand english but have gotten close a couple times. Rule of thumb for me is that, if the requestor is extremely polite (NO BROWN NOSING PLEASE... ok a tiny bit is ok) and I have free time, then sure I will help no problem. I've also made it a habit to refer strangers to www.qcdn.org > Event Scheduling for any future help they may need

 

[Sculli]

Even though I didn't make it to any reasonably high level in FFXI, I will have to back Villarel up on this.

We all pay to enjoy our time, to do with our time as we please, as such we can choose what to do with our paid for time, and if that does include helping a stranger, then so be it, if it doesn't, then it simply doesn't.

Saying "I don't know you", is in my opinion a perfectly reasonable response. I am online to play, I have plans for my playtime, those plans do not include running around and killing shit for people I have never heard of before. I may make an exception for people I do know, but unless I'd be bored to death it is very unlikely that a random player would get assistance.

 

[Krius]

I dont mind the random tells for help so much, but they always come when I'm about to go out to do something or I'm logging off.

 

[j]

"Do I know you or your friends," or "I dont know you or your friends

The name Hamburgler actually does seem recognizable and it might have been I who responded with that quote. But tell me..how is that a rude response? When some stranger messages you out of the blue wouldn’t you be curious as know who that person is? When I respond with that quote sometimes the person will reply saying we were in a PT or we chatted for a while, and on occasion I will go out of my way to help that person out. Rude? not in the least in my opinion.. I do agree however that responses to lower lvls are getting more and more to the point. But hamburgler you have to realize your not the only person on the server who randomly request help from higher lvls, and getting something like exoray mold can and will take hours to accomplish. Is it wrong to ask who you are before i invest the rest my evening into helping you get items with no benifit to myself? Or maybe its wrong of you to ask me, someone you've never met, seen, or communicated with to hold your hand and get the items for you? It goes both ways bud..A lot of lower lvls establish a network of friends and sometimes in that network will be a higher lvl who is lvling a subjob, I've met many people this way and sometimes i forget who they are... asking if i know that person is not rude.

Whatever happened to making your own groups.. getting together with your friends and accomplishing something, rather than having 1 high lvl hold your hand and do it for you.

Recently on our linkshell's private boards i offered assistance to the others who need AF.. the response i got?:

Perhaps those that are hitting the AF stages can get together and kill these NMs/keys together. It's alot more satisfying doing it with the correct level spread than having a few lvl70s totally destroy everything

something to keep in mind~

 

[Villarel]

I look for a higher lvl melee and find one that looks promising.

When you asked me, I was a Lv57 Ninja.

Asking a complete stranger Ninja to blink tank Exorays, is asking a stranger to throw away 5-7k an hour. Those Shiheis are expensive.

Unless, you just wanted me to be a damage dealer. :wink:

 

[ThisIsHamburgler]

Ghost, thanks for showing everyone what I meant by your high and mighty attitude. I really like how you insulted me and my linkshell just becuase my group and I wanted to get a little help.

Anyway I can certainly understand why "getting to the point" may have seemed quicker for you, but honestly it did seem like a rude response whether or not you intended it to be that way. Maybe I didnt tell you I didnt expect you to blink tank, you could have asked exactly what I needed and only taken an extra minute at most, I know theres no situation that requires so much attention outside of certain missions (you were in Jeuno if i remember correctly).

My point is that there is NO excuse for rudeness. You dont have to help everyone who asks you either, but just say "no I dont have time" or "I'm sorry but I only help those who I am familiar with." A little bit of explanation goes a long way. How would I have known that you only help those people you know personally? You never said anything but "I dont know you" which lead me to believe that you had the high and mighty attitude I talked about.

This was another reason I didnt bother posting your name here. I didnt want other people to avoid you simply because of my bad experience. I believe everyone deserves a few chances, and if I ever had the chance to party with you I would.

And also keep in mind that not all random /tells for help are from lazy players. As a matter of fact we had been fighting exorays for some time before I decided to ask you. All we wanted was the little extra security and a chance to speed up the battles, we didnt want you to blink tank or anything but I suppose I should have told you that.

Again, back to the insults... I dont need them. Obviously you didnt read my whole post about how I already had a group together (all between lvl 47-50 SHOCK!) and how I said highER level, which by that I meant someone who wouldnt need the mold, but wouldnt be expected to solo everything we fought, again I should have clarified that but since you didnt read my post anyway it wouldnt make any difference. And ghost, seriously, get off your high horse; just because you bought the game before I did doesnt give you the right to treat me like crap or insult me and my linkshell.

My whole point of posting was not that I expect higher level help on everything I do (the times I do ask I know that they probably wouldnt want to help me anyway which is why I am verp polite when I ask). My point is this: Take a little time out to be courtious to those who are to you, if you dont want to help someone out fine, just say no and why you cant or dont want to, dont just make a statement of the reason and expect them to figure it out.

-Ham :shock:

 

[Villarel]

You never said anything but "I dont know you" which lead me to believe that you had the high and mighty attitude I talked about.

I don't see the connection between saying "I don't know you" and giving the appearance that I'm high and mighty.

Am I missing something? According to your reasoning, I must appear an ass to everyone, everytime I respond with "I don't know you" or "Do I know you?"

 

[Runekane]

Obviously this is a big misunderstanding between Ham and Villarel.

Villarel, yeah Ninja's expensive, lol, I know and I'm only level 24 in the job, where it's not REALLY expensive 'til around level 40. Ham just wanted one extra melee, of higher level along, in case things went wrong; many people have misunderstood this point in his post. In no way was he asking for one 70+ stranger to "hold his hand" and get it done for him while he goes AFK for a few hours, Jazper. I realize many people do and probably do do this and expect this out of others, but Hamburgler is a good guy which you have no way of knowing of course since you all are (pretty much) total strangers.

I've cornered Villarel a few times to talk to him if I see him (hehe, don't you love it?), and he's always been nice, and I definitely don't think of him as high and mighty. Perhaps Ham thought it was a rude response from frustration of being down there for a few hours without a mold drop and as we all know, when someone gets frustrated, everything starts spiraling out of control and blown out of proportion.

Now as for you, Ghostinmyshell... I still don't appreciate the comment about the linkshell. We're very active in events, party together as often as we can, help each other out with missions and misc. stuff whenever we can. Please don't bash something you don't know about, especially if it is based off an assumption.

Perhaps those that are hitting the AF stages can get together and kill these NMs/keys together. It's alot more satisfying doing it with the correct level spread than having a few lvl70s totally destroy everything

Jsoft, with my highest job only being level 48, even I can totally agree with you on this. It seems the most epic events/quests in the game would be a LOT more enjoyable if you didn't use "cheat codes" and bring in a level 70 into the mix of a level 50 mob fight. All Ham was looking for was just an extra sword, it seems.

If your excuse is you have no friends or a lameass LS then thats your problem, not a high lvl saying no to you...

This quote still bothers me. Nice flameboard post still, but very inaccurate. Please do a little research on others before making ignorant comments or assumptions like this, please. ^^ Ham is very well liked among the LS, and outside of it too. BigFun is no "lameass" LS... I'd like to consider us one of the strongest, tightly-knit and well-organized LSes in Quetz. Although we don't have anybody in full AF, we still have a very fun and helpful environment, who are less concerned with XP parties than just having fun in the game. If that's "lameass" in your opinion, then I guess BigFun can join the hundreds of lameass LS groups out there.

 

[ThisIsHamburgler]

You never said anything but "I dont know you" which lead me to believe that you had the high and mighty attitude I talked about.

I don't see the connection between saying "I don't know you" and giving the appearance that I'm high and mighty.

Am I missing something? According to your reasoning, I must appear an ass to everyone, everytime I respond with "I don't know you" or "Do I know you?"

My group and I had been out there for some time and were getting a bit frustrated and the response just sounded snappy to me. Thats really all, it seemed like "I dont know you," meant "Just who do you think you are asking ME for help," even an "I'm sorry" was in there and I wouldnt have given it a second thought.

I can certainly see your point about the random /tells for help. People ask me for help too and sometimes I just plain dont want to help (I especially dread the "will u power lvl me?" question). But when I dont want to help I do try to be as nice about it as possible. I'll just tell them, "I'm sorry but I'm busy/I dont do power leveling/I am looking for an exp party." Any one of those responses could be seen as rude, which is why I add the I'm sorry to it. Thats really all I'm saying.

Its true you dont even have to respond to someone who asks you for help, I've been totally ignored by people who have asked for help and I'd much rather have that than "STFU NOOB!!!!1" because it leads me to believe they might just be AFK lol. If the choice is between lying and being rude, I dont think one person on the game would mind being lied to.

Looking back on this your response really wasnt THAT rude, it just came off to me as rude. I've dealt with people that have made me come close to using a /blist... But in the future remember that a little I'm sorry goes a long way... you dont even really have to mean it :wink:

-Ham :shock:

 

[yanzi]

just had to toss in my $0.02...
i love jaz's interpretation of the whole thing. a lot of us who had help as a low level, then feel we'll be high level and help others one day. but as soon as ppl are high level, there's other things to be doing instead of helping. why would a lv 75 give up a chance to do say dynamis or a HNM just to kill mobs for a coffer key?
it's easy for the lv 70+ ppl to say their time is too valuable, etc, etc. but only because they know lots of other 70+ ppl who can help them whenever they need something. that's not a luxury that low to medium level people have. given a choice, if that lv 70+ person is leveling up a second job, would they fight mobs for coffer keys with ppl their level, or ask all their lv 70+ friends to help? i feel it's just so hypocritical when a high level tells low level ppl to find help from ppl their own level.
this is also like the topic of whether ppl should PL. most high level will say they should get PL'd because they don't need to waste time with normal groups. i remember those days vil would PL us in valkurm, but those days are just another lost memory.

 

[Dalecooper]

I don't believe that "I don't know you" is a rude statement. It simply is not. Rude would have been "Fuck off" or something of the like. Sculli is right: it's your money, hard earned and whatnot, so its up to you how you want to spend your time in-game. However, the statement "I don't know you" is a vaguely valid reason at best.
Consider the concept of "know". I don't actually know any person I've come across in this game. I've "met" them online, and even people on my LS who I talk with on a daily basis, I can't really say I "know" them. I suppose that within the context of theis game, to "know" someone is to have played for some period of time with them and to be able to determine the quality of their ability and general demeanor.
Now, if you're high enough to even qualify for genkai 1, you MUST have played the game for more than 1/2 an hour, if you get what I mean. Not all lvl 50 players are good *cough cough -- Xcalade-- cough cough* but even being at lvl 50 seriously limits the amount of trouble that you can get into. Even on genkai quest, and especially for a high lvl player being a chaperone.
So is a higher player obliged to help lower levels? Of course not. And telling them that its because they "don't know them" isn't rude. However, it isn't a very legitimate one either. Did you "know" people when you started the game? Probably not. You have to play w/ them. So what, if when you were starting and only lvl 10, others wouldn't help you because they din't know you? If that were really the crux of the matter, no one would want to help anyone.
This is not to say that anyone SHOULD help others. I get requests for the dragon mission to achieve rank 3 all the time. Most of the time, I'm simply doing other things. When I completed that mission, out of a pt of 6, I only "knew" one of them. Instead of saying "I don't know you" simply say "I am doing other things, I don't have the time". It's probably more truthful anyway.

 

[DeviFoxx]

I've thought about this. And I do agree that it's merely a misunderstanding. But... like I said, early on in this thread, both Hamburgler & Villarel are right.

High Level players don't quite always have the time to help some of the Lower Level players. It was just a misunderstanding it appears.

Some people think I'm "rude" for the way I talk (I could name some names, but I'd rather not). But again, this is just how I "talk". I don't mean any disrespect towards you. I'm pretty sure Villarel's the same way.

And again, like I said. It wasn't rude, you guys are right. But however, to me it came off as sort of like "...And why should I help you?" ... Or atleast that's what's usually implied with a response like that.

Once again, I'm sure Villarel didn't mean any disrespect... That's just the way he responded. No biggie.

[On a side note: I understand where the vets are comming from. I'm a vet too... You see, with the way FFXI is designed, doing what you need to get done to "succeed" or "advance" can seem very chore-like at times... Even MORE so when you get to the higher levels... And as you progress... doing AF... Genkai... Missions... get tougher and tougher... So I guess after a while, ALL of us get into that mentality of "I'm glad I'm getting this done! I never wanna have to do this again! This is too tough!" (Don't deny it; all of us get that way at one point or another.) so... it's easy... VERY easy to just "brush off" people doing the same previous quests / AFs / missions / NM Battles you did, and just be like "Forget that. It was too hard when I did it. I really don't want to do it again. Let them go through what I went through; they gotta learn sometime!" ... But I ask... BOTH "Initiates" and "Veterans" ... To the Veterans... I know it's hard being a high level, and I know you went through alot of stuff to get to that point... but please be willing to continue to practice patience with those who aren't as strong as you yet. Look at it this way; the "initiates" will someday be YOUR level, right? Let THEM deal with the NEW initiates comming in to fill their place. It's gonna take a load off your hands, after all... And to the Initiates... Please, be willing to practice understanding. If we Vets "snap" at you, or you FEEL that we did, don't give it too much thought. There's probably a good reason why we did what we did. Just... try to get to our level, and perhaps then it'll all start to come together for you. That's all I have to say.]

 

[yanzi]

in regards to quests, AF, limits, etc, it's all about what's feasible or not. let's say you are doing genkai 2. do you seriously think finding an alliance of 50-55 people is easier than finding 7 lv 70+ to help?
also.. if you had a PT of 6 lv 50 fighting exorays vs a PT of 1 lv 50, 5 lv 70+ fighting exorays, i think the latter PT would find mold for everyone by the time the former finds even 1 mold.