Sleep effectiveness

[Bluefrost]

I would say (on my WHM) I have an 80% chance sticking SleepI with capped enfeebling and one merit in on VT mobs. I've never tried sleeping anything other than in sky, when most people's backs are turned in the direction I'm looking at. Usually Tongan is facing the party and I have my camera panned towards the back. I have a nice <call5> macro for when I'm sleeping, because, yeah, 20% is still a decent percentage not to get resisted.

With Elemental Seal, it's pretty much 100%. And of course, I am talking about mobs with no to little resistance to Dark.

With RDM, I have 95% chance of Sleep II sticking, if not, I've got SleepI, and if that, I better Gravity it and run away, cause it's probably Dark Based.

What I don't get is, I know Skeletons have a high resistance to Dark, but I can't ElementalSeal SleepII the Skeletons in Horutoto on my RDM. That's annoying. Very annoying.

 

[annabelle]

What I don't get is, I know Skeletons have a high resistance to Dark, but I can't ElementalSeal SleepII the Skeletons in Horutoto on my RDM. That's annoying. Very annoying.

It's not because skeletons are resistant against Dark. It's because they're immune to sleep entirely. A BRD wouldn't be able to sleep them with a light-based lullabye, either.

 

[Kire]

n away, cause it's probably Dark Based.

What I don't get is, I know Skeletons have a high resistance to Dark, but I can't ElementalSeal SleepII the Skeletons in Horutoto on my RDM. That's annoying. Very annoying.

Thats why you need a brd to sleep the undead =D
They do not have aot of +dark resist lol as you can easy stun them, just have like a lv 100 version of plds resist sleep i bet XD

 

[Kire]

It's not because skeletons are resistant against Dark. It's because they're immune to sleep entirely. A BRD wouldn't be able to sleep them with a light-based lullabye, either.

a brd can sleep them thats how KRT merits work

 

[annabelle]

Hmm... on second thought, I guess I couldn't be sure. I had just assumed the link I posted was referring to the Sleep status effect, not the spell.

 

[Kire]

Hmm... on second thought, I guess I couldn't be sure. I had just assumed the link I posted was referring to the Sleep status effect, not the spell.

every mob par few can be slept/lullaby only one that comes to mind is one with natural poions on them etc

 

[Bluefrost]

Once, long, long ago, I slept a Skeleton with Sleep I and I was Lv75 or close to it. I've been trying to do it again ever since.

 

[Kire]

Once, long, long ago, I slept a Skeleton with Sleep I and I was Lv75 or close to it. I've been trying to do it again ever since.

it is not actally possable lol they are imune to the spell "sleep" and also "death"

 

[Bluefrost]

it is not actally possable lol they are imune to the spell "sleep" and also "death"

I really did sleep it, lol, I'm not crazy. :crazy:

 

[Blabj]

I [touch wood] haven't had a sleep resist yet on my red mage.

Capped enfeebling since level 1, I think I uncap once I ding level 66, but I'll just work on casting dia repeatedly on exp mobs every now and then. I have a very sneaky plan which works every time for skilling up magic, but requires two people

 

[Kire]

I really did not sleep it, lol, I'm crazy. :crazy:

you placed the "not" in the wrong place lol =D

 

[Ewok]

It's not because skeletons are resistant against Dark. It's because they're immune to sleep entirely. A BRD wouldn't be able to sleep them with a light-based lullabye, either.

Ehhh, wrong. It has to do with their element, BRD in fact can sleep them. In fact, TW skele's can be slept with a sleep spell occasionally, just very unreliably.

 

[Mai Ikari]

[Sleep] has the lowest possible (5%~) sucess rate on skeletons. They're not immune to sleep, it's just damn near impossible, so everyone calls them sleep-immune so that you don't get BLMs trying to sleep them to prove how 1337 they are.

 

[Ewok]

it is not actally possable lol they are imune to the spell "sleep" and also "death"

Actually is possible, just improbable. The only spells they are immune to is Aspir and Drain spells ( maybe absorb spells too? never checked the comments in spell explinations).

 

[Zerayla]

Zerayla, you probably noticed me getting quite a few resists early on in our party Monday night. A couple cases was just bad luck, getting resisted against an IT+ beetle before I hit 51 to equip the Dark Staff. Other times, I was still reassessing my macro setup, and either had forgotten to equip +INT gear before casting or forgot to equip my Dark Staff.

However, our campsite could not have given me a better practice session, and after setting my Dark Staff equip line in macros for both Sleep spells, I was landing pretty much all of my Sleep spells and handling the links with ease. I didn't even touch Elemental Seal after that (I should consider using that for Aspir). I don't think I was even getting any partial resists, because I was watching the clock and noticed the mobs were always sleeping for the full durations.

When I try holding a mob using the Sleep -> Sleep II method, I've been watching the game clock as a guide for when to cast Sleep II. Every guide I've ever looked at suggests Sleep lasts for 30 game minutes. (This might be debatable. 30 game minutes ~= 72 RL seconds, not 60. Next time I login, I'm just going to cast and time it for myself.) So somewhere around ~25 game minutes after I had cast Sleep, I put Sleep II on the mob for good measure, and that will last for 37 game minutes (which does = 150 RL seconds). If that's still not enough time, it's not too hard to time another Sleep spell in between mob attacks if you've gotten aggro.

It brings me great comfort to know I can keep a mob incapacitated over 2.5 minutes for the MP cost of a single Cure III spell.

It wasn't anything to do with your resists really, but your choice of not using Elemental Seal. I wanted to fully understand first the difference in the two spells, Sleep I and Sleep II. I then wanted to understand how Elemental Seal affected them (accuracy or just duration of the spell)

For myself, after reading all the posts here i'm pretty sure that my choice of how I would sleep a mob, would be to use Elemental Seal + Sleep I, then wait for approximately 60 seconds (less just to make sure it doesn't wake) and then cast Sleep II.

In the case that my spell would not land, which I haven't experienced as of yet on my RDM, then I would immediately cast sleep II.

The only time I would change this, is if I were to sleep a dark based monster, in which case it seems the that by casting Elemental Seal + Sleep II would be the best idea?

I know its crucial to get that link slept asap so that the entire party including myself can focus on killing the first monster that is being fought, and so that we're not stressing our magic on two mobs, and having to toss out twice as much cures etc.

 

[Kire]

Actually is possible, just improbable. The only spells they are immune to is Aspir and Drain spells ( maybe absorb spells too? never checked the comments in spell explinations).

forgot drain and aspir >_>

 

[K. Ishitar]

You dont need Elemental sleep to pull off a sleep or sleep II, Ive slept mobs reliably without blm sub, it just really helps a lot when you dont want to waste time a mob whacking away at your pt

I believe sleep II lowers resistance for sleep status effect and sleepI has a longer duration (i read this awhile ago feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)

So i usually do sleepII then sleep if i have a resist issue but you should always used sleep II before sleep for me I believe that using tier II first lowers the resistance for sleep so the second one sticks.

Blms can sleep reliably as well, I just dont expect them too much since most blms i pt with have rdm at 75.

Without a blm sub I have been able to sleep any mob once or twice, only once I have had to use sleep spells 3 times >.> but then again that was an elemental in garliage.

For hnm and sky and dynamis you'll need /blm for ele seal definitely

So in short sleepII>sleep always or at least i have had the most success that way

 

[Zerayla]

The only problem I see with using Sleep II > Sleep I is that you would have less time that your mob would be slept for.


If Sleep II can override Sleep I, then it would make more sense to use the first spell (use ES with Sleep I just to ensure that it lands) because you'll be allowing the party more time to finish off the first mob.

Unless i'm missing something?

 

[annabelle]

I believe sleep II lowers resistance for sleep status effect and sleepI has a longer duration (i read this awhile ago feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)

That doesn't sound right to me. I don't know if Sleep's duration is 60 seconds or 72 seconds (30 game minutes), but I'm definately sure Sleep II has the longer duration.

And while it's possible for Sleep II to have a slightly higher accuracy of landing than Sleep, my personal experience suggests that difference to be marginal at best. On multiple occasions I've seen Sleep II fail and Sleep subsequently land on the same mob without problem. Unfortunately, I don't know of any significant testing on this, so every hypothesis about this is just educated guessing.

For myself, after reading all the posts here i'm pretty sure that my choice of how I would sleep a mob, would be to use Elemental Seal + Sleep I, then wait for approximately 60 seconds (less just to make sure it doesn't wake) and then cast Sleep II.

Yep, that's a perfectly reasonable way to approach it. I think the use of ES is mostly dependant on personal preference and playing style. Personally, if I feel I can reliably Sleep a mob without it (this involves knowing your targets strengths/weaknesses as well), I'll try to save ES for spells that more likely need the accuracy boost (such as Aspir, or enfeebling spells I have trouble landing, like Slow on earth-based mobs).

 

[K. Ishitar]

Yeah i think your right anna i have to relook into that and Zer to answer your ? it wont override it its a bit different than the rest ie Poison II overiding poison I or nin poison(considered II to me) overiding ichi poison ninjustu

if that makes sense