The Dynamis Show

Soujiro said:
Until i hear otherwise, i'm assuming that i, and everyone else that went to the new shell, is a "GREEDY F*CK" that wasted 11 months of your life.
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This is pretty much the same way I feel after reading this. There's only one piece of dynamis gear I've ever wanted. Everyone in the shell knows what it was. I actually cheered Lavi on when she got it. I was first in line for it when the shell broke. Encore's first run was Jeuno, and I had I believe 6 counterlotters for that piece of gear. But you know what? I'm still there, and I plan to go to every Encore run that I can possibly go to. If that makes me a GREEDY FUCK, then okay I guess I'm a GREEDY FUCK. Sorry to waste 11 months of your life having a great time with you in dynamis, getting you 4/5 of your whm relic, who knows how many free lot blm/war items, and iirc at least 1 100coin.
 
I'm offended too. Guys, hold me?
 
I heard about what was going on in TDS from Raesvelg over the past few months when things started to go down hill. I've been a member since day 1 when Foofighter started the LS but couldn't attend as many runs with a very hectic work schedule and college. Now that my schedule is much more stable with college and my new job I can attend runs once more as I did during the past months.

I joined Encore to be with my friends mostly. I love everyone in TDS, they are all some of the server's best players and just all around great folks to be with. Our little main core of people are always dependable.

Yes the new rules are a little too laxed for most people's taste, mine including. But, we had too many issues in the past with people getting 5/5 on the AF2 and bolting right after, including some people who I used to respect very much so, now I just see them mostly as assholes. With the new rules in place I think this may be the best way to keep people interested in doing city runs and farming without bolting an hour into a run.

Everyone who joined Encore made a sacrafice. We all gave up our lotting place to be able to still do runs and stay together. If you only see dynamis as a gimme gimme thing, maybe you are taking it too personally and should take a break from it. That is not all this game should be about. Hanging out with my friends and having one hell of a good time is what keeps me still in Dynamis after a year now. Hell, I'm 3/5 done my WHM AF2, I have the best peice of WHM AF2 you can get, but I still show up when I can.

Basically, everyone who had a place to lot got shafted, not just you Lavi.
 
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TDS switched to Encore because control needed to be passed to those leaders from me and their rules not mine. As far as me making a shell to get things I have 2 pieces of nin relic and did have the best ninja attendance until I left for Europe. My Koga chainmail I was the only ninja in the zone so Mishaela I don't understand why you mentioned me in that context, also I remember a Glacier run where I was up for rng boots and passed to a rng without lotting rights, but I guess I am greedy.
Lavi you know the leaders of Encore and you know that they are not greedy and not out to screw anyone. Instead of flaming right away you should have given it time and enjoyed it instead of flaming.
I do not apologize for not being able to play ffxi as much anymore and I don't apologize for not being able to lead TDS anymore because many many people benefitted with 4/5 and 5/5 relic with a few hardcore leaders doing many hours of preparation, money out of their own pockets to keep it free for you, and an active message board where problems where always welcomed to be discussed. Encore is a great reform in my opinion and the leaders are some of the mose respectable in this game. Wish I could participate.
 
You were my sun, you were my earth
but you didnt know all the ways I loved you, no
So you took a chance, made other plans
But I betcha didnt think that they would come crashin down, no


You dont have to say, What cha did
I already know, I found out from HIM
now theres just no chance
with you and me
there will never be
dont it make you sad about it


you told me you love me
Why did you leave me all alone
now you tell me you need me
When you call me on the phone


Girl I refuse
you must have me confused with some other guy
the bridges were burned
now its your turn,To cry


Cry me a river
Cry me a river er er
cry me a river
cry me a river er er
YA YA
 
I didn't think I was going to post here, but...

I joined TDS about three months ago, as a RDM. A RDM with approx 13 other RDMs ahead of me for Northlands gear. I was fine with that, I probably won't ever get it, but maybe I'll pick up some city gear, some RNG gear, and have some fun with friends...

Three months later, San d'Oria. RDM drops, and I'm told that I'm not allowed to lot. On my primary... after three months of perfect attendance. Three MONTHS and I don't even qualify as allowed to lot in a city? And you think I should stay in the shell? Give me a break, that's just like saying "Hey, stick with us, you won't get shit but you can watch as everybody else does. Enjoy the XP loss :D"

I know, it's not nine months like the original members... but if it kept going on like that, how long would it be? 2 years down the line, am I still third-rate? When would I stop being "that new guy" and start being a respected member? Never. That's why I'm with Encore, here my work is appreciated and possibly rewarded. Even without winning the lot, at least being allowed to lot in the first place means that I'm a valued member, which is enough for me.
 
When old members get shit and leave, the old members that still need shit get fucked over. It's then a question of who pays for it... the old members who got fucked - by having to lot against new members - or the new members who are joining to replace the old.

Unfortunately, if lines are bad enough, it makes more sense to join a new linkshell and get in on the ground floor, because it's mathematically more intelligent when you factor in the amount of time needed to lot and the odds of a shell breaking before you can lot.

For this reason, lotting really SHOULD slant towards new members being able to lot before older members all get their gear, because otherwise you won't get new members and the shell will break. Who fucked who over? The people who got their AF2 and then stopped showing up. The shell is just trying to distribute the loss of effort around so that new members don't have to deal with too much shit before lotting... so they'll join.

This is what needs to be considered in the very beginning, because if you make people wait on harsh lotting rules, then after they put in their time, relax the lotting rules... you fuck them over.

When I made my dyn shell I tried setting up a system of locks so you could lot with like 10 runs in a row.. or 16 out of the last 20 runs... things like that, so older members have less stringent priorities to lot, but newer members with ambition can still succeed.
 
To throw out an example of how things can go the other way, if you recall a while back the Perfect linkshell reformed and took all the valkyrs members into a LS only dynamis shell. If you take it from the perspective of a guy(not talking about me, like several people I knew) who had been a Perfect member for over half a year and hadn't worked their way up to lotting priority yet... you see why you need a system to compensate for newer members.
 
The problem is Encore made a system of no reward and had no provisions to reward those still waiting. I had waited my time, I had earned that piece, and I deserved it. Now, you start a new shell with entirely the same group and who gets rewarded? Lucky lots, that's it.

With the old system, people look at it like like this: You get one main and that's all you are allowed. That's just not so. You are allowed so much more if you have the patience and dynamis after all is a game of patience. You should allow people who've been waiting with a primary in X job to get their drops first so you can move ahead. Instead people don't. They have to wait and they don't care. The problem is no matter how you change the system only Y number of X job will ever drop. It doesn't change how many people are seeking X job, all it does is change who will get X job first. Instead of rewarding those who had obtained less within the shell, you've made it random. Instead of rewarding those who've stayed longer, it's random. Instead of rewarding attendance, it's random. With the current system, I am back to square one and I will never leave. It'll probably take me another 11 months to obtain the one piece that was owed to me by the same people who have the plan to counter lot me when it drops and every time it drops until I obtain it. Tell me the fairness in that?

I am sorry a lot of you didn't get as much as you wanted, but how can you tell me you deserve to get pieces over another player when they've yet to obtain their first full set? Many of you came into TDS with nothing. You obtained a full set, whichever set you desired or you wouldn't have come in the first place. Then when it came to lotting the next set, you couldn't wait for those less fortunate or newer players to get their's quick enough. However, there was a problem of people being set as secondary after obtaining full primary and newer players joining were able to lot over them, but that could have been resolved without starting a new shell. It could have been changed somehow instead of removing all the hard work of those still waiting for the few pieces they have yet to obtain. No, we can't do that, it'd still mean people would have to wait and that's just not fair.
 
Lavi said:
Now, you start a new shell with entirely the same group and who gets rewarded? Lucky lots, that's it.
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<Hmm> That's not so bad... FOR THE NEW PEOPLE!

[snap!]

Seriously, I really understand the frustration you are going thru. ; ;

People don't appreciate the good things you do because they don't even NOTICE them in the 1st place...
 
I will say one thing... not all sets are equal in value. Some sets naturally have less lotters and naturally drop more often, and of those sets people will get them within a couple months and will want to move on. Other sets take a while and naturally have a lot of lotters... a good example is to compare SAM and BLM sets. Dynamis shells will actively recruit BLM thereby making BLM harder to get by increasing the lotters - for most melee shells only accept 2-3 of the same job, making it very smooth. Afterall, 3 DRK, 3 MNK and 3 SAM are similar to 9 of any of them... but you cannot replace blm with another job. WHM is one of those jobs that can be a pain to get, therefore comparing your set to someone else who isn't a WHM's set isn't accurate.

Lotting wise, it would be most fair to recruit people based on drops, so that you get the most of the lotters on the jobs that tend to drop more often... but in reality shells like to go light on melee jobs since they're not proportionally as necessary and melees tend to be the leaders.
 
The problem is that under the old system, a few things happened. New people took one look at the line in front of them and simply left after a run or two. When you've organized the system in to tiers so that until the old guard get their piece the new people have no chance, they're going to look elsewhere to find a better opportunity. On the other hand, the old people that DID have all their pieces had issues with the new main lotters constantly preventing them from lotting their secondaries, and the inability to change mains without a revamp of the system tended to make rather a lot of them get the pieces they wanted, or all the pieces they could carry, and ditch.

The system needed to be changed, someone was going to get screwed, and that's unfortunate but necessary. I'm arguably one of the ones that got screwed, but I hold no particular venom for TDS. I had an inkling of what was going on in regards to the constant stream of complaints from both sides of the fence, and after a while it must have seemed very appealing to just reform the shell with new rules.
 
Willian said:
I didn't think I was going to post here, but...

I joined TDS about three months ago, as a RDM. A RDM with approx 13 other RDMs ahead of me for Northlands gear. I was fine with that, I probably won't ever get it, but maybe I'll pick up some city gear, some RNG gear, and have some fun with friends...

Three months later, San d'Oria. RDM drops, and I'm told that I'm not allowed to lot. On my primary... after three months of perfect attendance. Three MONTHS and I don't even qualify as allowed to lot in a city? And you think I should stay in the shell? Give me a break, that's just like saying "Hey, stick with us, you won't get shit but you can watch as everybody else does. Enjoy the XP loss :D"

I know, it's not nine months like the original members... but if it kept going on like that, how long would it be? 2 years down the line, am I still third-rate? When would I stop being "that new guy" and start being a respected member? Never. That's why I'm with Encore, here my work is appreciated and possibly rewarded. Even without winning the lot, at least being allowed to lot in the first place means that I'm a valued member, which is enough for me.
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You think it sucks you don't have any RDM AF, imagine the RDMs who've been there since day 1 and still don't. Who's fault is that though? TDS? Encore? Or SE? This is the problem most people seem to not understand and yet they do. They blame the shell for lacking AF when it's through no possible fault of their own. Some AFs are just in short supply and high demand. RDM and BLM are both like this.

All that aside, does the new system really benefit you? Lets think about it for a second. RDM has been really rare for TDS and let's suppose it's no different for Encore. How many plan to lot it now? At least with the old system, you only had to wait for the older members to obtain theirs and then newer members can lot. Now, who do you have to compete with? New, old AND those who have RDM leveled but had been set as a different job in TDS (secondary or not). Not only that, those who might have been opposed to changing lot or level RDM in the future can change lot to RDM at any time. They can lot a whole lot easier since there is no line and even worse, more would be apt to lot high demand pieces like the body and hat. Instead of being locked into a whole set, they can pick and chose making the best pieces of any set highly sought after. Enjoy a constant 10 players lotting RDM in Xarcabard, it'll be fun.
 
Lavi, you still aren't getting it. There was no fixing it. The issue of changing mains was brought up at least 5 months ago. Does it take that long to figure it out? It was denied. Reasonable options such as resetting your attendance back to day one, those that were still waiting on their first set remaining in a higher tier so no one could cut in line and get it before them, denied. People would have been satisfied with at least having the option of being put on a waiting list, instead of seeing new recruits coming in and getting priority. It was a cycle that would never end, so no, certain jobs had no realistic chance of being attained by overflow. In TDS, those jobs happened to be whm, rdm, and blm. If you were a long time member, and those weren't your main or secondary, you had virtually no chance of ever obtaining them, end of story.

Another thing you, and alot of people can't grasp, is that not everything is what it seems. Sure, it's easy to say that someone is a greedy lootwhore if they ever leave a shell after obtaining gear from that shell, but that simply isn't always the case. There's two sides to every story. I personally know that many left for reasons that have nothing to do with gear at all. Personality conficts being a huge factor for some. Others felt that it was just destined to fail. You don't call the guy an asshole that runs out of a burning building, or say the rat that leaves a sinking ship is greedy. I can think of one person that you lump in with the lootwhores, who would have helped anyone, who passed on things he deserved, and had to be forced to lot things he was in line for. That person went on to give all his non r/e stuff away to others and has quit the game. What a bastard huh?

Like i said before, the new shell has rules that can easily be taken advantage of by the bad seeds of the game. I am more for rewarding attendance/loyalty than putting someone in the shell for 6 months on same level as someone who it's their first run. I would have been fine with having lotting priority cross over into the new system, but it's not my shell, and for everything negative you can say about it, at least it doesn't penalize you for being a long term member by having goals that you have no chance of being able to reach.
 
Lavi said:
With the current system, I am back to square one and I will never leave. It'll probably take me another 11 months to obtain the one piece that was owed to me by the same people who have the plan to counter lot me when it drops and every time it drops until I obtain it.
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Or you could rejoin and lot it in a few weeks, whenever we're in Beaucedine next.

Yes Lavi, you got screwed. A lot of people did. We're victims of circumstance but the ends by far outweigh the means in this case. We're all better off under the new rules and we accepted this sacrifice as a minor inconvenience.

For the first time in over a year, I was excited to hit DynaSandy last week. No, for real. I was able to lot war boots, I was able to lot whm hat, and if a second 100c had dropped I would be able to lot that as well. The fact that I could technically walk out of one zone with 3 wootings got me hella excited to visit one of the most boring Dynamis zones in this game. Throw in the fact that it's still the same old awesome team of ragtag folks that do this - for fun - every week, and my Saturday mornings just kicked up a couple notches.

There's much more opportunity to acquire "teh stuffz" under the new rules, and everybody except for you has accepted their loss of position in favor of renewed faith and fun. I'm not saying you should follow the pack, I'm saying you should give it a try. Dynamis doesn't suck anymore.
 
Saying no one recognized Lavi's work is a terrible statement to make, especially when you have no idea what happened.

I left TDS a few weeks before it ended. To make a long story short, I was there much longer than I wanted to be because no one else was showing up. Lavi can say whatever he wants. I left because I was 5/5. I couldn't care less about the AF. It never was about gear for me and it never would be. Towards the end of my time with TDS I noticed people had one of two views. They would either give me all the flack for anything that happened that was less than perfect or they actually appreciated the work I put in. It got to a point where I couldn't even play FFXI on a non-run day without getting all sorts of tells.

If anyone wants to pin the fall on me, go ahead. If anyone wants to take jabs at Foo, go ahead. Same for anyone else. Go on the FB and blame anyone you want. TDS was dying for a long stretched out period of time. I think just about anyone that ran with the shell for any amount of time has admitted this already. I didn't reform TDS, I created a new shell because I still liked doing dynamis and for the friends that supported me while I tried to do my best, I felt I owed it to them to no longer continue dynamis unless it was with those people. This has nothing to do with who was 0/5, 4/5, 5/5. It might be about the gear for you, but it never was for some of us.

I was offered the opportunity to change anything that I wanted. Would it have been more fair if I came into the shell one day and declared "Hey, we're changing everything around?" Hell no. I decided to start my own shell with the blessings of everyone that mattered. With that, I was also told I could keep my doors open to any TDS members that WANTED to join. The people left did not have the time or energy to keep running the shell. Now maybe its because I have a bad memory, but I don't recall a time where I put a gun to anyone's head making them join.

I always appreciated what Lavi did. I even personally sent him tells when he won something to congratulate him, because he always deserved it. I'm sorry if any decisions I made "fucked you" out of a whm body. My decisions weren't based on you.

I would have loved to have you in Encore Lavi, but I understand if you're not keen on our rules or the way we do things. Not everyone came, so its not really a reformation. Everyone that is there now was aware of the rules before they joined. But hell, whatever goes on is really not anyones business that isn't in the shell. If coming on here and making it seem like TDS originally started just so you would be screwed over someday go for it. I really couldn't care less. I think the majority of the people that have posted here really said all that had to be said. I just got tired of people asking me if I've seen this thread.

All I know is that when I asked if you'd like to come along with us, instead of saying "No" you started talking about how I fucked you over. How me and my 5/5 buddies all ran away because we didn't want to wait for anything. This shell goes much deeper than gear. I don't expect everyone to understand that, nor do I expect this to be the right shell for everyone. There's no perfect lotting system. What you need is the right people for the system you have.

You go your way, and the "greedy fuckers that wasted 11 months of your life" and I will go our own. I will make sure I tell that also to the guy that comes for 0 gear and just comes to kill shit for fun with us. My shell has really done nothing to you, you're just bitter. Anyone could start their own shell tomorrow. The only difference is I offered a home to people that were going to be shell-less in the near future because I was told that I could. For trying to be nice I got a "Fuck you."
 
Raesvelg said:
The problem is that under the old system, a few things happened. New people took one look at the line in front of them and simply left after a run or two. When you've organized the system in to tiers so that until the old guard get their piece the new people have no chance, they're going to look elsewhere to find a better opportunity. On the other hand, the old people that DID have all their pieces had issues with the new main lotters constantly preventing them from lotting their secondaries, and the inability to change mains without a revamp of the system tended to make rather a lot of them get the pieces they wanted, or all the pieces they could carry, and ditch.

The system needed to be changed, someone was going to get screwed, and that's unfortunate but necessary. I'm arguably one of the ones that got screwed, but I hold no particular venom for TDS. I had an inkling of what was going on in regards to the constant stream of complaints from both sides of the fence, and after a while it must have seemed very appealing to just reform the shell with new rules.
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I understood all the problems based on the lotting system; however, the proper step would have been to fix the old system. As it stands, I don't think leadership has any clue on what they are doing. The Encore system is so inherently flawed, it's disgusting. There are no rewards besides lotting more which doesn't reward any positive behavior (attendance, long term membership, less drops recieved) and means luck has more to do with it than anything. Competition will be fierce. High demand pieces will be sought after by players with multiple jobs who can afford to change lots at will. Players can freely change lots to maximize lotting possibilities. As an example, a player with lot of jobs leveled can set 1st lot as BLM, 2nd lot as WHM and the remaining jobs which could be BRD, SAM, WAR, etc which are a lot less in demand. A player will do that simply because they know BLM and WHM will be heavily lotted so they need them as primary/secondary to lot and the remaining pieces are a lot more likely to go to overflow thus still able to freely lot them. All that still doesn't stop the revolving door problem either. People will come when they stand to benefit the most. People will quit once they've obtained all their desired pieces. Yes, leadership promises to remove those types of players, but they said the same thing in TDS too. The new system is far worse than the previous system and rewards greed more than anything else.
 
Audino said:
For trying to be nice I got a "Fuck you."
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Nice is telling me I spent 11 months to work my way to the top only to be tossed back to the very bottom? Nice is telling me no matter how much I did for the shell, it was for nothing? Nice how? The last piece I was to obtain which was supposed to be guaranteed to be by all those I helped in TDS is now a highly demanded piece by 90% of Encore. Do you know how many people have WHM leveled? Do you honestly think I am going to get that piece anytime soon when I am guaranteed to have to compete against 10 people at the very least. I can name a half dozen people off the top of my head and I am sure there are at least a half dozen more with WHM leveled that probably wouldn't mind lotting. I guess I should be happy that all those people are all too happy to walk all over me to lot it though?
 
Lavi, I think the problem is that you're looking at Encore as "TheDynamisShow2", which it isn't. Encore is a completely unrelated shell. People came when TDS died, yes, but it's not like the shell just changed names and kept going as if nothing ever happened. Encore has some TDS members, but it also has a ton of people that were never even in TDS. TDS died. It's over. It's done. There's nothing left to "screw you over". It's a memory of Quetzalcoatl. Encore is a new shell with its own rules and members. Encore owes nothing to anyone because it's a week old. Everyone's been a member for a week. What happened in TDS is irrelevant.

EDIT: grammar
 
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